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learnincurve posted:I'm not sure what 's being asked here? Are you asking about manual focusing aids or price? All cameras are manual in MF mode and if you don't care about video and want cheap than go for a older Nikon like the D300 or D5200 for the old nikon lenses or Sony a37/a58 for Minolta. poo poo the D3100 is £50 or less now. In general, objects designed to accomplish a task in a specific way do better at accomplishing tasks in that specific way than objects designed to accomplish a task in a different way. Car analogies are always bad so I will make the worst one that I can. I asked if anyone makes station wagons anymore because I want a station wagon and found out that all they make are SUVs because that's what everyone wants. I further found out that's possible to drop a new engine into a datsun 510 or that if I give an incalculable sum of money to leica they will deliver me an SUV so good I won't care that it's not a station wagon. Finally, I found out that I can lower my SUV to make it handle more like a station wagon. All of this was valuable knowledge, I intend to act on one piece of it right away and probably a second piece of it as a long term project. I thank you all for it. That being said, I realize that I can pick up groceries with an SUV, or a horse-drawn carriage but I would like to pick them up with a station wagon.
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Aug 12, 2020 00:15
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What is it that is holding you back with existing cameras that you'd specifically like to see improved in a stripped down, fully manual digital camera? I feel like people are struggling to give you recommendations because it's unclear what you actually want beyond a focusing prism.
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Aug 12, 2020 00:35
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big scary monsters posted:What is it that is holding you back with existing cameras that you'd specifically like to see improved in a stripped down, fully manual digital camera? I feel like people are struggling to give you recommendations because it's unclear what you actually want beyond a focusing prism. do you carry around 30 keys on your key ring that you never use? weight, processor ticks, the reliability of simplicity, being able to do the three things I need to do without chording buttons and, in a better world, a lower price. I don't think anyone's struggling to give recommendations, I've gotten some pretty good ones, but drat if a large portion of this sub doesn't struggle with reading comprehension.
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Aug 12, 2020 01:08
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The Voice of Labor posted:do you carry around 30 keys on your key ring that you never use? Nah you've been very obtuse with saying what you want, and when people have made recommendations you just tell them it's not what you want. You say you want a camera that is ONLY focused on taking photos, and you're willing to sacrifice video, automation, etc to save on costs. People have been trying to tell you that the only way that will actually save you money is if you buy film gear because the digital thing you want is basically Leica exclusive (which multiple people have recommended) - but that won't save you money because it's such a niche desire that the cameras are very expensive. The thing is, "taking photos" is something that has been perfected for quite a long time now, it's trivial - hence why most modern cameras instead focus on improving AF, video, ISO range, etc. If you really only care about taking photos as simply as possible, either: 1) buy a newer camera with great photo taking capabilities and just ignore all the other features you don't want. No, your camera isn't wasting processing power on those features when you turn them off. Yes, you will be paying some extra money for those features, but you can usually buy a camera that's a few years out of date (such as a Fuji XT20) that will be cheaper and have comparable photo quality. 2) go the opposite direction and get a fairly old digital camera, it'll be very cheap and have worse image quality, but will likely have much less focus on video, AF speed, etc. Either way you can adapt basically any old MF lens onto any digital body, so you can do that at least. If these options aren't what you're looking for, please clearly state what you ARE looking for. Also you really should actually consider film. The camera bodies + lenses are very cheap used, and you can send the film off to a lab to have them develop it for you AND scan it for you, so you get digital files back anyways.
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Aug 12, 2020 01:24
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It sounds like your perfect camera is a Hasselblad 500C/M with a Phase One back. It's a fantastic, fully manual camera with minimal unnecessary automation, a great set of lenses available, and a beautiful, bright, waist level viewfinder. Honestly a joy to shoot. I haven't used the digital back personally but if you don't want to use film it seems like the next best thing.
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Aug 12, 2020 01:40
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Nah, get a Fuji GX680 III with a Phase One to save some cash.
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Aug 12, 2020 02:00
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You n’ me, we’re gonna save some cash; using film cameras with digital backs.
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Aug 12, 2020 02:01
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CodfishCartographer posted:Nah you've been very obtuse with saying what you want, and when people have made recommendations you just tell them it's not what you want. fair enough. though looking at your last post I couldn't have been that obtuse. easiest thing first, independent dials for shutter speed and f stop, menuless access to iso and white balance.
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Aug 12, 2020 02:13
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Get that 8x10 digital back, it will only take the rest of your life to offset the cost of shooting film!
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Aug 12, 2020 02:34
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I can't say I spend much time studying the camera market, but $400 + cost of an old camera doesn't seem like that bad of a deal to get something I really like when all the nearest options are in the thousands
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Aug 12, 2020 02:48
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The Voice of Labor posted:fair enough. though looking at your last post I couldn't have been that obtuse. Get a used X-T2? I paid (I think) $600 for mine, but that came with a 23mm f/2 and flash, and that was before the X-T4 came out so it's potentially cheaper now. Everything you've mentioned except the white balance is on a manual dial, and you can set the white balance in the quick access menu, which is indeed very quickly accessible. The X-T3 and X-T4 upgrades have been mostly focused on video, so if you don't care about those, it's still a great camera. I shoot almost entirely manual, and the manual focus assist features are amazing for this. e: And I forgot to say, you can set a few different white balance options as presets, then set the function button (which is all on its own right behind the shutter, so you won't mistake it for anything else) to open the menu over the image, so you can select without even lowering the camera away from your eye. It's very easy to change things and navigate within the EVF. e2: In fact, by default the WB menu has a full range of temperatures to choose between, plus the preview and good EVF mean you get a really good idea of what your photo will look like before you even choose a WB. Cognac McCarthy fucked around with this message at 03:05 on Aug 12, 2020 |
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Aug 12, 2020 02:57
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Yeah, if you can deal with the fact that Fuji spent engineering time on autofocus and other things that’ll get you the dials you desire and will be way easier to deal with than whatever digital back you can find for cheap. Depending on the back you could wind up with a weird stylus touch screen to change settings, which doesn’t seem like quite the thing you’re looking for. Edit: also, I’ve tried split prisms in modern DSLRs and the big problem is that, at least on the D800 but I think most modern DSLRs are the same, there’s no easy way to calibrate the ground glass focus to match the sensor. I tried shimming forever and never was able to get it quite right. On cameras meant for them usually you have adjustments inside the camera instead of having to shim. This might not be so much of an issue on a lower resolution body, but it drove me nuts on the D800. Most of my glass is manual focus and I wound up going mirrorless because it was essentially impossible to get the ground glass perfectly calibrated enough if I was shooting wide open. powderific fucked around with this message at 04:04 on Aug 12, 2020 |
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Aug 12, 2020 03:59
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how long has digital back making been a thing? I realize it's niche, but video game flash carts and fpga setups are niche too and every year or two they cost half as much and are twice as good.
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Aug 12, 2020 04:04
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A long time, but it’s very rarified technology and has always been extremely expensive. I think the Sinar back we had was $40K? They are getting cheaper, but you’re still looking in the $10k range. There’s used stuff under $1000 but you’re looking old specialized crap. Like the Sinar back we had you can find now for that, but you need special software to run the thing and capture with FireWire, etc. I’m not sure it could even shoot non tethered now that I’m thinking about it. There are better used options than that I’m sure, but unless you’re down to spend quite a bit I don’t know that it’s going to get you the experience you’re looking for.
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Aug 12, 2020 04:14
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The Voice of Labor posted:how long has digital back making been a thing? I realize it's niche, but video game flash carts and fpga setups are niche too and every year or two they cost half as much and are twice as good. Almost 30 years. I believe they were some of the first digital cameras released? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_camera_back They represent a tiny, tiny minority of the camera market so they don't see a lot of development money or decrease in prices.
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Aug 12, 2020 04:18
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The Voice of Labor posted:weight, processor ticks, the reliability of simplicity, being able to do the three things I need to do without chording buttons and, in a better world, a lower price. I honestly don't see how a DSLR makes this difficult for you. Attach an old manual lens, disable image review, put it in M mode and superglue the dial in that position. Now you have a camera where you just put it up to your eye, center the meter with the knobs and wheels, focus, and press the button and you can pretend every other feature doesn't exist. The Voice of Labor posted:easiest thing first, independent dials for shutter speed and f stop, menuless access to iso and white balance. A DSLR in M with a manual lens has a knob on the grip for shutter speed and a ring on the lens for aperture. Forget about ISO; it's a complication. Pretend you're shooting Tri-X and leave it on 1600. Leave white balance on sunlight and then put a blue filter on the lens for incandescent like we used to.
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Aug 12, 2020 04:19
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You seem to think not having a video mode is a selling point but almost all of the good cameras are going to include it because it's pretty simple to implement and it makes their cameras more attractive to a different segment. In addition to my previous recommendations of Nikon DSLR, Pentax DSLR, and Sony mirrorless, let me also throw out the Fuji x-series rangefinders (these are a photographer's camera for sure, lots of mechanical controls), the Pentax 645D/645Z (video mode is terrible iirc so maybe that will satisfy you?) and the new Fuji MF bodies. Both the 645 and the Fuji MF bodies will be slower working than your average DSLR for sure, if that's your schtick.
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Aug 12, 2020 05:19
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The Voice of Labor posted:I don't think anyone's struggling to give recommendations, I've gotten some pretty good ones, but drat if a large portion of this sub doesn't struggle with reading comprehension. buddy it's because the poo poo you type is incomprehensible
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Aug 12, 2020 06:33
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use your phone camera and pretend
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Aug 12, 2020 06:33
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the perfect camera for you exists it's the nikon df
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Aug 12, 2020 06:37
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I get where he's coming from, because there are a lot of products where I feel like there's a bunch of unnecessary crap attached, and I'd almost prefer paying more just to not have to worry about all that. Smart TVs come to mind, as I don't need all the bloatware packaged with the TV (remember when high-end sets all came with 3D built in?  ), when I just want a simple display plus my Roku or Chromecast. But wanting a digital camera that doesn't have autofocus or autoexposure just kinda makes me scratch my head.I think it'd be easier to just shoot film and deal with the developing and scanning (whether you choose to do it yourself or send it off to a lab) than to try and find a digital camera that eschews all the meaningful technological advances of the last 40 years
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Aug 12, 2020 06:51
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or just turn the dial to M and keep shooting what you have
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Aug 12, 2020 06:53
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I keep saying the D300 exists if he wants lots of buttons and stripped down though. No it’s not awesome indoors, iso above 800 is fairly shite, but just because a new model of something has come out an older model doesn’t just melt into a pile of trash. I still use mine to make family calendars because my Nan likes the look of a “proper camera” and it makes her feel like a movie star.
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Aug 12, 2020 07:18
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404notfound posted:But wanting a digital camera that doesn't have autofocus or autoexposure just kinda makes me scratch my head. my stuff looks much better without it. at least with the d3300 every auto I turned off resulted in photos that, on average, I was happier with. I'm not real sure that 40 years of technological progress has made things better even if it has made them easier.
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Aug 12, 2020 07:37
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 Dude just buy the the 35mm 1.8 and stick the D3300 in manual, you have the latest sensor and the camera has already depreciated like a rock. If you want something that *looks* old school then get the Olympus OM-D EM-5
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Aug 12, 2020 08:08
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But seriously, pick yourself up a Minolta X570, or a TLR if your interested in medium format and a roll of film. If you hate the process sell it for the price you paid and you'll be out ~$15 for film, dev and scans. If you love it you'll really love it. The viewfinders on most SLRs poo poo all over modern DSLRs in terms of brightness and clarity and if you buy something more modern, like the X570, you'll even get in viewfinder shutter and apeture display along with metering. They're also smaller and lighter, and have a battery life you measure in months so you're winning all around.
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Aug 12, 2020 08:14
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how much are negative scanning machines?
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Aug 12, 2020 08:24
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Don't know around your area, but if you keep an eye out for a Epson V600 you can find a bargain. For scanning 35 a Pakon F-135 would do better but you'll pay a lot more. I got my V600 for $200 in Aussie dollars.
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Aug 12, 2020 08:27
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learnincurve posted:
congratulations, you have, with the substitution of a 40mm 2.8 described what I do. I do not want something that *looks* old school, if I did I would be asking about cold war warsaw pact cameras and pallets of romanian surplus film stock.
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Aug 12, 2020 08:33
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The Voice of Labor posted:no, I'm cool with plugging a usb cable into my camera and having all the photos on my 'puter, I'm cool with having effectively unlimited exposures for free and I'm cool with not needing to convert a space that I don't have into a darkroom . Get a P45+ digiback for a Hasselblad 501cm.
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Aug 12, 2020 08:41
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Wild EEPROM posted:the perfect camera for you exists it's the nikon df This is the correct camera for you. The Voice of Labor posted:
Nikon DF 
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Aug 12, 2020 12:31
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ansel autisms posted:buddy it's because the poo poo you type is incomprehensible Feeling very seen right now.
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Aug 12, 2020 14:41
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Real talk. If I want to go shoot with as little automation as possible I get out my minolta SR-T 202 and shut the meter off. It’s fun and with some forgiving b&w film even a shithead like me can nail exposure with a little forethought.
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Aug 12, 2020 14:43
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Subscribe to Nick Carver's YouTube channel then buy yourself a load of medium and large format film cameras.
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Aug 12, 2020 14:55
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That dude is so loving chill in front of a video camera, super easy to lean back and chill out to. Also his images kick rear end.
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Aug 12, 2020 15:06
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The Voice of Labor posted:congratulations, you have, with the substitution of a 40mm 2.8 described what I do. I do not want something that *looks* old school, if I did I would be asking about cold war warsaw pact cameras and pallets of romanian surplus film stock. Please do not poo poo talk Cold War Warsaw Pact cameras, they are in fact extremely good.
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Aug 12, 2020 17:27
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So what you’re saying is I should get the Kiev?
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Aug 12, 2020 17:41
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Megabound posted:For scanning 35 a Pakon F-135 would do better but you'll pay a lot more. I got my V600 for $200 in Aussie dollars. i think you mean a plustek 8200
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Aug 12, 2020 18:34
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Yeast posted:This is the correct camera for you. lmao I forgot this goofy loving thing exists, I kind of love it despite it being huge and weird speaking of chill photography youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2IPAeJaNJKw
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Aug 12, 2020 18:47
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Found a vlog of forums poster The Voice of Labor. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNJPmk5wIHw
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Aug 12, 2020 19:56
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