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Dan Didio posted:There was a chance just due to the unprecedented condition Ellie was in, but the surgeon seems pretty confident they'll be able to replicate it in lab conditions. Right I thought there was a higher chance of it being a failure for some reason.
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Jun 23, 2020 07:37
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JBP posted:Right I thought there was a higher chance of it being a failure for some reason. Probably because it takes place in a building that's mostly as grimy and dingy looking as the rest of the world with a group that get Ellie and waste no time at all trying to cut her open.
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Jun 23, 2020 07:43
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Zerilan posted:Probably because it takes place in a building that's mostly as grimy and dingy looking as the rest of the world with a group that get Ellie and waste no time at all trying to cut her open. That's probably it. It certainly seemed slap dash.
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Jun 23, 2020 07:49
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tero0sRNi8U
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Jun 23, 2020 07:49
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We also literally never see or hear of anything the Fireflies do that isn't a complete failure that gets everyone involved killed, leaving players inclined not to trust that this cure business would actually work.
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Jun 23, 2020 07:49
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The last half of the game is the scene from mgs3 with all the dead ghosts you killed, only 12 hours long and still in a bad game
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Jun 23, 2020 07:51
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Real hurthling! posted:The last half of the game is the scene from mgs3 with all the dead ghosts you killed, only 12 hours long and still in a bad game Also you can't kill a man, wait for a vulture to start eating his corpse, then kill and eat the vulture for some indirect cannibalism.
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Jun 23, 2020 08:04
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It's hard to beat Kojima for knowing how to make a video game special.
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Jun 23, 2020 08:16
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Real hurthling! posted:The last half of the game is the scene from mgs3 with all the dead ghosts you killed, only 12 hours long and still in a bad game *codec beeps* Ellie, Tommy here. It seems you've lost two fingers, you'll be less effective at holding your knife in CQC so be careful.
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Jun 23, 2020 08:23
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Kinda hard to say who deals with their abandonment issues in a worse way, Big Boss or Ellie.
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Jun 23, 2020 08:25
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Sassy Sasquatch posted:*codec beeps* This is good.
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Jun 23, 2020 08:26
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Cardiovorax posted:Kinda hard to say who deals with their abandonment issues in a worse way, Big Boss or Ellie. Big Boss, without question. He hosed the entire planet up for over 50 years.
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Jun 23, 2020 08:45
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Grapplejack posted:Big Boss, without question. He hosed the entire planet up for over 50 years. Dude, at least Big Boss had a proper business plan.
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Jun 23, 2020 08:46
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I think you can lay most of that at the feet of the support team than on ol' BB, anyway. It wasn't his genius idea to try control the war economy by way of 50s era AI copies of their own personalities.
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Jun 23, 2020 08:47
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Gzi2ceBqGQ
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Jun 23, 2020 08:55
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Hey remember how Metal Gear Solid V was suppose to be the Breaking Bad of gaming, but Big Boss never even went bad and you didn't even play as Big Boss.
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Jun 23, 2020 09:00
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Jun 23, 2020 09:57
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Pretty cool comparison. Very cool one might even say.
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Jun 23, 2020 09:59
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lurker2006 posted:He went farther than just criticizing the typical outcome, he said something that's interactive fundamentally cannot be art, even an idealistic example of one where thousands of man hours aren't spent on technical details with no profit motive. There was a really good talk at GDC a few years ago that went into this and explained what definition of art he was using, including how video games are basically kitsch. The whole talk is worth watching: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvZhRin-plA punk rebel ecks posted:What would you say is the "Citizen Kane" of music albums? It's always interesting that people use "well what's the Citizen Kane of X" as a sort of rhetorical question, since of all the classic movies you could pick, that's probably the one that has the strongest basis for making comparisons. Citizen Kane's real achievement was the level of technical innovation and creation of new film techniques that have a massive lasting impact on films to this day. It is not remembered because it had a particularly great story. It's hard to point to a single game equivalent because so many innovations are spread across multiple games and are genre specific. It's like saying "Seinfeld is the Citizen Kane of sitcoms". You can certainly make a case for some games here, like "Doom is the Citizen Kane of FPS games" or "PUBG is the Citizen Kane of battle royales".
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Jun 23, 2020 10:39
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I kept waiting for a plot point about Abby hulking out. I guess they just made her huge so you could see how rough she was at the very end. I wish we’d learned more about the Seraphites. My first thought was that “the prophet” may have been people hearing rumors of Ellie and a cult forming around that idea of a savior, but I think there was some dialogue from a WLF member that spoke to the actual prophet in a holding cell.
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Jun 23, 2020 10:40
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BOAT SHOWBOAT posted:I'm actually curious, why is there such a visceral drive from people that they actually seem angry about this game or want to knock the developers down with hyperbole and ad hominems? I played the first game and loved it, people wrote off that games story pretty hard as being generic but the characters were likeable enough that I went away with positive impressions of it. Never played multiplayer as that wasn't my thing but when it was time for me to retire my PS3 I actually mailed it to a friend with a few of my games- TLOU included I was in the camp of 'give me more stories in this world, just not Ellie and Joel I like that ending'. So roll around to it getting announced with a grizzled Ellie and nothing else I just let out this heavy sigh of "I sure hope they don't gently caress this up also Joel is probably dead". From there I was still willing to give it a shot- no reason not to, but each trailer focused more and more on graphic murders or boring cutscenes and just nothing hooked me. Hell I didn't even know if the zombies were around because they were showing such a little amount of gameplay. Did they all die out like the first game implied? I would be GENUINELY excited to see a game where the fungal zombies just didn't exist anymore due to dying out and perhaps a story about human life returning to these dilapidated cities, how people would try to go back to normal while others wouldn't- maybe that's why there were so many scenes that seemed to be in 'normal' areas? I dunno I kinda made this part up in my head when I was bored watching yet another cutscene of nothing interesting going on in a trailer. Still, the game just seemed to be on a more slippery slope as things went on- then Naughty Dog got outed for crunch and the unethical practice of using liveleak footage and loving up its employees just to get blood to splatter just right in a video game. Then Druckmann continued being himself with "we don't say fun around here" and I was totally off boat. The leak happened and videos were hard to find but "Joel dies, then Ellie dies because they're both bad people and they ran across a unreasonably buff lady" and I was just 'oh gently caress off naughty dog'. Then I saw Ellie get her poo poo kicked in and was told this was her death scene- Abby holding a knife to a pregnant womans throat and going GOOD at the idea of getting a double kill and it just made me mad. The stitched together plot synopsis and everything just made me more angry that Druckmann would smash the characters I liked into the ground for this, let alone damage his team of people over such a stupid misery inducing story. I had no intentions of buying the game but did it really end with a sequel hook with Ellie becoming Big Boss? I wanted to know so I just hung around threads like this as god forbid I try to get details from /v/ or twitter. I felt compelled to chip in my two cents every here or there but as Stux started making GBS threads up the thread more and more I just kinda came back to see when mods would finally step in and shoo out the clown. Now that he's gone I'm far more interested in discussing the air around the game then the game itself. That's basically it.
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Jun 23, 2020 10:49
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ThisIsACoolGuy posted:I had no intentions of buying the game but did it really end with a sequel hook with Ellie becoming Big Boss? I wanted to know so I just hung around threads like this as god forbid I try to get details from /v/ or twitter. I felt compelled to chip in my two cents every here or there but as Stux started making GBS threads up the thread more and more I just kinda came back to see when mods would finally step in and shoo out the clown. Now that he's gone I'm far more interested in discussing the air around the game then the game itself. That's basically it. Ellie becomes a hosed up emotional cripple with no friends and a hosed hand then wanders off into the forests. The end
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Jun 23, 2020 10:51
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It would be kinda cool if it ended with a gunshot and a thump as it cut to black for the last time
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Jun 23, 2020 11:03
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I do wonder if the build the leaker had ended with the basement scene. That could definitely lead you to conclude that Ellie dies, because her and Dina are both bleeding out on the floor and Tommy is shot in the head, and I'm still not entirely clear on how they get from there to living happily on a farm hundreds of miles away before the rest of the ending happens.
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Jun 23, 2020 11:04
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ThisIsACoolGuy posted:...damage his team of people over such a stupid misery inducing story. This is also why I'm interested in discussing it - for me it's a continuation of this premise that quality art requires suffering and must contain suffering, and that premise is being used to justify crunch and other lovely practices. It's like saying good acting is when you cut your hand during a take and keep going. The level of suffering in a story is also sometimes seen as an indication of how good the story is, which isn't an idea unique to games.
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Jun 23, 2020 11:08
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Hobo posted:This is also why I'm interested in discussing it - for me it's a continuation of this premise that quality art requires suffering and must contain suffering, and that premise is being used to justify crunch and other lovely practices. It's like saying good acting is when you cut your hand during a take and keep going. Quoting a friend of mine on the matter, it's not the suffering, it's the ability of pulling you out of your comfort zone.
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Jun 23, 2020 11:20
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Hobo posted:This is also why I'm interested in discussing it - for me it's a continuation of this premise that quality art requires suffering and must contain suffering, and that premise is being used to justify crunch and other lovely practices. It's like saying good acting is when you cut your hand during a take and keep going. Not to get too analytical but I think part of this could be cultural from puritan influences on American culture. There's a strong underlying theme that suffering and hurting must fundamentally be good in and of itself, and if something hurts it must be better. You see it in a lot of random places. I have wondered if part of Crossfit's popularity could be related to the way that doing exercises that hurt you badly just feels like it must be more worthwhile, even if the science says it's less effective.
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Jun 23, 2020 11:21
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The original God of War trilogy was about how self-destructive and pointless revenge is. It was also full of suffering and, for the time, grisly depictions of brutal violence. Kratos was also, until the sudden swerve redemption arc in the last game, a fairly unambiguous villain protagonist. The games were also fun if repetitive and unambitious. Despite all this, I can't recall them being compared to Schindler's List - or even high art at all!
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Jun 23, 2020 11:32
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CountryMatters posted:Not to get too analytical but I think part of this could be cultural from puritan influences on American culture. There's a strong underlying theme that suffering and hurting must fundamentally be good in and of itself, and if something hurts it must be better. Is that an America thing? I thought that the trend in American cinema was towards overly saccharine, good guy bad guy, happy ending despite it all (made infamous by the many films that had the studio step in and force a less of a downer final beat). And then you go to Europe for the unrelentingly dire and dour art house stuff. Which I guess makes Americans think it's especially deep because "it's so French!"
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Jun 23, 2020 11:36
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RoboChrist 9000 posted:The original God of War trilogy was about how self-destructive and pointless revenge is. It was also full of suffering and, for the time, grisly depictions of brutal violence. Kratos was also, until the sudden swerve redemption arc in the last game, a fairly unambiguous villain protagonist. Press triangle to gently caress
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Jun 23, 2020 11:36
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plasm posted:Killing a protagonist and taking the antagonist’s viewpoint has been done to death recently and to me it comes across as a bit lazy. Can you name a few games that did that? I can't think of one off the tip of my head and quiete frankly, I was pretty floored when I realized they were going for this in TLOU2 - it only fully dawned on me when I opened the character screen and saw that Abby had her own supplement skill progression. Up to that point I thought it was just another interlude like the other flashbacks of her. Although it would be pointless to name other games, since it would ruin the surprise. So nevermind then. I guess I'm just a chump who fully fell for it this time, and I mean that in the best way possible. I thought it was a ballsy move that paid off in the long run.
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Jun 23, 2020 11:40
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mcbexx posted:Can you name a few games that did that?
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Jun 23, 2020 11:42
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I'm watching a let's play and if TLOU2 was a movie a better comparison would be Drive: bottomless boredom punctuated by graphic violence. I actually liked Drive though
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Jun 23, 2020 11:44
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JBP posted:Ellie becomes a hosed up emotional cripple with no friends and a hosed hand then wanders off into the forests. The end Imo it's somewhat implied she's going back to Jackson and trying again
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Jun 23, 2020 11:48
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I thought this game was very good
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Jun 23, 2020 11:51
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doingitwrong posted:Is that an America thing? I thought that the trend in American cinema was towards overly saccharine, good guy bad guy, happy ending despite it all (made infamous by the many films that had the studio step in and force a less of a downer final beat). And then you go to Europe for the unrelentingly dire and dour art house stuff. Which I guess makes Americans think it's especially deep because "it's so French!" I think it's certainly the case for working cultures - look at the number of holiday days per year, expectations about standard working hours, and things like maternity leave. Living to work rather than working to live is a common thread in US working life, and an industry like games makes it worse because it relies on a steady line of people willing to overlook all this because "it's my passion and I'm creating great art". I won't be the first person to point out that you could say the film industry is also full of people willing to work long hours for their passion project, and yet they have unions that are there to ensure that that doesn't go too far, and that those people are compensated for those long hours. Of all the insecurities some game studios have about not being seen to be as prestigious as films, that's the disconnect that is really brushed over. The trend in American cinema vs European cinema might be a reflection of the level of escapism required from that, but I think that's overly broad since you can point to plenty of counterexamples.
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Jun 23, 2020 11:56
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BOAT SHOWBOAT posted:Imo it's somewhat implied she's going back to Jackson and trying again I took it as her fall being absolute and she was leaving.
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Jun 23, 2020 11:59
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Sassy Sasquatch posted:I'm watching a let's play and if TLOU2 was a movie a better comparison would be Drive: bottomless boredom punctuated by graphic violence. Cool congrats on watching someone else play the game.
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Jun 23, 2020 12:00
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JBP posted:Cool congrats on watching someone else play the game. Congrats, noone cares.
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Jun 23, 2020 12:02
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JBP posted:Cool congrats on watching someone else play the game. I mean do you ever play with someone else and take turns? It’s really not a purity test of means
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Jun 23, 2020 12:07
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