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https://twitter.com/BBCPolitics/status/1268482288372899841?s=20 I really appreciate parliaments commitment to demonstrating how poo poo and inadequate their protections for people being forced back to work are yep someone might have had a case of the coronavirus so we'll send him home but make everyone else keep coming in until his test results come back in two days, but it's ok because we gave his seat a bit of a wipe just a shame Hancock and Johnson probably can't catch it again e: 2020 is the year that historians will come to regard as the beginning of "the cool zone"
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Jun 4, 2020 11:55
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Will newspapers still exist in 5 years time
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Jun 4, 2020 11:56
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The Labour right spent three years trying to coup Gordon Brown because he was insufficiently racist and the media hacked into the medical records of his dead child.
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Jun 4, 2020 11:59
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jabby posted:Very mixed feelings watching the protests. As a socialist, obviously gently caress yeah. But as a doctor there's something genuinely chilling about watching people merrily spread this disease that I spend every day fighting and watching people die from. Do you honestly think people haven't considered the consequences? People have spent the last 3 months forced to weigh the risk of their actions. Why would they stop now?
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Jun 4, 2020 12:00
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crispix posted:MAAAADDDDIIIEEEEEEEEEEEEEeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee I'm not actually going to click on any articles to find out, but I am mildly curious as to why it's taken 13 years to hone in on a prolific German sex criminal burglar who known to be in the area in his camper van at the time.
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Jun 4, 2020 12:02
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peanut- posted:I'm not actually going to click on any articles to find out, but I am mildly curious as to why it's taken 13 years to hone in on a prolific German sex criminal burglar who known to be in the area in his camper van at the time. Saved it for a distraction (I know someone else already said that in this thread yesterday). I have a couple of friends who are obsessed with the Maddie case (what I call 'soft UKIPers' of the "I'm not racist but there are too many brown people round here and they're all scammers and that's why doctors aren't allowed to sign passport photos anymore" variety - what might have been considered 'working class Labour' 50 years ago as one of my nans was - all for labour and equal pay but brown people... nah) and I assume they're representative of a sizeable proportion of the electorate.
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Jun 4, 2020 12:07
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At least in the states the protests might result in a couple states changing their police departments (and the federal government going full fascist with bipartisan support) In the UK they will be totally ignored apart from convincingly being blamed for the second wave. So yeah doesn't seem worth killing thousands of people during a once in a century plague to me. I think "if not now, when?" applies slightly less than usual during the plague
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Jun 4, 2020 12:13
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The government not publishing then censoring then publishing a document saying "yes covid is killing more Africans and Bangladeshis but we won't tell you why because the reasons are all really racist" right in the middle of this won't have helped.
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Jun 4, 2020 12:18
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what a tory oval office https://twitter.com/Jackson_Carlaw/status/1268461730503503877?s=20
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Jun 4, 2020 12:32
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peanut- posted:I'm not actually going to click on any articles to find out, but I am mildly curious as to why it's taken 13 years to hone in on a prolific German sex criminal burglar who known to be in the area in his camper van at the time. So obviously I'm not involved in the search for Madeleine but from the many True Crime podcasts I have listened to combined with reading reports of police investigations into crimes, I can make some educated guesses why he hadn't been interviewed before. Basically it's to do with not everyone knowing all the facts at the time. Like at the time he was in Portugal, he would not necessarily have been known as a sex criminal. (While reading reports indicate that he did commit a rape some time before Madeleine's disappearance, he was not convicted of that crime for years after the facts, so the police may not have been investigating him for years after.) It also seems that while he may have been engaging in some crimes at the time (drug dealing, burglary) he is unlikely to have been the only criminal in the area where Madeleine went missing. Basically more and more credible evidence that has made him a prime suspect would have only come to light in the fullness of time. The other big factor is that Madeleine's disappearance was a huge media spotlight in an area that would not have been used to that type of investigation. Crimes happening in tourist destinations like that can get very complicated with police butting heads over what is to be done and where. The lead investigator being an odd chap probably didn't help. I think the idea that the authorities knew about this for years but sat on it as a media distraction is far fetched. It's a 13 year old case. If the media and the establishment did want to hold this in reserve for a distraction, there are plenty of opportunities in the previous 13 years to deploy it. Now, while he does seem like a prime suspect (not to mention a dangerous person.), at best this guy is just the person in the area who could have done it at the time of the offence.
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Jun 4, 2020 12:36
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crispix posted:Until there's an election coming up And in the years meanwhile, they'll shove the overton window back further right and attempt to negate anything pushed forward by the left, aided by Starmer chasing further rightwards to attempt to placate the media and capital.
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Jun 4, 2020 12:44
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Jose posted:what a tory oval office Sticking people in prisons that don't work, disenfranchising them, and then throwing them out on the streets angry and unreformed is an insult to their next victim.
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Jun 4, 2020 12:45
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Guavanaut posted:I'm reminded of the response that Swedish warden gave to some American lawman who was all like "why are your prisons so soft, what the hell you let them join prisoners' unions and vote?" As if people like the shitwit quoted above actually care about the victims.
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Jun 4, 2020 12:50
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Tell me why this thought process of mine is too simplistic: prisoners should be allowed to vote, if only because they can then vote for people who promise to make the thing they're in prison for not a crime, and release those convicted of it. That works for things like drugs, and is unlikely to make any difference in actual bad crimes. I'm more down the No Prisons route myself, but the above is more as a rebuttal to people who think prisoners should never vote because reasons.
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Jun 4, 2020 12:52
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peanut- posted:I'm not actually going to click on any articles to find out, but I am mildly curious as to why it's taken 13 years to hone in on a prolific German sex criminal burglar who known to be in the area in his camper van at the time. It sounds like an anonymous tip off to some german tv show after he got imprisoned.
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Jun 4, 2020 12:53
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Bobstar posted:Tell me why this thought process of mine is too simplistic: prisoners should be allowed to vote, if only because they can then vote for people who promise to make the thing they're in prison for not a crime, and release those convicted of it. Prisoners should be allowed to vote because if imprisoning people disenfranchises them then there's double the incentive to lock up your political opponents on spurious charges.
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Jun 4, 2020 12:53
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thespaceinvader posted:Prisoners should be allowed to vote because if imprisoning people disenfranchises them then there's double the incentive to lock up your political opponents on spurious charges. I think that actually fits as a subset of my theory, although a weird circular one. Prisoners should be allowed to vote, so that they can continue to vote against the status quo (of people who put them in prison to stop them voting), but if they can vote, they won't get put in prison in the first place, etc. But yes I agree, that's also a good reason.
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Jun 4, 2020 13:01
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Prisoners should be allowed, and encouraged, to vote because participation in society decreases recidivism. That's the biggest reason. Other reasons include: Discouraging the perverse incentive to build huge prisons in small towns so that they can claim a large population while still having regressive local rear end politics (mostly a US thing). Stopping the mass disenfranchisement of certain groups that are likely to vote for people/parties/policies that the powerful don't like. Ending the logical loop that sees people criminalized for things that they can't then vote to decriminalize, like drug war nonsense.
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Jun 4, 2020 13:02
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Prisoners should be allowed to vote because it's their goddamn right to be able to vote. It's not like the people claiming "they don't have rights" would also say "they also shouldn't pay taxes".
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Jun 4, 2020 13:04
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If you're worried about the votes of prisoners significantly influencing national elections then something might have gone terribly wrong in your society.
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Jun 4, 2020 13:06
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Yes, which explains the places with the most opposition to it.
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Jun 4, 2020 13:10
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Only white collar criminals should lose the vote and all of the middle class are criminals
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Jun 4, 2020 13:17
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Guavanaut posted:Ending the logical loop that sees people criminalized for things that they can't then vote to decriminalize, like drug war nonsense. Yeah this is what I was driving at really, but you phrased it better. That's not even starting on people who have been in prison but aren't any more not being allowed to vote...
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Jun 4, 2020 13:18
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The Question IRL posted:So obviously I'm not involved in the search for Madeleine but from the many True Crime podcasts I have listened to combined with reading reports of police investigations into crimes, I can make some educated guesses why he hadn't been interviewed before. Pretty sure the Express kidnapped her, and killed Lady Di, just so they could sell endless headlines and Psychic Sally interviews about them both. More seriously, yeah, it seems to be one of those cases where it's the combination of intense media scrutiny, inept, inadequate, or inexperienced police work, the lead investigator dismissing anything other than his pet theories, and a lack of any obvious pointers to anyone specific. The Question IRL posted:Now, while he does seem like a prime suspect (not to mention a dangerous person.), at best this guy is just the person in the area who could have done it at the time of the offence. Also this.
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Jun 4, 2020 13:19
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Wow in 2016 the USA had 2.2 million people incarcerated, and around 138 million people voted in the presidential election.
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Jun 4, 2020 13:20
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Bobstar posted:That's not even starting on people who have been in prison but aren't any more not being allowed to vote... e: 10.43% including those currently in prison, ~9.8% excluding. Normal state. Guavanaut fucked around with this message at 13:29 on Jun 4, 2020 |
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Jun 4, 2020 13:25
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Well that settles it. My wife's antibody test came back as positive for previous COVID infection. We were both ill around Easter, with her losing all sense of taste & smell for a few weeks afterwards. Neither of us had the obvious symptoms of fever though, so we weren't certain what it was until now.
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Jun 4, 2020 13:38
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xtothez posted:Well that settles it. My wife's antibody test came back as positive for previous COVID infection. where did you get it? i think i might've had it although long enough ago that it might return negative anyway
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Jun 4, 2020 13:40
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Guavanaut posted:
This in particular has always felt to me more like an argument against setting up your voting boundaries such that they take account of large quantities of non-voting adults than specifically against disenfranchising prisoners - it would equally not be a problem if you didn't count the populations of those huge prisons as part of that district for determining where the boundary lines are drawn. but then, the entire point of the way that system is set up is specifically to allow doing that so
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Jun 4, 2020 13:40
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Brendan Rodgers posted:Wow in 2016 the USA had 2.2 million people incarcerated, and around 138 million people voted in the presidential election. Oh it's even worse than this, I'm an idiot, forgot that you don't have to be incarcerated to be disenfranchised, when you include probation and parolees the disenfranchised in 2016 was at 6.1 million, according to: https://www.sentencingproject.org/p...ent%20in%202016
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Jun 4, 2020 13:41
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Guavanaut posted:Yeah felon disenfranchisement is some bullshit and iirc Florida has like 10% of it's voting population disenfranchised, which isn't apartheid bad or Georgian Britain bad, but it's definitely "part-free state on the development index" bad. Well that's more terrible than I thought... This also goes back to what prison is for, i.e. what the punishment actually is. With prison, at it's most basic, it's deprivation of liberty (whether that's for punitive or public protection reasons). Then people make up their own add-ons to what prison "should" be like, such as - No Playstations - No TVs - No books - No exercise - No voting - Solitary confinement for all! If we're going to have prisons, then there should be a conversation about these things, but if you tried that, someone would say "holiday camps" and it would all be over, and all of the above and worse would end up being formalised. So abolish prisons, IMO.
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Jun 4, 2020 13:42
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Lol the guy who was ill at Commons yesterday had a meeting in number 10 with sunak there first
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Jun 4, 2020 13:42
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Jose posted:Lol the guy who was ill at Commons yesterday had a meeting in number 10 with sunak there first Tories seem to determined to sacrifice themselves doing human trials about whether you can get reinfected with COVID 19 or not.
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Jun 4, 2020 13:44
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https://twitter.com/tnewtondunn/status/1268515540819234817?s=20
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Jun 4, 2020 13:45
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The surviving mods of my usual Swansea City forum (one died of cancer the other day) are outing themselves as full-on anti-left bootlickers, which is a bit annoying. The site admin is starting individual threads for UK protesters he sees on twitter doing something he doesn't like saying "Shoot him". There's one fan from Texas who is well liked because he's made several trips over here over the years, and his twitter feed is just retweeting Trump and Trump-adjacent chud garbage. Call him a racist and the knives come out. The coronavirus arguments were enjoyable despite all the idiots sucking off our government's every miss-step. This is time to walk away and deny them all the benefit of my wisdom re: the youth sides and why our manager is loving poo poo. They all love Starmer as well as a sensible, electable, proper leader.
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Jun 4, 2020 13:45
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Jose posted:where did you get it? i think i might've had it although long enough ago that it might return negative anyway She's an A&E staff nurse; virtually the whole department is also getting positive tests too. Boris' plan is right on schedule.
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Jun 4, 2020 13:46
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Johnson: Even I've now realised how serious this is and will be taking charge of the COVID 19 response. *next day* Johnson: I have potentially caught COVID 19 again and will be retiring to Chequers for the next two weeks.
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Jun 4, 2020 13:50
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sassassin posted:The surviving mods of my usual Swansea City forum (one died of cancer the other day) are outing themselves as full-on anti-left bootlickers, which is a bit annoying. The site admin is starting individual threads for UK protesters he sees on twitter doing something he doesn't like saying "Shoot him". The most shocking thing about this is the idea that the Swans have a following outside of Swansea.
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Jun 4, 2020 13:51
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Jose posted:Lol the guy who was ill at Commons yesterday had a meeting in number 10 with sunak there first  Wonder how many Tory MPs are thinking "You know, when Johnson said he wanted Herd Immunity, we didn't think he was talking about us."xtothez posted:Well that settles it. My wife's antibody test came back as positive for previous COVID infection.  You on the other hand, and other maybe infected posters ITT, hope you recover soon with no problems.And kudos to the posters ITT who daily have to interact and treat people, like Jabby. Or the ones who've had to work for various reasons. Stay safe. And to all the vulnerable posters too.
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Jun 4, 2020 13:52
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thespaceinvader posted:This in particular has always felt to me more like an argument against setting up your voting boundaries such that they take account of large quantities of non-voting adults than specifically against disenfranchising prisoners - it would equally not be a problem if you didn't count the populations of those huge prisons as part of that district for determining where the boundary lines are drawn. Bobstar posted:Well that's more terrible than I thought...
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