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Roll20 has significantly more software support for pathfinder 2 than pathfinder 1 my man.
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May 8, 2020 18:21
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PinheadSlim posted:Yeah but that doesn't make the problem better. Pathfinder 1e had all them 3e adventures to run with very minimal conversion needed. That was one of the primary reasons to play it. Pathfinder 2e doesn't have that safety net, and that's not a failing of the company/game or anything it's just not good for all of those original customers who might have seen a lot of appeal in an endless sea of premade adventures. Sort of a corollary to this, but when I tried to sell my old DM on 4E, he stated quite plainly that he was too invested in his massive 3.x library, RIFTS and the cancerous mass of 4X game he'd grown out of GURPS to pick up a new system. I can't blame him for that.
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May 8, 2020 18:41
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Bieeanshee posted:the cancerous mass of 4X game he'd grown out of GURPS I...I kinda want this. I have a real nostalgia for games that are just binders and binders of barely-organized rules.
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May 8, 2020 18:56
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GURPS 4X sounds awesome and terrible and I wish to know more.
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May 8, 2020 19:04
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e: nm
Absurd Alhazred fucked around with this message at 19:13 on Jul 22, 2020 |
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May 8, 2020 19:53
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Bieeanshee posted:Sort of a corollary to this, but when I tried to sell my old DM on 4E, he stated quite plainly that he was too invested in his massive 3.x library, RIFTS and the cancerous mass of 4X game he'd grown out of GURPS to pick up a new system. I can't blame him for that.
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May 8, 2020 20:00
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Absurd Alhazred posted:Outside of Roll20 it seems to be doing pretty well, isn't it? Didn't we have a discussion about that a few pages ago? I dunno about that. In my experience it's doing okay but I still see more people playing 1e. For example I hopped onto the Hero Lab forums to see what kind of user made data sets there were and I happened to see there are only 10 users browsing the 2e forum while there are 167 users in the 1e forum. Maybe that's just Hero Lab users though? So I hopped on to the pathfinder subreddit and most posts are categorized as 1e or 2e, and a substantial majority of the posts are 1e. So yeah I'm not sure I believe it's as successful as some people think it is.
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May 8, 2020 20:42
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e: nm
Absurd Alhazred fucked around with this message at 19:13 on Jul 22, 2020 |
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May 8, 2020 20:48
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Absurd Alhazred posted:I think you need to temper your expectations for something that just came last year completely displacing the product that had been on the market for more than a decade from the same company. People aren't going to immediately throw their old books in the trash. I mean, outside of TRPGs, that's basically what happens. Only committed diehards stick with old versions of Street Fighter or whatever.
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May 8, 2020 20:49
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e: nm
Absurd Alhazred fucked around with this message at 19:13 on Jul 22, 2020 |
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May 8, 2020 20:51
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Absurd Alhazred posted:Well, we are talking about TTRPGs. And it's funny you're talking about "committed diehard" and old versions of games because retro gaming and retro game streaming are pretty big on Youtube and Twitch. There's a whole industry of people speedrunning old games. I know, I am the diehards. 
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May 8, 2020 20:56
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e: nm
Absurd Alhazred fucked around with this message at 19:13 on Jul 22, 2020 |
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May 8, 2020 20:59
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Absurd Alhazred posted:It is not dead which can forever be done/ pro-tier username/post combo
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May 8, 2020 21:13
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Part of the PF2 thing is also the currently limited stuff for it. I have a bunch of friends in a long-running PF1 campaign, and they're gonna swap over once they finish. But a bunch of them are in weird classes or races that just aren't in PF2 so far, so they're not gonna bother converting over. I think you'll see a fair bit of people shift over once there's more stuff. PF1 was able to take off because you had almost the entire 3.x catalog to use at the start with easy conversions. Not quite as simple to swap to 2e from first.
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May 8, 2020 21:18
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Pathfinder 2e is a subscription model, right? How is that going over (pre-Covid) with game stores? Part of the reason for game stores to carry a game is to get people in to the store, playing it, and they buy stuff, and buy the game too. But if those customers are already armed with all the books and game supplements and stuff because they bought a subscription, why should the game store support it? I imagine someone thought of this and had organized play or something to make sure FLGSes have an incentive to support the game, yeah?
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May 8, 2020 21:27
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Probably about the same that Pathfinder 1e did, which was also a subscription model. Not everyone who plays buys a subscription, since that's only worth it if you plan on using literally every book available, rather than picking and choosing. And yeah, if you're playing in their Organized Play you get some minor bonuses if you buy stuff from the store you're playing in and show the GM your receipt.
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May 8, 2020 21:35
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D&D 5e does have a massive amount of support and premade tools and all sorts of handy stuff to make it supremely playable on roll20 though. Like, there's still no official way to get digital books outside of the ones on the roll20 platform for 5e are there?
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May 8, 2020 21:48
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e: nm
Absurd Alhazred fucked around with this message at 19:13 on Jul 22, 2020 |
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May 8, 2020 21:52
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Leperflesh posted:Pathfinder 2e is a subscription model, right? How is that going over (pre-Covid) with game stores? Part of the reason for game stores to carry a game is to get people in to the store, playing it, and they buy stuff, and buy the game too. But if those customers are already armed with all the books and game supplements and stuff because they bought a subscription, why should the game store support it? So basically Pathfinder 2e organized play can easily move to online with no problems (the same organized play sanctioning can be done online). Pathfinder has always been subscription model (note that it's not a pay a subscription and get all the rules; they sell subscriptions to their own product lines) in general, so it's no change for game stores; Paizo will happily sell you product to sell in your own stores, gives you advance release dates ahead of major online distributors to incentivize buying at your store, and so on. There's nothing particularly inimical about Paizo's sales to FLGS, but they don't have some dedicated new store support program.
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May 8, 2020 22:12
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Absurd Alhazred posted:I think you need to temper your expectations for something that just came last year completely displacing the product that had been on the market for more than a decade from the same company. People aren't going to immediately throw their old books in the trash. That's also compounded by how (a) Hero Lab Online is itself a new product compared to the desktop Hero Lab, and (b) Pathfinder 2e frankly needs a character generator much less than 1e.
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May 8, 2020 22:14
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Roadie posted:That's also compounded by how (a) Hero Lab Online is itself a new product compared to the desktop Hero Lab, and (b) Pathfinder 2e frankly needs a character generator much less than 1e. Well yeah that's exactly what I said, maybe it was just Hero Lab, that's why I checked Reddit too for a slightly more mainstream sample. Weirdly enough the ratio of 1e to 2e posts is even greater than the ratio of 1e browsers and 2e browsers on the Hero Lab forums. Not sure why.
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May 8, 2020 22:19
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Is Pathfinder doing any kind of organized play online? I’ve been cursing my luck that I’ve gotten into 2E right as all the pathfinder society stuff has shut down for the pandemic.
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May 8, 2020 22:20
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food court bailiff posted:Is Pathfinder doing any kind of organized play online? I’ve been cursing my luck that I’ve gotten into 2E right as all the pathfinder society stuff has shut down for the pandemic. PFS runs online games, and there are a bunch of online games being organized for the online PaizoCon.
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May 8, 2020 22:25
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PinheadSlim posted:Well yeah that's exactly what I said, maybe it was just Hero Lab, that's why I checked Reddit too for a slightly more mainstream sample. Weirdly enough the ratio of 1e to 2e posts is even greater than the ratio of 1e browsers and 2e browsers on the Hero Lab forums. Not sure why. That would probably be because most people are using the Pathfinder2e subreddit for 2e posting.
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May 8, 2020 22:52
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Roadie posted:That would probably be because most people are using the Pathfinder2e subreddit for 2e posting. That makes sense, serves me right for getting info from a site I don't understand. Weird that they still do 2e discussion when they have both subreddits. The user ratio between the two subs is much better than I thought it would be too, only about 1/3rd the active users as /r/Pathfinder_RPG but that really is good for how long its been out.
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May 8, 2020 22:56
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Hey guys, remember that Kickstarter for the pretty-but-often-illegible dice that got substantially more money for pledges than anyone here thought they could feasibly fulfill? Well guess what.... https://twitter.com/ftjl/status/1258317842300067840
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May 8, 2020 23:04
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Arivia posted:So basically Pathfinder 2e organized play can easily move to online with no problems (the same organized play sanctioning can be done online). Ah OK, that makes a lot more sense to me. My FLGS was always super-heavy into PF1 - the owner ran it preferentially over 4e, and the shop culture followed suit - but these days I see as much 5e in there as PF2, and I didn't know if maybe he was just being brand-loyal or if that was the norm in other stores.
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May 8, 2020 23:31
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Nuns with Guns posted:D&D 5e does have a massive amount of support and premade tools and all sorts of handy stuff to make it supremely playable on roll20 though. Like, there's still no official way to get digital books outside of the ones on the roll20 platform for 5e are there? You can pick up the digital books on Fantasy Grounds, too, but that's probably even less convenient than reading them through Roll20.
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May 9, 2020 03:06
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Leperflesh posted:Ah OK, that makes a lot more sense to me. Honestly in my experience as a store owner neither are great at support. Both offer various minor perks for buying from your LGS and have pretty rudimentary in-store play programs, but neither seem to have any interest in letting us price things even vaguely competitively with the Internet. For my money I'd take a MAPP over either, but FFG's stuff never really took off, so what can you do. My official events are D&D 5 because I'm heavily focused on new players, who want D&D if they know what's up, and who are generally well-served by 5E as an intro if they don't. Left to my own devices I'd run neither, but I also can't sell "homebrew hackjob of 4E and PBTA designed to emulate Persona" or whatever nonsense I'm into at the time, so I do that on my own time, heh.
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May 9, 2020 04:09
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:I know, I am the diehards.
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May 9, 2020 04:52
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Worth noting that the methodology is garbage for the Orr report, and that's the company that owns Roll20 so it's basically a marketing infographic. Which sucks because I wish there was good data.
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May 9, 2020 06:16
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So Mearls is writing for Frog God now, huh?
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May 9, 2020 07:37
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theironjef posted:So Mearls is writing for Frog God now, huh?  lol gently caress released May 1, 2020
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May 9, 2020 07:43
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"Mike Mearles"
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May 9, 2020 09:00
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What’s the deal with Frog God Games, again? Are they chuds? I have a hard time keeping track of all the small but apparently notable companies in ttrpgs
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May 9, 2020 10:10
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thetoughestbean posted:What’s the deal with Frog God Games, again? Are they chuds? I have a hard time keeping track of all the small but apparently notable companies in ttrpgs The company owner, Bill Webb, has made a habit of sexually harassing women at cons to the point that in 2017 he was nearly arrested at PaizoCon for it. "Nearly" only because the woman who was the target of it asked that he not be... because his wife and kids were there, and she didn't want to leave them stranded in Seattle. Roadie fucked around with this message at 10:25 on May 9, 2020 |
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May 9, 2020 10:18
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wow who wouldve thought Mike Mearls is a stupid rear end in a top hat???
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May 9, 2020 11:09
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PinheadSlim posted:Yeah but that doesn't make the problem better. Pathfinder 1e had all them 3e adventures to run with very minimal conversion needed. That was one of the primary reasons to play it. Pathfinder 2e doesn't have that safety net, and that's not a failing of the company/game or anything it's just not good for all of those original customers who might have seen a lot of appeal in an endless sea of premade adventures. What exactly makes Pathfinder 2nd Edition not compatible with 1e adventures anymore than you being unable to make a 3.0/3.5 adventure work for 5e? (The answer is you can convert them just fine) Nuns with Guns posted:D&D 5e does have a massive amount of support and premade tools and all sorts of handy stuff to make it supremely playable on roll20 though. Like, there's still no official way to get digital books outside of the ones on the roll20 platform for 5e are there? King of Solomon posted:You can pick up the digital books on Fantasy Grounds, too, but that's probably even less convenient than reading them through Roll20. I swear it feels like people here act like DnDBeyond doesn't exist sometimes, or something. Not a PDF technically, I suppose. Though it acts a lot like one via the mobile app. And out of all of my many PDF files for 5E from a lot of various companies, no matter how cleanly it's set up, none of them can compare for accessibility. Arthil fucked around with this message at 11:36 on May 9, 2020 |
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May 9, 2020 11:28
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Arthil posted:What exactly makes Pathfinder 2nd Edition not compatible with 1e adventures anymore than you being unable to make a 3.0/3.5 adventure work for 5e? (The answer is you can convert them just fine)
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May 9, 2020 11:59
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Nessus posted:We do not, as of yet, have the perfect warlock, rendering us immune to the rest of the jingle. Okay that made me laugh, dammit. Alongside that though DnD beyond is just kind of clunky. I much prefer things like Comp/Con from Lancer because it makes things relatively easy to understand and looks very stylish.
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May 9, 2020 12:28
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