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3D Megadoodoo posted:Every regulation ever imposed on corporations was a response to a worker or workers getting killed. (Or the relatives of the regulators being COMPETED AGAINST but that's not the point.) Nearly 100% yeah, or customers, or neighbors, or some rear end in a top hat downstream Regulations are written in blood
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Sep 14, 2020 21:47
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fat bossy gerbil posted:Those morons deserve to be parted from their money. Who the gently caress would gamble without the possibility of winning? These idiots apparently will, and if you’re dumb enough to do that you deserve to lose your money. It’s not gambling if there’s nothing on the line, they are paying to press digital buttons and there’s not excuse for it because they know they’re doing it. If these people had any brains they’d go and actually gamble with the money. D&D is one level up bud
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Sep 14, 2020 21:50
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fat bossy gerbil posted:Those morons deserve to be parted from their money. Who the gently caress would gamble without the possibility of winning? These idiots apparently will, and if you’re dumb enough to do that you deserve to lose your money. It’s not gambling if there’s nothing on the line, they are paying to press digital buttons and there’s not excuse for it because they know they’re doing it. If these people had any brains they’d go and actually gamble with the money. Its an addiction, tho. its just a more distilled example of free 2 play games or even subscription games. Sure you could say that WoW has more content than a slot game but these people are getting the same thrill out of this more basic poo poo
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Sep 14, 2020 21:52
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Cold on a Cob posted:https://twitter.com/cfarivar/status/1305504885404704778?s=20 cant imagine dumping money into a gambling app that didnt occasionally spit out big titty anime women. boomers dont know poo poo
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Sep 14, 2020 21:53
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yeah, gatcha games are basically slot machines too
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Sep 14, 2020 21:59
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elaboration has issued a correction as of 21:36 on Mar 22, 2023 |
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Sep 14, 2020 22:04
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And here I thought that Jim Sterling's favorite lootbox game was just satire when all along it was a real thing that some vampire actually made.
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Sep 14, 2020 22:15
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The Bloop posted:One lesson it's loving amazing that people haven't learned yet is that no matter how much It's real sad and kinda scary that a large amount of the population seems to accept "It's just business!" as a valid reason to gently caress someone over Shugojin posted:and since it said up front that you cannot win anything in it, this is not technically gambling? It's not even "not technically gambling", it's just plain not gambling and isn't even really pretending to be gambling. It's a slot machine app for your phone for when you really want to play a slot machine like, as a game. It's one of those lovely demo java apps that came free with old phones, but you have to pay for it.
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Sep 14, 2020 22:21
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says corporations are people (and being charitable he meant that corporations are made up of people) they range from amoral to immoral
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Cold on a Cob posted:https://twitter.com/cfarivar/status/1305504885404704778?s=20 chaser: https://www.seattletimes.com/business/technology/big-fish-games-becomes-250-employees-smaller quote:Seattle-based Big Fish Games on Tuesday said it was laying off 250 employees, telling staffers in a company memo the move is being made from a position of “financial strength” and that saving money was not a primary driver behind the cuts. the house wins again!!!
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Sep 14, 2020 22:22
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It's basically the exact same thing as candy crush, but the game is "a slot machine" rather than "bejeweled". It's bizarrely dumb.
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Sep 14, 2020 22:23
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millenial app maker turns the 'no give only take' meme back on the boomer ftw
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Sep 14, 2020 22:24
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zynga dot com posted:telling staffers in a company memo the move is being made from a position of “financial strength” and that saving money was not a primary driver behind the cuts. Okay I know we're laying you off but rest assured: we're not doing this because we have to, we're doing it because we want to, for funsies.
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Sep 14, 2020 22:24
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you still "win", though. you just "win" completely useless digital casino chips, whose only use is to suck you in further to the addiction. all the psychological effects of winning with none of the potential to convert winnings into cash = $$$ to the company
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Sep 14, 2020 22:32
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at least chuck e cheese had the courtesy to showcase potential "prizes" on the walls
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Sep 14, 2020 22:35
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Thanatosian posted:These are games designed by psychologists to be addictive. This is like saying the real problem with obesity in America is a lack of willpower, as if somehow people today just have less willpower than people 30 years ago did. This was at the end of the last page but it's really important. Especially with the rise of technology and always-on monitoring and analytics, iterating on the design of these sorts of games is ridiculously fast, and over the years there's been a lot of knowledge gained on how to best manipulate people. There's also plenty of tech around tweaking things towards individuals or groups because of how opaque everything is, even outside of gambling. Things like sites showing different prices depending on what website you came from or what region your IP is from, or even just random A/B testing. All of that gets poured back into the system to fine-tune the ways they extract money from you. Humans are incredibly stupid and easy to manipulate, and the government has generally let companies get away with pretty much everything.
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Sep 14, 2020 22:36
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https://twitter.com/CNBC/status/1305514914069590016?s=19
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Sep 14, 2020 22:41
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Zamujasa posted:This was at the end of the last page but it's really important. Especially with the rise of technology and always-on monitoring and analytics, iterating on the design of these sorts of games is ridiculously fast, and over the years there's been a lot of knowledge gained on how to best manipulate people. There's also plenty of tech around tweaking things towards individuals or groups because of how opaque everything is, even outside of gambling. Things like sites showing different prices depending on what website you came from or what region your IP is from, or even just random A/B testing. All of that gets poured back into the system to fine-tune the ways they extract money from you. i didn't see it mentioned in the article but the casino apps probably do the same thing gacha games do, where if the algorithm identifies you as a whale they will start tweaking the odds against you more because they know you're super likely to throw more money at them if you bust out. real casinos are a blight on society but at least they're regulated to have consistent odds little munchkin has issued a correction as of 22:46 on Sep 14, 2020 |
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Sep 14, 2020 22:43
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When choosing a drink, I always select the water beverage
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Sep 14, 2020 22:53
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little munchkin posted:i didn't see it mentioned in the article but the casino apps probably do the same thing gacha games do, where if the algorithm identifies you as a whale they will start tweaking the odds against you more because they know you're super likely to throw more money at them if you bust out. umm this isn’t true, like it it was the many data miners would bring it up and it would be a legit scandal
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Sep 14, 2020 22:54
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CharlestheHammer posted:umm this isn’t true, like it it was the many data miners would bring it up and it would be a legit scandal Okay but who's dumping $15,000 into candy crush to see if it does anything different for data mining purposes
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Sep 14, 2020 22:58
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CharlestheHammer posted:umm this isn’t true, like it it was the many data miners would bring it up and it would be a legit scandal this is actually trivial to do and not something you can prove isn't happening by just 'data mining', you would need big piles of logs and evidence to even start building a case as an example, consider greyball
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Sep 14, 2020 23:00
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Shame Boy posted:Okay but who's dumping $15,000 into candy crush to see if it does anything different for data mining purposes people are dumping $15k into final fantasy brave exidus, fire emblem whatever its called and so forth however
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Sep 14, 2020 23:00
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Shame Boy posted:Okay but who's dumping $15,000 into candy crush to see if it does anything different for data mining purposes candy crush isn’t a gotcha as far as I know what would you even summon all I know is is Japanese gotchas go out if their way to keep that poo poo legit going as far as full refunding if there is any errors they don’t even need to, I think most gotchas have a pull rate of like 5 percent it’s already low I also know there was a scandal about pull rates like that and the games data miner said there was no evidence of that in the code
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Sep 14, 2020 23:03
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CharlestheHammer posted:umm this isn’t true, like it it was the many data miners would bring it up and it would be a legit scandal They were calling their whales who were trying to close their accounts to promise them free chips if they stayed, what are you talking about
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Sep 14, 2020 23:04
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ekuNNN posted:They were calling their whales who were trying to close their accounts to promise them free chips if they stayed, what are you talking about I’m talking about Gotchas which are Japanese and much much more regulated
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Sep 14, 2020 23:08
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CharlestheHammer posted:I also know there was a scandal about pull rates like that and the games data miner said there was no evidence of that in the code you can't devise the actual rates on anything because any game with a hint of sanity would do all of this serverside, where a dataminer can't look you: "hey im spending $5 on jpegs gimme somethin" server: "ok" server: this person is a total tool and gives us lots of money so we'll give them rares at 0.01% instead server: "heres your jpegs. a few commons and an uncommon or two" you: "dang oh well" doing anything else would be trusting the client (you), and in that case you could just go "heeeey i did a pull and got 5 super ultra rare jpegs". without the ability to see the actual code running on the server (which you don't get to see, again) you have no way to prove or disprove anything, and since this is totally unregulated there's literally no downside to pulling all the scammiest poo poo you can for maximum profit
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Sep 14, 2020 23:10
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hobbesmaster posted:people are dumping $15k into final fantasy brave exidus, fire emblem whatever its called and so forth however Sure but are they actually datamining it or just doing that because they're addicts?
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Sep 14, 2020 23:20
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Zamujasa posted:you can't devise the actual rates on anything because any game with a hint of sanity would do all of this serverside, where a dataminer can't look yea the process is completely opaque and the code doesn't even exist on the phone/tablet app for people to datamine. maybe the japanese devs give their entire back-end code base for the regulators to analyze, in which case i'm sorry for using "gacha" to describe the entirety of scummy mobile f2p games
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Sep 14, 2020 23:24
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Why would it even be illegal to change win-percentages if you aren't explicitly advertising them? edit: vvv those seem like good regulations vvv ekuNNN has issued a correction as of 00:10 on Sep 15, 2020 |
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Sep 14, 2020 23:30
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I mean gotchas are scummy by their nature. but they are so big in Japan and scummy they actually made a ton of laws to regulate them the three I’m aware of are 1. you must have summon rates, players have to know their odds 2. every card must be sold as a single piece. cards that require others to work are illegal unless there is a free option 3.you can only charge so much money at a time I think it’s monthly? but I don’t know the limit it’s actually pretty interesting to look into
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Sep 14, 2020 23:30
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CharlestheHammer posted:I mean gotchas are scummy by their nature. but they are so big in Japan and scummy they actually made a ton of laws to regulate them And in the US we have regulations like: 1. gently caress you 2. Give us your money 3. gently caress you, we need more money
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Sep 14, 2020 23:49
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thinking about the time i installed some f2p poker game on steam out of boredom, and 15 minutes in I got one of those "click here to buy some currency!" popups casually asking me if i'd like to give them 100$. it made me feel slightly physically sick and i uninstalled the game immediately
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Sep 14, 2020 23:54
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fat bossy gerbil posted:Those morons deserve to be parted from their money. Who the gently caress would gamble without the possibility of winning? These idiots apparently will, and if you’re dumb enough to do that you deserve to lose your money. It’s not gambling if there’s nothing on the line, they are paying to press digital buttons and there’s not excuse for it because they know they’re doing it. If these people had any brains they’d go and actually gamble with the money. they added rankings and social aspects people who win more points get access to exclusive clubs and chatrooms available only to people who've won more than a certain amount of points that month maybe one month they can get lucky and win enough points to get into a high-tier club with just their free chips. but when the monthly rollover happens, they'll be cut off from their high rank and those exclusive chatrooms until they win that same number of points again. that's the hook. once in a while you might be able to luck into the digital millionaires club, but you can't do it consistently without dropping money, and after a couple weeks chatting with your new exclusive clan, you suddenly get kicked out and have to qualify for admission again. when you inevitably fail to reproduce last month's lucky streak and get really frustrated, well, you can still get your exclusive club membership and rank tier and social connections back just by pouring money into the app! that won't tempt everyone, but once it does manage to hook someone, the same incentives will serve to naturally ramp up their spending instead of anime jpgs, the reward in these games is social status. and just look at the massive unnecessary sums people spend for that in real life. plenty of people have blown temporary windfalls on status symbols, gotten used to the feeling of hanging around with a richer cohort than before, and ended up plunging deep into debt just so they don't look poorer than their neighbors
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Sep 15, 2020 00:58
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All these people saying they're fools for giving money to a gambling game that you can't cash out of are missing the point. The people are getting to play the game. Now Star Citizen on the other hand...
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Sep 15, 2020 01:23
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Cold on a Cob posted:https://twitter.com/cfarivar/status/1305504885404704778?s=20 Lol I love the argument. "Well actually it's not gambling because people can't win real money they can only lose it since they're just exchanging real money for virtual currency in our literal slot game"
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Sep 15, 2020 01:26
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It's not even really a game in any meaningful sense Dopamine beep boop sure ok
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Sep 15, 2020 01:27
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CharlestheHammer posted:I mean gotchas are scummy by their nature. but they are so big in Japan and scummy they actually made a ton of laws to regulate them #3 there is the thing I suggested in my op but there is no hope this will happen in america land of the free
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Sep 15, 2020 01:34
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Cold on a Cob posted:#3 there is the thing I suggested in my op Being rich is not a crime!!!
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Sep 15, 2020 01:43
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imo you're both right. The thing is immoral and should be illegal, and also the people losing money are deplorable morons. These aren't contradictory things.
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Sep 15, 2020 01:44
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that's what money is for, they're not really deplorable. Unless you give all your spare money to charity, you spend it on making yourself feel good (or not like poo poo), these people found their own short circuit to that.
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Sep 15, 2020 01:49
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