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Wax have a lot of ridiculous scaling mechanics people tend to sleep on a bit. Reform enhances cards so going all in on Draffs that constantly reform is a super easy way to get a horde of multi-attackers that you barely need to be concerned about HP with. They also have all the various ways to make poo poo loads of gold with things like Parafinn enforcer or Greedy Baron (RIP his Umbra synergy). Failing at all of that they're the only clan with access to Stealth which can be just hilariously broken if you stack it by slapping Holdover on the spell or putting endless on the guy who extinguishes into it.
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Jul 15, 2020 03:23
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The reform draff horde idea sounds fun but seems like it would take too long to put together. Though I guess you just need to find a holdover upgrade early
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Jul 15, 2020 03:34
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Legion of Wax is also an absolute clownshoe of a monster that can dominate of a floor entirely by themselves. And then you move its splits onto other floors and oh boy
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Jul 15, 2020 03:35
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Idk I had a legion of wax with a snuffer and multi hit with +5/+10 and it didn't carry quite as hard as I thought it would. Without the snuffer relic I think it's more trouble than it's worth. I finished a run with each of the pairings. It seems like hellhorned is a solid secondary or primary faction and I appreciate Prince more and more as I play, awoken's an ok primary and great secondary, Stygian is a great primary and mostly blah secondary given how hard their spells lean on Tethys, Umbra is an ok primary and passable secondary (set up a factory on another floor), Melting is way too complicated for me to evaluate. I think Melting has an issue where half their pool is just bad but apparently they're getting some buffs. My favorite subtheme I've seen so far is Hellhorned/Melting infinite imps. No Wave fucked around with this message at 03:47 on Jul 15, 2020 |
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Jul 15, 2020 03:38
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Intent on death makes legion really shine imo.
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Jul 15, 2020 03:51
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Endless Legion leaves the splits on the field, but I've never thought to use Intent on Death (I think both are rare though). Edit: Another silly gottagofast run, this time with multistrike Shattered Shell and Burn Bright III getting fed a metric assload of waxen spikes, and then the Devourer blew up for 435 damage to finish the job. It was honestly hard to get things to die for Melted Memories to feed the spikes.  DL Ranzear fucked around with this message at 04:36 on Jul 15, 2020 |
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Jul 15, 2020 04:11
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No Wave posted:If I don't get burnout I just lose sadly. This feels like a problem with most of the factions but yeah it's most pronounced with Melted - there's an objectively best champion choice and when it's not one of the two the game makes available to you the entire run feels terrible. So also the random starting cards; it's way too easy to get a giant pile of garbage out of the gate.
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Jul 15, 2020 05:29
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dyzzy posted:The reform draff horde idea sounds fun but seems like it would take too long to put together. Though I guess you just need to find a holdover upgrade early Khorne fucked around with this message at 06:00 on Jul 15, 2020 |
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Jul 15, 2020 05:57
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Irony.or.Death posted:This feels like a problem with most of the factions but yeah it's most pronounced with Melted - there's an objectively best champion choice and when it's not one of the two the game makes available to you the entire run feels terrible. So also the random starting cards; it's way too easy to get a giant pile of garbage out of the gate. Melted: Burnout and it's not even close Awoken: Spikes and it's not really close (explosive is getting buffed though). The draw a card one seems like it would make the early game actually impossible Hellhorned: The ideal prince 3 imo is double something with 1 multi-strike. All three are really cool though, fun and balanced champion Umbra: Actually pretty balanced as well. Architect is surprisingly good, Monstrous double gorge is very strong, triple gorge is ofc what dreams are made of Stygian: A point of sweep is just insane and basically mandatory imo. Triple spell weakness or spell weakness + double frostbite are my favored All things considered I don't think the champion balance is too bad. For as crazy as the game is I'm really surprised by how generally decent the balance is, or maybe the faction combination system is just that good. No Wave fucked around with this message at 15:59 on Jul 15, 2020 |
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Jul 15, 2020 15:06
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No Wave posted:Awoken: Draw and melting's "bring guys back from the dead" choice are really interesting to play. I'm glad they exist even if they aren't as optimal as other choices currently. Khorne fucked around with this message at 15:33 on Jul 15, 2020 |
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Jul 15, 2020 15:24
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Yeah Explosive Awoken is pretty good really. Awoken have access to a lot of sweep units that yer spiky boi does not synergise with. Explosive combos with that nicely - you do explode damage to the front unit once per turn if you have regen, plus an additional time for every heal applied, and your (ideally quick) sweeper cleans up the back rank.
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Jul 15, 2020 15:44
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Doublestack Siren's Song in a Frostbite deck  eat loving poo poo crystalcloak
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Jul 15, 2020 15:55
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Yeah Rector Flicker is the most lopsided champ imo as well. Tethys is probably the one I most often "multiclass" with.
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Jul 15, 2020 16:39
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For those who weren't aware - That event where the woman offers you either a terrible spike spell that duplicates itself or a terrible 1x2/1 multiattacker that duplicates itself, the cards upgrade and stop duplicating once you make four copies. This should really be told to you before you pick one of them because for a while I was skipping that event. The upgraded hands are actually kind of amazing.
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Jul 15, 2020 16:40
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What is the reward upgrade for the spell? I have never not windmill slammed the spikedriver colony button
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Jul 15, 2020 16:45
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I have no idea lol I do the same thing EDIT: I looked it up - apparently they gain +10 magic power and consume which does not seem as good to me! No Wave fucked around with this message at 16:51 on Jul 15, 2020 |
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Jul 15, 2020 16:48
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What do the later ranks of the Awoken “Revenge: Draw 1” champion look like? Draw 2 and Draw 3? If so, that’s completely unusable !!
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Jul 15, 2020 18:47
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Jay Rust posted:What do the later ranks of the Awoken “Revenge: Draw 1” champion look like? Draw 2 and Draw 3? If so, that’s completely unusable !! It stays Draw 1. The HP just goes up drastically every level.
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Jul 15, 2020 18:47
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Me: I would like "remove consume and +1 cost" please Merchant: no Me: Okay, well, I'll re-roll Merchant: no Me: Okay, well, i'll just wait till next time Merchant: no Me: I will re-roll agai- Merchant: no Me: Well, this has been a valuable use of my gold and time, thank you my good sir
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Jul 15, 2020 19:03
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That story is amusing to me because that's usually the power up I don't want to see. I rarely go through my deck more than twice.
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Jul 15, 2020 19:13
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No Wave posted:That story is amusing to me because that's usually the power up I don't want to see. I rarely go through my deck more than twice. I wanted to combine it with -1 cost so i could get free reusable packed morsels so my beefy hungry crucible warden never dies This probably won't work out but I can sure as gently caress try EDIT: should mention that I'm only at covenant rank 4
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Jul 15, 2020 19:15
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My issue w/ packed morsels is you'll usually find either a morselmaster or morselmaker which makes it impossible to put more than one morsel next to your collector anyways. It's still generically ok at 0 mana and it certainly makes better morsels than the starter card so there's nothing wrong with it and feeding Crucible all the morsels is probably the most solid/reliable boss killer strategy in the game.
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Jul 15, 2020 19:20
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No Wave posted:For those who weren't aware - She tells you that if you get enough - four will do - she’ll have something else for you
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Jul 15, 2020 19:39
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No Wave posted:My issue w/ packed morsels is you'll usually find either a morselmaster or morselmaker which makes it impossible to put more than one morsel next to your collector anyways. It's still generically ok at 0 mana and it certainly makes better morsels than the starter card so there's nothing wrong with it and feeding Crucible all the morsels is probably the most solid/reliable boss killer strategy in the game. Umbra is the clan with + capacity cards and also the clan that most benefits from picking +capacity at Daedalus and Fel (hell if you go Monstrous 3 you literally can't play your champ without at least one of those things)
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Jul 15, 2020 19:43
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The Maestro posted:She tells you that if you get enough - four will do - she’ll have something else for you
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Jul 15, 2020 19:47
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Also be aware there are two different but similar-looking blight card events. One just puts trash in one's deck (the one with the dudes locked to pillars) while there's a different one that offers some cane relic and blights that I've never taken, or three Calicified Embers. Do not confuse these events because only the latter will upgrade the cards later. A battle or two after the latter, all Calcified Embers will become Excavated Ember, just like from the rare Umbra card but permanent. Don't purge the embers if one wants them upgraded though. I had at least one run where I habitually clicked the Calcified Embers but it was the prior event, which just makes purging blight cards deal 100 damage to the front unit. If it were all units it might be worthwhile. The other options from that event are even worse, like +1 attack on all units per blight card. 100% hard no on that event. There just aren't enough good reliable interactions for me to ever take blight cards except the Calcified upgrade one. Dante is too rare and still kinda super iffy in value to me, and it sure seems like one only gets one of these three events in any given run, or worse one gets Dante and one's best choice from either of the other events is gonna remove the blights from their deck later anyway. There is no outcome that isn't counterproductive in some way that I've seen.
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Jul 15, 2020 20:06
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The calcified event that gives damage when you play blights is really good and I'm very happy to see it. It works on the blights in the fel/seraph levels and on dante's candles if you're lucky enough to pick him up.
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Jul 15, 2020 20:19
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The cane relic gives you two blights and then +1 ember for every two blights in your deck. I’ve had one run where I got Dante and then the add blights/+attack for each blight event. Rare, but it worked out pretty well for meNo Wave posted:I think she does that after you pick. I was just clicking leave every time. Ah yea maybe so. It’s also worth noting that after she upgrades the cards, it removes the create copy on extinguish effect.
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Jul 15, 2020 20:30
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Right, but both of those Calcified Ember cases rely on getting either that one Fel variant or Dante to show up at all, else it's just trash in one's deck because most other blight cards come from <5hp enemies which should be well enough handled or one has other problems (and are you really gonna let them hit your Pyre just for a chance they come up for the boss?) And that's already running up hard against my point that I never seem to get more than one blight card related event per run regardless. At least Calcified Ember can be gotten rid of easily. That the Calcified Embers are 3 ember one-shots kinda ruins it too. I'm not about to expect that kind of best-case in Monster Train, no matter how much more optimistic it is. StS would starve me of even the most basic bare-minimum for some combo often enough that I stopped playing it entirely (even aside from having way too many "Take 5 damage because Ranzear fucked around with this message at 20:38 on Jul 15, 2020 |
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Jul 15, 2020 20:35
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The downside for calcified ember is tiny. 3 mana deal 100 damage is like... moderately weak but they're gone very soon. I think leaving yourself open to amazing things happening is just part of playing this game (for example, putting extra emphasis on wildwood sap as an early pick in case you find a 5x vent) as long as it doesn't really hurt you much.The Maestro posted:The cane relic gives you two blights and then +1 ember for every two blights in your deck. I’ve had one run where I got Dante and then the add blights/+attack for each blight event. Rare, but it worked out pretty well for me No Wave fucked around with this message at 20:40 on Jul 15, 2020 |
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Jul 15, 2020 20:38
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Right, but now one needs to over-consider whether they should purge them or it's the same kind of banking on whether you'll see anything compatible come up. I think it's overplanning. 3 ember 100 damage can be useful for the immediate battle, but that requires ignoring the later pure-chance potential. There are no trash battles or ? rooms one can casually limp through and bide time like in StS. One is basically going into an elite every time and putting unmitigated trash in the deck is a far harder choice, at least to me. Ranzear fucked around with this message at 20:44 on Jul 15, 2020 |
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Jul 15, 2020 20:42
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You should always purge the +100 damage calcified embers as soon as you get a chance, maybe I wasn't being clear on that by talking about the cane in the same post.
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Jul 15, 2020 20:43
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That's still a back-footed case though, at least for me. 3 ember for 100 damage that is too likely to be eaten by trash because for some reason I have spare energy and no better way to apply it is a losing situation. If I'm far enough into the game to have that event come up but still need 100 front unit damage from a card, something is fucky. That's why I mentioned it'd be better if it was all-enemies, but I can see now how that'd be broken in some still rare cases. A good change would be all enemies, but damage is based on the cost of the card. Edit: I think that's where Monster Train is such an enjoyable departure from Spire, actually. There are so few truly bad events absolutely no 'get hosed vs get double hosed' choices. The event we're discussing is easily the most skippable/ignorable one in the game, and defintiely not one I actively pursue. Contrast with the Max/Min one that gives two loving awesome choices. StS was so focused on grinding the player down and loving them over that it's almost Stockholm Syndrome to accept the prior as a 'good' event. Ranzear fucked around with this message at 21:17 on Jul 15, 2020 |
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Jul 15, 2020 20:48
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One run I got the clacified ember event that upgrades and then the purge event right after so I got 6 of the upgraded embers.
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Jul 16, 2020 06:44
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Pigbuster posted:Legion of Wax is also an absolute clownshoe of a monster that can dominate of a floor entirely by themselves. And then you move its splits onto other floors and oh boy  Legion plus the card that triggers its deathrattle plus just making the legion as large as possible is hilarious. (although on this run I also had multiple quickstriking 50x3 draff units so very little even made it to that floor)
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Jul 16, 2020 15:03
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I now have 7 shadowsieges and no way to play any of them. This should go well. EDIT: It did not. Chairchucker fucked around with this message at 15:45 on Jul 16, 2020 |
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Jul 16, 2020 15:40
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Someone explain to me how the railspikes are intended to be used because I'm an idiot
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Jul 16, 2020 18:59
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Automatic railspike? It's a bad card that upgrades into a better but not really op card when you have four of them in your deck. Awoken's rail spike probably doesnt require much explanation. Is it the X cost that's causing a problem? It deals 5 * your remaining energy and uses it all.
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Jul 16, 2020 19:02
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Color Printer posted:Someone explain to me how the railspikes are intended to be used because I'm an idiot I think you're talking about the ones that upgrade either a spell or a unit greatly but give it Purge? I nearly always took the unit upgrade and used it to get a free purge on a Steward, if I had one.
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Jul 16, 2020 19:05
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I had a run recently where I ran into that event where it adds purge to a card, and I chose a Steward as usual forgetting that I had the daisy artifact that makes cards with purge have consume instead. There's some potential in that combo for sure...
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Jul 16, 2020 19:15
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