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Zephro posted:I only dip in and out of this game occasionally, so I just wondered - do CA do that thing where they buff the new Lords / DLC units / revamped factions massively to encourage people to buy them and play them, then gradually nerf them back into balance over time? I remember the consensus was that Ratling Gunners, Ikit and Kroak were all considered crazy OP when they first arrived... I think they kind of do that but maybe not intentionally. I think in general anything new (DLC or FLC) tends to border on the overpowered because they have gotten brave about experimenting with a lot of new stuff to make it more interesting. I haven't sunk my teeth into all of the new stuff yet, but even though Grom is very powerful I've found Wurzag and Imrik to be just insane. Wurzag can just eliminate entire armies with dozens of foot of gork nukes and Imrik eventually gets insane stats, a dragon mount, tons of abilities, perfect vigour, regeneration, powerful 'elite' dragon units he can hire, etc etc. His only real downside is a lovely starting position away from trade routes.
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Jun 12, 2020 11:09
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I honestly think it just feels that way because each new lord is hyperbolic and value adds to their faction so that it feels like the balence is being addressed when in reality its more like... everything is cray cray in the good way a little more as new content is added.
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Jun 12, 2020 11:16
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Fartbox posted:You know, I gave loremaster of sotek 5 minutes but he didn't get to the point. He spent 5 minutes saying he had to say something but not what he had to say. I'm sure it was good but holy poo poo He started around 8th minute, but right after that went on a tangent. Dude needs an editor.
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Jun 12, 2020 11:26
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Seems a bit of an oversight that i can't move imriks capital to uthuan. I've confederated motherfucker, let me trade with the elves without having to kill my way to the shore. e: Also the wood elfs immediately tried to kill me this game. That's cool.
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Jun 12, 2020 11:36
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"Greetings woodland savages, it is I, Imrik-" *war declared*
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Jun 12, 2020 11:41
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dogstile posted:Seems a bit of an oversight that i can't move imriks capital to uthuan. I've confederated motherfucker, let me trade with the elves without having to kill my way to the shore. You need to lose your current capital to change it.
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Jun 12, 2020 11:47
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Onmi posted:You need to lose your current capital to change it. I hate that I can't voluntarily bail on settlements or request specific settlements through diplomacy. Like if my ally takes some poo poo I rightfully own I don't wanna have to execute my pals to get my region secured.
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Jun 12, 2020 11:52
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Region Trading Mod, it saves OCD map painters.
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Jun 12, 2020 12:19
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I started a Wood Elves campaign as Durthu and so far it is way more fun than I thought it would be. Sieges aren’t as bad as I imagined. I got mad that some beastmen destroyed some of my settlements while I was fighting the Enchantress, but I realized I could just make a second army and run at a deficit. When you make a billion dollars for razing a settlements it’s fine to lose some money to upkeep.
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Jun 12, 2020 12:36
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Zephro posted:I only dip in and out of this game occasionally, so I just wondered - do CA do that thing where they buff the new Lords / DLC units / revamped factions massively to encourage people to buy them and play them, then gradually nerf them back into balance over time? I remember the consensus was that Ratling Gunners, Ikit and Kroak were all considered crazy OP when they first arrived... All those things are still overpowered Ikit literally can build nukes, still. Buffed ratlinggunners mow down everything in seconds Collapsing Farts fucked around with this message at 12:55 on Jun 12, 2020 |
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Jun 12, 2020 12:53
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Eltharion's later units are also kinda strong, but you'll probably be done with the campaign before you get to use them, so eh. Also they are really expensive.
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Jun 12, 2020 12:55
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they give you fun options and it's singleplayer so they don't give a gently caress
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Jun 12, 2020 12:56
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Gamerofthegame posted:they give you fun options and it's singleplayer so they don't give a gently caress this is correct, almost all single player campaigns are very much doable b/c of individual OP strats. Just play what you like and you can make everything OP (Except maybe some early Khemri strats because lmao being gated behind tech for a second army blows)
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Jun 12, 2020 13:01
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I think they try to set up a sitch where there’s a variety of different challenge levels in the content, so there’s Tehenenhuain as challenge mode, Gor-Rok for power fantasy mode, Ikit for meme mode, etc. The Imrik campaign is interesting because it gives you a very OP combat lord and then sticks you in a challenging campaign position where you need every bit of it to overcome the green/dawi/rat tide depending.
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Jun 12, 2020 13:26
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I like that type of campaign design as well. When I play co op with my friends I tend to pick the more difficult starts like tehenhauin because I like bieng pressured, but not all of my friends like the pressure so they can pick the easier starts and we each get the campaign we want with some dabbling in each others games.
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Jun 12, 2020 13:50
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When talking about DLC content it's important to remember that, based on their pre-release streams anyway, everyone at CA really sucks at Total War single player. It really seems like they don't catch the egregious stuff because they don't make use of it the way dedicated players do.
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Jun 12, 2020 13:52
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I do find it funny how Tehenahuin is the only example people can come up with for a hard campaign though I think it used to be Skarsnik before the Prophet and the Warlock DLC?
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Jun 12, 2020 13:53
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Broken Cog posted:I do find it funny how Tehenahuin is the only example people can come up with for a hard campaign though Belegar is still tough, Tretch can be very hard since you’re surrounded on all sides, Khatep ME is a miserable slog and Khalida ME isn’t exactly a walk in the park either.
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Jun 12, 2020 14:05
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:When talking about DLC content it's important to remember that, based on their pre-release streams anyway, everyone at CA really sucks at Total War single player. It really seems like they don't catch the egregious stuff because they don't make use of it the way dedicated players do. More fidelity to the table-top game there, nice
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Jun 12, 2020 14:05
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Skarsnik was a hard start due to no orks, people not understanding goblins, and fanatics having a cast ability that required a lot of micro and jumped around a lot. Also waaghs being bad. Once skarsnik or a night goblin lord got all of his buffs though, night goblins were stronger than ork boys, came with poison, and were cheaper. Your first fight was empire or dwarves and your source of AP was fanatics you couldn't get or nasty skulkers which did not do well when above normal difficulty. If you got a caster from a random event, you had a good chance of getting little waaagh which is harder to use than a blunt force big waaagh shaman. After that, I suppose Lokhir Fellheart or Arkhan the Black were the hard ones. One for having minor bonuses to a unit that you replaced by midgame and black arks not being good yet while the other was hated by everyone nearby and has only gotten harder with flaming bretonnians, skaven, and new lizardmen nearby.
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Jun 12, 2020 14:07
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Scrub-Niggurath posted:Belegar is still tough, Tretch can be very hard since you’re surrounded on all sides, Khatep ME is a miserable slog and Khalida ME isn’t exactly a walk in the park either. Man, ME Khatep is probably the one campaign I recommend people to stay clear of, it's just a miserable experience all around. It's not even all that hard, it's just, as you said, a real slog. Edit: Also, I haven't played Tretch in a while, but he really wasn't very difficult when I beat the Vortex campaign with him. The Skaven ambush stance makes all their campaigns pretty easy tbh, since it's basically a free lightning strike.
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Jun 12, 2020 14:09
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God I even forgot about Khatep. Stuck on a wall, hoping for trade.
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Jun 12, 2020 14:15
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i've found imrik ME tough. he is a monster but i'm so desperately poor and there are enemies everywhere i've spent 100 turns pinned between the great Waaagh and the eshin empire bouncing between them with my single doomstack e: this is my 2nd attempt too, my first attempt i killed eshin but grimgor declared on me and razed me into bankruptcy before i could get imrik back, this time round i rushed grimgor but eshin took everything i left behind. Communist Thoughts fucked around with this message at 14:28 on Jun 12, 2020 |
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Jun 12, 2020 14:26
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If we go to the other end, what would people consider to be the easiest campaigns right now? I feel like Noctilus and Ikit has gone above and beyond and taken the top spots pretty easily. Tyrion is still fairly easy, and Grom is definitely showing some promise as well. Vortex Eltharion is also pretty easy, since once you secure your first two provinces, you can literally just sit back and wait for the final battle if you want, the only reason to move off Ulthuan is if you get bored. Edit: I agree that Imrik is pretty tough. Playing High Elves without an option for trading really hamstrings your economy a lot. Broken Cog fucked around with this message at 14:32 on Jun 12, 2020 |
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Jun 12, 2020 14:27
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There was a bug found that meant you could win the Eltharion campaign turn one, so I think by default that's the easiest  Legitimately it probably still is Eltharion, there's a reason there's now a speedrunning community starting to go around his campaign. Edit: Also the bug from what I understand is that, the "actual" conditions to win the Eltharion campaign is that he just survives past turn 150. So if you just set him in Ambush stance away from the city, reach turn 150, let Grom attack and destroy the city, you'll win because Eltharion "survived" the battle. Blooming Brilliant fucked around with this message at 14:45 on Jun 12, 2020 |
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Jun 12, 2020 14:40
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Skarsnik is much easier now between the new goblin and troll units and the fact that the black ork heroes aren’t restricted which lets you get two beefy brawler heroes in the first few turns
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Jun 12, 2020 14:42
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Gelt is overpowered but his start can be pretty brutal now with the vampires so aggressive.
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Jun 12, 2020 14:45
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Honourable mention to Snikch's Vortex campaign as well, which can be won under two hours. Just turbo level Snikch to level 40 with Shadowy Dealings, buy RoR's so your army isn't trash, and then do the final battle.
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Jun 12, 2020 14:47
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Blooming Brilliant posted:There was a bug found that meant you could win the Eltharion campaign turn one, so I think by default that's the easiest I can see that, but the issue I have with Eltharion's Vortex campaign isn't so much that it's easy as that it's extremely barebones. You really don't have much to do after taking out the first 2 provinces. There's some low effort "Eh, you can take these settlements if you want" quests for some higher unit caps (that you don't really need), but other than that there's nothing. Edit: His ME campaign is actually a bit trickier though, at least if you go for trying to take both Ulthuan and the Badlands at the same time instead abandoning the Badlands to build up. Broken Cog fucked around with this message at 14:55 on Jun 12, 2020 |
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Jun 12, 2020 14:48
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Nakai is mindless. Did his full Vortex on VH and fought four manual battles over 80+ turns. Brettonia has so many campaign benefits they're always playing on -1 Difficulty. Being able to do whatever you want for as broad a win con as "2000 Chivalry" is great too. Wood Elves are a bit more involved but joining the Ordertide makes your victory inevitable. Mazdamundi might have the kindest start in the game, with three provinces worth of ruins to take at his leisure, three minor sub factions that are scared of war as his neighbors/buffers from real threats and being at a natural choke adjacent to but isolated from the Lustriabowl. Ikit has a hard start, surprisingly. Gunlines ain't free and you're in the middle of the bowl. You're also next to one of the super saurus factions that hate you and the doomrocket can't scratch dino rite stacks. Once he survives his start he's baby's first VH victory. I think Gelt has a nice start, he's surrounded by easy friends and has a natural fort. Appease or contain the closest electors, smash the Vampires, confed with Reiksland. Likewise the Von Carnsteins can reverse that, especially Vlad and Isabella. Raise Dead is the best campaign benefit in the game. They're basically two LLs for one and adjacent to the Empire before it can confed. Smother it in the crib. Kemmler can do the same to Brettonia but is honestly a generic campaign features lord carried by how broken OP Krell is.
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Jun 12, 2020 14:54
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Broken Cog posted:I do find it funny how Tehenahuin is the only example people can come up with for a hard campaign though Markus Wolfheart is not easy either - Empire units are kinda meh (at least early on), Markus himself isn't very killy, you start surrounded by lizards who hate your guts and regularly send giant dino armies at you which the Empire roster has difficulty dealing with, you can't trade for poo poo except with the other Empire faction nearby (which regularly gets crushed), Skeggi often survives long enough to be a giant pain too... oh and even if you can keep the vamps' off your back they're bad neighbours to have due to the pollution. Generally speaking I think every LL that starts next to hostile big Lizards factions are more difficult - pound for pound Saurus will gently caress up most tier 1/2 melee units, skinks with javs do a lot of damage for their price & ubiquity, skink skirmishers are a giant pain in the dick unless you have cavalry or chariots, and on top of that they also get access to tier 4/5 dinos super early... I hate fighting lizards.
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Jun 12, 2020 14:56
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Broken Cog posted:I can see that, but the issue I have with Eltharion's Vortex campaign isn't so much that it's easy as that it's extremely barebones. You really don't have much to do after taking out the first 2 provinces. There's some low effort "Eh, you can take these settlements if you want" quests for some higher unit caps (that you don't really need), but other than that there's nothing. The actual bug with Eltharion's campaign is you can win it in 1 turn. You see, the Grom battle? you don't have to win it, you just have to survive it. And there's a forest to hide your units. So get the phoenix out in the open to avoid the enemy hunting for your troops, hide your troops in the forest, and that's it. You don't lose if Grom takes the capture points, if you draw, that counts as a win, which wins the campaign.
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Jun 12, 2020 15:06
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Malus Vortex was surprisingly easy. Most players see the elixir as a fine, I saw it as a post battle reward I hit every three turns to control my PO and accelerate my growth. Breaking even on the melee attack penalty is easy. I guess it's a hard campaign and frustrating if you want to Devil Trigger every fight or make the mistake of doing diplomacy with rat factions. Be sure to sell your Naggaroth holdings at the start, bend rat killing into cease fires with the Lizardmen. Or darkshards them, you have their Achilles heel in your pocket.
Doomykins fucked around with this message at 15:16 on Jun 12, 2020 |
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Jun 12, 2020 15:08
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Onmi posted:The actual bug with Eltharion's campaign is you can win it in 1 turn. You see, the Grom battle? you don't have to win it, you just have to survive it. And there's a forest to hide your units. So get the phoenix out in the open to avoid the enemy hunting for your troops, hide your troops in the forest, and that's it. You don't lose if Grom takes the capture points, if you draw, that counts as a win, which wins the campaign. That's actually hilarious. So losing the battle counts as a draw? Edit: Wait, the battle doesn't end if Grom takes the town? So you just drag it out for the full siege duration? Ok, that's even funnier. Broken Cog fucked around with this message at 15:12 on Jun 12, 2020 |
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Jun 12, 2020 15:10
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Lokhir ME start is pretty hard
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Jun 12, 2020 16:06
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Biggest issue atm with Krell isnt his near-peerless martial ability, but his frickin smell!
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Jun 12, 2020 17:16
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"Summoning Krell!? But, he smells!"
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Jun 12, 2020 17:21
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i'm a little behind but generally i do lightning strike if the lord has no other worthwhile skills i want to sink every point into, or if they're going to be going abroad by themselves. Definitely get for vampirates, but for bretonnia or something, you're doing it wrong if you don't have one stack of grails and then two stacks of archers and trebs.
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Jun 12, 2020 17:39
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Doomykins posted:Mazdamundi might have the kindest start in the game, with three provinces worth of ruins to take at his leisure, three minor sub factions that are scared of war as his neighbors/buffers from real threats and being at a natural choke adjacent to but isolated from the Lustriabowl. Seriously, Cylostra gets the same comment. Everyone always complains about Skeggi, but if you can't put down a few marauders with all of Central America free for the taking, you don't deserve a victory.
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Jun 12, 2020 17:46
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i tend to not go lightning strike because im extremely good and cool and also i play a lot of rats who have a built in lightning strike ability except better really tho you can generally get the battles you want if you use ambush stance and know when to roll with multiple stacks at a time. i have taken it a few times and then just never end up using it anyways e: easiest campaigns: eshin, tyrion, mommy's boy, morathi, karl, ikkit, mummy slann and his generic saurus pal. hardest: belly nohammer and his ghost dads, chaos if ordertide happens Tiler Kiwi fucked around with this message at 18:05 on Jun 12, 2020 |
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Jun 12, 2020 17:54
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