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Ingmar terdman posted:
That wide shot of the Arrakeen landing field looks amazing. e: well I guess its Geidi prime nevermind but still amazing
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Sep 3, 2020 04:38
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I could buy that the deep desert suits have to seal better, fit better, pump better, hold up to more wear and tear, whatever. Lots of parallels in real life like cars
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Sep 3, 2020 04:39
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I think the idea is that they are just less efficient with their seals etc, so you will lose more than "a thimbleful of water a day". In the cities with higher ambient moisture and plenty of dietary water from offworld foods, that is fine, but in the deep desert you will soon lose too much water to survive.
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Sep 3, 2020 04:49
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Okay, that makes sense. Dune has this incredible power- no matter how ridiculous and fantastical it gets- to make me engage with it seriously. I always end up trying to puzzle out "why don't they grab some ice from elsewhere in the solar system and smash it through the atmosphere to increase its moisture content-?" and then I have to remind myself that Dune is a half-century-old science-fable written by the same dude who invented the word beefswelling.
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Sep 3, 2020 05:03
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Ingmar terdman posted:I could buy that the deep desert suits have to seal better, fit better, pump better, hold up to more wear and tear, whatever. Lots of parallels in real life like cars Plus not all beef jerky is made the same
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Sep 3, 2020 05:18
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Tree Bucket posted:Okay, that makes sense. It's specifically a point that the Kynes plan is to terraform Arrakis the hard way, that the Fremen themselves are in control of, rather than relying on the Empire's infrastructure and technology to do so.
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Sep 3, 2020 05:31
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Sep 3, 2020 05:51
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Tree Bucket posted:Okay, that makes sense. It's not that they can't do that. The Emperor and the Guild won't let them, The balance of power is so delicate that changing life on Arrakis would disrupt galactic commerce and society. The planet remains a desert and Kynes doesn't tell the Emperor everything he knows, because he's secretly committed to terraforming. exmachina posted:The dinner party scene will make or break this movie for me Also this.
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Sep 3, 2020 05:58
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Tree Bucket posted:Okay, that makes sense. Water could be imported; essentially it is via off world food. However it won't change the climate: free moisture is encapsulated by soundtrout anyway
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Sep 3, 2020 06:05
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Naibs With Attitude
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Sep 3, 2020 07:56
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was going to say he needs a giant clock around his neck but then did clocks get destroyed in the butlerian jihad, are mentats trained to subconsciously be counting the time all day every day???
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Sep 3, 2020 09:35
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Eau de MacGowan posted:was going to say he needs a giant clock around his neck but then did clocks get destroyed in the butlerian jihad, are mentats trained to subconsciously be counting the time all day every day??? There's a point right when they arrive in Arrakeen where they make a deal about resetting all of their clocks to local time, and Idaho makes a drunken fool of himself at 2am following the dinner party, as noted by Jessica.
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Sep 3, 2020 15:22
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phasmid posted:It's not that they can't do that. The Emperor and the Guild won't let them, The balance of power is so delicate that changing life on Arrakis would disrupt galactic commerce and society. The planet remains a desert and Kynes doesn't tell the Emperor everything he knows, because he's secretly committed to terraforming. I bet this subplot is going to be a lot more present in this version than in Lynch's. In the modern world the idea of a guerilla movement focused on ecological change in the face of entrenched powerful opposition carries a lot of weight. People may even get the emotional impact of that movement being hijacked by a messiah figure and used for power politics in a way that the book clearly felt but didn't always communicate.
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Sep 3, 2020 15:50
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Notahippie posted:I bet this subplot is going to be a lot more present in this version than in Lynch's. In the modern world the idea of a guerilla movement focused on ecological change in the face of entrenched powerful opposition carries a lot of weight. People may even get the emotional impact of that movement being hijacked by a messiah figure and used for power politics in a way that the book clearly felt but didn't always communicate. That's a good point. If the movie finds an audience - and I think it will - that part of it will resonate with a lot of people.
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Sep 3, 2020 17:07
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If the "Fremen fighting for ecological change" things does resonate, God Emperor of Dune (and even Children to an extent) as a movie is going to be interesting. Basically all the changes Kynes and the Fremen do to make Arrakis "better" just completely destroy the Fremen and the Arrakis way of life in general.
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Sep 3, 2020 17:12
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Lord Justice posted:If the "Fremen fighting for ecological change" things does resonate, God Emperor of Dune (and even Children to an extent) as a movie is going to be interesting. Basically all the changes Kynes and the Fremen do to make Arrakis "better" just completely destroy the Fremen and the Arrakis way of life in general.
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Sep 3, 2020 17:21
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Tolkien would be sickened by all the allegory
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Sep 3, 2020 17:22
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AFewBricksShy posted:At this point I'm going to be happy if we get a Dune Part II. I highly doubt anyone would finance Children or especially God Emperor. There's plenty you can do with Messiah though, especially if you add in Children of Dune material like the SciFi miniseries did.
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Sep 3, 2020 17:27
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the challenging sci fi story of heroes who want to cause a climate apocalypse in a stable ecosystem
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Sep 3, 2020 17:28
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u brexit ukip it posted:There's plenty you can do with Messiah though, especially if you add in Children of Dune material like the SciFi miniseries did. Agreed, but Dune would have to make  Marvel to get a sequel beyond the second half of the first book.Doc Hawkins posted:the challenging sci fi story of heroes who want to cause a climate apocalypse in a stable ecosystem We're already watching a movie where a young wealthy person joins a group of desert dwellers intent on overthrowing the government by taking control of a substance that the universe needs to be able to travel, a pro-climate change movie would probably be the easier sell here. AFewBricksShy fucked around with this message at 17:45 on Sep 3, 2020 |
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Sep 3, 2020 17:29
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trying to imagine a cinematic adaptation of God Emperor and  .
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Sep 3, 2020 17:30
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The closest movie I can think of in terms of weirdness and the hero/villain standing around saying screwy oddball poo poo is Island of Dr. Moreau edit: cast Steve Coogan in a worm suit doing his best Marlon Brando vvvvvv 
kiimo fucked around with this message at 17:39 on Sep 3, 2020 |
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Sep 3, 2020 17:34
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https://youtu.be/8_wktVpKUNc for proof of concept
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Sep 3, 2020 17:37
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kiimo posted:Tolkien would be sickened by all the allegory Elves don't need OPEC. Their horses are fueled by magic grass. AND THAT'S ALL IT IS. I HEAR YOU KIDS SNICkERING BACK THERE!
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Sep 3, 2020 17:39
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kiimo posted:The closest movie I can think of in terms of weirdness and the hero/villain standing around saying screwy oddball poo poo is Island of Dr. Moreau I was just telling someone this morning that Brando Moreau is extremely Leto II 
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Sep 3, 2020 17:47
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Ingmar terdman posted:I was just telling someone this morning that Brando Moreau is extremely Leto II Getting more of a Baron Harkonnen vibe.
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Sep 3, 2020 17:48
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AFewBricksShy posted:We're already watching a movie where a young wealthy person joins a group of desert dwellers intent on overthrowing the government by taking control of a substance that the universe needs to be able to travel, a pro-climate change movie would probably be the easier sell here. And not just any substance but space LSD
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Sep 3, 2020 18:20
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Barron Trump: Muslim Ecoterrorist
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Sep 3, 2020 18:30
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Ghost Leviathan posted:Getting more of a Baron Harkonnen vibe. i was gonna say Tleilaxu, Brando is three of them in a muumuu.
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Sep 3, 2020 18:32
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Anne Frank Funk posted:https://youtu.be/8_wktVpKUNc for proof of concept We have the technology
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Sep 3, 2020 19:23
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Ghost Leviathan posted:Getting more of a Baron Harkonnen vibe. Don't forget, Leto is both Atreides and Harkonnen
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Sep 3, 2020 19:23
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Tolkien famously didn't like Dune.
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Sep 3, 2020 22:26
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Notahippie posted:I bet this subplot is going to be a lot more present in this version than in Lynch's. In the modern world the idea of a guerilla movement focused on ecological change in the face of entrenched powerful opposition carries a lot of weight. People may even get the emotional impact of that movement being hijacked by a messiah figure and used for power politics in a way that the book clearly felt but didn't always communicate. That's a really excellent point. I never thought of Dune in those terms before, but it's absolutely A Thing. Dune really should be Kyne's story of patient, cautious, rigorous ecological work- but it all just ends up as backdrop to some charismatic dude's personal adventure.
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Sep 3, 2020 22:46
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Tree Bucket posted:That's a really excellent point. I never thought of Dune in those terms before, but it's absolutely A Thing. Dune really should be Kyne's story of patient, cautious, rigorous ecological work- but it all just ends up as backdrop to some charismatic dude's personal adventure. I don't remember it from my reading but is it ever explained in the books why the fremens agree to terraform Arrakis knowing very well it's going to destroy the sandworms ecosystem? Is it like "we prefer to live on a paradise planet rather than being coveted by all the great powers of the universe"? SpaceGoatFarts fucked around with this message at 23:07 on Sep 3, 2020 |
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Sep 3, 2020 23:04
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They were going to keep parts of it a desert still. Whether that was really feasible or just a convenient fantasy is another question.
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Sep 3, 2020 23:09
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   Not trying to make a point here just getting amped. And I wish the children of dune movie was available somewhere
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Sep 3, 2020 23:29
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Tree Bucket posted:That's a really excellent point. I never thought of Dune in those terms before, but it's absolutely A Thing. Dune really should be Kyne's story of patient, cautious, rigorous ecological work- but it all just ends up as backdrop to some charismatic dude's personal adventure. It's something I've been thinking about because it's an active theme in the book - I don't remember if it was Chani or Kynes or even Kynes' dad in the appendix in the copy I had, but one of the ecologists talks about how "the worst thing that could happen to my people is if they fall into the hands of a hero" and there's a suggestion that the Fremen were in part ready to unify behind Paul because Kynes had successfully unified them behind a transformational vision. But Herbert never really does anything with it other than basically say "yeah, poo poo sucks doesn't it" and the plot really glorifies Paul. I've never been sure whether Herbert meant it to read as a tragedy but fell into the trap that your hero is always the most sympathetic character, or if the ecological stuff was just background.
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Sep 3, 2020 23:38
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He extrapolates the ecological story by having the entire desert shrunk down to a small patch with no worms. The Fremen prophecy was about creating a kind of better world that was still distinctly their own. Paul used their momentum - in his vision, someone somehow was going to do this anyway - to propel himself to emperor. In book 2 there was a conspirator who told about going to a planet with great seas and trying to drink the saltwater our of excitement. In book 4 there are the descendants of the Fremen, a mostly-ignored group of traditionalists who kept the Fremen ceremony and custom but who didnt know their real culture of isolationism and barbarity. They couldn't fight and the only sandworm they knew was President God. There's other stories of how the Fremen way of life was lost in a gradual assimilation/dissolution. Their story is a sad one, a people once enslaved, then briefly, bitterly free before their erasure.
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Sep 3, 2020 23:52
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Good post. The museum fremen that duncan meets near the end of GE and dunc's frustration and pity is a highlight from that book
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Sep 3, 2020 23:56
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Ingmar terdman posted:
I am going to make a point: I love that she's seated in this shot and that Paul towers over her. Under normal circumstances we'd consider the person who is physically higher and more dynamically posed to be more powerful, but Mohiam - and by extension the Bene Gesserit - don't operate by those rules.
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Sep 4, 2020 00:07
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