|
Well, visually, you can always see the other titan off in the distance and from different angles. I'd say that's doing something neat with the concept. It's also neat how all the areas are interconnected and not isolated islands like in Xenoblade 2.
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 01:36
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 6, 2024 14:09 |
|
|
Xenoblade 2 does stand out design wise because in Gormot and Mor Ardain you can sea the head and other body parts of the titan and no matter where you are you can always see and fall into the cloud sea. And even the titans in which you can't fall into the cloud sea from like Uraya or Tantal their interiors do feel like a stomach. I'd say the weakest design in Xenoblade 2 was Temperantia, which I really don't know what purpose served in the story other than blueballing Jin's sidequesting grind. In 1 so far, Makna Forest is just a forest, Valak Mountain is just an icy mountain, and Satorl Swamp is just a swamp. And Eryth Sea doesn't make any sense to me locationwise. They are all pretty sure, but they could have done some more creative stuff, like have Valak Mountain actually be the titan's spine, or have the trees in Makna Forest be some freaky protrusions.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 07:59
|
|
|
Yeah the best area of Xenoblade 1 from a lore perspective and design perspective is the sunken hand. Both games really suffer from needing to imply a significantly more massive scale to their areas but make them still traversable and fun.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 08:41
|
|
|
If you look down in the Colony 6 area you can see Colony 9 nestled in the kneecap too. It makes me wish there was more of that to help with the sense of scale and progression, because I do like going from the bottom to the top of the Bionis. It gives an extra layer to the story progression, as opposed to some other JRPGs being "now you're in the desert town and next you'll go to the coastal town and after that's the snow town".
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 09:22
|
|
|
I'm in the giant robot now. Am I almost done?
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 09:23
|
|
|
Waltzing Along posted:I'm in the giant robot now. Am I almost done? No, Shinji But seriously, you have about 1/3rd of the game to go, especially if you do the sidequests.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 09:27
|
|
|
Satorl was never just a swamp, it's always been swamp-rear end with beautiful music
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 09:33
|
|
|
Barudak posted:No, Shinji Yeesh.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 09:49
|
|
|
A Sinister Rap posted:If you look down in the Colony 6 area you can see Colony 9 nestled in the kneecap too. It makes me wish there was more of that to help with the sense of scale and progression, because I do like going from the bottom to the top of the Bionis. It gives an extra layer to the story progression, as opposed to some other JRPGs being "now you're in the desert town and next you'll go to the coastal town and after that's the snow town". What they could have done is for the fight at Sword Valley at the beginning (or returning there) shown a ship leave from the knee and fly up, to the sword. I guess it'd be hard because the game is really wank at the scale of the two titans but it would have been nice. Probably out of the remit of the remake though. My biggest issue with the setting - and this is a spoiler for anyone who hasn't passed sword valley yet - is how they built the big city on Mechonis. Are they like....ripping up chunks of the titan? At least the bionis has stuff that's growing and you could make stuff out of wood or etc. The Mechonis has none of that. It genuinely feels like a gigantic robot when I really wish they'd made it into a metal....world like the Bionis is a biological world. I remember thinking this the first time but I can't remember if I posted it in the thread. And talking of sword valley - story wise how the gently caress can they present what happened there as a win at the start of the game? It's still crawling with Mechon and there's a fortress there now. If anything it feels like the mechon won there! Plus as we've seen they can just fly to the colonies with no issue. Mizuti posted:So, I've finally reached endgame. Enemy levels have spiked up alarmingly, and I'm being handled quests for level 90+ bosses. Is there any method to level up faster? This is the point I quit on the Wii because I couldn't bring myself to not do some of the side quests (the giant ones especially) but also couldn't fathom levelling up enough. Grinding against mobs that are yellow will level you really pretty fast but it depends what level you are right now as to where it's best to go. No matter what level you are though there will be a spot. This time round before I went to (spoilers for chapter...16? I think?) the Mechonis Core I went and levelled to 80 on the giant apes on Bionis leg. It was a really good decision. Taear fucked around with this message at 10:03 on Jun 14, 2020 |
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 09:54
|
|
|
I mean the additional material Bionis produces comes from somewhere, so I assume Mechonis is the same. Like a smelter plant on the lower levels. As for the battle of sword valley both times Ive played Im like "did I miss a cutscene where they win?"
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 10:20
|
|
|
Barudak posted:I mean the additional material Bionis produces comes from somewhere, so I assume Mechonis is the same. Like a smelter plant on the lower levels. I think it would be nice to show it. I guess I just wish they'd gone all in with the Mechonis and it was more of a world. And yea - honestly, how the hell is it a win in any sense? It doesn't matter loads I guess but I'd still like to know. A bit like I'd like to know what happened to the other Homs colonies.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 10:42
|
|
|
Chronicles X had my favorite world of the Xenoblade games. The sense of scale was much easier to see, and I like how everything is just gigantic. The other benefit is because you're flying around in giant robots, Monolith was able to make monsters much bigger than anything in the other two games. The game makes you feel really insignificant in ways that the other games tried to do but couldn't really pull off.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 15:56
|
|
|
I said come in! posted:Chronicles X had my favorite world of the Xenoblade games. The sense of scale was much easier to see, and I like how everything is just gigantic. The other benefit is because you're flying around in giant robots, Monolith was able to make monsters much bigger than anything in the other two games. The game makes you feel really insignificant in ways that the other games tried to do but couldn't really pull off. Kinda hard to feel insignificant when you get the sword forged by God and/or the Moe-nado, also made by (another) God, in the first half-hour of plot. While Rook probably isn't just some guy/gal, they're outwardly a standard human and we don't get any Skell custom-built at sunrise on the top of an holy mountain using Excalibur as the core.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 16:22
|
|
|
Waltzing Along posted:I'm in the giant robot now. Am I almost done? That section is huge and consists of like four areas. Once you beat it you’re about 90% done with the story, just know that beating it will cause a bunch of side quests to expire (and the game will warn you about this). Blackbelt Bobman fucked around with this message at 16:29 on Jun 14, 2020 |
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 16:23
|
|
|
I said come in! posted:Chronicles X had my favorite world of the Xenoblade games. The sense of scale was much easier to see, and I like how everything is just gigantic. The other benefit is because you're flying around in giant robots, Monolith was able to make monsters much bigger than anything in the other two games. The game makes you feel really insignificant in ways that the other games tried to do but couldn't really pull off. The best bit of XCX is easily the enormous monsters and the areas you can only reach by flying. I think the world becomes a bit weird once you're in the skell and it almost feels like having noclip on in Morrowind but I feel like you could have a really fun game set around it if they'd had a bit more time.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 18:06
|
|
|
A Sinister Rap posted:If you look down in the Colony 6 area you can see Colony 9 nestled in the kneecap too. It makes me wish there was more of that to help with the sense of scale and progression, because I do like going from the bottom to the top of the Bionis. It gives an extra layer to the story progression, as opposed to some other JRPGs being "now you're in the desert town and next you'll go to the coastal town and after that's the snow town". Yeah, the game does a good job of conveying verticality - especially early on - and scale. But it’s really not until Sword Valley a little bit, and the Fallen Arm in a big way that you truly feel that you’re walking around on bodies and not just, some weird mountain.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 18:21
|
|
|
Re: levelling for the end-game, is that when you open up the back areas of Tephra Cave? There are a few places like that with high level enemies that are meant to help you boost your levels. In other news, I've gotten absurdly lucky with UMs that spawn during certain weather conditions. Right as I was heading over Raquel Bridge for this first time, it started thunderstorming. Up in Eryth Sea, right as I exited the capitol, BAM, falling stars. And just now while I was tooling around Makna Forest, I tripped over Shimmering Forte.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 18:35
|
|
|
Is it possible to improve affinity between two party members without controlling one of them? Sharla and Reyn flirt with each other constantly (despite Sharla being I guess engaged to her step dad? hosed up.) but they don’t have a high enough affinity for a heart to heart I can see.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 18:42
|
|
|
Give them gifts in the affinity menu
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 18:43
|
|
|
Ogmius815 posted:(despite Sharla being I guess engaged to her step dad? hosed up.) Um. That's. That's not the case. I have no idea how'd you'd get "He's her step dad" from "They served together in the military." EDIT: I mean, they ARE engaged. I just don't get how you think he's her step dad.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 18:44
|
|
|
Taear posted:The best bit of XCX is easily the enormous monsters and the areas you can only reach by flying. I think the world becomes a bit weird once you're in the skell and it almost feels like having noclip on in Morrowind but I feel like you could have a really fun game set around it if they'd had a bit more time. This is the thing I probably missed most in 2 coming from X. Even when you're flying around in your mech, you still feel pretty insignificant against the backdrop of the huge world. I also liked that in X you were just a gang of folk that happened to be good at what they do, and not given a god-sword 20 minutes in.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 18:45
|
|
|
Ogmius815 posted:Is it possible to improve affinity between two party members without controlling one of them? Sharla and Reyn flirt with each other constantly (despite Sharla being I guess engaged to her step dad? hosed up.) but they don’t have a high enough affinity for a heart to heart I can see. Yes. Battle affinity from the tension boost QTEs is applied towards at least two pairings in the group if not all three, I'm not exactly sure which. Chain attacks boost affinity for all participants. I think battle banter is pre-determined and doesn't really depend on story progress or affinity progress though.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 18:50
|
|
|
I find it funny for the character affinity likes everyone is a broad category except Reyn, who lists only one item and its something he nor any other human would even know exists
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 18:51
|
|
|
J Detan posted:Um. Sharla says they were engaged and that Gadolt was like a big brother to her in the same conversation at the refugee camp, it is kinda weird.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 18:56
|
|
|
J Detan posted:Um. Am I remembering wrong? I remember her saying that he raised her when she was a child. So, foster dad I guess. That’s basically just as bad.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 18:56
|
|
|
Barudak posted:I find it funny for the character affinity likes everyone is a broad category except Reyn, who lists only one item and its something he nor any other human would even know exists You get an achievement if you give him one! Reyn is the only person with a big pile of items that give 3 affinity though. I find gifting pretty inefficient though because it takes absolutely goddamn forever. Getting 1000 when even a 3 heart item is only giving 22 is just....not fun. That might change if you could trade more than one item at once though so you could easily get a big pile of whatever it is you need. Ogmius815 posted:Am I remembering wrong? I remember her saying that he raised her when she was a child. So, foster dad I guess. That’s basically just as bad. Gadolt is 26 and Sharla is 21. But she DOES say he's like an older brother and I still feel like that makes it a little strange. Almost in the same sentence she's telling you he's like an older brother then telling you he's her fiancee. I feel somewhat like Sharla was meant to be JuJu's mum at one point and they changed it around as well since her 4th skill tree quest kinda infers she has kids. Sharla is weird all around though. Taear fucked around with this message at 19:05 on Jun 14, 2020 |
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 19:01
|
|
|
Taear posted:You get an achievement if you give him one! Reyn is the only person with a big pile of items that give 3 affinity though. Gifting is inefficient, BUT... The other day as I finished Valak Mountain and realized "quests are not going to get me to a decent place on affinity for more than like... one set of characters, because I am running out of quests." and also, was getting fed up with not using Shulk as I hit Sword Valley and really needed to kill more Mechon. So, I went to the gift screen, sorted by sell value (so that the worthless low level stuff was all grouped up), and pulled up the wiki, and just handed out all of the collectibles I had 20 of or whatever to whoever got the highest result. It took about, oh, 45 minutes, and I followed it up with a loop of every Heart to Heart I had walked by that I could do. By the end, basically everyone was cloudy or better with everyone barring a few easy to shore up pairs (Dunban/Reyn and Riki/Sharla mainly), and of course, everyone to 7. quote:Gadolt is 26 and Sharla is 21. But she DOES say he's like an older brother and I still feel like that makes it a little strange. Almost in the same sentence she's telling you he's like an older brother then telling you he's her fiancee. I feel somewhat like Sharla was meant to be JuJu's mum at one point and they changed it around as well since her 4th skill tree quest kinda infers she has kids. Sharla is weird all around though. The Riki/Melia/Sharla end battle banter is the best for this. "RIki wishes Melly were his big sister!" "What about Sharla?" "Sharla more like mother. One mother enough."
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 19:31
|
|
|
If Sharla were Juju’s mom then she’d be a woman over thirty. Which is of course a JRPG no no. She does read as older than 21, but I’m used to mentally adding 3-5 years to the stated ages of JRPG characters so that’s not weird.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 19:34
|
|
|
Sharla being more mature makes enough sense since she's had to raise Juju. I didn't realize Gadolt was only 26 though, that certainly makes the relationship less awkward. Everything about her is pretty weird though, especially when one of her first interactions with Reyn is her comparing him to her dead brother/fiance and Reyn seeing it as the perfect rebound.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 19:42
|
|
|
multijoe posted:Sharla says they were engaged and that Gadolt was like a big brother to her in the same conversation at the refugee camp, it is kinda weird. OK, that IS a bit weird, but is also not "He's her step father."
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 19:59
|
|
|
Ogmius815 posted:If Sharla were Juju’s mom then she’d be a woman over thirty. Which is of course a JRPG no no. That's partly why I think it was changed. Honestly Dunban doesn't come across as 30 either. I don't MIND Shulk/Reyn/Fiora being 18 and aging them up a bit wouldn't change a lot but Sharla definitely comes across like she's supposed to be older. Melia is 88 which I assume is the High Entia equivalent of 18? Who knows. Don Argentis is about 250 and he's portrayed as being a really old man.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 19:59
|
|
|
I buy Dunban as 30. He could be a few years older and not be too weird I guess but too much older and you’re getting out of “prime physical fitness” years. I mentioned I just finished Tales of Vesperia, which has easily the worst offender I’ve ever seen for the “JRPG characters are way too young” trope. There’s this one party member who comes off as really tired and world-weary, and he’s always referring to the other characters as “you kids” and talking about how he feels old. Also, all the other characters constantly call him “old man”. He’s loving 35.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 21:18
|
|
|
Ogmius815 posted:I buy Dunban as 30. He could be a few years older and not be too weird I guess but too much older and you’re getting out of “prime physical fitness” years. Counterpoint: I am 36 years old and recently returned to college for my undergrad degree. I pull exactly this sort of Bullshit constantly.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 21:24
|
|
|
Ogmius815 posted:I buy Dunban as 30. He could be a few years older and not be too weird I guess but too much older and you’re getting out of “prime physical fitness” years. To be fair, Raven is also dead. Well, being kept alive by a blastia heart but I mean he was dead at one point.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 21:29
|
|
|
I tried to find spots to level but it's a chore and moves slowly. The relevant enemies are arbitrarily scattered throughout the giant world. Sidequests that I could do dried up quickly. High-level enemies getting a huge evasion bonus means I can't defeat them even if I can tank their attacks.  At level 79 I got to the point of no return and just kept going. There's some quests I'd like to see yet, but it will take so long to get the 10-15 levels I need.On plot stuff: there's actually things happening at endgame! And plot twists! But it's all compacted into the last 10 hours of the campaign. There's a huge lull in story at the midpoint of the game. I think it's related to the fact that the mechon are largely absent from the marsh/forest/sea regions, so we get no further leads or development on the big antagonistic force that's supposed to be Shulk's nemesis. The first glimpse of what's going on in a bigger sense is when you meet giant-Zanza, far into the campaign. I think they should have cut most of the high entia succession drama: it's dreadfully dry, cliche, barely progresses the good stuff, and is largely rendered moot by the events of the endgame, anyways! Melia's wicked stepmother gets transformed offscreen and the assassin disappears from the plot for 30 hours only to pop up and tie up that loose end as an optional quest at the very end of the game. Xenoblade Chronicles spends so much of its time farting around with irrelevant fluff that when the plot actually does get rolling, some of the conclusions to its threads and characters feel rushed. Overall, there's some juicy stuff here but the pacing is awful.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 22:12
|
|
|
lezard_valeth posted:In 1 so far, Makna Forest is just a forest, Valak Mountain is just an icy mountain, and Satorl Swamp is just a swamp. And Eryth Sea doesn't make any sense to me locationwise. They are all pretty sure, but they could have done some more creative stuff, like have Valak Mountain actually be the titan's spine, or have the trees in Makna Forest be some freaky protrusions. I know it's more that it's a bit of a weak design, but i kinda headcannoned it away by rationalising that the Bionis is made out of everything our Earth is and that even though it's humanoid in shape at a distance, when you get right down into the nitty gritty of it (and after a few millennia or however long it's been since it stopped moving) it's ended up pretty much just looking like regular forests and swamps and stuff as gravity and life did whatever it did to things. The Mechonis, however, is a machine. It doesn't naturally change so that's why the shape has remained handlike with a bit of vegetative growth on it. The shape is kinda there though. I mean you're definitely climbing up pretty much all the time from colony 9 through to Makna forest and then you get shot up to the back for the sea, but you're travelling down from Makna forest via Valak mountain until you reach the sword. When it comes to scale too, i don't think the Bionis/Mechonis are supposed to be that big. According to Google, space is only 100Km away vertically, so if you maybe assume these things are at least half that in height then the breadth/width of them wouldn't be too far off of that too and the areas kinda fit in terms of scale.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 22:14
|
|
|
Mizuti posted:I tried to find spots to level but it's a chore and moves slowly. The relevant enemies are arbitrarily scattered throughout the giant world. Sidequests that I could do dried up quickly. High-level enemies getting a huge evasion bonus means I can't defeat them even if I can tank their attacks. For xp grinding, honestly, it feels like the best option is to abuse expert mode and level down to whatever is appropriate for the best aoe grinding spots, even if they're lower than the max level you could be grinding at. Just re-downlevel, rinse, and repeat as needed.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 22:32
|
|
|
Kin posted:I know it's more that it's a bit of a weak design, but i kinda headcannoned it away by rationalising that the Bionis is made out of everything our Earth is and that even though it's humanoid in shape at a distance, when you get right down into the nitty gritty of it (and after a few millennia or however long it's been since it stopped moving) it's ended up pretty much just looking like regular forests and swamps and stuff as gravity and life did whatever it did to things. Sure, but XC2 handles this so much better, and the Fallen Arm doesn't feel like a hand because or in spite of it's mechanical stuff - I mean, there's plenty of organic growth all over those beaches and such, but the biggest factor is just in the geometry of the hills and the locations of the coastline. The literal geography of it. All of which is something that they kind of vaguely nod to at times in the Bionis zones, but just never really commit to enough to make the premise work. I think the biggest sin here is probably Sartorl Marsh through Makna Forest, which is just kind of... somewhere. If you made Sartorl as a zone hillier, and made it clear as you went there from C6 that you were moving around behind the Bionis, maybe have the characters comment about how they can't see the Mechonis from this side, etc., put the statues in a more clearly defined canyon, that'd be interesting. The Bionis interior section in between the two even is fine. But then... where the gently caress is Makna forest? Why is it mostly level ground with a river running through it in such a deep canyon? Why is it so hot? There's a great opportunity to say, "this is inside of the Bionis's open mouth" and just fix the skybox, but instead it's just "there's a jungle somewhere" with no real sense of connection to anything.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 22:40
|
|
|
CaptainPsyko posted:For xp grinding, honestly, it feels like the best option is to abuse expert mode and level down to whatever is appropriate for the best aoe grinding spots, even if they're lower than the max level you could be grinding at. Just re-downlevel, rinse, and repeat as needed. Also for xp grinding, I'd turn on casual mode. You can disable it once you're done, and as far as I can tell there's no penalty or badge of shame anywhere (it shows up on your save file, but you can just save again with casual mode turned off). I was able to take on single or two enemies 20 levels higher than my party with casual mode, and probably more if they were closer in level. Combined with expert mode to eliminate any xp penalties it worked pretty well for me. I did only need it for 3 levels but I don't see why it wouldn't work to level 99.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 22:49
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 6, 2024 14:09 |
|
|
I forget since I originally played it on the Wii, but what quests (besides the Refugee Camp quests) expire before getting Seven?
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2020 22:49
|
|
