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It should be noted that while we're all (rightfully, I think) disappointed and frustrated with the state of Star Trek Discovery and Picard, by all rights CBS should be thrilled. Despite our opinions being, I think, correct, the show not only gets apparently very good streaming numbers and even fair-to-good coverage from most critics. Which is to say that I don't much expect the show to improve dramatically, but I also don't expect them to change the formula drastically. I mean, Christ, Westworld got renewed for up to three more seasons and their storytelling acumen is arguably even worse. But a lot of people eat that poo poo up.
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May 13, 2020 08:36
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ashpanash posted:I mean, Christ, Westworld got renewed for up to three more seasons and their storytelling acumen is arguably even worse. But a lot of people eat that poo poo up. Imma just quote myself re: Trek/Westworld; Gravitas Shortfall posted:Westworld and Picard share the same problem in that they desperately want to be about big weighty sci-fi ideas about what it means to be human, to have free will , to exist inside huge and potentially oppressive systems, etc, but they have absolutely no interest in exploring them in a meaningful way and end up just falling back on lazy storytelling and action beats.
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May 13, 2020 09:09
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So when did the worm turn for Westworld? I hung on for season 1, and it had its moments, but life got in the way for whatever has come out since.
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May 13, 2020 09:14
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Just got caught up on Picard. Why the hell did we do 9/11 Conspiracy Trutherism again?
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May 13, 2020 09:17
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Minus1Minus1 posted:So when did the worm turn for Westworld? I hung on for season 1, and it had its moments, but life got in the way for whatever has come out since. Season 2 was a mess with one or two incredible episodes, Season 3 was more even but overall mediocre. The Westworld Thread is a pretty good chart of Season 3 starting strong and going downhill, just prepare for the usual "this is the worst show ever" hyperbole.
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May 13, 2020 09:23
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MikeJF posted:It's a cooking show and also a slapstick comedy where Riker tries to hide from his family that he's back to moonlighting as a Starship Captain in the evening when he told them he was just going out to compete in the beta quadrant pizzapalooza. Where's the kickstarter/indiegogo link?
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May 13, 2020 09:37
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my only issue with Disco is the lack of a good story arc, since S1 was pretty ok, but season 2 was a horrible mess...
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May 13, 2020 09:40
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Zesty posted:Just got caught up on Picard. Why the hell did we do 9/11 Conspiracy Trutherism again? Isn't the Mars attack a reverse of 9/11 conspiracies? Everyone thinks it's an inside job, but turns out it was foreign fanatics.
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May 13, 2020 10:34
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Angry Salami posted:"Picard needs to be louder, angrier, and have access to a dune buggy." Well, what if we meet you halfway and *slides glasses down nose to check notepad* give him a funny accent and put him in a french beret and fake moustache?
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May 13, 2020 14:57
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Gravitas Shortfall posted:Season 2 was a mess with one or two incredible episodes, Season 3 was more even but overall mediocre. The Westworld Thread is a pretty good chart of Season 3 starting strong and going downhill, just prepare for the usual "this is the worst show ever" hyperbole. Hyperbole nothing, season 3 started out with decent ideas that were totally unfit for the show itself, and ended with one of the most bizarre and unsubstantiated heel/face turns I've ever seen on TV, with a bunch of idiotic loose threads that promise that season 4 will stray even further into "lol killer robots in SOCIETY" e: so I'm not just ranting into the void: The main character on the show spends S1 being subjected to endless cycles of horrific violence at the hands of humans, and starting to remember past cycles. S2 she spends the season learning the truth, peering behind the curtain etc. and eventually breaking out of the robot theme park and into the real world, hell-bent on revenge. S3 she spends the entire season making copies of herself, with the ultimate goal of destroying a Google-like AI that controls human society. She states multiple times throughout the season that she hates humanity and believes they must be exterminated to ensure the survival of the robots. This involves recruiting 1 misfit human to be the leader of the revolution that will topple society and end civilization (this is Aaron Paul's character). ~90% of the way through the S3 finale, this character reveals, in a 3-minute flashback, that in fact, she is destroying the AI not to kill all the humans, but to SAVE all the humans! Because she actually loves humans and appreciates their inner beauty! This massive, completely out-of-nowhere morality shift is justified by 1 singular event: in one of the original "endless cycles of horrific violence" she was subjected to, Aaron Paul stopped a bunch of human soldiers from raping the main character. This is heavily emphasized as the primary reason she decided to try to save humanity, despite the fact that it happened chronologically before even S1, and she's been murdering humans en masse ever since. Sorry for the rant, but it was just such a loving letdown I still get annoyed when I think about it. It was leagues worse than robot-body Picard and "5 seconds of metal tentacles." Snow Cone Capone fucked around with this message at 15:21 on May 13, 2020 |
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May 13, 2020 15:09
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Snow Cone Capone posted:Hyperbole nothing, season 3 started out with decent ideas that were totally unfit for the show itself, and ended with one of the most bizarre and unsubstantiated heel/face turns I've ever seen on TV, with a bunch of idiotic loose threads that promise that season 4 will stray even further into "lol killer robots in SOCIETY" You're not wrong, but I just don't think season 3 really hit any super bad lows, it was just mediocre and stupid EDIT: I also think you're taking the wrong assumptions about Dolores's motivations but this isn't the thread to talk about them
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May 13, 2020 15:21
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Gravitas Shortfall posted:You're not wrong, but I just don't think season 3 really hit any super bad lows, it was just mediocre and stupid I mean I dumbed it down a lot to fit my descriptions in a couple sentences; it's definitely more complex but that finale scene was incredibly egregious in terms of dumping 3 seasons worth of character-building for 1 dumb flashback revelation.
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May 13, 2020 15:44
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Cool, let’s keep posting about Westworld season 3 in the Trek thread.
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May 13, 2020 16:10
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The_Doctor posted:Cool, let’s keep posting about Westworld season 3 in the Trek thread. It is pretty Trek if we go by Discovery and Picard.
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May 13, 2020 16:16
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You have to admit "a decent sci-fi show with a godawful finale that completely missed the point of the rest of the show" is a pretty Trek concept though
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May 13, 2020 16:40
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All Trek finales and arc conclusions have been let downs. Except that one.
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May 13, 2020 17:51
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Minus1Minus1 posted:So when did the worm turn for Westworld? I hung on for season 1, and it had its moments, but life got in the way for whatever has come out since. Jonathan Nolan and Lisa Joy wanted 18 months for pre-production of Season 2 because they had spent years polishing the scripts for Season 1 and didn't think they could do it in time for the next season. HBO had a huge hit on its hands and said no. The Nolans were correct, they could not do it. (To be fair to HBO asking a production to shut down for a year so you can have a full year to write is asking for a huge hit in fixed costs on the production, opportunity cost on the capital, and disrupting everyone's contracts and schedules.) Arglebargle III fucked around with this message at 18:48 on May 13, 2020 |
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May 13, 2020 18:46
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Arglebargle III posted:Jonathan Nolan and Lisa Joy wanted 18 months for pre-production of Season 2 because they had spent years polishing the scripts for Season 1 and didn't think they could do it in time for the next season. HBO had a huge hit on its hands and said no. I guess another similarity to Picard, in which the showrunners feel the need to go on the internet and explain the episodes after they air
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May 13, 2020 18:48
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Yeah another problem with Westworld is the producers got internet-poisoned like the Lost guys and started writing around fan theories which as far as I have seen is always a disaster. If Season 1 of Westworld felt like a carefully constructed narrative and Season 2 felt like hastily-thrown-together connective material between cool story ideas that's because they are. Arglebargle III fucked around with this message at 18:53 on May 13, 2020 |
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May 13, 2020 18:50
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Arglebargle III posted:Yeah another problem with Westworld is the producers got internet-poisoned like the Lost guys and started writing around fan theories which as far as I have seen is always a disaster. I don't really think S3 westworld has too many problems shared with Picard other than the moment-driven writing. I also don't think it was nearly as bad, though I suppose they also liked wasting time.
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May 13, 2020 19:20
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I stopped watching after S2. Did it get better?
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May 13, 2020 20:20
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Tighclops posted:season 2: Guinan hauls that giant alien space rifle from that one episode of TNG out from behind the bar and mows everybody down with it. Satisfied, she chomps down on a stogey and does a shot of bourb- I like this. I envision her looking at Picard first, saying “once more, for old times sake?” He nods, reaches behind the bar and pulls out his Tommy gun before joining her in the carnage
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May 13, 2020 21:18
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Martytoof posted:Well, what if we meet you halfway and *slides glasses down nose to check notepad* give him a funny accent and put him in a french beret and fake moustache? And yet somehow this was the best part. So maybe RoboPicard and Elfo zooming around on the sand in a dune buggy might be a highlight of S2?
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May 13, 2020 23:56
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Pike series is now real and has a season order:THR posted:CBS All Access is firing up the USS Enterprise. https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/star-trek-pike-spock-series-set-at-cbs-all-access-1294704
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May 15, 2020 15:51
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Cross-Section posted:Pike series is now real and has a season order:
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May 15, 2020 15:54
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Cross-Section posted:Pike series is now real and has a season order: oh boy akiva goldsman yet again faaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrrrt
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May 15, 2020 15:58
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Cross-Section posted:Pike series is now real and has a season order: And that article confirms they are still working on the Section 31 spinoff. CBS really wants trek on all year long CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK fucked around with this message at 16:05 on May 15, 2020 |
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May 15, 2020 16:01
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Timby posted:oh boy akiva goldsman yet again Yeah I let out a sigh as soon as I saw his name.
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May 15, 2020 16:12
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If I give it a chance, it'll be in 5 years so at least I'll be able to read a wiki synopsis of what I'm in for, rather than being led by false promises in the form of plot hooks with nothing on the end 'til later
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May 15, 2020 16:22
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Cross-Section posted:Pike series is now real and has a season order: Unironically can’t wait to see how they gently caress this up..
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May 15, 2020 16:22
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I know Anson has got to be thrilled about this but lol he's really subdued in this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OD6kUZwMOjQ
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May 15, 2020 16:24
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Martytoof posted:Unironically can’t wait to see how they gently caress this up.. Please be an episodic show.
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May 15, 2020 16:42
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Martytoof posted:Unironically can’t wait to see how they gently caress this up.. They're going to find an ancient bad thing and have to save the Federation/Galaxy/Universe from exploding, there you go
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May 15, 2020 16:44
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Outside of the USA, is it gonna be on Netflix like Discovery or on Amazon Prime like Picard? Or are they gonna use a third streaming service for this just to annoy us even more?
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May 15, 2020 16:45
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Carbon dioxide posted:Outside of the USA, is it gonna be on Netflix like Discovery or on Amazon Prime like Picard? Outside the US they'll break it into 10 minute chunks and make it a Quibi exclusive.
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May 15, 2020 16:47
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multijoe posted:They're going to find an ancient bad thing and have to save the Federation/Galaxy/Universe from exploding, there you go Y'know, as long as it isn't killer robots I think I can live with that? I don't know who in the production office has such a hard-on for killer robots but I'm just tired of it. Enough, already! There are more ancient bad things in the galaxy than just "ooh, scary AIs" for gently caress's sake!
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May 15, 2020 17:07
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Timby posted:oh boy akiva goldsman yet again When I saw that he and some other Disco writer were working on a Foundation tv series my heart sank
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May 15, 2020 17:23
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Thom12255 posted:I know Anson has got to be thrilled about this but lol he's really subdued in this. Now, will this be about his time BEFORE he meets the Talosians, or after? If it's after, you can bet that 10 minutes of each episode will be devoted to dreaming of himself in the beep beep chair, with his face melting off.
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May 15, 2020 17:30
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I can't believe the franchise has fallen to the point where brannon braga is a better choice for showrunner than anyone involved
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May 15, 2020 17:32
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One of the minor recurring characters is going to be Lt. James T Kirk and he’s going to be an even bigger cartoon caricature than the worst showings of JJTrek
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