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And yet, it happens often enough most players have a story pertaining to it. So I suspect that the maths you're showing are after a patch or so. Is a little weird how defensive over it we're being though. It's just a funny thing we like to poke fun at cause the mental image is ridiculous.
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Jun 9, 2020 22:31
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i mean in the past it has been a point of very serious venom and contention and these numbers have been the thing since something like...b15? 14? i don't remember when the doctoring revamp was done, but it's been years at this point. like i said, if we're just memeing about it then yeah it totally be like that sometimes but in previous days it has been the source of copious amounts of salt and thrashing on the game, along with earnest laments about how it will never be fixed because the developer is the sort of blockhead who thinks that's realistic. when really that's the cataclysm:dda guy.
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Jun 9, 2020 22:34
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There was a patch or two where the catastrophic failure rate was increased to happen too often but I haven't had any issues with it happening consistently. And yeah everyone has a story about the one catastrophic failure that screwed them over hard but that's because you forgot the other 100 times the leg just got installed without an issue. The stories are the whole point of the game anyway. I am sure there is a mod that completely eliminates catastrophic failure if you don't find it fun.
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Jun 9, 2020 22:42
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Ah, then I see where you're coming from, thanks for explaining. Let me assure you this isn't a salt or venom poke at the mechanic. (Though being dismissive of it as 'memeing' is a tad rude) Looking over the posts, I don't think many of us still think its a serious endemic problem. But of course, losing an expensive bionic part despite taking every possible precaution is still very memorable. And of course the way that wounds are generated upon a failure is also amusing to a lot of us, as in my own example, trying to replace a leg and cut wounds showing up at the opposite end of the patient is a hilarious moment of 'how the gently caress did that happen' which is always fun for the imagination. We still love this game, as I'm sure you do too. We wouldn't be here talking about it so much if we didn't. It's basically dwarf fortress in space, and it's great for that. I don't think any of us are really mad at the game at this point. (I'm certainly not. I still play it)
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Jun 9, 2020 22:46
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I've had my share of catastrophic nonsense happen but basically every time it's because I decided to roll the dice with a lovely hospital or else I pull up my Numbers tab, look at my surgery success chances and see it's because I screwed up and forgot to take the guy off doctoring after he got his arm shot off or else he'd been getting into the hooch
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Jun 9, 2020 22:50
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Drakenel posted:(Though being dismissive of it as 'memeing' is a tad rude)
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Jun 9, 2020 23:24
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How am I supposed to recruit using the Hospitality mod? I just got a notification that one of my departing guests is now willing to be recruited, and his guest tab shows the same, but I can't figure out the actual mechanism for recruiting. Selecting one of my colonists and then right clicking on the guest only gives me the option to trade.
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Jun 9, 2020 23:34
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Jewmanji posted:How am I supposed to recruit using the Hospitality mod? I just got a notification that one of my departing guests is now willing to be recruited, and his guest tab shows the same, but I can't figure out the actual mechanism for recruiting. Selecting one of my colonists and then right clicking on the guest only gives me the option to trade. I have never seen that! Tell me your secrets if you figure it out. Also, try commenting on the mod's workshop page, the dev helped me fix it last week. As for surgery chat my take on it is that it was very silly that one of my surgeons failed at installing a prosthetic arm so bad she left cuts on the patient's neck. How do you mess up that bad, you're like skill 12 and know what an arm is. ... but I'm not angry about it, and I don't care enough about it to look for a mod to fix it. It is a funny counterpoint to wherever Tynan has said that he wants things to be realistic, because lol
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Jun 9, 2020 23:40
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The specific surgery modes of failure are still fairly absurd, even if the probability of failure can be minimised fairly well. It doesn't make any sense that you end up with massive lacerations all over the body from trying to perform surgeryon a specific location. Plus the mechanic itself I don't think is especially well designed as if you don't already have a skilled surgeon there's literally no way to mitigate it, you can reduce the chance but occasionally the game just RNGs and kills/fucks up your pawn, there's no option for, say, using more medicine to stop critical failures. As a mechanic it just doesn't really work well, and really only encourages you to savescum, at which point why bother having it? I think you need a baseline level of interest for a mechanic to make it worthwhile, and surgery failure just doesn't have one. Because the consequences are either it works as intended or you get a really boring and unfun outcome at random. And you can work around it, sure, I just savescum past it, but I think that so many people feel the need to do that means the design of the mechanic is poor. If I was going to redo it I'd give you the option to spend more medicine and involve more pawns to improve outcomes, as well as including more medical equipment you can build, possibly involving parts you can only get from quests or trade. Also the game tells you the outcomes for a given expenditure beforehand. Make it a resource assignment decision rather than an RNG. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 00:09 on Jun 10, 2020 |
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Jun 10, 2020 00:04
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I think it would be super cool to allow more than 1 colonist work on a surgery and have each of their skills impact it with them sharing exp. So like, the lvl12 medical who has the rare chance of failure maybe gets stopped by the lvl5 medical who otherwise wouldn't have succeeded themselves, from stabbing an eye out while replacing a leg.
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Jun 10, 2020 00:10
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Would also give you the option to have a sort of apprenticeship system where pawns can learn outcome sensitive skills without producing useless poo poo so much. Good for things like art and high level crafting.
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Jun 10, 2020 00:38
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I’m on mobile but I'm pretty sure this is the mod I’ve used in the past to make surgeries go a little less crazy when they go wrong if you find the mechanic really annoying. It’s very true that the skill could use some equivalent of high quality crafting/constructing rather than just a failure chance, like mood boosts or efficiency gains from well fitted prostheses. By far though most of my surgery catastrophes come from forgetting about work priorities and a newly recruited prisoner with 4 medicine diving straight into the colony life with a bunch of pending surgeries. Less Arbitrary Surgeries quote:-If they don't succeed, they get a second chance to succeed with non-lethal injuries.
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Jun 10, 2020 01:15
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If you use the dragons mod and do the start where you're four tribal dudes who stole an egg..... make sure they have animal skills of at least 7. drat thing hatched and it's living in my warehouse eating my food and I can't tame it until a pawn levels up his animal skill.
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Jun 10, 2020 02:15
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Coolguye posted:sorry, didn't mean to have a dismissive tone on that. memes are good yo. We're cool, dude. Just didn't want ya to feel like I was trying to make it personal or anything. As for the hospitality thing, I may be misremembering, but I think it's an option you tick on in the guest tab when you have them selected. (Something about recruiting when they have enough friends, under the 'make default behavior or some such.)
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Jun 10, 2020 03:30
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SLR but thanks for the answers re: raid AI pathing. I got a riverside town that I built flush against the river so I feel like I may have hosed my shot at using it as a proper defensive moat, and I have also elected to build defensive positions around the whole town instead of walling it off so I'm using way too much power for turrets 24/7. I'm wondering how to rebuild it so I can actually present a single defensive line, hence my questions.
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Jun 10, 2020 04:10
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Jewmanji posted:How am I supposed to recruit using the Hospitality mod? I just got a notification that one of my departing guests is now willing to be recruited, and his guest tab shows the same, but I can't figure out the actual mechanism for recruiting. Selecting one of my colonists and then right clicking on the guest only gives me the option to trade. Click on the person you want to recruit, click on the guest tab. It's either a button or a box in there.
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Jun 10, 2020 04:52
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toasterwarrior posted:SLR but thanks for the answers re: raid AI pathing. I got a riverside town that I built flush against the river so I feel like I may have hosed my shot at using it as a proper defensive moat, and I have also elected to build defensive positions around the whole town instead of walling it off so I'm using way too much power for turrets 24/7. I'm wondering how to rebuild it so I can actually present a single defensive line, hence my questions. If power is a problem in the short term as you're building a wall, you can also build 1 tile power conduits next to turrets that are not connected to your power network. When you tell the turrets to Reconnect, they'll sometimes connect to the 1 tile power conduit and shut down. When raids come, click Reconnect again to stick back on to network. Also don't be afraid of ripping out huge chunks of a base and rebuilding.
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Jun 10, 2020 05:35
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Has anyone else loaded up drop pods with boomalopes and launched them at sieges and enemy defences?
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Jun 10, 2020 11:30
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Complications posted:Click on the person you want to recruit, click on the guest tab. It's either a button or a box in there. Am I missing a button or something?
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Jun 10, 2020 14:35
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If they are leaving the map then the recruit button goes away, you'll have to wait for them to visit again.
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Jun 10, 2020 15:04
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Surgery chat: I think I'm okay that it's a little unrealistic that someone stitching up a downed pawn might cut their ear or something. I think that sort of stuff is supposed to (in a tiny way) offset the fact that a dabbling pawn can perform a double lung transplant alone on a dirt floor and have a chance of succeeding at all. And also the patient is up and running laps half a day after. I wonder if anyone has made a "realistic medicine" mod? Like to train medicine past like 2 you have to rocket launch a pawn to the planet's medical school, wait eight in game years for them to return, and to perform anything more than splints and stitches they need a full surgical theater along with a posse of similarly trained pawns. And also any pawn who has had a major injury or procedure is down for days and then has to receive months of physical therapy from even more medically educated pawns.
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Jun 10, 2020 15:10
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This is the dark Rim future we’re talking about. It’s all offsite learning, source your own learning materials (including cadavers).
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Jun 10, 2020 15:58
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Holy poo poo the orbital battle event in events expanded is intense  damage to the colony was superficial but it was distressing and it busted open the ancient danger I've been dragging my feet on dealing with. I also managed to rescue a few survivors, and one of them joined the colony  I've only actually recruited two people after capturing them, everyone else fell from the sky and stayed behind afterwards.Incidentally nearly half of my colony are Ratkin because they must be terrible at flying. It's good for my enormous greenhouse project though.
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Jun 10, 2020 19:57
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https://twitter.com/Jonlissla/status/1270793327756169217
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Jun 10, 2020 20:53
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Those SOS ship fights are.. kind of broken? I attacked a trade ship and apparently trade ships don't have any weapons, so they just sat there doing nothing. I sent a 3-man boarding party over to it using a small shuttle, shot my way through the walls right into the bridge, shot the pilot, and then hacked the bridge (Intellectual skill check) to give me control of the entire vessel. The rest of the enemy crew just sort of milled about. They would shoot at my guys if I moved in range, but they never triggered coordinated hostility or started pathfinding towards me, so it was incredibly trivial to kill all 20+ of them room by room even though I only brought 3 guys. Once they were all dead I flew the enemy ship over to my ship's map and spent the next 2 years dismantling it for hundreds of thousands of steel, plasteel, uranium, etc. Basically if you can get a ship into orbit, any ship, no matter how small or crappy, as long as it has a shuttle bay, you can attack a trade ship and get all the resources you could ever need.
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Jun 10, 2020 21:47
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Sounds like they dont really have a "target" to go for, like how normal raids target bedrooms and take targets of opportunity on the way. Since they dont have something specific to head towards, they just mill around until the target of opportunity comes to them. I wonder how hard it would be to have a similar enemy assault trigger that makes them rush shuttles? E: actually come to think of it, when you're at an enemy town, eventually they'll all just rush your guys, so I'm probably way off 
Danaru fucked around with this message at 22:02 on Jun 10, 2020 |
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Jun 10, 2020 22:00
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Mzbundifund posted:Those SOS ship fights are.. kind of broken? I attacked a trade ship and apparently trade ships don't have any weapons, so they just sat there doing nothing. I sent a 3-man boarding party over to it using a small shuttle, shot my way through the walls right into the bridge, shot the pilot, and then hacked the bridge (Intellectual skill check) to give me control of the entire vessel. The rest of the enemy crew just sort of milled about. They would shoot at my guys if I moved in range, but they never triggered coordinated hostility or started pathfinding towards me, so it was incredibly trivial to kill all 20+ of them room by room even though I only brought 3 guys. Once they were all dead I flew the enemy ship over to my ship's map and spent the next 2 years dismantling it for hundreds of thousands of steel, plasteel, uranium, etc. Basically if you can get a ship into orbit, any ship, no matter how small or crappy, as long as it has a shuttle bay, you can attack a trade ship and get all the resources you could ever need. This reminds me of X-Com Apocalypse where the game had these elaborate corridors and my team would just cut their way through the walls with dual wielded heavy, unlimited ammo alien laser rifles. Either that or the aliens were making a stand inside a wooden box structure suspended on toothpick pillars with less structure HP than paper sheet. And I'd throw an incendiary grenade through a window and the whole place would burst into flames and then crash to the ground with all occupants inside.
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Jun 10, 2020 22:07
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Danaru posted:E: actually come to think of it, when you're at an enemy town, eventually they'll all just rush your guys, so I'm probably way off Yeah I suspect they're supposed to work like that, but either because it was a trade ship or because ships in general are buggy that just never happened. The only other ship I've attacked was a small mechanoid probe, and once I broke through the wall the mechanoids all attacked me, but since the entire probe ship was only a single small room I can't say if they were triggered to attack my guys or if they just attacked because they were too close and had line of sight.
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Jun 10, 2020 22:08
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Can you move your ship around on the space map? I always worry about building too close to an edge and messing up the layout. I know you can specify where to land but I forget if you can shift it without leaving the space map. I need to get starflight researched  I keep getting distracted with other techs
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Jun 10, 2020 22:23
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Danaru posted:Can you move your ship around on the space map? You can, but right now it doesn't keep track of room temperatures so make sure to harvest all your hydroponics, put all your guys in EVA suits, and any animals into cryptosleep because your entire ship is going to drop to -100C until your heaters can stabilize it again.
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Jun 10, 2020 22:29
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That's awesome, I already have a bunch of ideas on how to get weird with this
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Jun 10, 2020 22:46
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I would recommend keeping a surface base just because it turns out space is kind of... boring. Literally the only events that will happen in space are encountering other ships and the opportunity to go on an away mission to some asteroids or a space wreck to get tiny amounts of resources compared to what killing a ship gets you. Occasionally I've encountered a "hostile" ship, but so far none of the other ships I've met have attacked me, it just says they aren't responding to hails but make no move to attack so I always get the chance to choose whether or not to initiate the attack or just skip it. There's no point in attacking one because trade ships are unarmed and killing one gets you infinity resources and there's no consequences. It's just trade ships and pointless asteroid hulk/salvage missions forever. I haven't even had a disease or a zzzt or anything even minor at all.
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Jun 10, 2020 23:09
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Mzbundifund posted:Those SOS ship fights are.. kind of broken? I attacked a trade ship and apparently trade ships don't have any weapons, so they just sat there doing nothing. I sent a 3-man boarding party over to it using a small shuttle, shot my way through the walls right into the bridge, shot the pilot, and then hacked the bridge (Intellectual skill check) to give me control of the entire vessel. The rest of the enemy crew just sort of milled about. They would shoot at my guys if I moved in range, but they never triggered coordinated hostility or started pathfinding towards me, so it was incredibly trivial to kill all 20+ of them room by room even though I only brought 3 guys. Once they were all dead I flew the enemy ship over to my ship's map and spent the next 2 years dismantling it for hundreds of thousands of steel, plasteel, uranium, etc. Basically if you can get a ship into orbit, any ship, no matter how small or crappy, as long as it has a shuttle bay, you can attack a trade ship and get all the resources you could ever need. Sounds like a bit of a waste to me, why take years dismantlying it when you could Minify Everything and just directly bolt parts of it onto your ship?
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Jun 11, 2020 00:41
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Of course I'll have a ground base, how else would I build an oil refinery slash cocaine factory farm operated by prison labour 
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Jun 11, 2020 02:20
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With SOS2 there's nothing stopping me from just building a gigantic space station and living in space, right? I don't really have a need to visit other planets but I dig the atmosphere up there and it's a fun place to live  I could probably grow enough drugs in hydroponics to trade for materials like steeledit: oh this was already answered on this very page Mzbundifund posted:I would recommend keeping a surface base just because it turns out space is kind of... boring. I was hoping for aliens that beam onto my ship for raids or something  Maybe I'll use it to planet-hop and steal from other settlements.
deep dish peat moss fucked around with this message at 02:37 on Jun 11, 2020 |
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Jun 11, 2020 02:34
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Hm. Has anyone else played with the Lovecraft storyteller? It feels like he's barely throwing me any events. Kinda thinking of swapping to Randy for a proper game soon.
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Jun 11, 2020 02:38
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deep dish peat moss posted:I don't really have a need to visit other planets but I dig the atmosphere up there 
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Jun 11, 2020 02:58
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okay geez don't bother with the Lovecraft storyteller. He has a few spooky events but then seems to fade off. Boring! I'm back to Randy and things are happening, which is what I wanted in the first place. That said, does anyone know if Randy has access to all modded-in events or no?
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Jun 11, 2020 03:18
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He absolutely does. I added Events Extended midsave and within minutes I had shells and ship chunks careening into my island from two ships battling in orbit
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Jun 11, 2020 03:20
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Danaru posted:He absolutely does. I added Events Extended midsave and within minutes I had shells and ship chunks careening into my island from two ships battling in orbit The space battle is one of my more favored ones, though I haven’t had direct hits on my colony yet. Running in to grab a treasured down pawn though is super nail biting.
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Jun 11, 2020 05:38
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