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Who will you vote for in 2020? This poll is closed. |
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| Biden |
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425 | 18.06% |
| Trump |
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105 | 4.46% |
| whoever the Green Party runs |
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307 | 13.05% |
| GOOGLE RON PAUL |
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151 | 6.42% |
| Bernie Sanders |
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346 | 14.70% |
| Stalin |
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246 | 10.45% |
| Satan |
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300 | 12.75% |
| Nobody |
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202 | 8.58% |
| Jess Scarane |
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110 | 4.67% |
| mystery man Brian Carroll of the American Solidarity Party |
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61 | 2.59% |
| Dick Nixon |
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100 | 4.25% |
| Total: | 2089 votes | ||
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Failed Imagineer posted:The only acceptable outcome is president Hawkins dealing with a Dem majority in both Houses. Voting for anything less than that is just putting your head down on the tracks and waiting for the 9.15 train to end your misery Why the Libertarian instead of the Green?
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Aug 13, 2020 12:47
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Gentleman Baller posted:Does anyone actually think like this or is it just being memey? When I decide who to vote for in any election, who a candidate wants to not vote for them is so unbelievably far down on my list of poo poo I care about, and I see people whose opinions I respect a lot going hard on it like either they do think it is important, or they think Joe Biden supporters think its important and either possibility just seems so bizarre. Yes, I think like this, it's why I said it. Put a different way: Joe Biden told me that if I believe the credible allegations of rape against him, I shouldn't vote for him. What is your take from that? How do you feel about being told that? How does that influence your decision? But even if it wasn't that specific statement, it's a stupid thing to say, and a candidate who is supposedly competing with the worst president in the history of presidents probably shouldn't be telling people not to vote for him, right? In a time when every single campaign and PAC email right now starts with WE MUST REMOVE TRUMP AT ALL COSTS, why is the candidate himself discouraging people from voting for him, especially about such sensitive issues?
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Aug 13, 2020 12:50
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Heliotrope posted:Considering how obviously they want a candidate that will let them go back to brunch and forget about politics, my worry is that Biden winning will make them go "Good, the President has a D next to their name. Everything's fine now." Then they'll ignore all the bad things happening like they did (and continue to do) with Obama. Trump forces it out into the open, where they can't tune it out no matter how much they might want to. If they start ignoring politics again that makes it easier for a cadre of Leftists to get Progressives through primaries. All you tell the idiot brunchers when the general comes up is "My terrible opponent wants to end brunch" and then once you're in office do whatever.
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Aug 13, 2020 12:52
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Gentleman Baller posted:Does anyone actually think like this or is it just being memey? When I decide who to vote for in any election, who a candidate wants to not vote for them is so unbelievably far down on my list of poo poo I care about, and I see people whose opinions I respect a lot going hard on it like either they do think it is important, or they think Joe Biden supporters think its important and either possibility just seems so bizarre. If I tell you not to vote for me, directly, for moral reasons, and you do it anyway... why? You clearly don't respect my opinion, you don't want to do what I tell you to do, and I'm clearly not a good representative for your beliefs. E: Code Jockey posted:Put a different way: Joe Biden told me that if I believe the credible allegations of rape against him, I shouldn't vote for him. What is your take from that? How do you feel about being told that? How does that influence your decision? Also this. IF I believe Tara Reade THEN I should not vote for Joe Biden. - Biden's own logic. IF I vote for Joe Biden, what does that say about whether or not I believe Tara Reade, according to Biden's own logic? Somfin fucked around with this message at 12:59 on Aug 13, 2020 |
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Aug 13, 2020 12:54
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https://twitter.com/politico/status/1293691250298822656 Frankly, it's looking like the only chance we get anything worthwhile in the next decade may depend on Biden eating poo poo in November. Isn't that completely hosed.
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Aug 13, 2020 13:17
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The democrats literally don't want progressive votes, they want republican votes. Unfortunately the dragon they're chasing watches fox news and thinks harris is a stalinist.
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Aug 13, 2020 13:35
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And even if Biden eats poo poo in November they will concede absolutely nothing because they will (rightfully) attribute their loss to Trump cheating and dismantling the very infrastructured used to vote. Hell, I don't think any institutional force can be used to stop Trump and the GOP attempting this, not since Obama and his Democrats completely abdicated his responsibility to holding governing and holding as many branches of government as possible.
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Aug 13, 2020 14:27
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Phobophilia posted:And even if Biden eats poo poo in November they will concede absolutely nothing because they will (rightfully) attribute their loss to Trump cheating and dismantling the very infrastructured used to vote. Hell, I don't think any institutional force can be used to stop Trump and the GOP attempting this, not since Obama and his Democrats completely abdicated his responsibility to holding governing and holding as many branches of government as possible. If Trump wins by dismantling enough voting infrastructure and blocking enough votes to overcome his current polling deficits, we dont live in a democracy anymore anyways and a progressive presidency would be an even bigger pipe dream than primarying Kamala in 2024
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Aug 13, 2020 14:38
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OctaMurk posted:If Trump wins by dismantling enough voting infrastructure and blocking enough votes to overcome his current polling deficits, we dont live in a democracy anymore anyways and a progressive presidency would be an even bigger pipe dream than primarying Kamala in 2024 Bad news coming in for you about the democracy status of the us as is.
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Aug 13, 2020 14:43
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atelier morgan posted:Bad news coming in for you about the democracy status of the us as is. Its not great, but if the USPS is fully dismantled and millions of votes are simply discarded to change the outcome when it should be a landslide for Biden, its completely over. There will be no more possibility of changing anything at all by voting.
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Aug 13, 2020 14:48
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OctaMurk posted:Its not great, but if the USPS is fully dismantled and millions of votes are simply discarded to change the outcome when it should be a landslide for Biden, its completely over. There will be no more possibility of changing anything at all by voting. You're right, considering the polls it should be a landslide for Biden exactly the same as 2016 should have been a landslide for Hillary
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Aug 13, 2020 14:59
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OctaMurk posted:There will be no more possibility of changing anything at all by voting. atelier morgan posted:Bad news coming in for you about the democracy status of the us as is.
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Aug 13, 2020 14:59
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I am just accepting now that Trump will win, and the House and Senate will probably both be Republican controlled this time. Democracy was already on its way out for most of the world as is, it makes sense that the United States is getting there too. There is just no strong reason to believe Biden will win this.
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Aug 13, 2020 15:09
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The Democrats made the precedent back in 2000 that they won't contest rigged elections.
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Aug 13, 2020 15:13
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Ghost Leviathan posted:The postal service is officially being sabotaged. It's probably best to assume that postal votes might as well go straight in an incinerator. At best, the warehouse from Indiana Jones. Yeah it’s pretty buck wild and Trump’ll probably get away with it. I mean, the Democrats sent A LETTER, we can’t expect anything more! Nucleic Acids fucked around with this message at 15:22 on Aug 13, 2020 |
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Aug 13, 2020 15:14
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OctaMurk posted:Its not great, but if the paper ballot is fully removed and tens of thousands of Ohioan votes are simply modified to change the outcome when it should be a landslide for Kerry, its completely over. There will be no more possibility of changing anything at all by voting. quick edit to my first election, also We knew at the time of course but it came out this year that Kerry knew and intentionally didn't bring it up because 'we were at war' and 'two contested elections in a row might be bad for the perceived legitimacy of the government' haha atelier morgan fucked around with this message at 15:25 on Aug 13, 2020 |
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Aug 13, 2020 15:22
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The best thing about Kerry winning is that it would've led to the dissolution of the electoral college. Because as soon as some Constitutional process works against Republicans it immediately becomes illegitimate.
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Aug 13, 2020 15:24
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Herstory Begins Now posted:As I understand it so far Left orgs like the DSA, IWW, SRA, etc etc etc. have seen their memberships explode under Trump, who is just so dumb and boorish it's basically impossible for anyone even halfway intelligent and tuned in to continue to ignore the contradictions in our society. Also these organizations and leftists in general have not really been persecuted for their beliefs by the administration -- you might argue that Trump empowers fascist groups like the proud boys or cop posses to eg. go harass your local DSA meeting, but even today that sort of thing is few and far between and does about as much harm to the workings of left orgs than Red Guard weirdos who show up every once in a while to throw tantrums about how everyone is a strasserite collaborator or whatever the gently caress. Maybe it's out of incompetence, but the Trump administration certainly does not consider socialism a threat -- instead the threat of US socialism is a tool they employ all the time to scare centrist conservatives into staying on their side of the fence: "Well, look, I don't love Trump, but I'm no socialist!". Being "against socialism", whatever they think socialism means, is a tentpole of conservative propaganda and happily regurgitated by every reactionary idiot that will vote R anyway. Democrats, on the other hand, do see the resurgent left as a threat, because it is - even in its early stages - a direct threat to its power, or at the very least depresses their popularity and has the extremely annoying habit of primarying their safe, stable, machine politicians. They have a real and understandable need to crush nascent leftism in their ranks, and we've seen this over and over and over and over and over again in how they crushed the Sanders campaign and what they keep trying to do to the Squad (but because they're very popular women of color who are sort of willing to play ball it's been very difficult for them). There is no way the Biden administration and its handlers and hangers-on are dumb enough to ignore the threat the left poses to them and there is no way they're going to stop trying to dismantle left movement in what would otherwise be their voter base. Really, the only hope the left has is that the democrats are too broadly incompetent to wage war against a mass left movement (this is probably true, as opposed to a presidential campaign), but if you think that the Biden faction doesn't have a target painted on the back of every left organization in America today you're sorely mistaken.
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Aug 13, 2020 15:25
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I said come in! posted:I am just accepting now that Trump will win, and the House and Senate will probably both be Republican controlled this time. Democracy was already on its way out for most of the world as is, it makes sense that the United States is getting there too. There is just no strong reason to believe Biden will win this. I disagree; I think the aristocrats and oligarchs who actually control this country have signaled that they would like a boring caretaker in the White House while they use all the power they’ve amassed to really loot this shambling corpse of a country. Why rig the election to keep Trump in office, when Biden will calm down the proles and do nothing that might affect their ability to wield power? Democracy is already dead, but stuffing ballot boxes and other Three-Stooges-level tricks isn’t necessary when the rich just control all media and all sources of information for the vast majority of voters. And moreover, I don’t really think it loving matters, because neither administration will do anything at all that meaningfully addresses the massive structural issues causing widespread suffering in the states, much less the imperial war machine we keep running 24/7. Trump and Biden aren’t the same, but they’re both uniquely awful to about the same degree. FWIW, that’s why I don’t really buy the “competent fascist in 2024 under Biden, leftist victory under Trump” thesis. The conditions that could lead to either outcome will arrive in the same fashion, and if the left can’t beat the moribund Democratic Party in the wake of either a disastrous Biden/Harris presidency or their loss in the face of Trumpism, then we should probably just sit out the end of history and wait our turn to die like the losers we are.
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Aug 13, 2020 15:38
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You know, the weird thing is that I can pop open this thread and the USPOL thread in a separate tab, click a page at random, and soup to nuts, it'll be a defense of Biden on anything and everything that isn't "architect of the modern carceral state". I assume that would be because that's a hell of a thing to try and defend 
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Aug 13, 2020 15:44
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Victory Position posted:You know, the weird thing is that I can pop open this thread and the USPOL thread in a separate tab, click a page at random, and soup to nuts, it'll be a defense of Biden on anything and everything that isn't "architect of the modern carceral state". the closest thing to a defense of him on that front is "nobody cares about weed," a defense that lets you know exactly how white and upper middle class the people making it are
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Aug 13, 2020 15:55
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It's very likely a Biden presidency will actively seek to murder more goons personally than a Trump one. They want leftists silenced, forever.
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Aug 13, 2020 16:02
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Meanwhile, https://twitter.com/atrupar/status/1293905691602751488?s=21 Nothing quite like living in a country where both candidates promise you open corruption and continued misery and half the country thinks one or the other is the only person who can save them e: I actually don’t know how to share a single tweet that’s part of the thread, that’s annoying. But as long as we’re talking about AOC: https://twitter.com/afashioninsider/status/1293790130927538176?s=21 Wow, thanks HRC! I love it when the only party that even pretends to support my human rights just throws me directly under the bus at the possibility that they’ll be able to garner some votes from Karens in suburbia. rko fucked around with this message at 16:07 on Aug 13, 2020 |
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Aug 13, 2020 16:03
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Code Jockey posted:Yes, I think like this, it's why I said it. Not at all. If you believe the allegations and still felt like voting for him until he told you not to, that's super weird. You valued something more than not voting for a rapist, and this shouldn't change that unless you highly value the opinion of this rapist? Code Jockey posted:even if it wasn't that specific statement, it's a stupid thing to say, and a candidate who is supposedly competing with the worst president in the history of presidents probably shouldn't be telling people not to vote for him, right? In a time when every single campaign and PAC email right now starts with WE MUST REMOVE TRUMP AT ALL COSTS, why is the candidate himself discouraging people from voting for him, especially about such sensitive issues? I 100% agree it was a ridiculous thing for him to say, but if I was one of those people who thought Trump is the worst president ever, then why should him saying this ever matter? The only way it could if there is a bunch of people who think he is a rapist, like his platform but respect his opinion too much to go against it to vote for what I perceive as the best candidate for PotUS.
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Aug 13, 2020 16:10
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rko posted:Meanwhile, Came here to post the HRC/Kasich story. This is exactly why the Democratic Party must be destroyed. There is no line they won’t cross if it means the Party wins (or, at least, their donors do).
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Aug 13, 2020 16:13
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christ. the democrats can't make an effective stand against this moron? he's openly admitting this and they sent him a loving letter. can you imagine if we had a fully competent fascist? Pelosi would be wearing a kente cloth in protest at the gas chamber grand opening.
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Aug 13, 2020 16:37
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Famethrowa posted:christ. the democrats can't make an effective stand against this moron? he's openly admitting this and they sent him a loving letter.  and all that.
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Aug 13, 2020 16:51
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Famethrowa posted:christ. the democrats can't make an effective stand against this moron? he's openly admitting this and they sent him a loving letter. Considering that the quote was given yesterday evening I think it's a little early to gauge the effectiveness of the Democratic response.
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Aug 13, 2020 17:00
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Famethrowa posted:christ. the democrats can't make an effective stand against this moron? he's openly admitting this and they sent him a loving letter. So, wait, are the DNC Machievellian geniuses who utilise every trick they can to ensure the left is kept perpetually down, or incompetent bumblefucks who can't successfully oppose a paper bag?
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Aug 13, 2020 17:00
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Daduzi posted:So, wait, are the DNC Machievellian geniuses who utilise every trick they can to ensure the left is kept perpetually down, or incompetent bumblefucks who can't successfully oppose a paper bag? The two things can and have been in the same people - witness the sabotage of Corbyn. The center wing the world over has exactly one competency, and that's suppressing left insurgencies inside their party; it's not so much competency as priorities, one could say. StratGoatCom fucked around with this message at 17:05 on Aug 13, 2020 |
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Aug 13, 2020 17:03
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Daduzi posted:So, wait, are the DNC Machievellian geniuses who utilise every trick they can to ensure the left is kept perpetually down, or incompetent bumblefucks who can't successfully oppose a paper bag? "2016 never existed"
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Aug 13, 2020 17:04
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Relevant Tangent posted:Why the Libertarian instead of the Green? I believe you are confused
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Aug 13, 2020 17:05
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...is there actually a reliable timeline on this? The Kasich thing is rooted in a 2016 fact sheet. You get the same thing if you Google Ted Cruz, Rand Paul, and Donal Trump and the HRC. And Searching Trump specifically, it doesn't just seem tied to the 2016 fact sheets. There are some Trump admin links that are linked from Google that are also down.
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Aug 13, 2020 17:06
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Two things. First, they’re not even that good at crushing the left. The Dems very nearly lost control entirely and were only saved by throwing everything they had at the problem. Labour let Corbyn become head of the party, and then failed to keep him from winning the surprisingly good show against May that kept him in power until every party in Britain worked to get rid of him ASAP. Any sufficiently smart centrist party would’ve found ways to marginalize or co-opt these figures instead of coming to the brink of allowing them to take power. Second, the elected anglophone left is loving pathetic. AOC and Sanders are basically volunteering to humiliate themselves on behalf of a party that has embarrassed and marginalized them over and over, and the most prominent elected figure who has dared to speak up about how disgusting all this is is Virginia House Representative Lee Carter. Meanwhile, Corbyn decided to play nice with his Labour enemies instead of getting a good purge going, and they rewarded him by dragging him through the mud and tying him to their hardline anti-Brexit poo poo sandwich. There aren’t any good guys or figures to admire. It’s just poo poo from top to bottom. Sucks, doesn’t it?
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Aug 13, 2020 17:12
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Timeless Appeal posted:...is there actually a reliable timeline on this? It was up as recently as last week: https://web.archive.org/web/20200806191123/https://www.hrc.org/2016RepublicanFacts/john-kasich
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Aug 13, 2020 17:14
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JordanKai posted:https://twitter.com/besf0rt/status/1293592730560593920 Be wary of these "stock went up, clearly it's because of this political event" tweets. Especially when they're zoomed so far in that they only show a few hours. Usually it's someone taking a momentary blip in the stock wildly out of context for the sake of farming Twitter likes. https://mobile.twitter.com/ExistentialEnso/status/1293663720653180934 https://mobile.twitter.com/joemirabella/status/1293698386332282880 https://mobile.twitter.com/jlgriffiths/status/1293881229616570368
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Aug 13, 2020 17:16
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Timeless Appeal posted:...is there actually a reliable timeline on this? If I plug the website (https://www.hrc.org/2016RepublicanFacts/john-kasich) into the Internet Archive, it shows that the page was available on the internet as recently as August 6, and the fact that Google is still showing me the meta description if I search “human rights campaign john kasich,” I’m guessing it hasn’t been offline too long. e:fb
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Aug 13, 2020 17:18
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Daduzi posted:So, wait, are the DNC Machievellian geniuses who utilise every trick they can to ensure the left is kept perpetually down, or incompetent bumblefucks who can't successfully oppose a paper bag? They are brutally efficient at crushing challenges to their grifting operation yes. Donald trump helps their grifting operation so they don’t care as much
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Aug 13, 2020 17:23
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No different than every lib erasing #MeToo from their Twitter profile. These people don't believe in anything beyond their own personal advancement.
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Aug 13, 2020 17:24
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To be fair, it does seem as though the entire “2016 Republican Facts” section was taken down around the same time. But it’s also been up since mid 2015, so why it needed to come down this week is a bit of a mystery.
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Aug 13, 2020 17:32
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