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food court bailiff posted:pretty sure they're talking about the Good Hitmans, 2016 and the sequel And blood money. That description sounds like Hitman 2 from 2004.
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Sep 11, 2020 20:07
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The White Dragon posted:i played about an hour of hitman-something on the ps2 but running in and dying instantly was pretty boring, as was sitting in a tower for twenty minutes figuring out guard paths, going in, and realizing i missed someone and instantly dying You should give the new Hitmans a try. In my opinion, reliance on scripted encounters is at its most lovely when the game is otherwise open, like you said. Alpha Protocol has a particular boss that you're forced to fight head on when you could do the rest of the game without combat, and everyone hates that about it. It's a bad fight that is forced on the player. If you can't think of good examples though, that means you just don't have exposure. They do exist. Go play the new Hitmens
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Sep 11, 2020 20:24
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being able to solve problems in various ways is why deus ex was so good
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Sep 11, 2020 20:26
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Shibawanko posted:being able to solve problems in various ways is why deus ex was so good Furthermore, the new Deus Ex games were stupid for being designed so fully against lethal options, and still giving you only one battery charge that recharges on its own.
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Sep 11, 2020 20:38
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I literally cannot play Deus Ex human revolution, like I can't get past the first bit of challenging poo poo in it and I give up every time. It's like that part of my brain just won't work or something and I have no idea why.
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Sep 11, 2020 22:44
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Shibawanko posted:being able to solve problems in various ways is why deus ex was so good maybe this is the case with dx1, but in dx:hr, i solved the problems in various ways until the first mission, which ended with a boss that was unkillable because i'd spent my limited spec points on stealth  otoh, alpha protocol, for all its fuckups, has a first boss the goal of which is to walk to the overpass he's standing on so you can judo chop him in the neck in a cutscene, and if your stealth is high enough he'll lose track of you every time you duck behind a traffic divider. shame about the helicopter boss though Fur20 fucked around with this message at 23:07 on Sep 11, 2020 |
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Sep 11, 2020 23:04
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peter gabriel posted:I literally cannot play Deus Ex human revolution, like I can't get past the first bit of challenging poo poo in it and I give up every time. It's like that part of my brain just won't work or something and I have no idea why. same but its just because i knew i wasnt really interested and would only be disappointed by the game
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Sep 11, 2020 23:07
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Just checked my Steam account. Deus Ex human revolution Play time 39.2 hours Achievements 1/49 
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Sep 11, 2020 23:07
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Der Kyhe posted:Furthermore, the new Deus Ex games were stupid for being designed so fully against lethal options, and still giving you only one battery charge that recharges on its own. Mankind Divided actually revamped the whole recharging battery situation, and it really enables to let you constantly be using a full bar's worth of energy. Unfortunately, they never told anyone that they changed the system so everything still thinks it works the way it did in HR, which is ironic and serves them right.
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Sep 11, 2020 23:08
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I mean, Boomer hot take incoming-- Cyberpunk is lame. Even when it's done well, it's lame. It's been lame since 1990. Trying to do any sort-of Cyberpunk seriously since the first Deus Ex has never been anything but lame, and even the first Deus Ex was just a capstone to a decade where most of what cyberpunk was talking about became reality-- the absolute commodification of the individual in service of "the system" and all that, which was always metaphorically realized in Cyberpunk stories via cyborgs or prosthetics or implants or VR or whatever. A Deus Ex revival was doomed from the start. Cyberpunk 2077 legitimately looks like a GTA V mod pack. There's nothing wrong with liking that stuff, but I mean... it's lame.
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Sep 11, 2020 23:41
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I installed the Aug because I was genuinely curious what it would do. It also fits the narrative pretty well because both Adam Jensens are dumber than a box of hammers
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Sep 11, 2020 23:47
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Barudak posted:I installed the Aug because I was genuinely curious what it would do. It also fits the narrative pretty well because both Adam Jensens are dumber than a box of hammers Yeah, me to. I did also have the thought that it was being presented to the player as so obviously a trap that maybe it was a fakeout lol. But either way I was confident that, being a AAA console game, it was not actually going to matter very much. A title like that is not going to screw you in that way. This isn't the loving 80's playing King's Quest where you can make the wrong decision and just have a dead save hours later because of it. And wow lo and behold the boss fight wasn't hard anyway. I actually wonder if they nerf the boss if you do it, to compensate. Imagine roleplaying or just doing something to see what happens, in a video game where it's basically guaranteed to have minimal effect. Wow what a maroon lamo!!!
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Sep 11, 2020 23:53
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mind the walrus posted:I mean, Boomer hot take incoming-- Cyberpunk is lame. Even when it's done well, it's lame. It's been lame since 1990. Trying to do any sort-of Cyberpunk seriously since the first Deus Ex has never been anything but lame, and even the first Deus Ex was just a capstone to a decade where most of what cyberpunk was talking about became reality-- the absolute commodification of the individual in service of "the system" and all that, which was always metaphorically realized in Cyberpunk stories via cyborgs or prosthetics or implants or VR or whatever. Counterpoint: Invisible Inc rules, you are the one who is lame
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Sep 11, 2020 23:59
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Caesar Saladin posted:i bet so many people put a bunch of money and effort into some raspberry pi emulator thing and used it twice and then realised they had already played all the snes games they are interested in i think building the device is probably the real fun in making one, especially these days when you can basically buy the same thing pre-built for like 5 bucks on aliexpress
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Sep 12, 2020 00:05
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The best cyberpunk is me, running around town with AirPods in, bouncing from public WiFi to public WiFi, getting mugged constantly while I attempt to code via voice commands.
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Sep 12, 2020 00:06
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Chomp8645 posted:Imagine roleplaying or just doing something to see what happens, in a video game where it's basically guaranteed to have minimal effect. Wow what a maroon lamo!!! You should only make decisions that let you be smug on the forums later on. "Doing something to see what happens" is fine when we're talking about running through the water fountain in FEAR to have the dialogue change slightly, not getting mugged in an alley in Age of Decadence because you wanted to pass a Speech check.
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Sep 12, 2020 00:07
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mind the walrus posted:I mean, Boomer hot take incoming-- Cyberpunk is lame. Even when it's done well, it's lame. It's been lame since 1990. Trying to do any sort-of Cyberpunk seriously since the first Deus Ex has never been anything but lame, and even the first Deus Ex was just a capstone to a decade where most of what cyberpunk was talking about became reality-- the absolute commodification of the individual in service of "the system" and all that, which was always metaphorically realized in Cyberpunk stories via cyborgs or prosthetics or implants or VR or whatever. this is one of the best things DX:IW did - cyberpunk was pretty dead even as deus ex came out so the sequel embraced the ending of the first one and went full post-cyberpunk
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Sep 12, 2020 00:12
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Ruffian Price posted:You should only make decisions that let you be smug on the forums later on. "Doing something to see what happens" is fine when we're talking about running through the water fountain in FEAR to have the dialogue change slightly, not getting mugged in an alley in Age of Decadence because you wanted to pass a Speech check. I mean, if you got mugged in an alley in Age of Decadence you probably didn't intentionally fail your persuade/streetwise. And passing such encounters is necessary for a lot of poo poo. My man, Age of Decadence is like the game to do poo poo so you can see what happens. There's like a million things that can happen and at least like, ten different endings. And you won't find them with that attitude! God what a great game.
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Sep 12, 2020 00:16
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The problem with cyberpunk is "you can be a punk, but in the future" except no one wants to be a punk right now. Steampunk is even worse.
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Sep 12, 2020 00:19
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Chomp8645 posted:Imagine roleplaying or just doing something to see what happens, in a video game where it's basically guaranteed to have minimal effect. Wow what a maroon lamo!!! the amount of comments here and elsewhere when DX:HR came out where people were surprised and upset at the outcome is more what i was talking about, not "oh this is obviously the wrong choice but I want to see what happens"
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Sep 12, 2020 00:22
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New CP game looks fine but all we got for a good 3 years was concept art and teaser trailer. The hype behind it kinda irked me. Re ME3. Casey Hudson promised the game wouldn't have an A,B,C ending and then it did. That alone justifies the butthurt imo.
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Sep 12, 2020 00:24
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food court bailiff posted:the amount of comments here and elsewhere when DX:HR came out where people were surprised and upset at the outcome is more what i was talking about, not "oh this is obviously the wrong choice but I want to see what happens" Ok that's fair. I can believe that. It seems like no matter how telegraphed something is, there are always a bunch of clowns who are pikacku shocked by it. I just don't want to be lumped in with them! That's even funnier that people who upset about it though, considering it barely affects anything. It makes one single encounter that isn't remotely difficult, slightly more difficult. Wow wow wee-wah! I guess it makes the player feel slightly foolish, which is is probably the real crime lol.
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Sep 12, 2020 00:26
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Waltzing Along posted:The problem with cyberpunk is "you can be a punk, but in the future" except no one wants to be a punk right now. Steampunk is even worse. my gripe with fiction-punk fashion is that everyone looks like an assclown. cant u just maintain cyberpunk values like personal privacy practices and anticoporatism but still like a normal person or do you have to show everyone how iconoclastic you are
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Sep 12, 2020 00:28
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Chomp8645 posted:I mean, if you got mugged in an alley in Age of Decadence you probably didn't intentionally fail your persuade/streetwise. And passing such encounters is necessary for a lot of poo poo. then you can of course pretend eating poo poo was part of your plan
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Sep 12, 2020 00:30
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i would be genuinely over the moon for a deus ex invisible war remake that expanded and fixed things that game deserves another chance dammit
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Sep 12, 2020 00:47
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food court bailiff posted:i would be genuinely over the moon for a deus ex invisible war remake that expanded and fixed things Agreed. That game had some good poo poo in it but it had so much stuff that just straight up didn’t work and ruined it.
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Sep 12, 2020 00:47
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Ruffian Price posted:I'm referring to encounters that penalize you if you pass because the number doesn't matter when you made a dumb decision in the first place, thinking the power of stats would just make the world magically conform Oh yeah those. They're part of the charm!
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Sep 12, 2020 00:52
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I beat invisible war more than any other Deus Ex game so Im forced to call it the best in the franchise
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Sep 12, 2020 00:54
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Waltzing Along posted:The problem with cyberpunk is "you can be a punk, but in the future" except no one wants to be a punk right now. Steampunk is even worse. steampunk isn't punk
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Sep 12, 2020 00:58
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punk often involves adorning your clothes with pointless tacky bullshit and thats all steampunk really is
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Sep 12, 2020 01:42
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Der Kyhe posted:Furthermore, the new Deus Ex games were stupid for being designed so fully against lethal options, and still giving you only one battery charge that recharges on its own. The part of DXHR where your plane gets shot down and you have to eliminate 20 dudes and a giant robot ~nonlethally~ on a timer to save your pilot friend without blowing the clean hands achievement is one of the worst cases ever of this stupid bullshit absolutely ruining the tone of the game. Killing any of the attackers ruins your clean hands run- even knocking one of them out in such a way that they fall off the balcony may ruin the run. But you can just bail and leave your friend to die, and that's fine. To save her you have to chain together a bunch of takedowns, stuns and tranq darts just so to take everyone out just in time without having to reload or eat a protein bar. It makes no sense for the main character to behave this way but anyone who's trying to get the achievement has to play that way.
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Sep 12, 2020 02:13
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RPATDO_LAMD posted:steampunk isn't punk Exactly, cyberpunk is about the struggle against the negative outcomes of capitalism developing advanced computer technologies. Steampunk is the complete opposite. It's a fantasy where technology is whimsical and mostly has good outcomes.
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Sep 12, 2020 02:14
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The nuDX games also really over-rewarded the player. You could get XP several different ways just entering the same room through different routes. It's kind of a problem in the genre in general, but in those games it was really apparent at times. I would get into the habit of getting into a place, probably the airvent type sneaky way, use magic knockout powers to get rid of the patrols, then work backwards and hack all the stuff and unlock the crap. Hacking stuff for XP even if I know the code. Nonlethal stealth route so often lets you just farm the other routes on top of what you get for being sneaky. Would really love to see an immersive sim where nonlethal route is genuinely harder, not just slower. Knocking out a person without doing brain damage (and that knockout lasting forever in-game), just makes non-lethal stealth OP for no real drawback or extra challenge. Then you get all the toys and all the XP. The violence route should be the easy one, the one with the most mechanical incentive, the one you're tempted to do but choose to be non-lethal and do it the hard way. That kind of ties in with a core problem with good/evil systems. They never try to make Doing the Right Thing difficult, it's never a hard choice and often the other choice is just pointlessly/cartoonishly evil and not beneficial to anyone or yourself anyway. There should be an actual reason and temptation to do evil or selfish things, otherwise it's not really a choice or meaningful option, it's just some whacky dialogue options
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Sep 12, 2020 02:35
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Invisible War introduced me to Kidney Thieves. I also enjoyed the coffee war.
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Sep 12, 2020 02:39
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is pepsi ok posted:Exactly, cyberpunk is about the struggle against the negative outcomes of capitalism developing advanced computer technologies. Steampunk is the complete opposite. It's a fantasy where technology is whimsical and mostly has good outcomes. Praise to Karras!...and The Builder!
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Sep 12, 2020 02:44
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is pepsi ok posted:Exactly, cyberpunk is about the struggle against the negative outcomes of capitalism developing advanced computer technologies. Steampunk is the complete opposite. It's a fantasy where technology is whimsical and mostly has good outcomes. Yeah that's another reason why steampunk is stupid bullshit while cyberpunk can be cool and good. Cyberpunk often includes certain visual tropes but doesn't have to and certainly isn't defined by them (for instance Invisible Inc shies away from those aesthetics pretty hard but is very cyberpunk in other ways). Steampunk is the visual tropes and nothing else.
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Sep 12, 2020 02:45
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The only good steampunk is Looking Glass Steampunk.
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Sep 12, 2020 02:47
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Khanstant posted:That kind of ties in with a core problem with good/evil systems. They never try to make Doing the Right Thing difficult, it's never a hard choice and often the other choice is just pointlessly/cartoonishly evil and not beneficial to anyone or yourself anyway. There should be an actual reason and temptation to do evil or selfish things, otherwise it's not really a choice or meaningful option, it's just some whacky dialogue options im lazy i would rather just tell the player "well... you're playing as a generally good character dwi  " with no decisions over outcomes because you always do the righteous thing--just choices about whether you're a plucky shonen, a mighty aniki, or a stoic crono, that sort of thing
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Sep 12, 2020 02:49
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poverty goat posted:The part of DXHR where your plane gets shot down and you have to eliminate 20 dudes and a giant robot ~nonlethally~ on a timer to save your pilot friend without blowing the clean hands achievement is one of the worst cases ever of this stupid bullshit absolutely ruining the tone of the game. Killing any of the attackers ruins your clean hands run- even knocking one of them out in such a way that they fall off the balcony may ruin the run. But you can just bail and leave your friend to die, and that's fine. To save her you have to chain together a bunch of takedowns, stuns and tranq darts just so to take everyone out just in time without having to reload or eat a protein bar. It makes no sense for the main character to behave this way but anyone who's trying to get the achievement has to play that way. The lesson here is that achievements are stupid, and video games as a whole are worse off because of their existence.
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Sep 12, 2020 02:55
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The White Dragon posted:im lazy i would rather just tell the player "well... you're playing as a generally good character dwi That's a legit approach, especially in videogame production if you don't want to expend a ton of time/energy/money on increasingly niche avenues of the game when only a fraction of players will even beat the most linear of games. In a good-only scenario, I think it's best when the good side is genuinely righteous or good. If not, least let you acknowledge it or actively work against the element/group/people/philosophy/demon-curse/system/whatever in it that's stopping it from actually being good.
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Sep 12, 2020 03:00
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