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yeah i remember a lot of old time quick tags and corner work. and then the babby either escapes or they just stop for no reason. should've just kept on doin' it
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Aug 5, 2020 22:22
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Critical posted:This was an actual tag team tactic during the golden era, Monsoon always called it "tag-team continuity" if it was The Rockers doing it and "cheating" if it was the heels See, that crossed my mind, but I felt like the Rockers were always playing defense when they did it. They had to work together to be able to knock down the Barbarian or what have you.
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Aug 5, 2020 22:29
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Critical posted:This was an actual tag team tactic during the golden era, Monsoon always called it "tag-team continuity" if it was The Rockers doing it and "cheating" if it was the heels It was fun when they tried doing that to Bossman and Akeem at Wrestlemania 5, until Akeem just stood there and clotheslined the poo poo out of Michaels. Jesse: I believe he irritated Akeem.
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Aug 5, 2020 22:32
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DeathChicken posted:It was fun when they tried doing that to Bossman and Akeem at Wrestlemania 5, until Akeem just stood there and clotheslined the poo poo out of Michaels. I've watched WM5 hundreds of times (I had like 3 PPVs on tape as a kid and this was one of them) and I still laugh at that to this day.
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Aug 5, 2020 22:46
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davidbix posted:But...when dude first got online, his immediate responses to requests for road stories were pretty much all him committing felonious sex crimes, including one that's largely been corroborated as a true story. So...this being a true story that he just blurted out one day would be completely in-character for him. Well, I only said that I'm very skeptical because of stories like the aforementioned flight one, which, although possibly true, has several elements that I thought had been established as clearly overcooked ("and then everyone on board cheered and high-fived us!!"). If it was around 2001 that he first posted it then I would also think that as an addict his brain is probably even mushier today as well. But you'd know better than I would, I don't know all of his stories and I'm just a casual wrestling observer. I'm only noting that from personal experience, when an addict posts something like that on the Internet, which begins with something startling but winds up becoming a whimpering set of random statements targeted at someone else entirely, often an ex-lover, then usually there's little basis for it. In a way I hope I'm right, but if the police want to investigate it then fair enough.
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Aug 5, 2020 23:06
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Hedgehog Pie posted:But you'd know better than I would, I don't know all of his stories and I'm just a casual wrestling observer. I'm only noting that from personal experience, when an addict posts something like that on the Internet, which begins with something startling but winds up becoming a whimpering set of random statements targeted at someone else entirely, often an ex-lover, then usually there's little basis for it. In a way I hope I'm right, but if the police want to investigate it then fair enough. I think people are concerned since Marty's wording implies that he killed more than one person in his life "the very first time I made a man disappear"
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Aug 5, 2020 23:26
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Hedgehog Pie posted:Well, I only said that I'm very skeptical because of stories like the aforementioned flight one, which, although possibly true, has several elements that I thought had been established as clearly overcooked ("and then everyone on board cheered and high-fived us!!"). If it was around 2001 that he first posted it then I would also think that as an addict his brain is probably even mushier today as well.
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Aug 6, 2020 00:13
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The plane ride had to have been this stretch of shows:quote:WWF @ San Francisco, CA - Cow Palace - January 4, 1991 (6,778) quote:WWF @ Austin, TX - Frank Erwin Center - January 6, 1991 They would have flew into Dallas for an Austin show Tony Atlas sticks out as someone who would be able to verify the story/be willing to talk about it
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Aug 6, 2020 01:06
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EDIT: It's been a long day.
davidbix fucked around with this message at 02:26 on Aug 6, 2020 |
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Aug 6, 2020 01:29
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Why aren't the Rockers on either show?
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Aug 6, 2020 02:14
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Rusty Shackelford posted:Why aren't the Rockers on either show? Well this is weird - I assumed they did run-ins or something, but Cagematch says they were in Japan for shows on 1/4/1991, 1/6/1991 and 1/8/1991 quote:08.01.1991 Super World Sports The Rockers (Marty Jannetty & Shawn Michaels) defeat Jeff Jarrett & Naoki Sano (13:37)
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Aug 6, 2020 02:23
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Whoops, it's been a long day. But remember: It's not like we aren't missing results, too.
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Aug 6, 2020 02:27
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Jeff Jarrett and Naoki Sano is a WAR level randomness team
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Aug 6, 2020 02:29
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Here is bushwacker luke telling the story on Reddit https://www.reddit.com/r/squaredcircle/comments/61vx21/_/dfhqb0z quote:Numerous! Many of them X-rated! I have dozens with Roddy Piper, but I will tell you about the flight from hell. Thread full of redditors being like " this was wholesome fun in the 80s"
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Aug 6, 2020 02:33
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It's also possible Shawn and Marty were pulling some Young Bucks bullshit with nonstop travel and they flew into San Francisco to catch the plane back to Texas for a day off before flying straight back to Japan San Antonio's only an hour away from Austin
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Aug 6, 2020 02:35
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DeathChicken posted:It was fun when they tried doing that to Bossman and Akeem at Wrestlemania 5, until Akeem just stood there and clotheslined the poo poo out of Michaels. One of my favorite lines and deliveries of all time
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Aug 6, 2020 03:07
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MorrisBae posted:It's also possible Shawn and Marty were pulling some Young Bucks bullshit with nonstop travel and they flew into San Francisco to catch the plane back to Texas for a day off before flying straight back to Japan And didn't get on either card?
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Aug 6, 2020 04:36
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Looking a little bit more at TheHistoryOfWWE.com results etc. during the pretty limited time frame where the guys that we've always heard were on the flight are in the company together: * Reno on 11/12/90 is a show we don't have results for, but was advertised as having Warrior-Savage, Slaughter, and Power and Glory. There are no more results available for that crew until 11/16 in Youngstown, Ohio, which does include Rose, Rockers, Kerry, and the Bushwhackers, but no Slaughter. A version of the Warrior crew had worked Austin on 11/3, but Slaughter is the only other hit there. * Reno on 3/27/91 is a Challenge taping, and since it's TV, you can assume that everyone could have been there even if we don't have results for them. Next results are on 3/30, with the Bushwhackers in New Zealand (for one of those weird combined WWF/Australasian indie shows that happened in the era that Titan didn't run there) and Rockers/Warrior/Kerry at SWS Super Wrestle at the Tokyo Dome. At least using shows we know happened, it kind of has to be an Austin show we don't know about after one of those two...I guess?
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Aug 6, 2020 04:41
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Rusty Shackelford posted:And didn't get on either card? Ok here's what I'm thinking as far as a timeline Keep in mind that Japan time is 14 hours ahead of San Francisco time Nonstop flight from Tokyo to San Francisco is 9 hours 1/4/1991 (Friday) - Chiba, Japan - Rockers competed here at roughly 8PM local time, Show ends at at 11PM local time, Rockers board flight an hour later at 12 AM **Rockers take 9 hour flight to San Francisco, when they land at 9AM Tokyo time...which is still only 7PM San Francisco time! They made it to San Francisco in time to watch the WWE show (or at least meet the boys at the hotel after)** 1/4/1991 (Friday) - San Francisco - Rockers watch the WWE show (perform maybe?) They fly with the boys that same night to Dallas, a 4 hour flight - Plane ride from hell ends at roughly 5AM on 1/5 when they touch down in Dallas Shawn and Marty go to San Antonio to sleep *or* they hang out with the WWE crew, for whom it's a day off *and/or* they score drugs - they have until 5PM that same day to board a 13-hour flight from Dallas to Japan 1/6/1991 (Sunday) - Shizuoka, Japan - Rockers competed here at roughly 8PM local time 1/6/1991 (Sunday) - Austin, TX - Rockers were in Japan, so they couldn't have been at this show 1/8/1991 (Tuesday) - Aichi, Japan - Rockers competed here MorrisBae fucked around with this message at 05:38 on Aug 6, 2020 |
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Aug 6, 2020 05:32
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davidbix posted:At least using shows we know happened, it kind of has to be an Austin show we don't know about after one of those two...I guess? Buddy Rose was gone from WWE after January 1991
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Aug 6, 2020 05:36
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MorrisBae posted:Buddy Rose was gone from WWE after January 1991 So...probably November 1990? I feel like we've heard enough, and with the cities repeated, that it seems like the story is true, although it's also possible that Jannetty remembered the cities wrong and Luke/maybe others borrowed that aspect from his version.
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Aug 6, 2020 07:01
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this is incredible work.
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Aug 6, 2020 07:37
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i mean isnt it possible that they showed up to work and were just too hosed up even by 1990 standards to wrestle?
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Aug 6, 2020 07:41
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JOHN CENA posted:i mean isnt it possible that they showed up to work and were just too hosed up even by 1990 standards to wrestle? Given that Davey Boy had to carry Dynamite on his back to the ring, they'd have to be hosed up. Didn't Andre use a cane in his last few appearances?
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Aug 6, 2020 12:24
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Crutches. They sold it with an angle where Earthquake beat him up
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Aug 6, 2020 13:32
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That was also one of the main reasons for the ring carts at Wrestlemania VI. And then you have Wrestlemania VII where Andre just sort of hobbled down to the ring and yelled at people. And Bossman still didn't get the belt.
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Aug 6, 2020 13:52
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DeathChicken posted:Crutches. They sold it with an angle where Earthquake beat him up I remember being at a house show after that where one match was Jake Roberts vs. Earthquake with Andre in Jake's corner. Before the match, Andre stood up and cut a promo on Earthquake. I was in the sky box seats. I didn't understand a goddamn word he said. It sounded like Godzilla gargling.
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Aug 6, 2020 14:37
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JOHN CENA posted:i mean isnt it possible that they showed up to work and were just too hosed up even by 1990 standards to wrestle? But somehow continued on the tour? It really doesn't seem like it happened as described.
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Aug 6, 2020 16:09
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Rusty Shackelford posted:But somehow continued on the tour? Why wouldn't they? Do you think they'd be punished? I doubt it's a case of them being too hosed up to work a show but I wouldn't expect them to be held off a tour because of drugs. We have the story from multiple sources. It fits the MO of wrestlers at the time. It fits the MO of Marty and Shawn especially. The fact we don't have cards with everyone on it in an era where we don't have close to complete house show records is not evidence it didn't happen as described other than maybe getting cities confused.
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Aug 6, 2020 16:17
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It's also notable that the match where Charles Austin was paralyzed by Marty Jannetty happened a few weeks prior on 12/11/1990 - I wonder if they had to fly back for depositions or somethingquote:11.12.1990 World Wrestling Entertainment Dark: The Rockers (Marty Jannetty & Shawn Michaels) defeat Charles Austin & The Genius
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Aug 6, 2020 16:21
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don’t forget the knoxville show in there. not saying it’s important, but it could be.
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Aug 6, 2020 18:59
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I don't remember if I've told this story here, but I have a friend who went to a Christian event of some kind a couple years ago where HBK was the big celebrity guest, and there was (of course?) a big group discussion of his born-again faith, and he was struck by how humble and liberal-seeming Shawn is. Other people were trying to push him on gays and trans people and the other kinds of people he should be speaking against because otherwise he's implicitly endorsing them, and HBK kept coming back to two points (I'm paraphrasing heavily, it's been years): a) he's going to assume everyone is the person God made them to be re: sexual orientation and gender expression and race and creed, and if that's not true and it's somehow his business to know, God'll fill him in when he dies, and b) he's not inclined to condemn people because he has too much in his past for him to think anything other than "if I could be saved, anyone could be saved." When that story came out a couple weeks ago about HBK having to explain BLM and racial inequity to an insensitive producer, it reminded me of this story and of that first point. These stories are a good reminder of why he mentioned that second point.
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Aug 6, 2020 19:00
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disaster pastor posted:I don't remember if I've told this story here, but I have a friend who went to a Christian event of some kind a couple years ago where HBK was the big celebrity guest, and there was (of course?) a big group discussion of his born-again faith, and he was struck by how humble and liberal-seeming Shawn is. Other people were trying to push him on gays and trans people and the other kinds of people he should be speaking against because otherwise he's implicitly endorsing them, and HBK kept coming back to two points (I'm paraphrasing heavily, it's been years): That's a cool story about Shawn and makes me like him more, but Meltzer said that the BLM story was false on his board, sadly.
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Aug 7, 2020 02:17
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Do new wrestlers go to Dave with scoops, like how everyone new in Japan goes to Ribera even though it's not that great? Are there enough old dudes that he can still farm for stuff?* *He gets it all from Vince, it was him all along
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Aug 7, 2020 02:50
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Admiral Joeslop posted:Do new wrestlers go to Dave with scoops, like how everyone new in Japan goes to Ribera even though it's not that great? Are there enough old dudes that he can still farm for stuff?* He probably has the best access to talent he's had in a decade since WWE signed everyone from PWG.
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Aug 7, 2020 02:56
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Back to a previous subject...davidbix posted:Overproduced WWE programming isn't remotely a recent development. Check out an '80s Saturday Night's Main Event special on the network for the most obvious examples, but there's plenty more along those lines after the syndicated shows were refreshed to more closely resemble SNME for the Fall 1986 season. And in particular, make sure to use headphones to listen to the audio track, because that's where you can really hear just how extensive the sweetening and general audio manipulation is. There are major angles where it's clear that almost the entire live soundtrack has been replaced. I just remembered this one, which is easy to embed: It's funny watching the occasional Wrestling Challenge where you can tell it's like 11pm, the people have been there since 6 or 7 much less how early they left to get to the show and get in, and they're watching Honky Tonk Man squash his third man of the night. They're exhausted, nobody is moving much, but you can hear people passionately cheer the poor local competitor's comeback and boo when that dastardly Honky Tonk Man wins. Triple so for SNME, they turned the sweeteners up to 11 for those.
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Aug 7, 2020 03:32
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collocation posted:That's a cool story about Shawn and makes me like him more, but Meltzer said that the BLM story was false on his board, sadly. Ah, I didn't know that. That's a shame.
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Aug 7, 2020 05:04
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Admiral Joeslop posted:Do new wrestlers go to Dave with scoops, like how everyone new in Japan goes to Ribera even though it's not that great? Are there enough old dudes that he can still farm for stuff?* I'm told that offering up your first hot scoop to Big Dave is a respected rite of passage for the aspiring grapsperson.
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Aug 7, 2020 06:49
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MorrisBae posted:It's also notable that the match where Charles Austin was paralyzed by Marty Jannetty happened a few weeks prior on 12/11/1990 - I wonder if they had to fly back for depositions or something
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Aug 7, 2020 08:52
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davidbix posted:That's not how that works. Austin didn't sue until months later at a minimum. Maybe they were meeting with a lawyer/Jerry McDevitt? Marty was taken off the road for a couple weeks in December after it happened, so the company knew he was in some poo poo.
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Aug 7, 2020 15:16
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