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GHOST_BUTT posted:Charlemagne is Good, Actually because of the large number of tribal rulers that you can take in whatever direction you want. 
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Jun 9, 2020 10:06
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To be clear, paradox has said they're open to doing more start dates as DLC. The feature they said they don't want to ever return to is being able to pick any day in history from 1066 to the end of the game. That's probably not a feature paradox is ever going to revisit in their future titles.
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Jun 9, 2020 10:48
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I don't blame them tbh, seeing as the workload of trying to fill every date versus how much the non starter dates were used must of been incredibly demoralising.
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Jun 9, 2020 10:55
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:To be clear, paradox has said they're open to doing more start dates as DLC. The feature they said they don't want to ever return to is being able to pick any day in history from 1066 to the end of the game. That's probably not a feature paradox is ever going to revisit in their future titles. Kinda wish they could just copy over each post-1066 day, even as a DLC. Part of the game is clicking around all the dates and looking at rulers. I'd argue that's part of the game if we're just counting by hours spent with the application open, whether or not anyone actually starts a game. BBJoey posted:i'd like additional start dates as DLC for CK3. i suppose it could start arguments about how they're charging for something that was free in CK2, but i'd like to think people would understand that properly researched and fleshed out start dates are more valuable and interesting than the half-functioning later dates in CK2. What do you mean half-functioning? All the monarch's journeys seem to be working fine. Do you just mean missing events?
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Jun 9, 2020 18:51
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https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/threads/crusader-kings-3-dev-diary-30-event-scripting.1397140/ New dev diary on event scripting
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Jun 9, 2020 19:13
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GHOST_BUTT posted:Charlemagne is Good, Actually because of the large number of tribal rulers that you can take in whatever direction you want. Yeah Charlemagne is a good "sandbox" start, since so much of the map is undeveloped, the main problem is the blobbiness of Europe/the middle east.
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Jun 9, 2020 20:19
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The Cheshire Cat posted:Yeah Charlemagne is a good "sandbox" start, since so much of the map is undeveloped, the main problem is the blobbiness of Europe/the middle east. Plus mega-Tibet that has a 50% chance of being absorbed by the Western Protectorate, loving up games near-China.
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Jun 9, 2020 21:54
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Ironically, you could probably improve the Charlemagne start dramatically by just deleting all the Karlings.
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Jun 9, 2020 22:00
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i guess it depends on what you consider bad about it. the blobbiness of karl ends up being super overstated in my mind. all his vassals start out hating his loving guts which means that there's a real chance he'll end up either murdered before he can form the HRE or going full satan in order to try to fight back against the intrigue, which also pretty much guarantees he will not form the HRE because he's too busy brawling with the pope over everything to get the conditions met. he might form francia, but that's a more traditional empire with traditional splintering mechanics; it can be hard to break up, but very, very far from impossible. the umayyads and the abbasids start out really, really intimidating but the muslim decadence mechanics mean that they're basically on a timer from the beginning. within 100 years they're pretty much guaranteed to see their first decadence revolt unless they start holy warring europe in the first 50. and that's not talking about the rise of the shia event which WILL gently caress things up in the muslim world in that time period somehow. the byzantines are the really big blob threat in my mind, but the same mechanics that make them hard to splinter also make it hard for the AI to gain a lot of real momentum. every time the ruling dynasty changes the new emperor spends half of his life ratfucking various people out of titles to give them to his family. so yeah, they're a big threat, but they're also mostly going to stay put until you're ready to handle them. the main thing i dislike about it is that directly on the year 800 every loving viking on the planet will start raiding and it will completely screw up anyone nearby. it is, conversely, incredibly nice to be a viking in 800, but holy gently caress one of the things that keeps me from making another 769 start is january 1, 800.
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Jun 9, 2020 22:20
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Incidentally, I made it a goal of my viking game to stamp out the Karlings once I was done booting the Chrstians from Europe. That turned out to be much, much harder, those fuckers scattered to the wind whenever I took a crown and put it on a Knytling. They somehow wound up holding half the duchies in Sub-Saharan Africa, which is around when I decided to live and let live.
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Jun 9, 2020 22:34
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As noted, I am a Charlie start advocate, but the Viking thing is 100% valid. It is, however, not particularly exclusive to the Charlemagne start as playing anything other than Norse in Old Gods sucks for the same reason.
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Jun 9, 2020 23:58
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Help I'm playing Venice 769 again. I got an invasion request for Italy and took a duchy from Byzantium to form Italia, vassalized the Pope, and married my son to a Byzantine princess. When he took over I pressed my claim for Byzantium, destroyed the title out of spite, and handed out a dozen kingdoms to keep people relaxed. I can't decide how to shape my military as I cut a path over to China and conquer them!!
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Jun 10, 2020 00:01
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Coolguye posted:the blobbiness of karl ends up being super overstated in my mind. all his vassals start out hating his loving guts which means that there's a real chance he'll end up either murdered before he can form the HRE or going full satan in order to try to fight back against the intrigue, which also pretty much guarantees he will not form the HRE because he's too busy brawling with the pope over everything to get the conditions met. Karl also dies early fairly frequently, causing everything to go to his idiot brother Karloman, who is virtually guaranteed to gently caress everything up.
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Jun 10, 2020 00:09
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Soho Joe posted:Help I'm playing Venice 769 again. I got an invasion request for Italy and took a duchy from Byzantium to form Italia, vassalized the Pope, and married my son to a Byzantine princess. When he took over I pressed my claim for Byzantium, destroyed the title out of spite, and handed out a dozen kingdoms to keep people relaxed. Subjugate or take some bites out of Bulgaria. The Empire of Italia must not be split!
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Jun 10, 2020 00:18
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I think the problem with later start dates in EU4 is that within about a century or two after 1444, things already start to consolidate really fast. The colonial sprawl begins, some nations like the ottomans quickly make massive gains (that are literally impossible in actual gameplay) and so later start dates mean that you're starting out in a world where the great powers of the coming centuries are already pretty well defined, you don't get to play out the colonial land grabs and so on. Starting in 1444, there's still a lot of chances for things to go very differently Crusader Kings doesn't really have this problem, there isn't really as much of a linear progression towards consolidated great powers over the game's timeframe, and in fact some of the earlier start dates are a lot blobbier than later ones. For example, starting around the fourth crusade offers a lot of interesting possibilities that aren't possible in earlier centuries, since the whole byzantine region is in flux
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Jun 10, 2020 00:27
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The later start dates in EU4 are straight up broken, as they never got updated with newer additions to the game. Furthermore, the arc of the game is such that you really do miss out on the fun if you start at a later time period. With CK2 the basic mechanics of the game remain basically the same and functional no matter when you start, and it's fun digging around in history for interesting start dates. Personally I always like trying to find a sweet spot in the years after the Alexiad for that period of time when the HRE has lost it's grip on Italy so you have a bunch of little duchies, while the Byzantines are still recovering from Manzikert (though they quickly regain ground in most games).
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Jun 10, 2020 01:15
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Jedi Knight Luigi posted:Kinda wish they could just copy over each post-1066 day, even as a DLC. Part of the game is clicking around all the dates and looking at rulers. I'd argue that's part of the game if we're just counting by hours spent with the application open, whether or not anyone actually starts a game. It's not the creation of those start dates that's the problem, though that is quite labor-intensive. It's the QA testing. Every single feature needs to be tested to make sure there aren't any weird major that crop up in some later start dates, and it's a massive drain on the process. So no, I doubt they'll even do it as DLC.
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Jun 10, 2020 01:26
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McGavin posted:Karl also dies early fairly frequently, causing everything to go to his idiot brother Karloman, who is virtually guaranteed to gently caress everything up. haha oh my god every time i have seen karloman get his shot at glory it's like watching a slow motion train wreck. you think he might have it for a moment and maybe the train's going back onto the rails, and then a superduke revolts and it's like no son, that poo poo is not happening now or ever. one of the most entertaining starts i've ever done is as karl's vassal (dax) and seeing karloman get everything. i WAS one of the loving lunatic vassals and we inmates were running the asylum.
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Jun 10, 2020 09:03
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Various Meat Products posted:Devs said that nobody played any start date besides TOG and 1066 and it wasn't worthwhile to bother otherwise. No, I'm pretty sure that it was 769 being played the most but with a significant amount of players still picking 867 and 1066. Paradox players in general have a mental block where they must pick the earliest date available, CK2 was pretty unique in later dates still being picked a bit (but extremely few post 1066). Anyway, more start dates might happen but I really doubt you'll ever see the "pick any date" thing they started in EU3.
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Jun 10, 2020 11:40
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CK2 is also unique in that starting dates have very little unique content. Charlemagne and Iron Century get some special events but only for a few characters. You don't feel like you lose a lot starting later. But EU4 (and probably HoI4) is frontloaded with early events cause obviously later you can't make events about the specific situation. CK2 somewhat reverses that: you get special invasions, epidemics, late game imperial administration mechanics and events. Early on there's what, events about Shia and Viking age?..
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Jun 10, 2020 11:48
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I liked picking around for start dates. I had some nice fun with independent northern Italy, which you only get with way later start dates. I think that the one big thing that does change over time in the time period that EU4 takes place over is the centralization of authority in countries, instead of border consolidation, which is really not well-represented by the game.
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Jun 10, 2020 17:21
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I finally played Charlemagne and I think I've detected a minor flaw in the event-driven campaign.
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Jun 12, 2020 03:10
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I noticed in CK3 it seems Ambitious and Diligent both add to your Stress gain. I like this fairly small change, because they're universally good traits that give you bonuses all around, but also mean that if you act against your traits you might get mental breaks very quickly. I am really hyped for CK3 after the past few months of Dev Diaries. I can't wait to dig into the game to try some stuff, then digging into code and see if I can't make a mod or three.
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Jun 12, 2020 17:17
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Vivian Darkbloom posted:I finally played Charlemagne and I think I've detected a minor flaw in the event-driven campaign. idgi
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Jun 12, 2020 22:11
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Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
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Magil Zeal posted:I noticed in CK3 it seems Ambitious and Diligent both add to your Stress gain. I like this fairly small change, because they're universally good traits that give you bonuses all around, but also mean that if you act against your traits you might get mental breaks very quickly. I am almost more excited for the mods that are gonna come out of CK3 than the main game itself. The religion system alone will make CK3 ports of several fantasy or alt history CK2 mods much cooler. And yeah, I'm also excited that there aren't just blankly positive or negative traits now. Like, diligent in CK2 technically made you more likely to get stressed, but considering how easy that is to remove and how random the event can be, that barely matters. Hellioning fucked around with this message at 22:27 on Jun 12, 2020 |
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Jun 12, 2020 22:23
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I particularly appreciate that different faiths can have different ideas of what's sinful and what's virtuous. Some crazy stuff could come out of that.
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Jun 12, 2020 22:29
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Some mods already do that, but it'd be nice to have it enshrined in the rules instead of having larger, clunkier tooltips of 'this religion +5 opinion' in addition to the actual effects, yeah.
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Jun 12, 2020 22:34
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Coolguye posted:i guess it depends on what you consider bad about it. Funny enough on all of the 769 starts I've done recently, there end up being multiple big blobs that last all the way through the 900s: Sunni Hispania, The Arab Empire and the Byzantine Empire. Also Khazaria. I haven't seen the Karlings blob successfully in a while.
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Jun 13, 2020 00:19
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Hellioning posted:I am almost more excited for the mods that are gonna come out of CK3 than the main game itself. The religion system alone will make CK3 ports of several fantasy or alt history CK2 mods much cooler. I've never really been interested in the big total conversion mods for CK2 myself (we'll see if that changes for CK3), but it will be interesting to see just how far the religion system can be pushed. I've got a few ideas myself about beliefs I'd like to create, if they're possible. I'm a little disappointed that it seems there will be no Imperial government at launch, but I'm guessing/hoping that means it will get a lot of attention later and be a bit more of a comprehensive/involved thing than the Imperial Elective succession law in CK2. In the meantime, I am curious about the Clan government; I've seen precious little information on it other than it's somewhat like Iqta but "more feudal". Really, I just want more incentive to try and make sure that my dynasty is growing in power and in particular heirs are landed, because the CK2 "keep them in a box" strategy never really sat right with me. So things like the Dynastic Legacy bonus system and Clan government are both things I'm watching closely. It's why I've been more or less sold on CK3 since the first dev diary but I've really only gotten more hype since then.
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Jun 13, 2020 05:01
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PittTheElder posted:idgi Charlemagne's brother died at random, thereby giving me the most powerful realm in the world and wrecking the series of historical events. At least, I don't think that's supposed to happen.
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Jun 13, 2020 05:07
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That's what happened in history though.
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Jun 13, 2020 05:10
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Amergin posted:Funny enough on all of the 769 starts I've done recently, there end up being multiple big blobs that last all the way through the 900s: Sunni Hispania, The Arab Empire and the Byzantine Empire. Also Khazaria. Same, I like the 769 start well enough, but in any given game you do often end up with 2/4 blobs hanging around for a while. Karlings and Hispania most likely to break up, in that order. Khazaria does tend to get large but I’ve never had issues squishing them when the time came. Whoever pointed out that the byzantines end up infighting too much to expand is right though - the blob is there, and large, but frequently revolting against itself, and has real trouble expanding west very much I’ve found if you power through to 1100 or so, the byzantines and Arab empire tend to split. Winning a crusade in Africa, Egypt, or Jerusalem can shatter the Arab empire in a hurry.
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Jun 13, 2020 05:13
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Mantis42 posted:That's what happened in history though. Well that's dumb
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Jun 13, 2020 05:18
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Vivian Darkbloom posted:Well that's dumb Take it up with the developer
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Jun 13, 2020 05:20
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I played a couple more decades and founded the HRE. This makes me the only big Catholic realm around. I guess this doesn't totally kill the challenge, since HRE is Princely Elective and the dukes don't seem to like Karlings much. Plenty of crusading to be done too.
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Jun 13, 2020 16:50
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I do like that CK2 pushes the conspiracy theory that Karloman was killed by his own mother at Karl's request.
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Jun 13, 2020 17:11
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You think that's broken? I ended up marrying some Italian girl, dropping her because the people hated her, and... Get this... Ended up with a claim on Lombardy!
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Jun 13, 2020 18:16
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Do AI characters spend money on buildings, troops, diplomacy, and such? Like, are the calculations greatly simplified for marginal characters such as barons?
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Jun 13, 2020 20:28
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Barons and landless people* run a simplified simulation, yes. I think they still gain and spend money, but they don't experience nearly as many events or decisions as "full" characters. * I think they also get the full simulation if they are important for some other reason, like being a close family member of the player, or a council member?
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Jun 13, 2020 20:35
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The new Monarch's Journey rewards you with a Silver achievement just for starting it up.
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Jun 14, 2020 03:38
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