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Soup du Jour
Sep 8, 2011

I always knew I'd die with a headache.

Stellaris 2 should be a set map that’s based in the future ruins of a game of Stellaris.

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Red Bones
Aug 9, 2012

"I think he's a bad enough person to stay ghost through his sheer love of child-killing."

Does Ck3 have the 'exclave independence' game rule they added to CK2?

Mantis42
Jul 26, 2010

Yep

Xinder
Apr 27, 2013

i want to be a prince

Reveilled posted:

I really do wish they'd follow the trend of similar games like Civ and just let you get achievements without Ironman. I have thousands of hours in these games and not one achievement because no loving way am I trusting these games not to throw out some weird bug that I have to use the console to fix, or risk losing my one save to corruption. Achievements are supposed to be fun little challenges, if you let people get them even though they cheated, they only cheated themselves, nobody else is worse off.

I feel this because nobody actually looks at other people's achievements and thinks "oh this guy is so cool he got that really rare achievement". the only person they matter to is the person getting them, so if you're cool with cheating for them whatever. i like achievements for giving me a fun set goal to work towards.

AG3
Feb 4, 2004

Ask me about spending hundreds of dollars on Mass Effect 2 emoticons and Avatars.

Oven Wrangler

Red Bones posted:

Does Ck3 have the 'exclave independence' game rule they added to CK2?

They have it, but it doesn't seem to have the desired effect from what I've seen.

ilitarist
Apr 26, 2016

illiterate and militarist

Xinder posted:

I feel this because nobody actually looks at other people's achievements and thinks "oh this guy is so cool he got that really rare achievement". the only person they matter to is the person getting them, so if you're cool with cheating for them whatever. i like achievements for giving me a fun set goal to work towards.

:same:

Those games are big enough so that you can screw around play whoever for a long time, or to try to do better than country X did historically (which is rarely challenging), but then you have to think hard to set your own goals that aren't just conquer the world. Achievements close that gap between understanding mechanics well enough to survive and conquering the world.

I guess it's one of the things more traditional 4X games do better. In those you just crank up the difficulty. In EU4 once you can survive as Byzantium doing the same on a harder difficulty is hardly rewarding.

BBJoey
Oct 31, 2012

CharlestheHammer posted:

But CK3 is more open to wacky stories and people love that poo poo

CK2’s horse councillors, Satan worshippers and dynasties flipping Jewish due to court physician guardians were very down to earth

BBJoey
Oct 31, 2012

CK3 having border gore like every other paradox title: proof of wackiness
CK2 having immortality: that’s history baby

Davincie
Jul 7, 2008

the comparison is with imperator im fairly sure...

Edgar Allen Ho
Apr 3, 2017

by sebmojo

BBJoey posted:

CK3 having border gore like every other paradox title: proof of wackiness
CK2 having immortality: that’s history baby

CK3 is at most differently wacky at present but you can’t turn any of it off

Torrannor
Apr 27, 2013

---FAGNER---
TEAM-MATE
You can have your entire court run around naked in CK3.

AAAAA! Real Muenster
Jul 12, 2008

My QB is also named Bort

yikes! posted:

I think they'd have to make, at the very least, the diplomacy and internal politics way better before I'd find asymmetrical starts fun in stellaris
Damnit zoik now I want factions to work like the new EU4 Estates :mad:

Just make a few changes to replace land with political power or popular support or something like that and I'd be pretty happy with it over the current inscrutable broken black box of Stellaris factions. Its just so dumb that if you're authoritarian and you get an Egalitarian faction it is going to draw more and more people to it because :reasons: but it will always be unhappy if you want to stay Authoritarian.

Lead out in cuffs
Sep 18, 2012

"That's right. We've evolved."

"I can see that. Cool mutations."




AAAAA! Real Muenster posted:

Damnit zoik now I want factions to work like the new EU4 Estates :mad:

Just make a few changes to replace land with political power or popular support or something like that and I'd be pretty happy with it over the current inscrutable broken black box of Stellaris factions. Its just so dumb that if you're authoritarian and you get an Egalitarian faction it is going to draw more and more people to it because :reasons: but it will always be unhappy if you want to stay Authoritarian.

If you have a faction appearing and growing out of nowhere, it either came with some immigrants, or you have a neighbour projecting their cultural influence. Just build a black site or something.

But lol if you think factions in Stellaris are inscrutable. They could possibly be more interesting, but they're not complicated.

feller
Jul 5, 2006


I think voidborne starts are still bugged to generate truly random ethics for pops instead of just random ethics from the ones you chose. I heard they maybe got ethics shifting to work right finally though

AAAAA! Real Muenster
Jul 12, 2008

My QB is also named Bort

Lead out in cuffs posted:

If you have a faction appearing and growing out of nowhere, it either came with some immigrants, or you have a neighbour projecting their cultural influence. Just build a black site or something.

But lol if you think factions in Stellaris are inscrutable. They could possibly be more interesting, but they're not complicated.
This is 100% incorrect. Egalitarian factions spring up by simply having slaves. This will happen if you have zero immigrants and have yet to meet foreign empires. I used the word inscrutable specifically because the game tells you the prior info in exactly zero places in-game. I've run tests on this. I've tried it dozens of times. Its so loving stupid.

Just like how if you are Spiritualist but have a species trait to be good at technology, you will get a Materialist faction 100% of the time; remove that technology research rate trait? Materialist faction 10% of the time because of RNG.

yikes! posted:

I think voidborne starts are still bugged to generate truly random ethics for pops instead of just random ethics from the ones you chose. I heard they maybe got ethics shifting to work right finally though
They changed it game-wide for there to be a decent amount of RNG for all starts, so even if you fix the Voidborne start files you still get random bullcrap faction alignments in your starting pops. I've tested this a lot, too. Its part of why I quit playing the game.

edit: actually I think the change was that they made it so your starting pops are not comprised of 100% your empire ethics and instead are just pure RNG. This is for everyone, not just voidborne.

AAAAA! Real Muenster fucked around with this message at 17:46 on Sep 11, 2020

Crazycryodude
Aug 15, 2015

Lets get our X tons of Duranium back!

....Is that still a valid thing to jingoistically blow out of proportion?


Ok now to be fair, uh, I think it makes perfect sense that slaves cause an egalitarian faction? They generally don't enjoy being enslaved and would prefer to not be, so of course they sign on with the anti-slavery movement.

Outside that specific example though yeah ethics have never worked right and are still kinda janky. I don't think it's really gamebreaking though, the worst case is you lose out on some influence.

AAAAA! Real Muenster
Jul 12, 2008

My QB is also named Bort

Crazycryodude posted:

Ok now to be fair, uh, I think it makes perfect sense that slaves cause an egalitarian faction? They generally don't enjoy being enslaved and would prefer to not be, so of course they sign on with the anti-slavery movement.

Outside that specific example though yeah ethics have never worked right and are still kinda janky. I don't think it's really gamebreaking though, the worst case is you lose out on some influence.
You are correct, but it just bugs me that:
1.) My options for interacting with the Egalitarian faction are only to change government wide policies and by doing so I then make another sizable faction angry instead; its incredibly binary and stupid
2.) They added Authoritarianism to the game and require the Authoritarian faction to desire having slaves, but its a moot point if having slaves means eventually 75% of your non-slave population joins the Egalitarian faction despite having zero tangible pull towards it, while also running like 300% Governing Ethics attraction modifiers (Conformists, One Vision, Deep Space Black Site, Fear Campaign, the influence-costing empire edict, and whatever else there is that I cant remember). tl;dr they added a gameplay mode that is pretty much unusable.

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!

BBJoey posted:

CK2’s horse councillors, Satan worshippers and dynasties flipping Jewish due to court physician guardians were very down to earth

I....I didn’t mean it was limited to three just the wacky stories hides the faults CH3 has that has existed for most paradox launches.

Though CK2 was getting really stupid at the end so it’s toned down a bit

PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

:geno: Yes, it's like a lava lamp.

AAAAA! Real Muenster posted:

You are correct, but it just bugs me that:
1.) My options for interacting with the Egalitarian faction are only to change government wide policies and by doing so I then make another sizable faction angry instead; its incredibly binary and stupid
2.) They added Authoritarianism to the game and require the Authoritarian faction to desire having slaves, but its a moot point if having slaves means eventually 75% of your non-slave population joins the Egalitarian faction despite having zero tangible pull towards it, while also running like 300% Governing Ethics attraction modifiers (Conformists, One Vision, Deep Space Black Site, Fear Campaign, the influence-costing empire edict, and whatever else there is that I cant remember). tl;dr they added a gameplay mode that is pretty much unusable.

I honestly don't know what's happening for you, because I almost exclusively play some combo of Authoritarian and/or Xenophobe with plenty of slavery, and have literally never had this problem with Egalitarians. I don't really spend much effort investing in Governing Attraction either, black sites would be the only one of those I'd ever bother with.

AAAAA! Real Muenster
Jul 12, 2008

My QB is also named Bort

PittTheElder posted:

I honestly don't know what's happening for you, because I almost exclusively play some combo of Authoritarian and/or Xenophobe with plenty of slavery, and have literally never had this problem with Egalitarians. I don't really spend much effort investing in Governing Attraction either, black sites would be the only one of those I'd ever bother with.
That is really bizarre. For a long while I was running a Xenophobe / Authoritarian / Materialist with the start that puts you on a Relic World or whatever it is. My goal was beat people up, take their planets, then move their pops (my new slaves) to my worlds - if climates didnt match they all went to my homeworld. In either case, all my pops end up gravitating to being like.... 50% Egalitarian by 2300. Playing unmodded.

Xanderkish
Aug 10, 2011

Hello!
Playing CK3 as the Byzantines. First guy was typical Byzantine Emperor stuff -- you know, conquering land, building your domain, blackmailing people and then demanding they pay you.

Second guy was blind dude so good at diplomacy he forcibly vassalized several small kingdoms.

Third guy was an extremely learned and devout mystic who was unfortunately outed as a sodomite early in his rule after he got too drunk at a feast and spilled the beans. Though he wanted to wage a holy war to conquer an entire kingdom, he died before he was able to become pious enough to overcome his disrepute and do just that.

Fortunately, his son, an expert torturer with a penchant for cannibalism, was plenty pious to do just that. He also made a point to arrange the assassination of four Khazarian rulers, two of whom were children. He dealt with the strain on his conscience by stress-eating prisoners.

I'm having a great time.

Dirk the Average
Feb 7, 2012

"This may have been a mistake."

AAAAA! Real Muenster posted:

That is really bizarre. For a long while I was running a Xenophobe / Authoritarian / Materialist with the start that puts you on a Relic World or whatever it is. My goal was beat people up, take their planets, then move their pops (my new slaves) to my worlds - if climates didnt match they all went to my homeworld. In either case, all my pops end up gravitating to being like.... 50% Egalitarian by 2300. Playing unmodded.

What living standards are you running? If I remember correctly, running stuff like stratified economy makes it so that really only your rulers are the people who count as far as factions go, so even if the unfortunates are clamoring for freedom, their political power is so low that it doesn't matter.

Yaoi Gagarin
Feb 20, 2014

Dirk the Average posted:

What living standards are you running? If I remember correctly, running stuff like stratified economy makes it so that really only your rulers are the people who count as far as factions go, so even if the unfortunates are clamoring for freedom, their political power is so low that it doesn't matter.

Yeah, and slaves in particular have zero political power iirc

AAAAA! Real Muenster
Jul 12, 2008

My QB is also named Bort

Dirk the Average posted:

What living standards are you running? If I remember correctly, running stuff like stratified economy makes it so that really only your rulers are the people who count as far as factions go, so even if the unfortunates are clamoring for freedom, their political power is so low that it doesn't matter.
I usually ran Stratified Economy, yeah. Slaves have zero political power and the working and specialist class have very little, but the problem is that when they are in factions that have zero percent happiness their productivity drops. I dont play the game any more (due in part to this problem) so its all a wash at this point anyway.

Dirk the Average
Feb 7, 2012

"This may have been a mistake."

AAAAA! Real Muenster posted:

I usually ran Stratified Economy, yeah. Slaves have zero political power and the working and specialist class have very little, but the problem is that when they are in factions that have zero percent happiness their productivity drops. I dont play the game any more (due in part to this problem) so its all a wash at this point anyway.

Weird, that's definitely not been my experience. Checking an authoritarian game I have going on right now (all my pops are synths, but some are enslaved via a civic), none of the enslaved pops are in a faction, and while their happiness is low (usually 30-40% as compared to 90% or so for non-enslaved pops), their output is actually higher and their upkeep is much lower due to the bonuses my empire has to slave output. In fact, the number of pops in factions is pretty much exactly the ratio of pops that are free (the empire currently has a little over 3,000 pops).

AAAAA! Real Muenster
Jul 12, 2008

My QB is also named Bort

Dirk the Average posted:

Weird, that's definitely not been my experience. Checking an authoritarian game I have going on right now (all my pops are synths, but some are enslaved via a civic), none of the enslaved pops are in a faction, and while their happiness is low (usually 30-40% as compared to 90% or so for non-enslaved pops), their output is actually higher and their upkeep is much lower due to the bonuses my empire has to slave output. In fact, the number of pops in factions is pretty much exactly the ratio of pops that are free (the empire currently has a little over 3,000 pops).
Yeah your number of not-enslaved pops and number of pops in factions should be exactly the same. That meant any of my not-slave Workers or any Specialists were not getting slave productivity bonuses; they are all in pissed off factions which meant they had happiness penalties which means productivity penalties. I'm on my work computer otherwise I would look to see if i had any of my old screenshots documenting this crap still around so I could share.

Vivian Darkbloom
Jul 14, 2004


Man, the 90s were weird. Paradox, which looks like it grew out of a Swedish tabletop RPG company, released a Swedish-only title in 1997 called Svea Rike.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRxDDAjKMfs

I mean, I can see how this evolved into an implementation of the old EU board game, but it's rather primitive compared to modern mapgames. It seems like you're a lord who controls Swedish provinces (and you can buy more) but the only other countries you interact with are Denmark, HRE, Poland, and Russia. They occasionally declare war on you and if you win the corny tactical battle you can take one of their provinces. This all earns you honor points that determine your score in 1818.

Pretty limited scope, but there were these sweet minigames. Remaster when??





Vivian Darkbloom fucked around with this message at 03:26 on Sep 19, 2020

Edgar Allen Ho
Apr 3, 2017

by sebmojo
lol if you didn't start with Svea Rike III: Crown of the North and its Hundred Years War clone

jk, I started by finding HoI2 on a shelf somewhere in Dallas, right after reading some dumb ww2 book in middle school, then finding the paradox forums, and then asking for and getting a set of EU2, HoI1, Vicky 1, Svea Rike 3, and that clone HYW game that was on sale on ancient Amazon.

Crazycryodude
Aug 15, 2015

Lets get our X tons of Duranium back!

....Is that still a valid thing to jingoistically blow out of proportion?



I'm sorry is that Space Invaders?

Jazerus
May 24, 2011


Crazycryodude posted:

I'm sorry is that Space Invaders?

space invaders was based on shelling spanish pike squares, not the other way around. keep up with your gaming history man

Soup du Jour
Sep 8, 2011

I always knew I'd die with a headache.

Edgar Allen Ho posted:

lol if you didn't start with Svea Rike III: Crown of the North and its Hundred Years War clone

jk, I started by finding HoI2 on a shelf somewhere in Dallas, right after reading some dumb ww2 book in middle school, then finding the paradox forums, and then asking for and getting a set of EU2, HoI1, Vicky 1, Svea Rike 3, and that clone HYW game that was on sale on ancient Amazon.

big shoutout to my uncle buying me the physical copy of EU3: Complete after JerusalemLP knocked me on my rear end with how games could replicate history

Yaoi Gagarin
Feb 20, 2014

I pirated hoi2 as a child, but I've bought every game since then so hopefully Johann will forgive me :ohdear:

Edgar Allen Ho
Apr 3, 2017

by sebmojo
I may have posted this guy before but I love posting him



Who else still has this dumb bust from the worst paradox game?

e: please don't judge the cat hair

Fuligin
Oct 27, 2010

wait what the fuck??

wiz's hohenzollern lp is what made me finally shell out for an account here

Complications
Jun 19, 2014

Edgar Allen Ho posted:

I may have posted this guy before but I love posting him



Who else still has this dumb bust from the worst paradox game?

e: please don't judge the cat hair

If you post a picture of the cat we will not judge the byproduct of cat because we'll be too busy cooing about the cute kitty

Kangxi
Nov 12, 2016

"Too paranoid for you?"
"Not me, paranoia's the garlic in life's kitchen, right, you can never have too much."

Fuligin posted:

wiz's hohenzollern lp is what made me finally shell out for an account here

I lurked for hohenzollern LP and andalus LP, and joined around the time I signed up to work on the byzlp conversion. and now some people have signed up to read mine. the cycle of lps. I'll bet we still have people here from the first Jerusalem LP


Edgar Allen Ho posted:

I may have posted this guy before but I love posting him



Who else still has this dumb bust from the worst paradox game?

e: please don't judge the cat hair

you have nothing to apologize for. please post the cat if you can

Edgar Allen Ho
Apr 3, 2017

by sebmojo

there are two others but this is the current heir.

idhrendur
Aug 20, 2016

Fuligin posted:

wiz's hohenzollern lp is what made me finally shell out for an account here


Kangxi posted:

I lurked for hohenzollern LP and andalus LP, and joined around the time I signed up to work on the byzlp conversion. and now some people have signed up to read mine. the cycle of lps. I'll bet we still have people here from the first Jerusalem LP

I caught hohenzollern and jerusalem on the archives, lurked for Goths, and joined for byzlp.

The old ones are what got me motivated to work on automated converters, at least. I wanted to be able to do the same and thought making the computer do the work would be less effort. Which is true if you consider how many people have used them. It's not so true personally.

idhrendur fucked around with this message at 08:07 on Sep 20, 2020

Morrow
Oct 31, 2010
I'm still waiting for the return of the AzeriLP.

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Gaius Marius
Oct 9, 2012

I can't believe no ones out here repping the Texas lp. And the absolute cluster gently caress/ pure art that was the crete lp.

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