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Skippy McPants posted:A theme of this game appears to be "we don't like the message you took from the first game, so here is exactly what we meant, put as bluntly as possible." i dont know if you can fault them for that given how many people seemed to have missed what was already not very subtle in the first one lol Zeta Acosta posted:Im going to be the contrarian: the uncharted series is loving trash also the bloody baron in witcher 3 is better than everything naughty dog has done so far i mean ND is purely within the "competent story telling and decent gameplay" so theyre not exactly the pinnacle, but the witcher 3 is truly overrated. if you want genuinely fantastic writing then probably dont bother with AAA games at all, indies have and continue to do more interesting things with games as narrative vehicles. the only reason something like tlou sticks out at all is because compared to most big games where you watch alien robots half emote at each other it looks like a masterpiece, but its just relative to its competition.
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Apr 30, 2020 19:30
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Fat_Cow posted:I like the part where after they beat his skull into a pulp with golf clubs they spit on his body saying "Burn in Hell penedejo" games gonna have to do wonders to stop me from cheering for their deaths
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Apr 30, 2020 19:31
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They should have made a golf pun instead
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Apr 30, 2020 19:36
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Stux posted:i dont know if you can fault them for that given how many people seemed to have missed what was already not very subtle in the first one lol It's not that we didn't get what the game was trying to say, it's that we thought the game was stupid, pretentious and incompetent in saying it and that soured us on it and we went for other interpretations that Neil Drukman doesn't approve of, but that the material supports more, because he hosed up. Mind you there's possibly people who think things like "the fireflies are the good guys" and, yeah, that's a failure on all accounts.
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Apr 30, 2020 20:17
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The overwhelming reaction I'm seeing from random strangers on the internet is that they're mad about Joel dying. That character must've resonated with a lot of people, for all the wrong reasons.
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Apr 30, 2020 20:57
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People are really not in the mood for bleak post-apocalyptic torture porn right now for some reason. Also Sony AAA fans need to be reminded to breathe through their noses so of course they're shocked and outraged that Sad Murder Dad Gets Murdered, Sad.
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Apr 30, 2020 21:09
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Kavak posted:People are really not in the mood for bleak post-apocalyptic torture porn right now for some reason. Also Sony AAA fans need to be reminded to breathe through their noses so of course they're shocked and outraged that Sad Murder Dad Gets Murdered, Sad. Yeah I agree with this personally at least. I just finished Days Gone recently and thought it was a really good game, at least tangentially similar in setting to TLOU, but so much more fun to play in terms of tone and approach. There were a few torture porn-ish scenes and they were completely unnecessary and didnt particularly add anything to the overall tone of the game
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Apr 30, 2020 21:15
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Zeta Acosta posted:Im going to be the contrarian: the uncharted series is loving trash also the bloody baron in witcher 3 is better than everything naughty dog has done so far Uncharted is fun but Bloody Baron's deal would've been improved if I could've made the lovely sergeant at his hideout dead like he needed to be from the start, honestly if there was a "Kill the Baron's whole group of dudes" choice I would've never picked anything different, a bunch of his own story got muddied super hard for me by how trash his people were. Yardbomb fucked around with this message at 21:31 on Apr 30, 2020 |
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Apr 30, 2020 21:27
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SIGSEGV posted:It's not that we didn't get what the game was trying to say, it's that we thought the game was stupid, pretentious and incompetent in saying it and that soured us on it and we went for other interpretations that Neil Drukman doesn't approve of, but that the material supports more, because he hosed up. i dont think theres anyone that thinks that, the people who think joel is good obviously think they suck, and the people who understood the very simple story know both suck Kavak posted:People are really not in the mood for bleak post-apocalyptic torture porn right now for some reason. Also Sony AAA fans need to be reminded to breathe through their noses so of course they're shocked and outraged that Sad Murder Dad Gets Murdered, Sad. i mean, being honest, despite the reaction here everyone knows tlou2 is going to sell pretty well regardless
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Apr 30, 2020 21:28
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Stux posted:i mean, being honest, despite the reaction here everyone knows tlou2 is going to sell pretty well regardless The PS4 store also has no real refund policy. I expect a 50% gap in critic and fan ratings, though.
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Apr 30, 2020 21:33
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Skippy McPants posted:Like, here's what I expect from TLoU 2. It's somewhat speculative, but it's what I'd do if I had to write a lovely Revenge R Bad narrative. Also that leak video should have stayed. This is the spoilers thread for fucks sake.
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Apr 30, 2020 21:54
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Kavak posted:People are really not in the mood for bleak post-apocalyptic torture porn right now for some reason. I am always in the mood for that
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Apr 30, 2020 21:58
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Zeta Acosta posted:Also that leak video should have stayed. This is the spoilers thread for fucks sake. yeah I don't quite get the mod decision here. I don't think having the leak link here is going to open SA up to any legal liability, and this is a thread for specifically talking about leaks, unless a new rule was added that I'm not aware of?
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Apr 30, 2020 22:07
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Jason Schreier states that he believes this leak origin narrative to be false and that for all of ND's faults, he does not have evidence of pay withholding https://twitter.com/jasonschreier/status/1255974873047891968
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Apr 30, 2020 22:45
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We frankly need to be able to talk about where leaks are being posted even if we don’t link to them directly, in the same sense that we don’t link to torrents on The Pirate Bay but the site has been discussed before here. This thread is otherwise just going to be a bunch of people reacting to things they’ve seen in places off-site and other people not knowing what the gently caress. We have already seen baseless conjecture like “Abby is trans” being accepted as possible truth until people set it for the record. People are going to eat troll-bait if we can’t even discuss where these rumors are coming from. I don’t know if this is something the admins had a hand in or the forum’s mods on their own, games don’t have leaks like this very often but movies and TV shows etc do fairly regularly now so this isn’t new to SA. Edit: Actually people posted the Pokémon Sword & Shield strategy guide leaks that eventually got some Discord user taken to court by The Pokémon Company, so I know even Games has been here before. Craptacular! fucked around with this message at 23:35 on Apr 30, 2020 |
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Apr 30, 2020 23:28
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I have found no spoiler yet that reveal what will be the new giraffe scene. This is very distressing because that really was the peak of the whole thing.
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Apr 30, 2020 23:45
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Wulf posted:I have found no spoiler yet that reveal what will be the new giraffe scene. This is very distressing because that really was the peak of the whole thing. giraffes were symbols of hope and healing in the original and thus have no place in the sequel
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Apr 30, 2020 23:47
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Abby breaks a giraffe's neck with a suplex
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Apr 30, 2020 23:56
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GOT and TLJ were spoiled to hell and back with direct quotes, images, pictures et all. I dont know why this is different.
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Apr 30, 2020 23:59
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a bunch of people itt saying “Ellie was a terrible person in TLOU and you’re an idiot if you didn’t see that” but I don’t really remember anything she did that was objectionable? It’s probably because I played it once 5 years ago and it mostly bored me so I wasn’t fully paying attention but all I remember about her is: she wanted to be useful but Joel kept trying to keep her from killing anyone, then she almost got eaten by cannibals and killed a dude in self-defense. I definitely remember Joel robbing stagecoaches while wearing his signature red carnation over the clasp of his dashing capelet but I really don’t remember her doing anything bad.
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May 1, 2020 00:04
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Bonaventure posted:a bunch of people itt saying “Ellie was a terrible person in TLOU and you’re an idiot if you didn’t see that” but I don’t really remember anything she did that was objectionable? It’s probably because I played it once 5 years ago and it mostly bored me so I wasn’t fully paying attention but all I remember about her is: she wanted to be useful but Joel kept trying to keep her from killing anyone, then she almost got eaten by cannibals and killed a dude in self-defense. Who said Ellie is a terrible person in TLOU? I genuinely can't remember even one person, let alone a bunch of people, saying that. Pretty much the entire argument is based around Joel and I don't think anyone holds Ellie at fault.
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May 1, 2020 00:13
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Oxxidation posted:everyone in tlou is scum and that includes ellie
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May 1, 2020 00:20
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Oh. Well, I wouldn't take Oxxidation's post at face value in that case!
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May 1, 2020 00:20
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ImpAtom posted:Who said Ellie is a terrible person in TLOU? I genuinely can't remember even one person, let alone a bunch of people, saying that. Pretty much the entire argument is based around Joel and I don't think anyone holds Ellie at fault. i did, mostly on the merits that no one in tlou is blameless and anyone hunting for a "good guy" in that story is looking at it the wrong way
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May 1, 2020 00:20
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I guess I assumed a lot of the subsequent conversation, since it didn’t challenge that assertion, gave tacit assent to it but in retrospect it just meant everyone else was wise enough not to bite.
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May 1, 2020 00:27
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What evil did Ellie do? Serious question.
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May 1, 2020 00:41
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Ellie killed a bunch of people in the DLC who didn’t directly have it coming, I think, but she’s less “evil” and it’s more “nobody in the post apocalypse has a clean conscience”.
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May 1, 2020 00:46
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Dewgy posted:Ellie killed a bunch of people in the DLC who didn’t directly have it coming, I think, but she’s less “evil” and it’s more “nobody in the post apocalypse has a clean conscience”. i don't blame her for the throats she cuts (a sizable number of those people literally wanted to eat her) but she's weak, self-absorbed, and self-destructive to the point where her decision to go on the table in the game's final chapter is almost definitely based in suicidal urges more than any actual benevolence, as she herself sort of admits in the ending. she's part of the disastrous collision in that hospital just as much as joel and marlene are, as her insistence on making the trip even though it's all but certain it's a lost cause is because she wants all the poo poo she's been through to be worth something none of this is because of some inherent defect in her character, she went through one bout of nastiness after another with no real role models or guardians besides the breathtakingly dysfunctional joel. but that's tlou in a nutshell, broken people destroying each other in their efforts to find a reason to give their lives meaning
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May 1, 2020 00:52
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I enjoyed cleaning out the hospital. I was like yeah eat poo poo cultists give me back my daughter.
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May 1, 2020 00:53
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ErrEff posted:The overwhelming reaction I'm seeing from random strangers on the internet is that they're mad about Joel dying. This happens I found with a lot of media. People find reasons to excuse a lot of awful stuff as long as it is the protagonist doing it.
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May 1, 2020 00:55
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blackguy32 posted:This happens I found with a lot of media. People find reasons to excuse a lot of awful stuff as long as it is the protagonist doing it. *waves a big "Breaking Bad" flag*
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May 1, 2020 00:56
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blackguy32 posted:This happens I found with a lot of media. People find reasons to excuse a lot of awful stuff as long as it is the protagonist doing it. If I was guessing the reasons for why and how the character swap occurs I'd reckon its out of a direct reaction to this.
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May 1, 2020 01:05
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blackguy32 posted:This happens I found with a lot of media. People find reasons to excuse a lot of awful stuff as long as it is the protagonist doing it. Because you empathise with them. The setting for this game and other stuff isn't exactly day to day living so when you've got some background and understanding of them you get it. I like it when media gets you understanding protagonist and antagonist. I don't think this will deliver, but if they can get you on side for Ellie and Abby where you don't want either to win it'll be big time good story.
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May 1, 2020 01:10
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its fine to not want the character you play as to "win"
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May 1, 2020 01:16
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Stux posted:its fine to not want the character you play as to "win" I mean kill the other. I measure winning and losing by who survives in both real life and fantasy
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May 1, 2020 01:44
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BOAT SHOWBOAT posted:All of these retrospective "TLOU 1 was overrated trash" "was just OK/competent" takes are so hollow. It was a game that was almost universally loved upon release. Sure, emphasis on almost and some of you might be the exception, but it stinks of contrarian nonsense. No, actually, the reason I say TLoU is at best competent and is more accurately described as overrated trash. I don't hate hate people who like TLoU or anything - Opinion are subjective, if you like it you're not wrong - but I hate it because it inspires such insipidly loving braindead takes as this, where people say "OMG GAMES ARE ART NOW, YOU JUST DONT GET IT" because of this trash. The Last of Us fails on several levels. The first issue I take with it is the title. It's post apocalyptic fiction where humanity is on it's way out. It's on it's last legs. Yet despite that you never fail to run out of convenient groups of soldiers, bandits, cannibals, or whatever whenever the game needs to fill up a shooting gallery with enemies. You can say "oh but everything does that!" but no, good post apocalyptic fiction doesn't. How many fights do the father and son get into on The Road? "That's not a game!" you might protest. Fine, what about LISA? Nearly every enemy has a name and don't respawn. Every fight you get into, you have irreversibly incremented down the count of surviving humans one more notch. The implication is clear: This is it. The end of the human race. You might even say those people are the 'last of us' as a species :thinking: Now, not every piece of apocalyptic fiction needs to be like that, but a game literally called "The Last of Us" failing to inspire a sense of finality sure isn't a good sign about the quality of the writing to come. The game is just so drat 'safe'. People talk about how ~emotional~ it is when Joel loses his daughter in the first five minutes. It's one of the cheapest narrative tricks in the book. We as humans have lizard brains that make us more empathetic towards things when we can relate to them; If you say a rock has a family before smashing the rock, people will feel more sympathetic to the rock. That might work for most people, but it's sure not going to work for anyone who can see past how low effort it is. I know it's a lot more work to spend time and effort making people care about a character before killing them off, but if you want a story to have any impact on people who posses critical thinking abilities, you're going to have to do better than that. Stories don't need to be unique to be good. There's nothing new under the sun, after all. The Last of Us has a plot that's been done many, many times before though, and it fails to do anything beyond that. Joel and Ellie are as generic as generic gets. Naughty Dog builds it's games via series of setpieces and then figuring out how to connect them, which really shows here. The bond between Joel and Ellie feels like poo poo I'd see in a loving light novel, where the explanation for why they get closer is "because they're the main characters, silly!" and everything else in the game is like that too. You can basically tell every character's arc just from knowing the genre the game is in along with knowing the writers are hacks. Most of the moment to moment dialogue isn't much better. The game goes to comical lengths to make all of the antagonists as evil as possible, and then makes Joel and Ellie do terrible things too to make ~moral ambiguity~ but it all just loving falls flat for me because you get to the point where there's no reason to be invested in them except Stockholm syndrome. The gameplay is functional at best, repetitive and poorly executed at worst. It's just a series of AAA gameplay features like stupid instant crafting, garbage stealth where your AI partners could be sucking the enemies off and they wouldn't notice, and loving quick time events. The shooting sucks too. All the guns are boringly generic without things like Metro 2033's quality/bad quality ammo to liven it up, along with shooting that uses the loving bumpers to fire instead of the triggers. The one kind of zombie you have to slow walk past is also fuckin tedious because they so rarely are around other enemies or anything. Not to mention getting close means instant death for whatever reason, despite only detecting noise. Your noise, I mean. Not ellie's. She can run around like a dumbass child hopped up on coke and pop rocks and they won't notice any more than the humans. At least there's the mu- Oh wait no, there is no fuckin music half the time and what's there is once again generic as generic gets. It's like a Marvel movie soundtrack or something, which means you just get to sit in somber silence as you solve such creative puzzles as 'move the ladder then climb up it real slow'. Once again, if you like it, I don't really care. There are people who like everything from the straight up irredeemably bad to the sleep inducingly mediocre and it doesn't make a difference to me. What I do loving hate is people who act like people who have actually experienced something actually well made are the ones who are wrong because they call TLoU out for the overrated trash it is. PS: Better things you could play than The Last of Us. LISA the Painful - Infinitely better integration of story and gameplay elements, far better reasons to empathize with why the main character does the horrible things he does without resorting to cheap tricks or exposition. Spec Ops: The Line - Much more interesting 3rd person shooting mechanics along with more natural dialogue and a story that displays to us why the characters grow the way they do. Metro 2033 The STALKER series Also, Children of Men and The Road.
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May 1, 2020 02:25
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Cuntellectual posted:
You're completely insane.
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May 1, 2020 02:34
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RevolverDivider posted:You're completely insane. A lot of people don't realize it, but the actual interesting gameplay relating to sand isn't shooting the setpieces, it's firing and grenading sand on the ground to create clouds of sand as impromptou cover that lets you play more aggressively than your extremely low health would initially indicate, as well as impairing better armed enemies. I can't think of a single thing TLoU did that was a positive innovation on shooter gameplay. The enemy AI is also actually really good at doing things like providing covering fire so that other enemies can creep around to flank you, using grenades well, and changing cover when they can to get into better cover. Cuntellectual fucked around with this message at 02:44 on May 1, 2020 |
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May 1, 2020 02:39
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Cuntellectual posted:A lot of people don't realize it, but the actual interesting gameplay relating to sand isn't shooting the setpieces, it's firing and grenading sand on the ground to create clouds of sand as impromptou cover that lets you play more aggressively than your extremely low health would initially indicate, as well as impairing better armed enemies. The animation where enemies begged for their lives before you impaled them?
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May 1, 2020 02:44
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CharlieFoxtrot posted:The animation where enemies begged for their lives before you impaled them? Spec Ops The Line had execution animations that grew more and more vicious as the game went on, from 'quick and clean' to 'victim tries to futilely push you away as you jam a shotgun into his mouth' as the situation devolves further and further. I don't think it was the first game to do that, but if nothing else it did that before TLoU almost exactly a year earlier. 
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May 1, 2020 02:46
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