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How quickly we forget the perfect VideoGames rating scale
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Jul 8, 2020 16:36
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Man I just want to vent about how mind bogglingly stupid "Gamer Culture" is. Like there are so many things you could legitimately criticize about this game, I don't even think it's all that great, but the backlash is like 90% impotent rage about how strong daddy was murdered by feminist sjw. Someone please feel bad for me, a white male gamer, about how this personally affects me.
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Jul 8, 2020 20:43
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ZaronYeras posted:Man I just want to vent about how mind bogglingly stupid "Gamer Culture" is. Like there are so many things you could legitimately criticize about this game, I don't even think it's all that great, but the backlash is like 90% impotent rage about how strong daddy was murdered by feminist sjw. Someone please feel bad for me, a white male gamer, about how this personally affects me.
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Jul 8, 2020 20:47
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Yes video games have the worst culture of any medium
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Jul 8, 2020 23:31
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ZaronYeras posted:Man I just want to vent about how mind bogglingly stupid "Gamer Culture" is. Like there are so many things you could legitimately criticize about this game, I don't even think it's all that great, but the backlash is like 90% impotent rage about how strong daddy was murdered by feminist sjw. Someone please feel bad for me, a white male gamer, about how this personally affects me. If their life support in the form of sexually charged games with Id pleasing content wasn't cut off they would still be inside their pod. But the real world doesn't function that way so they can get hosed just because Laura Bailey did roles in Naughty Dog that they didn't liked I still remember how people bitched and moaned about Nadine Ross, another character voiced by her.
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Jul 9, 2020 03:36
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gyrobot posted:I still remember how people bitched and moaned about Nadine Ross, another character voiced by her. I mean, that's a completely different crowd of people, and also an actual valid complaint
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Jul 9, 2020 04:00
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precision posted:I mean, that's a completely different crowd of people, and also an actual valid complaint Nah, they're talking about the crowd of people that complained about her because she could beat up Nathan Drake who are totally the same. Those that complained about Nandine being voiced by a white woman (especially in the next game where she co-stars with another woman of colour voice by a white woman) are on the money though.
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Jul 9, 2020 06:24
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Ohhh yeah I had forgotten that fight scene was so controversial Like even if you're gonna go down that road, Drake is characterized as being barely athletic and Nadine is a drat soldier. The fact that Drake can easily punch out all those other soldiers doesn't matter because they're not characters. They're just... gameplay pinatas
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Jul 9, 2020 06:35
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Personally I was surprised it took them 4 or 5 games to actually bring someone in who could beat him in an honest fist fight without resorting to attempting to punch them being an instant kill. Because Drake never really struck me as the Uncharted world's greatest hand-to-hand combatant.
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Jul 9, 2020 06:39
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ZaronYeras posted:Man I just want to vent about how mind bogglingly stupid "Gamer Culture" is. Like there are so many things you could legitimately criticize about this game, I don't even think it's all that great, but the backlash is like 90% impotent rage about how strong daddy was murdered by feminist sjw. Someone please feel bad for me, a white male gamer, about how this personally affects me. I still can't get over how mad some gamers get about difficulty options in games. Like, there is a topic where someone is mad about a developer adding options that allow people to customize the difficulty of the game and some people got pissed just because the option existed. Like over time, I am starting to see the conservative side of a lot of gamers and it often is masked in unsubtle libertarian leanings. I hear, "it should be up to the developers a lot". Then when developers actually start adding them, people get upset about that. I remember the last big dust up was over Sekiro, where a bunch of disabled gamers were actually speaking out this sort of thing. But I am glad that TLOU2 has all of the options it has and I hope more games adopt that sort of thing going forward. The Neal! posted:Nah, they're talking about the crowd of people that complained about her because she could beat up Nathan Drake who are totally the same. This still pisses me off to this day. I mean, you have one of the Whitest AAA franchises that I can think of off of the top of my head and then when you finally add some more complex characters of color, you make them voiced by White people? Come on. blackguy32 fucked around with this message at 07:12 on Jul 9, 2020 |
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Jul 9, 2020 07:10
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Naughty Dog should double down make an Uncharted 5 like this. Eddy Raja's daughter shows up. Hip hop trap remix introducing her "What's up what's up white America assassinate my character" kills Drake and then Cassie seeks revenge and the plot then follows Last of Us 2 exactly beat for beat with a character swap
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Jul 9, 2020 07:25
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This talk got me thinking, by the end of TLoU2 are there any named characters of color still alive? Dead: Isaac Jesse Manny Whitney Marlene Henry Sam Riley Alive:  In Manny's case his writing was honestly sort of racist to begin with so maybe a double negative makes for a positive ?
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Jul 9, 2020 08:48
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Lev is still alive. But yeah, despite Druckmann's views on inclusion, his stories always come off feeling White as hell to me. blackguy32 fucked around with this message at 08:53 on Jul 9, 2020 |
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Jul 9, 2020 08:50
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Baby JJ, I guess. More of a prop than a character though.
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Jul 9, 2020 08:59
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Of all of those I think Manny's death annoyed me the most, because he was the only character who could possibly suffer any lasting consequences in that scene and so of course he wasn't gonna survive it. Generally I'm not annoyed by stuff like that, but during Ellie's section Manny is left unaddressed, ergo he has to die during Abby's. So as soon as he came on screen totally outta nowhere I knew he was dead. And the way he gets killed is just so lame. So many times this game has someone do something dumb and irrational in a cutscene and then get one-tapped from offscreen, it just stinks. Feels like the writers have got no idea how to remove characters from the story besides killin em. It's the only part of the writing I feel is truly objectively weak from a structural point of view.
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Jul 9, 2020 09:07
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I mean, by the end there's not that many named characters alive full stop.quote:And the way he gets killed is just so lame. So many times this game has someone do something dumb and irrational in a cutscene and then get one-tapped from offscreen. I don't totally disagree, but who're you thinking of? I guess Yara maybe, but she wasn't really doing anything irrational, she just got unlucky during a battle. Necrothatcher fucked around with this message at 09:14 on Jul 9, 2020 |
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Jul 9, 2020 09:10
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Necrothatcher posted:I mean, by the end there's not that many named characters alive full stop. Jesse dies in almost the same manner
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Jul 9, 2020 09:23
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She jumps ahead of you without waiting for Abby or Lev to follow and just stands there out in the open without even having her gun out with her back to the wide open alleyway she just hopped into. What a surprise, someone comes out of nowhere from behind her! It's like something out of a cheesy 80s horror movie. edit: ^^^ Him too, but at least Jesse has the excuse of not knowing what's going on in the next room. Yara just completely lets her guard down for no reason other than "this character served her story purpose and needs to be dead now". CJacobs fucked around with this message at 09:27 on Jul 9, 2020 |
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Jul 9, 2020 09:24
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shout out to tommy, who got merked in the head but walked it off
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Jul 9, 2020 09:45
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Eau de MacGowan posted:shout out to tommy, who got merked in the head but walked it off Listen, if TLOU teaches us anything, it's that you get to survive the current game based upon how much of an unrepentant bastard you are, Tommy just face heel turned to not die. If you are noble or flawed you get killed/sacrifice yourself.
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Jul 9, 2020 09:52
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Stormgale posted:Listen, if TLOU teaches us anything, it's that you get to survive the current game based upon how much of an unrepentant bastard you are, Tommy just face heel turned to not die. If you are noble or flawed you get killed/sacrifice yourself. Huh, good point. I was gonna say that this is not a universe that you wanna be gay in but yeah, Tommy's the only straight person to survive.
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Jul 9, 2020 10:11
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RareAcumen posted:Huh, good point. I was gonna say that this is not a universe that you wanna be gay in but yeah, Tommy's the only straight person to survive. Abby? And we don't know Lev's sexuality.
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Jul 9, 2020 10:36
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abby, having being stabbed and slashed twenty to forty times by ellie, was unable to steer the boat accurately and dropped herself and lev into a whirlpool thirty seconds after disappearing from camera, sorry to break this to you
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Jul 9, 2020 10:42
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ZaronYeras posted:Man I just want to vent about how mind bogglingly stupid "Gamer Culture" is. Like there are so many things you could legitimately criticize about this game, I don't even think it's all that great, but the backlash is like 90% impotent rage about how strong daddy was murdered by feminist sjw. Someone please feel bad for me, a white male gamer, about how this personally affects me. It's frustrating. There's plenty of interesting discussion to have about this game (positive and negative) but it's an absolute cesspit in most places. The last few pages here (except for some of the people trying to argue watching the interactive medium is as valid as playing it) have been pretty interesting though!
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Jul 9, 2020 11:53
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Manny and Jesse being murdered in the exact same way unceremoniously is a storytelling device, them mirroring each other so completely is the opposite of weak writing IMO. What other places even are there to discuss video games that aren’t completely preceded by an awful reputation? reddit has literally always been a total toxic waste dump ressetera was transparently created as a power structure for nerds to lord over gently caress Facebook groups and that leaves SA and the comments in Polygon or Kotaku articles? Yeah no thanks to all of that lmao Bust Rodd fucked around with this message at 12:49 on Jul 9, 2020 |
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Jul 9, 2020 12:34
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I was really bummed when Jesse died, he seemed like a pretty nice guy. I lent my PS4 and TLOU2 to my friend and a large part of why I don't miss it is that he's giving me regular updates and I have someone non toxic to discuss the game with. This thread has been okay but there's still been a whole lot of bad. There's been so many dumb arguments but I think my favourite has been the "Joel was a tactical genius and never would have trusted those strangers" as though it's not a good idea to be as friendly and diplomatic as possible to a group of heavily armed people you're stuck in a cabin with.
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Jul 9, 2020 13:16
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The Neal! posted:This thread has been okay but there's still been a whole lot of bad. There's been so many dumb arguments but I think my favourite has been the "Joel was a tactical genius and never would have trusted those strangers" as though it's not a good idea to be as friendly and diplomatic as possible to a group of heavily armed people you're stuck in a cabin with. "Joel would have NEVER let his guard down like that!" is the softcore slice of the same toxic misogyny pie as "Joel got killed by a girl". It infers that Joel is somehow "less-than" or inadequately suited to being empathetic and that letting your guard down is sign of weakness. Joel's softening up from his hardened lifestyle of being a murderous human trafficker should, if anything, be seen as a GOOD thing (yes, even though it may have cost him his life). Like ultimately Joel did get a happy ending, just from going through his house and the flashbacks. Ellie was still in his life and he loved her at least as much as he loved Sarah. He had his brother and sister-in-law and his whittling (incredible character development that is never mentioned or spoken of, I loved it) and was beloved and respected in Jackson. Pretty much a happy ending with a bow until the literal final punctuation mark in the epilogue of his life.
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Jul 9, 2020 14:14
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I think it kind of depends on who that point is coming from. I did find it a bit strange to see him just walk into a situation like that, considering the kind of experiences with trusting strangers that he has had. "Once burned, twice shy" and all that. PTSD doesn't just go away over a bare few years of a comparatively more peaceful lifestyle. It's certainly a positive character development for him, just not necessarily an entirely believable one.
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Jul 9, 2020 14:17
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Have we seen any evidence in either game that Joel suffers from PTSD the way Ellie obviously does in the 2nd, or is that something people are just inferring? There are lots of ways that psychological damage and trauma can manifest in people, that's not the only one and I feel like some people use it as like a catch all, umbrella term when it's a very specific thing with symptoms.
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Jul 9, 2020 14:22
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The Neal! posted:I was really bummed when Jesse died, he seemed like a pretty nice guy. Honestly Joel and Tommy's mistake was accepting to follow her back to her group in the first place. The reason they decide to ride to that cabin instead of going back to Jackson is more or less "no time to explain". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sDtze6qIKA8&t=462s From there yeah, you probably should be way more on your guard when you're surrounded by a heavily armed group of people you've never met but I feel that at that stage you've already tied the noose around your neck regardless.
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Jul 9, 2020 14:23
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Bust Rodd posted:Have we seen any evidence in either game that Joel suffers from PTSD the way Ellie obviously does in the 2nd, or is that something people are just inferring? There are lots of ways that psychological damage and trauma can manifest in people, that's not the only one and I feel like some people use it as like a catch all, umbrella term when it's a very specific thing with symptoms.
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Jul 9, 2020 14:39
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The Neal! posted:I was really bummed when Jesse died, he seemed like a pretty nice guy. Yeah. I had a sinking feeling when he turned up, though - it seemed pretty certain that either he or Dina were going to die and was sort of waiting for it to happen. It's pretty odd that it's implied that there's going to be an Ellie Jesse Dina problem as a subplot, but then it's dropped, and then Jesse's killed. The Neal! posted:I lent my PS4 and TLOU2 to my friend and a large part of why I don't miss it is that he's giving me regular updates and I have someone non toxic to discuss the game with. The Neal! posted:This thread has been okay but there's still been a whole lot of bad. There's been so many dumb arguments but I think my favourite has been the "Joel was a tactical genius and never would have trusted those strangers" as though it's not a good idea to be as friendly and diplomatic as possible to a group of heavily armed people you're stuck in a cabin with. We're going to be discussing this for the next three pages now. Anyway, yeah, no argument. Joel wasn't even suspicious enough to act in the way that people claim that he would in the first game and they know that - it's straight-up "I didn't want this to happen so here are some entirely unprovable assertions about how Joel would have behaved". I'm all for getting worked up when characters are ill-treated by the story (and think that there are times in this game when characters are pushed around like cardboard cutouts in order to make a specific thing happen), but the people who've deified Joel to the extent that they can't accept that aspect of this story are victims of a problem that they've created.
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Jul 9, 2020 15:01
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When has a room full of heavily armed strangers stopped Joel before, honestly.
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Jul 9, 2020 15:49
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Sassy Sasquatch posted:Honestly Joel and Tommy's mistake was accepting to follow her back to her group in the first place. The reason they decide to ride to that cabin instead of going back to Jackson is more or less "no time to explain". You could also consider the fact that there’s no way on earth there’s a fortified ski lodge compound that close to Jackson that Joel and Tommy aren’t intimately familiar with so you could make a case that Joel and Tommy still felt at ease because they were still in familiar territory and these kids seem pretty harmless considering how owned they got by infected.
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Jul 9, 2020 15:54
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Heh, watching that scene I like the detail that Tommy seems to have given Abby their names as a calming technique, assuming she was in shock. It comes across the way a paramedic would talk to someone in a bad way, as if Tommy's had that sort of encounter a hundred times before. I didn't notice that the first time.
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Jul 9, 2020 15:59
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dogstile posted:When has a room full of heavily armed strangers stopped Joel before, honestly. Well he should have known there was a cutscene coming.
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Jul 9, 2020 16:35
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Curses, he's been foiled.
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Jul 9, 2020 16:45
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why would joel think he was in any danger? the furniture was not conspicuously arranged as waist-high cover
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Jul 9, 2020 16:51
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I think you might be able to make the point that Joel should have caught on a little quicker instead of making a little joke. I do kind of wonder how people would have taken things if they went with the original plan and tortured information out of other Jackson residents first.
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Jul 9, 2020 17:11
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| # ? Jun 5, 2024 00:00 |
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This is what I did cause I was playing the bad guy (and my Saints Row boss) all of a sudden. I know it's my own fault but Abby throwing the ball into the stadium seats made her irredeemable.
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Jul 9, 2020 17:19
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