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Just wondering regarding Lions led by donkeys, how come these seemingly average American guys are so left wing and and have a bunch of people listening? I thought those kind of politics were super fringe in the USA?
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Aug 19, 2020 15:18
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Party In My Diapee posted:Just wondering regarding Lions led by donkeys, how come these seemingly average American guys are so left wing and and have a bunch of people listening? I thought those kind of politics were super fringe in the USA? The American political landscape has changed dramatically in the last five or so years. Exercise to the reader as to why.
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Aug 19, 2020 15:23
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Party In My Diapee posted:Just wondering regarding Lions led by donkeys, how come these seemingly average American guys are so left wing and and have a bunch of people listening? I thought those kind of politics were super fringe in the USA? Your 'average American' (that word is meaningless, America is like 12-14 monocultures that exist mostly in closed-off monads based on geography) has no real political ideology or compass and just cobbles together viewpoints. Television backfills an ideology from that and sets the agenda, but by and large the American people are far more leftward leaning than their rulers at every level.
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Aug 19, 2020 15:24
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If you talked to the most diehard conservative about nationalizing industry you could probably convince them its a good idea so long as you dont mention socialism or communism by name.
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Aug 19, 2020 16:04
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Yeah. When you poll based on policies and leave out anything about parties or names, the majority of Americans are pretty left wing. Vastly different than the government.
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Aug 19, 2020 16:22
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Yeah, the US is a country that is laughably swayed by propaganda. Use the right words and you can get a huge chunk of the population to completely shift their position to a more progressive one on any given matter. Then you point out their hypocrisy and they start foaming at the mouth.
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Aug 19, 2020 16:24
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Americans generally want left-wing policies, but also have severe crab-bucket mentality and are willing to be spiteful as hell about it.
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Aug 19, 2020 16:35
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feedmyleg posted:Yeah, the US is a country that is laughably swayed by propaganda. Use the right words and you can get a huge chunk of the population to completely shift their position to a more progressive one on any given matter. Then you point out their hypocrisy and they start foaming at the mouth. Yeah this is totally unique to America and certainly only runs one way politically 
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Aug 19, 2020 16:41
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It's certainly not unique to the US, but we're more susceptible to it due to our deeply ingrained two-party system which splits the country almost exactly down the middle. The right is more susceptible not because they're less intelligent or savvy, but because there's a massive national right-wing television network that spews nonsense propaganda all day every day and there's no equivalent for the left. Plus the country is split mostly center and right, not right and left.
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Aug 19, 2020 16:55
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AnEdgelord posted:If you talked to the most diehard conservative about nationalizing industry you could probably convince them its a good idea so long as you dont mention socialism or communism by name. The fun thing is that attempting to repurpose all the rhetoric for improvement of the social good but studiously distancing themselves from the nominative socialists and communists was one of the founding features of naziism. Of course, most of the talk about social good was either a purposefully misleading lie or it was with the idea that only one ethnicity would get all of that government-provided social welfare. And of course, postwar America similarly was real big on government programs to promote social goods but only for whites. It's even possible that social welfare programs having been forced open is one of the reasons why there's now so much political will behind attempting to dismantle them, but I have no idea for certain. Racism as a motivating factor is definitely swimming around in politics, but it's hard to pin down, especially when some antiracists are often fine with classism.
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Aug 19, 2020 17:47
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feedmyleg posted:It's certainly not unique to the US, but we're more susceptible to it due to our deeply ingrained two-party system which splits the country almost exactly down the middle. The right is more susceptible not because they're less intelligent or savvy, but because there's a massive national right-wing television network that spews nonsense propaganda all day every day and there's no equivalent for the left. Plus the country is split mostly center and right, not right and left. ? It's not split down the middle. Neither the Democratic nor Republican party represent a simple majority of the United States. It'd be more correct to characterize the US as 2 pluralities that are represented by two parties of capital, one capital-intensive and one labor-intensive, and a disengaged majority that sees politics as, at best, a confirmation or refutation of the imaginary America.
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Aug 19, 2020 17:50
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SlothfulCobra posted:The fun thing is that attempting to repurpose all the rhetoric for improvement of the social good but studiously distancing themselves from the nominative socialists and communists was one of the founding features of naziism. I remember reading somewhere (probably even on these forums) a theory that the only reason the Scandinavian welfare state has survived for so long is because the Nordic countries are extremely racially homogenous and thus there was never any fear of “those people stealing our money” and now because of the refugee crisis, those fears have arrived and brought a bunch of right wing governments in those countries to power who are now eroding said welfare state. It sounds sadly plausible. AceOfFlames fucked around with this message at 20:14 on Aug 19, 2020 |
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Aug 19, 2020 20:09
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SlothfulCobra posted:It's even possible that social welfare programs having been forced open is one of the reasons why there's now so much political will behind attempting to dismantle them IIRC this (and earlier fears about polio and later on air conditioning) is what happened to public swimming pools in a lot of areas?
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Aug 19, 2020 20:36
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Penisaurus Sex posted:? We don't have a labor-intensive party though. And while the Republicans were more centered on big business 30 years ago, now they're more centered on fundamentalism, racism, and a cult of personality. Workers' rights don't command a major political platform in the US, and right now many of the former the big business republicans who don't have a lot of sunk cost or other reason to be interested in the party are dominating the democrats, although there is the whole progressive movement trying to infiltrate and push their platform, because that's literally the only way to put that platform out into American politics after that wing of the democrats was killed off in the 90s. I guess in summary, politics in America have a lot of diversity of opinion that is totally snuffed out on the national level, and also often gets crowded out of all the media that we export across the planet, so it's understandable if you don't know about it if you don't live in the US. We in the US generally have much less of an idea of how other countries' politics are going ourselves, because we tend to export much more media than we import.
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Aug 19, 2020 21:17
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while no one would ever put it in these terms, there is a persistent feeling in the US that the rest of the world isn't actually real or at least feels very distant and muted, which mostly comes down to sheer geographic isolation as well as a cultural identity that continually looks inward even when that feeling is ruptured by stuff like 9/11 its always ultimately about us and the terrorists themselves are reduced to cartoon villains with no motivation other than to hurt us because they "hate us for our freedom" edit: in fact if you wanted a historical parallel to this attitude I would say its very similar to Imperial China's ideas about the rest of the world which had similar hegemonic control of its region as well as geographical isolation and was a major cultural exporter AnEdgelord fucked around with this message at 23:28 on Aug 19, 2020 |
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Aug 19, 2020 23:22
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That's an absolutely moronic loving take. Every country on earth is primarily concerned with their own affairs, that doesn't mean they see the rest of the world as imaginary. I don't know what it is about the internet that makes people create these sweeping narratives based on absolutely nothing.
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Aug 20, 2020 00:06
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Party In My Diapee posted:Just wondering regarding Lions led by donkeys, how come these seemingly average American guys are so left wing and and have a bunch of people listening? I thought those kind of politics were super fringe in the USA? I'm 99% sure that the overall podcast audience is nothing like a representative sample of "average American guys".
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Aug 20, 2020 02:00
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AceOfFlames posted:I remember reading somewhere (probably even on these forums) a theory that the only reason the Scandinavian welfare state has survived for so long is because the Nordic countries are extremely racially homogenous and thus there was never any fear of “those people stealing our money” and now because of the refugee crisis, those fears have arrived and brought a bunch of right wing governments in those countries to power who are now eroding said welfare state. It sounds sadly plausible. That's bullshit, the reason it was established in the first place was as a truce between labor and capital after a period of high worker militancy in the early 20's century because capital was relatively weak and needed organized labor to cooperate to be competitive, they couldn't just crush it like in the US. It just hasn't been (completely) dismantled after that. It would be dismantled anyway, the immigrants are just one excuse. Grevling fucked around with this message at 06:10 on Aug 20, 2020 |
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Aug 20, 2020 06:07
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SlothfulCobra posted:We don't have a labor-intensive party though. And while the Republicans were more centered on big business 30 years ago, now they're more centered on fundamentalism, racism, and a cult of personality. I guess 'labor-intensive capital' is too close to 'labor party'? Labor-Intensive capital represents things that you would commonly associate with factory work or production. Usually it's a physical commodity being produced and sold; it's dominated by the cost of wages and the inputs of human labor (we can make more widgets if we hire more people to churn out widgets). Capital-Intensive capital represents more 'modern' economic activity -- FIRE, Tech, etc. These industries' main input is excess capital, not labor. Apple is never going to hire 10,000 people in a month, but they'll absolutely take cheap credit to expand automation or speculate or advertise etc. This is the primary divide in capital, in terms of economic activity. Republicans generally map to labor-intensive capital, while Democrats map to capital-intensive capital. Penisaurus Sex fucked around with this message at 18:46 on Aug 20, 2020 |
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Aug 20, 2020 18:42
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AceOfFlames posted:I remember reading somewhere (probably even on these forums) a theory that the only reason the Scandinavian welfare state has survived for so long is because the Nordic countries are extremely racially homogenous and thus there was never any fear of “those people stealing our money” and now because of the refugee crisis, those fears have arrived and brought a bunch of right wing governments in those countries to power who are now eroding said welfare state. It sounds sadly plausible. This is what right wing nationalists want to believe. Which Scandinavian right wing governments did you have in mind? Erna Solberg is I suppose a conservative, but she's not exactly Boris Johnson or Geert Wilders.
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Aug 22, 2020 04:43
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There’s a new “In the Shadows of Utopia” episode up and the host cops to being addicted to context which is hilarious. However, I don’t think it’s a bad thing. I’m learning all sorts of new stuff about southeast Asian history. This is the kind of good tangent (for the bad kind, see most of the tangents Carlin goes off on now that, while interesting, don’t fully relate to the topic at hand).
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Aug 25, 2020 16:17
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Thwomp posted:There’s a new “In the Shadows of Utopia” episode up and the host cops to being addicted to context which is hilarious. I'm 3 episodes into this and liking it a lot. Somr of his analogies aren't very useful but this is a standard feature of history podcasts so it's ok.
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Aug 25, 2020 18:14
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So I began re-listening It Could Happen Here with my partner last night. I had listened to it already while getting over eye surgery so I wasn't all that present. And frankly it's still real good, but boy it's weird listening to it in 2020. I know it was recorded less than 18 months ago, but man how things have changed. It's pretty interesting to get back into in retrospect.
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Aug 26, 2020 16:29
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Lions Lead By Donkeys just released an episode on the idiotic failed coup in Venezuela, but I could have sworn they already did one a few months ago, but I cant find it in the back catalog. Feel like I'm going crazy
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Aug 26, 2020 20:56
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The Glumslinger posted:Lions Lead By Donkeys just released an episode on the idiotic failed coup in Venezuela, but I could have sworn they already did one a few months ago, but I cant find it in the back catalog. Feel like I'm going crazy Hell of a way to die did a episode about it, maybe you're thinking about that https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wa7Csry3L0w
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Aug 26, 2020 21:07
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Robert Evans had mentioned that Behind the Bastards will eventually do an episode on the failed coup, but he wanted to wait for more details to come out. And obviously some stuff has happened since then that has taken precedence.
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Aug 26, 2020 21:34
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The Dollop also did an episode on Goudreau and the coup.
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Aug 26, 2020 21:43
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AceOfFlames posted:The Dollop also did an episode on Goudreau and the coup. I'm probably thinking of that one, thanks
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Aug 27, 2020 05:20
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Been digging this western civ podcast, nice and casual. https://www.westerncivpodcast.com
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Sep 11, 2020 02:13
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In Our Time back starting next week, for any fans of that  . Do love that Bragg clearly just refused to do the show over Zoom.
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Sep 11, 2020 21:01
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GraPar posted:In Our Time back starting next week, for any fans of that Ooo, sweet! I wasn’t sure it was going to come back until there was a vaccine.
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Sep 11, 2020 22:08
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https://twitter.com/kthalps/status/1304554094208712706?s=21 I haven’t listened yet but it’s probably interesting.
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Sep 12, 2020 00:07
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Kazak_Hstan posted:https://twitter.com/kthalps/status/1304554094208712706?s=21 If you listen to a decent amount of political podcasts there's probably not much here you haven't heard before, but it's worth a listen. MeatwadIsGod fucked around with this message at 02:39 on Sep 12, 2020 |
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Sep 12, 2020 00:53
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GraPar posted:In Our Time back starting next week, for any fans of that Scratch that, sounds like they did it over zoom but Bragg was in studio to thread that needle lol
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Sep 18, 2020 06:56
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I just wanted to “give a shout-out” (as the kids say these days) to whomever recommended the China History Podcast. It’s really really good/fun/interesting.
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Sep 21, 2020 02:39
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Anyone listened to Carlin's latest Common Sense? Apparently it's super doomy and gloomy.
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Sep 21, 2020 07:13
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As opposed to the previous few, where he was chipper as heck? 
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Sep 21, 2020 13:16
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I haven't listened to CS in a while, the only thing I remember was his "let's look at this from both sides" angle.
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Sep 21, 2020 15:36
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Schadenboner posted:I just wanted to “give a shout-out” (as the kids say these days) to whomever recommended the China History Podcast. It’s really really good/fun/interesting.
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Sep 21, 2020 16:33
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busalover posted:I haven't listened to CS in a while, the only thing I remember was his "let's look at this from both sides" angle. He does the same thing again and also scolds protesters for not realizing that we just need to talk to each other.
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Sep 21, 2020 18:29
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