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Shumagorath posted:And yet, good and free nations have still time and time again chosen to ally themselves with her, and even her not-so-free previous victims like Vietnam Yeah dude people ally with lovely countries all the time, especially ones with huge militaries and global hegemony that can reduce your country, or its economy, to rubble if you don't cooperate. The case of Japan in the 80s is a pretty good one; Japan's emergence as a global economic player and a possible threat to American hegemony was halted in its tracks by the Plaza Accord which it was forced to sign due to being an American protectorate. The end result was Japan's lost decade, which has in fact stretched into multiple decades that it has yet to seriously recover from. then there's the endless cases of countries that didn't bow to american pressure and what happened to them: for example chile and iran, democracies coup'd and replaced with murderous american backed dictatorships mila kunis fucked around with this message at 00:22 on Jul 5, 2020 |
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Jul 5, 2020 00:19
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bob dobbs is dead posted:vietnam thing is probably because the war counter china-vietnam is way higher than the war counter america-vietnam. vietnamese have one American War and then like you need a fuckin typology of the wars with the chinese yeah pretty much also re: the china-us-vietnam triangle, remember when china and the USA backed the khmer rouge, one of the vilest regimes of all time, against vietnam and lost. that was pretty cool imo
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Jul 5, 2020 00:20
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bob dobbs is dead posted:vietnam thing is probably because the war counter china-vietnam is way higher than the war counter america-vietnam. vietnamese have one American War and then like you need a fuckin typology of the wars with the chinese Yeah nobody even gives a gently caress about the US war anymore. China's been their existential threat for thousands of years, yeeting the US out of Vietnam was a blip compared to that.
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Jul 5, 2020 00:21
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mila kunis posted:yeah pretty much Which led to China invading Vietnam as punishment while the Vietnamese military was still tied up in Cambodia. They basically scorched-earthed their way through until the (heavily outnumbered) Vietnamese reserve troops kicked their teeth in.
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Jul 5, 2020 00:24
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mila kunis posted:yeah pretty much Agreed Im also glad it happened
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Jul 5, 2020 00:24
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I know this might be crazy, but I feel like it males sense to post about how bad America is in the various threads about lovely stuff that America does, and to post about genocide that is happening in China in the China thread. I hate Chester the Cheeto-colored Molester AND the Grand Pooh Bear in nearly equal measure. I don't feel the need to defend Trump's policies in order to say that concentration camps in China are bad and that genocide is wrong.
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Jul 5, 2020 00:44
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The Khmer Rouge was backed and propped up by China. But of course, in the minds of idiot tankies, nobody has agency but the USA, the prime and sole mover of history, and all things (well, all bad things, never good things) are the consequence of the US using its omnipotence to shape reality to its whim It's like a loving cult
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Jul 5, 2020 00:44
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Unrelated to all this icky politics/war/genocide talk. (All three of those things are bad and wrong by the way.) I have a petty inconsequential China question. Do the big Cantonese pop stars ever get crossover audiences with Mandarin pop stars? Or vice versa? Also are there pop stars that sing or release songs in local languages? How big do they get? When I was in Fuzhou, a lot of my High School students loved Taiwanese pop stars. But surely given it's huge entertainment industry, there are HK pop stars also. And reluctantly bringing it back to politics, how does the CCP like/deal with the fact that a great deal of it's young people are listening to potentially disharmonious non-patriotic songs from the rebellious island province?
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Jul 5, 2020 00:47
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On the other hand, if the USA actually was the political and moral equivalent of China then everybody who posts in C-SPAM would be gone, so silver linings
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Jul 5, 2020 00:49
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BrigadierSensible posted:Do the big Cantonese pop stars ever get crossover audiences with Mandarin pop stars? Or vice versa? Also are there pop stars that sing or release songs in local languages? I don't have an answer for this but funny anecdote: Mandarin songwriters often completely throw out the tones when writing lyrics, you have to actually think to decipher what the hell people are singing about half the time. Cantonese songwriters do not, and their lyricists refuse to give up on wrangling the 9 tones into sensible lyrics.
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Jul 5, 2020 01:10
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Fojar38 posted:On the other hand, if the USA actually was the political and moral equivalent of China then everybody who posts in C-SPAM would be gone, so silver linings HUH I might have to rethink who I'm voting for this year...
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Jul 5, 2020 01:43
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https://twitter.com/ChinaDaily/status/1279588354003066886?s=20
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Jul 5, 2020 02:32
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BrigadierSensible posted:Unrelated to all this icky politics/war/genocide talk. (All three of those things are bad and wrong by the way.) I have a petty inconsequential China question. The HK pop stars in the 90s were huge in mainland. Jackie Cheung Leon Andy Lau etc. Not so for newer pop stars. They just suck. All of them also release Manderin albums in Taiwan. It's really easy to learn Manderin for a Cantonese. Not the other way around but there were a handful of boy band type Taiwanese stars released Cantonese album. The CCP has never been that properly communist. I don't know how long will it take for some of you to figure that out.
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Jul 5, 2020 02:55
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BrigadierSensible posted:
Probably the same way that they like having lots of young Taiwanese going to China for jobs - it will work somehow into one country, two systems. Even though the younger Taiwanese are the ones who dislike China the most.
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Jul 5, 2020 02:57
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BrigadierSensible posted:Unrelated to all this icky politics/war/genocide talk. (All three of those things are bad and wrong by the way.) I have a petty inconsequential China question. I'm not sure exactly what you're asking but tons of HK pop stars have basically moved their business up north over the border and now exclusively sing in mandarin instead of Cantonese. Same with actors. It's been like a two-decade long exodus. Basically the whole HK film/music industry has migrated. They certainly have audiences in the mainland and during the protests, a few who even so much as approached anything even remotely hinting at a sympathetic stance were ganked on Chinese social media until they made public apologies (or, rather, were forced to by their management agencies). As for your very last question, no HK popstar making that sweet sweet yuan in China is ever singing disharmonious lyrics. Any popular HK-only artist who is ostensibly yellow is being censored in the mainland. E: to clarify, you are not getting your song released in China if you've got glory to hk as your chorus. For example, popstar Denise Ho basically lost her entire mainland audience and all that money by being public as being 'yellow'. Things were different in the past, though. Megastars of the 80s/90s (basically before the 2000s which is when the exodus started) had tons of crossover appeal into the mainland even if they sung in Cantonese (though singing songs in mandarin has been going on for ages with HK pop stars not just for access to markets but also because it offers a different sound and different opportunities for lyricists). Shrimp or Shrimps fucked around with this message at 03:05 on Jul 5, 2020 |
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Jul 5, 2020 03:02
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BrigadierSensible posted:Unrelated to all this icky politics/war/genocide talk. (All three of those things are bad and wrong by the way.) I have a petty inconsequential China question. Its been a while so im kinda hazy but I think Faye Wong was big as a cantonese singer originally? I dont think she was native canto though and she released tons of stuff in putonghua, but she was notably in Chungking Express and did the cantonese "dreams" cover of holy poo poo piss fame for it. Anyway she was super well known in the mainland. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qnPPyyRabjo Now watching that just makes me sad :/
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Jul 5, 2020 03:04
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Wong Faye growth up in Beijing.
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Jul 5, 2020 03:24
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stephenthinkpad posted:Wong Faye growth up in Beijing. yeah but she got popular in HK first didnt she
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Jul 5, 2020 03:31
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Ohhhhhboy, just FYI, New Zealand has been letting US warships in since 2016. https://www.stripes.com/news/pacific/destroyer-will-be-1st-us-navy-ship-to-visit-new-zealand-in-3-decades-1.434597
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Jul 5, 2020 03:31
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hakimashou posted:yeah but she got popular in HK first didnt she I am just saying she doesn't identify herself as a Hong Konger, although she speaks almost 100% fluent Cantonese. She is a very special case.
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Jul 5, 2020 03:49
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Also, we bailed out of the ANZUS defense treaty because it was bankrupting us. The Nuclear-free thing was just a thing to get the public to buy into it. Not that that's a bad thing (Seeing as Hydro and Geothermal power's pretty abundant here), mind. You gotta know how to get the great unwashed to bellyfeel something first.
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Jul 5, 2020 04:32
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Weka posted:Ohhhhhboy, just FYI, New Zealand has been letting US warships in since 2016. Cool, it still doesn't change our nuclear-free stance given the assurances made. It was under John Key, a right wing muppet, but close enough. Good catch. I only have to change the wording a little. From quote:The continued rejection of US warships in keeping to our nuclear free stance To quote:The continued rejection of nuclear armed or powered US warships in keeping to our nuclear free stance
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Jul 5, 2020 05:09
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Small change in plan. The letter to the PM will be posted ahead as the open letter to the MPs will take too long to write to my satisfaction. To enhance the impact I will also send a copy to HKFP for consideration. The second scares me, but if I want it to matter. I call for final submissions for corrections, fact checking etc.quote:Honourable Prime Minster Jacinda Ardern
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Jul 5, 2020 05:54
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hakimashou posted:Its been a while so im kinda hazy but I think Faye Wong was big as a cantonese singer originally? I dont think she was native canto though and she released tons of stuff in putonghua, but she was notably in Chungking Express and did the cantonese "dreams" cover of holy poo poo piss fame for it. Is putonghua a loaded term? I remember calling Mandarin that infront of my Taiwanese professor's family once and them all laughing.
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Jul 5, 2020 06:33
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Mantis42 posted:Is putonghua a loaded term? I remember calling Mandarin that infront of my Taiwanese professor's family once and them all laughing. it's part of the CCP effort to eradicate local dialects, brings to mind the newscaster speak in beijing dialect with super exaggerated tones, all the state propaganda is in this style
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Jul 5, 2020 06:55
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Mantis42 posted:Is putonghua a loaded term? I remember calling Mandarin that infront of my Taiwanese professor's family once and them all laughing. it means "common language" its what im used to calling it. maybe its from living in guangdong and thats what people there called it when speaking chinese to me I dont mean this sarcastically or anything, its just what I got used to calling it hakimashou fucked around with this message at 08:36 on Jul 5, 2020 |
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Jul 5, 2020 07:38
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Mantis42 posted:Is putonghua a loaded term? I remember calling Mandarin that infront of my Taiwanese professor's family once and them all laughing. That sounds like the one time I tried talking in mandarin to a HK taxi driver
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Jul 5, 2020 07:43
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while we are on the topic, what happened to the Hong Kong film industry?
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Jul 5, 2020 08:47
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In general or just in the past few weeks?
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Jul 5, 2020 08:55
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Fojar38 posted:The Khmer Rouge was backed and propped up by China. But of course, in the minds of idiot tankies, nobody has agency but the USA, the prime and sole mover of history, and all things (well, all bad things, never good things) are the consequence of the US using its omnipotence to shape reality to its whim Imagine believing even tankies support the Khmer Rouge lmao You need to calm down
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Jul 5, 2020 09:10
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gently caress off
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Jul 5, 2020 09:13
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I would blow Dane Cook posted:while we are on the topic, what happened to the Hong Kong film industry? You could describe it as similar to what happened with the collapse of the studio system in Hollywood. The studios still controlled alot of the movie theaters there, when they went down the whole distribution and marketing apparatus fell apart. The major producers (Golden Harvest, Shaw Brothers) went down in popularity, which destroyed the star system set in place (and as you know in HK, all the stars were multi-talented, with movies and albums and talk shows and all that stuff.) The best talent (directors, actors) were being poached to go work in other places by the early 90s. Much like the entire economic model for HK is being squeezed out by other Chinese cities, HK couldn't compete with the money being thrown around on the mainland for talent. And unlike India, because HK and Chinese movies always had widespread dubbing, you don't have that base of customer support just because you're going to see the only Cantonese movie like the Tamil or Bengali film industry. Wikipedia goes into it pretty well: quote:Numerous, converging factors have been blamed for the downturn: The piracy one is always fun to laugh at but it is true: VCDs were a huge loving market and were a super easy way to get films even in the 2000s. And the hollywood stuff matters too. You don't think about it, but the average mid-tier hollywood movie (which rarely gets produced anymore) just looked better than what the average HK film was doing. Better camera, sets, costumes, sound production...you see the money on the loving screen, and people notice. A4R8 posted:Imagine believing even tankies support the Khmer Rouge lmao is this a version of calmhitler.jpg GoutPatrol fucked around with this message at 09:17 on Jul 5, 2020 |
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Jul 5, 2020 09:14
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I can see where he's coming from, not all Nazis support Hitler,
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Jul 5, 2020 09:19
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The collective psychosis itt 
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Jul 5, 2020 09:30
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A4R8 posted:Imagine believing even tankies support the Khmer Rouge lmao Please define for me what exactly tankies support, I'm just worried I might cause hurt feelings
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Jul 5, 2020 09:30
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Traveler posted:Please define for me what exactly tankies support, I'm just worried I might cause hurt feelings These imaginary tankies seem to be hurting your feelings though
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Jul 5, 2020 09:34
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Tankies support all the good stuff China is doing. Tankies deny any of the bad stuff China is doing. There, simple.
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Jul 5, 2020 09:37
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A4R8 posted:These imaginary tankies seem to be hurting your feelings though No need to project dear, this is a safe space for you to talk your personal issues instead of gaslighting
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Jul 5, 2020 09:41
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A4R8 posted:These imaginary tankies seem to be hurting your feelings though poo poo pee pee posted:Hopefully you're all in hong kong when the tanks roll in at least
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Jul 5, 2020 09:58
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oohhboy posted:Small change in plan. The letter to the PM will be posted ahead as the open letter to the MPs will take too long to write to my satisfaction. To enhance the impact I will also send a copy to HKFP for consideration. The second scares me, but if I want it to matter. I call for final submissions for corrections, fact checking etc. Is this for real? Are you from NZ? You should ask the NZ government offer more refugee status to HK young radical students who are too poor to immigrate out of HK, not some unrealistic trade "sanction" a tiny country like NZ is in no position to execute. I don't remember ever reading NZ's name in any of the "Five Eyes countries trying to sanction China" news.
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Jul 5, 2020 10:08
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