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TheFluff posted:Islands of Ice has always been absolutely terrible by the way and it's impressive that despite a complete rework it's still absolutely terrible. It's almost a mirrored Mountain Range now and Mountain Range is one of the worst loving maps in the game. Okinawa is also real bad and so is Tears of the Desert. There are a lot of okay maps and some really good ones so it really pisses me off that poo poo like Islands of Ice and Tears of the Desert are so loving common in the T9/T10 rotation. Hotspot, Trap, Sea of Fortune and Warrior's Path are all pretty good, why can't we have more of them instead? Every new map needs an island chain separating the team spawns that can't be crossed without being crossfired by the entire map, a bunch of random rocks on the border to block you from disengaging if your side loses, and a giant island in the back so that a CV can hide behind it and waste 15 minutes after the game is won. (Ocean is an underrated map because it has none of those)
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Apr 22, 2020 02:59
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James Garfield posted:Every new map needs an island chain separating the team spawns that can't be crossed without being crossfired by the entire map, a bunch of random rocks on the border to block you from disengaging if your side loses, and a giant island in the back so that a CV can hide behind it and waste 15 minutes after the game is won. Comedy map option: The entire border is surrounded by land. A few small/medium islands scattered about, but no humping the map border anymore.
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Apr 22, 2020 04:06
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Ocean is an overrated map because islands are your only real friends in this game and it has none of those.
EponymousMrYar fucked around with this message at 04:41 on Apr 22, 2020 |
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Apr 22, 2020 04:38
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James Garfield posted:Every new map needs an island chain separating the team spawns that can't be crossed without being crossfired by the entire map, a bunch of random rocks on the border to block you from disengaging if your side loses, and a giant island in the back so that a CV can hide behind it and waste 15 minutes after the game is won. Somewhere, Greece sneezes.
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Apr 22, 2020 05:03
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EponymousMrYar posted:Ocean is an overrated map because islands are your only real friends in this game and it has none of those. It sucks if you're a radar Minotaur or maybe a Colbert, but pretty much every other ship in the game is good in open water. It's nice if you get an opportunity to farm some reversing Yamato from behind a rock, but it isn't necessary and the fact of islands existing doesn't guarantee that you can do that. On a lot of maps the islands serve more to interfere with playing around concealment and to funnel pubbies into stupid parts of the map, where you then don't get to flank them because of said islands (hi 1 line on Greece) Ocean is the smallest tier 10 map, but you have access to the whole map and there are no islands blocking line of sight so getting spotted pushing a flank doesn't instantly get you focused by the whole enemy team like on Shards or Greece (even though those maps are bigger). There also aren't any of the stupid loving islands in the middle of caps for destroyers to park behind instead of being useful and spotting (but I'm contesting the cap for my team!!  ), and you get to laugh at the pubbies in American cruisers who complain about Ocean because they think American cruisers are supposed to be played bow in behind a rock.
James Garfield fucked around with this message at 05:34 on Apr 22, 2020 |
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Apr 22, 2020 05:19
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I’m really loving bad at high tier cruisers, and I think it’s all because I’m too eager to shoot.
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Apr 22, 2020 05:40
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Good day gents, I just started playing and after reaching tier 5-6 I start seeing that everyone except dds just hug map borders ALL the time. I play mostly cruisers so Id like to not be closest to the enemy team. Is this something that is mid tier symptom or is the high tier gameplay basically just hugging borders and lobbing poo poo at max range? I do not enjoy this type of gameplay (a la strv type redline sniping in wot) so if this is indeed the correct way to play this game, then I dont think Ill be continuing.
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Apr 22, 2020 10:04
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madfury posted:Good day gents, In general it's not a good way to play the game, it's just that pubbies are bad and want to run away from everything. It's pretty common to see battleships in particular cluster into a corner or along some narrow corridor for some inexplicable reason. Decent players know that different ships want different kinds of positioning though - things like Russian DD's and IJN cruisers want to flank around the map edges to annoy battleships so they have to turn their turrets to shoot at them, while battleships are usually best played in a central position where they can get at the broadsides of people pushing the flanks, and things like USN cruisers with radars generally want to be close to cap circles. As you go up in tiers the engagement ranges generally become longer, but pubbies sniping from 20km are almost always terrible and close range engagement (below 10km) happen frequently at high tiers too. In general you usually want to be as close as possible (so it's as easy as possible to hit what you're shooting at) while still being able to disengage if you need to.
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Apr 22, 2020 11:04
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I dont play this game much but I triple citadeled an invisible cruiser today and that made me feel good and the cruiser player was very 'lol' about it and that made me feel even better.
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Apr 22, 2020 21:34
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Just wanted to pop in and say thanks for the advice on playing the Phoenix. I was being extremely overaggressive and cooling my heels really made it less of a slog. More importantly, the Omaha has been a ton of fun since I got it.
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Apr 22, 2020 21:56
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James Garfield posted:Ocean is the smallest tier 10 map, but you have access to the whole map and there are no islands blocking line of sight so getting spotted pushing a flank doesn't instantly get you focused by the whole enemy team like on Shards or Greece (even though those maps are bigger). Even when I'm hanging back and screening BB's for DD's, I still get sniped at by several of the battleships on the enemy team. (I do the same to enemy cruisers in my BB's when I get Ocean on them.) That's the other side of the double-edged sword that is Ocean. The entire map is open. You can be shot by everyone who has range on you. Most Ocean battles I've seen (and won) that weren't one-sided stomps were of teams that could accurately shoot and sink ships across the map. No ship in the game can withstand or dodge that amount of shells being fired at it. They can get lucky breaks, but so can the people shooting them. madfury posted:Good day gents,
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Apr 22, 2020 23:06
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My win rate in the Zao is 42% and Chapayev is 41% 
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Apr 23, 2020 00:08
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You could win presidential elections with these numbers!
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Apr 23, 2020 00:13
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serious gaylord posted:I dont play this game much but I triple citadeled an invisible cruiser today and that made me feel good and the cruiser player was very 'lol' about it and that made me feel even better. Doing the lord's work, you are. This right here, followed by that right there:     is one of the few reasons to play battleships. The other is the loving Georgia, which is the wackiest goddamned battleship that ever sailed. Currently up to 41 games, 29 of which have been wins. Higher average damage per game than in the Montana. It's a ship where if you gently caress up your positioning horribly by going into the enemy spawn like an idiot pubbie shitlord because the enemy team abandoned your flank entirely and idk what I was thinking, you sometimes end up with a hilarious flank and end up doing 180k damage in about three and a half minutes. Still regretting shooting the Skåne at the end, should have tried to finish the Massachusetts instead. We won anyway but that was bad target priority, just reflex I guess. Seriously, get this ship. It's stupidly overpowered, it makes a shitton of credits and it's some of the most fun you can have in this game. Whoever put the most accurate battleship guns in the game with the highest AP damage per shell in the game on the fastest battleship hull in the game deserves... idk, to get fired from the balance department probably, but in my book they might as well take a medal because this thing is hilarious. Ignore the secondaries, they're just a pubbie trap. In that game I clipped above I got 100 secondary hits for a whopping 12k damage and a single fire. IFHE presumably makes them slightly better, but it's absolutely not worth the skill point investment. I used to really like the Richelieu because it could sorta do this sort of fast battleship thing, but then I soured on the entire French BB line because of the unreliable guns and the need to fire a lot of HE like a goddamned caveman, but this is what that line wishes it could have been. It's like someone took everything I liked about the NC and made it an order of magnitude better. TheFluff fucked around with this message at 00:38 on Apr 23, 2020 |
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Apr 23, 2020 00:33
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I feel like I should be ashamed to admit this but I'm absolutely loving the Russian cruisers. Just ground out the chappy, working my way into donkey. Are 180mm lazer guns as good as I think they are? e. Any favorite builds for donkey?
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Apr 23, 2020 01:29
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EponymousMrYar posted:I call BS on this. Every time I open fire with my DM on Ocean my PT goes up to 5-7 instantly and I've got tons of HE and AP shells coming in at me from all directions. Des Moines (especially with the legendary upgrade) is still good on Ocean, as long as there isn't a CV. You go to a flank and use the concealment to avoid being focused while you engage people at 11 km and kill them because you're a Des Moines. If everyone is focusing you you can't shoot as much, but they're unlikely to keep their guns turned toward you when you're unspotted when they could be shooting your teammates. If they do you can still kite them at 15 km and wait for them to lose interest. Your game plan in random battles shouldn't revolve around sitting behind a rock and shooting reversing BBs. It's nice when you get a chance to do it, but you'll be far more effective if you figure out how to play US cruisers in open water.
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Apr 23, 2020 01:41
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Maksimus54 posted:I feel like I should be ashamed to admit this but I'm absolutely loving the Russian cruisers. Just ground out the chappy, working my way into donkey. Are 180mm lazer guns as good as I think they are? The same exact build as you've been using. The donkey is good, but you can kinda feel that the 180mm shells just aren't as good as everyone else's 203s, right up until someone gives you a tasty broadside at a range they think is safe. I really felt the IFHE change though, since you still need it to get above certain thresholds in armor.
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Apr 23, 2020 01:52
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Maksimus54 posted:I feel like I should be ashamed to admit this but I'm absolutely loving the Russian cruisers. Just ground out the chappy, working my way into donkey. Are 180mm lazer guns as good as I think they are? It's clumsy and its armor is still poor, so focus on long-range gameplay. I found IFHE is not necessary to play it right because the AP on broadsides is effective at long ranges and because of its armor/slow turning you want to go dark now and then and position, but think about your personal playstyle: AP/fire starting or sheer HE dpm and act accordingly. Unlike the Chappy you can't stealth radar and unlike the Moskva you can't bow tank toward a cap to use the radar, so you need to have good map awareness and the use of hard cover. I loved my time in her, truth be told. So Priority Target, Adrenaline Rush, Superintendent, Concealment Expert. Then some combination of Preventative Maintenance, Expert Loader (very useful if you don't have IFHE especially), Demolition Expert, IFHE, or Jack of All Trades. Expert Marksman if you want more mlg turrets is also nice when you're wiggling a lot.
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Apr 23, 2020 04:15
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James Garfield posted:Your game plan in random battles shouldn't revolve around sitting behind a rock and shooting reversing BBs. It's nice when you get a chance to do it, but you'll be far more effective if you figure out how to play US cruisers in open water. If you have to hide behind an island and farm damage on boats in the early game to keep your HP up so you can trade it away for kills/a win in the late game, that's what you do. The DM, even with legendary mod, doesn't have the speed or range to open water gunboat as well as a Henri or a Hindenburg. It's not that hard to hit at 15km and any BB with 457mm won't care about whatever angling your doing. Even if you're angled to get autobounces, shells are perfectly capable of flying over your angled bow and citadeling you through your deck plating. All game plans should revolve around shooting and sinking enemy boats. Sometimes you can get away with sailing around in open water, guns blazing. Sometimes you need to hunker down behind an island to stay alive while shooting boats.
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Apr 23, 2020 04:29
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EponymousMrYar posted:And sometimes the answer to that is 'don't play in open water.' You don't even need the legendary upgrade to play open water Des Moines (but it's worth it). It's about using concealment to control who can shoot you and taking favorable engagements just outside your concealment range. If you're on a flank a little over 11 km from the closest enemy ship, you don't have to dodge many BB salvos at all because you can stop shooting and get unspotted before the BBs have a chance to shoot you. You don't have to sit at maximum range dodging three BBs to play an open water cruiser. That's how you play the French cruisers. A Zao or Hindenburg can't do that either but everyone kind of accepts that those are good in open water; I don't get what it is about the American cruisers that makes people glue themselves to a rock.
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Apr 23, 2020 04:56
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James Garfield posted:You don't even need the legendary upgrade to play open water Des Moines (but it's worth it). It's about using concealment to control who can shoot you and taking favorable engagements just outside your concealment range. If you're on a flank a little over 11 km from the closest enemy ship, you don't have to dodge many BB salvos at all because you can stop shooting and get unspotted before the BBs have a chance to shoot you. I think it's the DPM and the shell arcs. The Des Moines at range wins via DPM, which runs counter to the kind of flanking shenanigans that work best for cruisers. A french cruiser can burst damage and then kite at range, a Zao can get very high HE alpha and fires with on salvo and go dark, but the Hindi and DM shine when always shooting. Open water like that is harder, so then pubbies hide behind rocks or stay at max range.
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Apr 23, 2020 07:24
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James Garfield posted:If you're on a flank a little over 11 km from the closest enemy ship, you don't have to dodge many BB salvos at all because you can stop shooting and get unspotted before the BBs have a chance to shoot you. Is there a way to shorten the time (20 seconds?) it takes to reconceal somehow? BBs in my games generally have no problems launching a billion shells at me before i get away / go dark
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Apr 23, 2020 07:40
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TheFluff posted:Seriously, get this ship. It's stupidly overpowered, it makes a shitton of credits and it's some of the most fun you can have in this game. Whoever put the most accurate battleship guns in the game with the highest AP damage per shell in the game on the fastest battleship hull in the game deserves... idk, to get fired from the balance department probably, but in my book they might as well take a medal because this thing is hilarious. Ignore the secondaries, they're just a pubbie trap. In that game I clipped above I got 100 secondary hits for a whopping 12k damage and a single fire. IFHE presumably makes them slightly better, but it's absolutely not worth the skill point investment. Where do you get it?
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Apr 23, 2020 10:02
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Also, are any of the captains you get from the quest chains / chests worth it? I got the French captain from buying French chests with coal and also the British one. Is Halsey or the Polish captain worth the grind? I mostly play cruisers and destroyers.
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Apr 23, 2020 10:08
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Ataxerxes posted:Where do you get it? You can currently get it in the Armory for coal. You can also buy it for like seventy real life human dollars. Personally I'm just slowly saving coal. I'm also abruptly jumped all the way into the last stage of the Des Moines legendary module grind--thanks BOATC clan goons for hassling me into joining up! This grind seemed insurmountable last year and now it's just rocketed at light speed into "I can get this done before the end of the month."
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Apr 23, 2020 10:09
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Yolomon Wayne posted:Is there a way to shorten the time (20 seconds?) it takes to reconceal somehow? Look at them and make sure their guns are not pointing your way when you fire. "Most" BBs can't even traverse their turrets in 20 seconds. If you are getting focused that fast it means you are not stopping firing when they start to get interested in you. Get Priority Target, the 1 point Captain skill so you know how many are looking st you. PT, in my very humble opinion, is easily one of the most useful captain skills there is. I take it on everything.
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Apr 23, 2020 10:09
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Redeye Flight posted:Personally I'm just slowly saving coal.
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Apr 23, 2020 10:28
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Ataxerxes posted:What is the best way to do that? Just keep selecting more resources in containers? Yeah. That and do the daily mission chains, plus play ranked and/or clan brawls. You get cupons for 25% off ships for resources in the armory a few times a year too, remember that.
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Apr 23, 2020 11:42
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Burt posted:Look at them and make sure their guns are not pointing your way when you fire. "Most" BBs can't even traverse their turrets in 20 seconds. If you are getting focused that fast it means you are not stopping firing when they start to get interested in you. Get Priority Target, the 1 point Captain skill so you know how many are looking st you. I have PT on almost every shipt, but most things that immeadiatly shoot me once im spotted are things i didnt see prior due to how spotting works. And what i meant was, even after stopping to shoot it still takes 20 seconds to go dark again. Is there a way to shorten this time?
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Apr 23, 2020 12:12
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Yolomon Wayne posted:And what i meant was, even after stopping to shoot it still takes 20 seconds to go dark again. Is there a way to shorten this time? If you break line of sight with all enemy ships for one second your detection goes back to normal. Other than that you have to wait out the whole timer.
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Apr 23, 2020 12:41
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davejk posted:If you break line of sight with all enemy ships for one second your detection goes back to normal. Other than that you have to wait out the whole timer. Ok, thought i missed something since talk was about shooting someone at 11km on ocean and then casually buggering off witout getting bombed to narnia.
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Apr 23, 2020 13:52
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Yolomon Wayne posted:I have PT on almost every shipt, but most things that immeadiatly shoot me once im spotted are things i didnt see prior due to how spotting works. No way to shorten it, but if you leave firing range of the closest ship you go dark immediately. I'd not recommend that strategy often, though. My advice for being an annoying HE spammer is fire right when he fires his guns once and see if he responds. If he does, keep going. If Priority target goes up, don't shoot again unless you are in a favorable position. You go dark in 20s but every BB in the game has a 20+ second reload.
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Apr 23, 2020 14:05
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Yolomon Wayne posted:Ok, thought i missed something since talk was about shooting someone at 11km on ocean and then casually buggering off witout getting bombed to narnia. The trick is to get into a position where they have to turn their guns like at least 90 degrees to shoot at you before opening up.
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Apr 23, 2020 14:12
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Like, it's impossible to just write out a step by step guide on it, but, as a cruiser, you just get a feel for when to extend on a flank (by paying attention to the enemy deployment and knowing where is going to be the safest spot for you to be in relation to their guns), and when people will be focusing on you/able to be focused on you. Like, I open water poo poo tons, because you get a feel for "ok this guy is going to be busy with other poo poo so he's not gonna shoot me", and when added to putting yourself in a place where there's only one angle from which shells will be coming, you can greatly mitigate/eliminate return damage, even in open water. My sincere advice would be to watch streams, not YT videos, from very good players. For Des Moines, you will almost always catch m373x playing it, and he is almost constantly on the move, https://www.twitch.tv/m373x/videos (he's been playing a lot of Euro DDs lately sadly, but flipping around, this seemed like a pretty good one https://www.twitch.tv/videos/587787154?t=02h56m47s). Really you want to observe a good chunk of matches as they happen, and not cherry picked ones, to really get a feel for what it is you're looking out for/positions to take/reactions to make. A lot of cruiser mistakes I both see and still make are not reading map/match conditions and reacting too late to situations that were obvious minutes ago. So many cruiser players react after they are spotted, or get into situations where they have to try to turn out or extract way, way too late. In all of WoWS anticipation is one of the most important aspects.
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Apr 23, 2020 14:23
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A standard situations i frequently find myself in and dont really know what to do proactively would be: Warriors path, "arrow tip spawn" You have a tiny island in the midst of the sea, even trying to go there in a cruiser usually results in death. Hide behind the large mountain with nothing to shoot at? Open water circling until their dd spots you and the rest of their spawn launch shells at you? Theres another one like that, but the name escapes me. One side of the spawn has a single large mountain inbetween the teams. e: is it north? I think its north. Yolomon Wayne fucked around with this message at 14:54 on Apr 23, 2020 |
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Apr 23, 2020 14:41
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Yolomon Wayne posted:A standard situations i frequently find myself in and dont really know what to do proactively would be: I've circled the classic USN cruiser spots on Warrior's Path:  Around the C cap in particular, your goal is not to hide behind the mountain but rather sit at a corner (from the south spawn there's a sandbar that blocks torps but not vision, which can be both handy and annoying). If the enemy is being passive and doing the same thing that you are, that is they're not pushing the 9/10 line, then you won't have anything to shoot at unless there's some stupid DD in the open in the cap, so in that case just go to B instead of sitting around and wasting time. If they are pushing you can usually stop them; they won't really have decent angles on you until they get pretty far towards the middle of the map and you can just reverse away or stealth before that happens. B cap on Warrior's Path is a Des Moines' wet dream and can be a hilarious thunderdome and/or a goddamned death trap depending on enemy team composition. Sometimes people cruiser rush it in things like Minotaurs or whatever, in which case you should absolutely ruin their fun. Later in the game the B cap is a great place to hang out if you want to shoot people pushing B from A. TheFluff fucked around with this message at 15:27 on Apr 23, 2020 |
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Apr 23, 2020 15:22
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Are Italian cruisers worth it? I can get in around tier 8/9 via freeXP.
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Apr 23, 2020 15:27
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And, speak of the devil, m373x is streaming a bunch of Des Moines games right now, go watch and pick his brain about DM play! https://www.twitch.tv/m373x
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Apr 23, 2020 16:17
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Stanley Pain posted:Are Italian cruisers worth it? I can get in around tier 8/9 via freeXP. Yes, Venezia is one of the strongest T10s right now. That said, don't skip entire tech trees with free XP, it's a huge waste (unless you're sitting on literally millions). If you're really determined to skip up the tree just play them from tier 7.
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Apr 23, 2020 16:29
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Tossed an application to the clan under the same name as here. Been getting back into the game pretty heavy the last few weeks and having a good time.
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Apr 23, 2020 16:32
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