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XMNN posted:apparently it was pmqs? "Hire More Black Screws" with the clapping emoji punctuation.
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Jun 10, 2020 13:19
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What actually happens when a hard gently caress-you Brexit kicks in simultaneously with a 100k+ death second wave of COVID this winter? Does the City of London just fall off the edge of the world like in Brexit.gif? Does public revolt make Tory rule unsustainable? I know the crystal balls are all shattered, but is there even any articles out there that attempt to grapple with the confluence of these events?
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Jun 10, 2020 13:22
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Failed Imagineer posted:Does public revolt make Tory rule unsustainable? lmbo
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Jun 10, 2020 13:23
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Your balls notwithstanding, it could be a long summer of protests and ratcheting unemployment and austerity that makes the unthinkable inevitable
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Jun 10, 2020 13:25
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Jose posted:the absolute state of EU supergirl 
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Jun 10, 2020 13:25
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https://twitter.com/jewdas/status/1270690874733875200?s=21
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Jun 10, 2020 13:26
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Umbra Dubium posted:"Hire More Black Screws" with the clapping emoji punctuation. tbf that's slightly better than my first assumption when I read that Boris Johnson wanted to get more BAME people into the prison service at least steve bell hasn't forgotten what a loving joke this sack of poo poo claiming to be the not racist prime minister of this not racist country is 
XMNN fucked around with this message at 13:29 on Jun 10, 2020 |
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Jun 10, 2020 13:27
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XMNN posted:like obviously the "but my white British heritage That statue of Stanley is in my home town Denbigh. And yes there are people arguing that it's fine that a man who used to adjust his gun sights by shooting African children was actually cool and good. Watch It Burn fucked around with this message at 13:36 on Jun 10, 2020 |
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Jun 10, 2020 13:34
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" people were never interested in history, but this is actually a really good time for finding out about things you never knew about
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Failed Imagineer posted:Your balls notwithstanding, it could be a long summer of protests and ratcheting unemployment and austerity that makes the unthinkable inevitable Most didn't revolt when 160,000 lives were needlessly cut short because of tory rule. They didn't revolt when nurses were paid below their means of living. They didn't care that May magically misplaced the only copy of a document listing Tory nonces in the HoL. They didn't react to Windrush or any of the other countless xenophobic scandals. Nothing will change. It's because they either know and don't care (because it doesn't affect them), or they just blindly absorb what is fed to them by the Tory press.
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Jun 10, 2020 13:37
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Ratjaculation posted:Most didn't revolt when 160,000 lives were needlessly cut short because of tory rule. They didn't revolt when nurses were paid below their means of living. They didn't care that May magically misplaced the only copy of a document listing Tory nonces in the HoL. They didn't react to Windrush or any of the other countless xenophobic scandals. Yeah, on another day I would be taking this side of the discussion. I don't exactly disagree. Hope is a lie. Unless...?
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Jun 10, 2020 13:40
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Camrath posted:Fudge Update Great news! Keep well, fuzzyfaces. Looking forward to getting stuck in. And my tabby kitten pounced on your gang tag as I was reading your post, which is a good sign, probably.
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Jun 10, 2020 13:41
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Ratjaculation posted:Most didn't revolt when 160,000 lives were needlessly cut short because of tory rule. They didn't revolt when nurses were paid below their means of living. They didn't care that May magically misplaced the only copy of a document listing Tory nonces in the HoL. They didn't react to Windrush or any of the other countless xenophobic scandals. Hmm yes history truly did end and no one has been or will be affected by the sudden and fairly immediate changes that are happening or will come lol Why, a statue was pulled down the other day and nobody even noticed!
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Jun 10, 2020 13:41
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Ratjaculation posted:Most didn't revolt when 160,000 lives were needlessly cut short because of tory rule. They didn't revolt when nurses were paid below their means of living. They didn't care that May magically misplaced the only copy of a document listing Tory nonces in the HoL. They didn't react to Windrush or any of the other countless xenophobic scandals. The ones who know and don't care because it doesn't affect them are already starting to care about the COVID-19 response because it does affect them. And when their businesses start to go under because they're not quite rich enough for the Tories to help, they're going to care about Brexit too.
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Jun 10, 2020 13:42
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Revolution is always impossible right up until the point it happens.
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Jun 10, 2020 13:47
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Jedit posted:The ones who know and don't care because it doesn't affect them are already starting to care about the COVID-19 response because it does affect them. And when their businesses start to go under because they're not quite rich enough for the Tories to help, they're going to care about Brexit too. I think this is right. It's a giant magic trick, they make it seem like nothing can touch them by keeping the number and categories of people affected by their Tory Terror exactly right - so that the Very Sensible people can scoff, and rationalise, and tell each other than everything is fine. This is what protects the Tories, but they're not actual political wizards. Events which push the number and/or type of people affected past the critical point can occur, and that's when things will happen (NOT ACCELERATIONIST)
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Jun 10, 2020 13:47
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Nobody knows what's going to happen. Never underestimate Britain's appetite for misery or craven obsequiousness. But also don't overestimate the stability of our state, its looking extremely shakey. Mind you the establishment can just swap to kier if public outrage actually does topple the tories electorally. Hes their man.
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Jun 10, 2020 13:49
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namesake posted:Hmm yes history truly did end and no one has been or will be affected by the sudden and fairly immediate changes that are happening or will come lol but didn't only about 10% of polled people think it was a good thing it was tore down? outside of this thread the country is very different place. also jfc at anyone thinking the middle/upper classes revolting would be in anyway beneficial for anyone but themselves
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Jun 10, 2020 13:53
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13% of people willing to support direct action when government fails is pretty high. When it gets to about 20% things start getting interesting.
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Jun 10, 2020 13:58
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13% of people responding to a yougov poll at that
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Jun 10, 2020 14:01
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What’s better is the thousands of people protesting these injustices years ago, with no hope of immediately seeing any change , and then suddenly society convulses and the dam breaks Or yeah nothing ever changes why bother doing anything
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Jun 10, 2020 14:04
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i was thinking itd be funny if we took to the streets and it turns out that right wing views are just massively over-represented electorally cause olds loving love to vote but they aren't gonna actually challenge direct action in any way
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Jun 10, 2020 14:07
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Communist Thoughts posted:i was thinking itd be funny if we took to the streets and it turns out that right wing views are just massively over-represented electorally cause olds loving love to vote but they aren't gonna actually challenge direct action in any way And as they get older they tend to find themselves in leadership positions through gerontocracy, and even further from the public sentiment
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Jun 10, 2020 14:14
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Ratjaculation posted:but didn't only about 10% of polled people think it was a good thing it was tore down? 13% approved of the removal and the method. But 40% approved of the removal but not the way in which it was done. I can only assume they wanted his arse removed, stuffed with dynamite and have him blow to the sun.
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Jun 10, 2020 14:16
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What's interesting in the poll is 13% were like hell yeah pull it down, 33% didn't want it down, and the plurality wanted something that wasn't going to happen. And this was after the statue was down. If you'd asked "do you think the slave man statue should stay" absent any context it'd probably look more like  People reevaluate what's possible/should be done in the aftermath of it having been done.
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Jun 10, 2020 14:17
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bessantj posted:13% approved of the removal and the method. But 40% approved of the removal but not the way in which it was done. I can only assume they wanted his arse removed, stuffed with dynamite and have him blow to the sun. Anecdotal I know, but I've found those 40% can be very quickly won around if you mention that campaigns and petitions have been going around for years with no action taken.
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Jun 10, 2020 14:20
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Guavanaut posted:People reevaluate what's possible/should be done in the aftermath of it having been done. Yeah, the people who brought the ropes and hooks on Sunday correctly understood that the crowd would side with them which granted them the authority to pull down the statue beyond the ability of the state authorities to stop them. Meaningful political activity is creating that level of immunity/freedom of action while building structures willing and capable to act in that space to achieve their aims.
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Jun 10, 2020 14:22
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Guavanaut posted:Revolution is always impossible right up until the point it happens. I think you'll find that revolutions are wrong at a time when negotiations are still going on - Sir Keir Forensic Edit - God drat it is such a shame Corbyn isn't still Labour leader at this time (regardless of in or out of government). Desiderata fucked around with this message at 14:27 on Jun 10, 2020 |
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Jun 10, 2020 14:23
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The government hasn't been subtle about it's narrative on the negotiations, they've put more energy into blaming the EU's lack of willingness at the negotiating table then they themselves have spent on negotiations. We have what appears to be David Hasselhoff during that burger incident leading a soggy opposition and a socialist movement that has split into a dozen factions, I think we're going to be Tory for a long time.
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Jun 10, 2020 14:35
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love to see someone link a loving candace owens video on facebook and praise her strength at speaking out
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Jun 10, 2020 14:41
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Ratjaculation posted:The government hasn't been subtle about it's narrative on the negotiations, they've put more energy into blaming the EU's lack of willingness at the negotiating table then they themselves have spent on negotiations. Whilst also putting us into internatinoal arbitration from the country-level megacorps if we do anytthing that they perceive might be damaging to their future profits. Which is basically anything.
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Jun 10, 2020 14:43
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this is hellworld and the country is cursed so i imagine the rest of the world will undergo glorious utopian revolutions while britain soldiers on bravely doing a racism forevermore
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Jun 10, 2020 14:45
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they're actively insulting the membership now https://twitter.com/UKLabour/status/1270688411930640385?s=20
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Jun 10, 2020 14:51
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Angepain posted:this is hellworld and the country is cursed so i imagine the rest of the world will undergo glorious utopian revolutions while britain soldiers on bravely doing a racism forevermore It's only a glorious utopia if they accept refugees
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Jun 10, 2020 14:53
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News on the fate of the statue: https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/jun/10/bristol-mayor-marvin-rees-edward-colston-statue-slavery Mayor of Town posted:He said: “We’ll retrieve the statue and take it to one of our museums where it will be assessed for damage. A decision hasn’t been made [regarding] what we will do with it going forward. In terms of the space where it was, I think we need to facilitate a citywide conversation about that. The conversation needs to be almost without emotion. Yep, very sensible grownup here, not like that uninformed mob...
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Jun 10, 2020 14:56
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He's not wrong, too much of the argument IS emotional rather than informed. But from context, he's not clear on which parts are which. Facts don't care about your feelings friend, and the fact is the statue is preciselty where it ought to be and never should have been erected in the first place.
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Jun 10, 2020 15:00
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Sensible good history without emotion is why it went from "vote for me and I'll remove the statue" to "I have compromised with the council that we will add a plaque about the 19,000 slaves he killed" to "the plaque will mention his sensible investments in tobacco and sugar and directorship of the Royal Africa Company."
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Jun 10, 2020 15:01
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Angepain posted:this is hellworld and the country is cursed so i imagine the rest of the world will undergo glorious utopian revolutions while britain soldiers on bravely doing a racism forevermore God i wish it could be that good. As it stands, every country is doing a racism and competing to see who does it hardest, fastest
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Jun 10, 2020 15:12
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thespaceinvader posted:He's not wrong, too much of the argument IS emotional rather than informed. Isn't the very nature of a statue meant to be emotional? It's meant to invoke awe, inspiration. If you wanted no emotion at all, just hammer a sign in the ground that reads "Colston.  "
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Jun 10, 2020 15:15
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Ratjaculation posted:Most didn't revolt when 160,000 lives were needlessly cut short because of tory rule. They didn't revolt when nurses were paid below their means of living. They didn't care that May magically misplaced the only copy of a document listing Tory nonces in the HoL. They didn't react to Windrush or any of the other countless xenophobic scandals. death of a million is a statistic etc humans are really, really bad at imagining large groups of people. We know other primates have hard limitations that, if extrapolated, say we could deal with a few hundred. Let's be really anthrocentric and generous and say ok, but our social behaviours are emergent and complex and lack easy comparisons - let's throw some zeros on that. Say, somehow, we can imagine and empathise with 20,000 unique individuals. When we talk about 160k dead, we have to relate this to people we know to mourn it, and we have to have lost those close to us and really internalise why before it is an atrocity. This is not a task that's easy, it is one that requires time, and education on the problem, and a priming for the message. It's part of why our hierarchies can sustain themselves at all - they don't work if we criticise them consciously 24/7, which is sort of the point of being a leftist. It leaves a lot of people with very little time or inclination to choose to understand atrocities that don't relate to them in obvious ways, for the sole purpose of feeling misery, unless you're already committed to action. It is the proverbial boiling lobster, or the "first they came", and so on. It's a work to appreciate these horrors and a lot of people don't even get why we'd want to until it's already too late for them. You know what they can't chose to ignore? hospitals and morgues shutting down for exactly the reasons the government were told they would. Having to choose between potential death at work and potential death unemployed. No furlough scheme. No jobs. No functioning economy. The question is, what happens when you do all the bad neolib poo poo in one moment, as opposed to spaced out? We're seeing it. We see flickers in Bristol of what happens when people realise they've suddenly got the numbers to resist oppression, they make their own history. The tories have found yet another way to kill their own votebase right as they prepare for the best conditions for uprising since the troubles. We even got a six month break to re-organise the left after a catastrophic defeat of electoralism. Our thoughts ahead should be what to do when the army are inevitably deployed en masse, because the gunpowder has been placed and the tories juggle sparklers.
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Jun 10, 2020 15:41
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Communist Thoughts posted:i was thinking itd be funny if we took to the streets and it turns out that right wing views are just massively over-represented electorally cause olds loving love to vote but they aren't gonna actually challenge direct action in any way Yeah, it's exactly this. There's plenty of people in Bristol who strongly object to what's happened to the statue but you don't see an enormous mob of them marching down to the harbour to fish the statue out and triumphantly return it 'cos they're all pensioners.
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