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bolind posted:A local 28 year old guy got caught by a speed trap (camera van.) That upset him so much that he went home, took off his license plates, replaced them with a sign that said “gently caress POLICE” (sic) and proceeded to speed past the van an additional four times, at around double the posted limit. Seems like something a competent lawyer could have worked on. I'm guessing it wasn't worth it? Unless there's something unique like bumper stickers, aftermarket parts or body damage, or you ID the driver, how are you going to distinguish one Kia Forte from another if the plates don't exist and you don't ID the driver? A red light camera ALLEGEDLY popped me rolling a right-turn-on-red at like 2mph. $100 for something anybody else on the road would do, especially with zero cross traffic and 100% visibility. The only identifying info the picture/video gave was a dark car-sized amorphous blob with two tail lights and the text "COOLGUY" (not my plate #) showing in the license plate area. There was no color, no issuing state legible or visible, no reg sticker detail... but since the text of the plate got a hit from the State of Illinois registration database, the ticket comes to me. Now, "COOLGUY" is a vanity plate you can expect a lot of people would have. I know of at least 3 other people with the same plate # as mine, and they're in different states. So, it follows that if anybody else with that plate # runs a red light in the State of Illinois, the ticket would come to me. Barring any identification that points to the vehicle shown being MY vehicle and not someone else's, that isn't right! $100 is worth fighting once with that defense, but not worth taking any further or hiring a lawyer over. There were a dozen other people in line behind me waiting for their hearing, and I'm sure we represented a fraction of a percent of the people who got popped there that particular week. The city has gotta be raking in a cool million a year over that red light camera, I've thought several times about going back there with a ladder, vest & hard hat to go up and install a trash bag over it. Or doing what this guy did, except getting a rental & rolling the light over and over with spoofed plates belonging to some city official.
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Sep 21, 2020 17:53
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I forgot to mention that on every picture he was flipping a double bird to the camera. The pics here are usually decentish enough to ID the driver.
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Sep 21, 2020 18:17
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One thing I really can't stand about photo radar vans is when they repeatedly park in the same place over and over again. Just install a fixed camera if that specific spot requires such frequent enforcement.
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Sep 21, 2020 18:33
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We had a guy locally get busted by photo radar... only to come back later with his rifle and shoot the drat thing up to try to destroy the evidence. He didn't destroy any evidence (on the contrary, it helped convict him) but he did manage to hit a passing vehicle and drat near a kid who was a passenger in another vehicle  Way to go from basically a nothing offense to spending a few years in jail. slidebite fucked around with this message at 20:01 on Sep 21, 2020 |
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Sep 21, 2020 19:58
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The cameras around me have all been removed. A guy ran for mayor on getting them removed and he won. Also they were hurting small business, I guess. https://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/orange-county/os-apopka-to-stop-use-of-red-light-cameras-20180816-story.html
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Sep 21, 2020 20:23
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They installed one in Manchester NH which lasted about a week until it was pointed out there is a law in New Hampshire saying you cannot automated law enforcement or something to that degree.
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Sep 21, 2020 20:37
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NoWake posted:A red light camera ALLEGEDLY popped me rolling a right-turn-on-red at like 2mph. Hey, at least you had the option. I got nabbed for exactly the same thing a few years ago, but what I got in the mail was quite explicit that it was NOT a ticket. It was just a bill for $100. And bills don't come with the option of arguing them in traffic court. So there was no moving violation or anything, but this particular bill, if unpaid, would still cause your license to be suspended by the DMV. It's a lovely little arrangement for them. They don't get to hand out moving violations, but who cares about that? This way, it's just money directly into the town coffers, under threat of legal consequences but with no way for their victims to legally defend themselves in court against those consequences. I'm not upset about the hundred bucks -- they did, after all, catch me fair and square doing a rolling stop, with video and everything. But I'm decidedly irked that this town's government has thrown away even the appearance of law or justice or being anything other than a shakedown racket.
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Sep 21, 2020 23:59
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A bill instead of a ticket... that is a pretty nice racket.
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Sep 22, 2020 00:11
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Texas does a similar thing, but they'll put a block on being able to renew the registration for your car. It's a particularly lovely scheme.
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Sep 22, 2020 00:25
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one weird trick to avoid red light tickets: just loving stop at red lights and stop signs
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Sep 22, 2020 05:25
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Goddammit https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Jmpo_QgAuY For the record, I knew the crosswalk and cross street was empty. If it wasn't for the train stopping on coming traffic, leaving the cross street empty, I'd have gone into her.
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Sep 22, 2020 05:25
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Tex Avery posted:Texas does a similar thing, but they'll put a block on being able to renew the registration for your car. It's a particularly lovely scheme. They do that here, and it's not a moving violation, but you still have the option to contest it in court. So, for example, you couldn't say "I wasn't driving," since the ticket is given to the registered owner of the vehicle, but you could make the claim that it's not actually your car if it's not.
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Sep 22, 2020 05:26
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BraveUlysses posted:one weird trick to avoid red light tickets: just loving stop at red lights and stop signs Though are rolling stops even dangerous at 5mph or 3mph? A stop/speed camera shouldn't be set too sensitive.
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Sep 22, 2020 06:32
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Dylan16807 posted:For red lights, that depends on the yellow being long enough. If it is, then sure. Rolling rights are quite dangerous for peds and cyclists. For example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=piWmcIB5vwI
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Sep 22, 2020 06:49
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Dylan16807 posted:For red lights, that depends on the yellow being long enough. If it is, then sure. im not suggesting that we have more cameras, i just want people to loving stop at stop signs and red lights. you're not that important or too busy to just loving do it.
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Sep 22, 2020 16:19
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Dylan16807 posted:For red lights, that depends on the yellow being long enough. If it is, then sure. Short yellows have been pretty conclusively shown to increase accident rates. Their only purpose is to get more people to run the red lights, even when traveling at the posted speed limit, unless they want to full-on emergency brake, risking being rear-ended. Conversely, longer yellows and longer all red overlaps universally improve safety for all traffic in an intersection. The fact that yellow lights are still regularly configured super short is a travesty. Signage and lights are for safety, not profit generation.
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Sep 22, 2020 16:33
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Never don't stop at stop signs, after all, more opportunities to do a launch!
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Sep 22, 2020 16:36
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Honestly a full stop versus a "safe" rolling stop takes at most 2 seconds, you're never too busy to just do it properly.
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Sep 22, 2020 17:27
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BraveUlysses posted:im not suggesting that we have more cameras, i just want people to loving stop at stop signs and red lights. you're not that important or too busy to just loving do it. And I want there to be fewer stop signs and red lights. For chrissakes the vast majority of four-way stops could be replaced with two signs saying YIELD and two signs not being there at all. Or roundabouts, roundabouts are good. KozmoNaut posted:Signage and lights are for safety, not profit generation. Ditto speed limits.
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Sep 22, 2020 20:02
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As much as I would love too, I don't have nearly enough faith in the average North American drivers ability.
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Sep 22, 2020 20:25
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Phanatic posted:Ditto speed limits. Here in southern Germany, a lot of small towns have 30kph limits, either permanently or at night only. With how bendy and tight the roads are in some of them, there's definitely a safety angle, but I figure the majority of them are because of noise reduction. So generally safety, but there can be other factors weighing in on the selection of speed limits as well. It is a little bit odd coming straight from a 100kph main road into a 30kph town, I have to admit. But since the money from speeding tickets don't go directly into the town's coffers like they do in the US, I don't really see them as nefarious traps, but more of a "small town inhabitants dislike the noise from people racing down their main street" factor. In general, the speed limits are very sensible, the majority of main roads are 100kph national speed limit, and people generally choose anywhere from 80-100kph as a speed they're comfortable with, which works out. Of course, some people insist on going 120kph, but I think a certain amount of speeding is always going to happen, no matter what. And oh boy the Autobahn. I honestly wish they would just cap it at 130kph or something, because there is often an absolutely absurd speed differential, and it does lead to some very tense situations and emergency braking. But that's a whole different kettle of bratwurst. KozmoNaut fucked around with this message at 20:57 on Sep 22, 2020 |
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Sep 22, 2020 20:55
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KozmoNaut posted:Here in southern Germany, a lot of small towns have 30kph limits, either permanently or at night only. With how bendy and tight the roads are in some of them, In southern (at least) England those same roads are like 50mph and it is glorious. It's so nice to be going every bit as fast as you want down a road and be in compliance with the law because the speed limit was set rationally.
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Sep 22, 2020 21:15
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Phanatic posted:In southern (at least) England those same roads are like 50mph and it is glorious. It's so nice to be going every bit as fast as you want down a road and be in compliance with the law because the speed limit was set rationally. I am talking about the streets in towns. If you go 50mph down those, please stop. E: Also "able to go as fast as I want" != "rational".
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Sep 22, 2020 21:32
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Phanatic posted:In southern (at least) England those same roads are like 50mph and it is glorious. It's so nice to be going every bit as fast as you want down a road and be in compliance with the law because the speed limit was set rationally. A couple years ago my wife and I did the Northcoast 500 in Scotland and it is the first time I think I ever slowed to below the speed limit for some corners just because it was a little too fast for me for being unfamiliar with the road, and driving on the other side of the car, on the other side of the road for the first time. I found it quite enjoyable and really glad the renal car lady convinced us to go with the VW Golf over the Fiat 500 we'd originally booked.
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Sep 22, 2020 21:44
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KozmoNaut posted:E: Also "able to go as fast as I want" != "rational". e: And as far as 'speed trap towns' are concerned: You can't have a road marked for 50mph & that naturally encourages people to go 50mph, then suddenly drop the limit to 25mph with no change in how the road is set up and act surprised that people still naturally want to go 50 instead of 25. Either accept that the through road is going to have faster traffic(and have the speed limit set accordingly) or invest the time and money into changing the part that goes through town so people naturally slow down there. Refusing to do either is what gives people the impression that it's a trap to make money. (I get that these aren't the road setups you're talking about where you're at, but this is what most people are complaining about in this context) Haifisch fucked around with this message at 22:41 on Sep 22, 2020 |
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Sep 22, 2020 22:27
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KozmoNaut posted:I am talking about the streets in towns. If you go 50mph down those, please stop. I was going 50 down roads with a speed limit of 50. I didn’t mean the streets in town, I was talking about the twisty country roads in rural England. quote:E: Also "able to go as fast as I want" != "rational". You’re misunderstanding me, and I didn’t say “able to go as fast as I want.” My point is that if you’re a competent driver, and you’re going as fast as you feel is safe for a road, *and* you aren’t speeding when you do it, then that’s a good sign because it means the speed limit was set appropriately for that road and not artificially low so it can be a revenue source.
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Sep 22, 2020 22:45
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Haifisch posted:A rational speed limit is set at the speed the road naturally makes motorists want to go. Designing roads to make people go certain speeds is an actual thing, and a lot of too-low speed limits are the result of people wanting roads that encourage everyone to go fast(because they feel nicer to drive on than roads that naturally encourage people to drive slower and more cautiously) but wanting people to drive slower. This veers dangerously close to "A = A" argumentation. There are a lot of roads where the speed limit is set lower than would immediately appear applicable or "rational" at first glance. For instance, there may be treacherous lines of sight, intersections with less than optimal geometry, nearby forests and historical animal tracks/crossings, there are plenty of reasons that may not be immediately obvious to the common driver, and which do not necessitate artificially reducing the comfort or apparent niceness of the road in order to reduce speeds. Most countries have blanket default speeds for certain types of roads, regardless of the fact that those roads may be vastly different in curvature, road surface standard and general markings/signage. Compare and contrast a nice and wide 60mph national speed limit road in the middle of England to a barely two lane road with the exact same 60mph national speed limit way up in the Scottish highlands. Which one of those was set "rationally"? Speed limits are not simply set by whichever speed the average driver thinks is appropriate or wants to be appropriate. There are a long list of considerations taken into account, which may not be obvious, but that does not invalidate them. Like it or not, the limit is the limit. If you want to go faster, go to a track or somewhere with a higher speed limit. Lack of self control is not an excuse. KozmoNaut fucked around with this message at 23:29 on Sep 22, 2020 |
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Sep 22, 2020 23:17
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Phanatic posted:I was going 50 down roads with a speed limit of 50. I didn’t mean the streets in town, I was talking about the twisty country roads in rural England. Which is something completely different from what I was talking about in the post you quoted. Phanatic posted:You’re misunderstanding me, and I didn’t say “able to go as fast as I want.” My point is that if you’re a competent driver, and you’re going as fast as you feel is safe for a road, *and* you aren’t speeding when you do it, then that’s a good sign because it means the speed limit was set appropriately for that road and not artificially low so it can be a revenue source. 95% of drivers consider themselves above average in competence.
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Sep 22, 2020 23:20
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KozmoNaut posted:Like it or not, the limit is the limit. If you want to go faster, go to a track or somewhere with a higher speed limit. Lack of self control is not an excuse. So if I'm on the most boring freeway in the world, the 5 in Central California, where it's straight and flat as far as the eye can see, I should not go faster than 65? And plenty of modern towns have roads with 55mph limits in them, I just got back from a week in one (Carlsbad) and it gave me the worst gas mileage my SUV has seen (speed up to 55mph, then hit a red light and wait for minutes, rinse and repeat).
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Sep 22, 2020 23:34
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MomJeans420 posted:So if I'm on the most boring freeway in the world, the 5 in Central California, where it's straight and flat as far as the eye can see, I should not go faster than 65? Unless you have the power to somehow change traffic laws on-the-fly, then yeah. Maybe that's "boring", but you can't always get what you want. Lobby to have it raised if you want it raised, but the primary purpose of public roads is to get you from A to B, not to get your blood pumping.
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Sep 22, 2020 23:40
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You haven't explained why I should follow traffic laws. Do you think legality and morality are the same thing? If I was gay and lived in Texas should I have avoided having sex in the early 2000s?
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Sep 22, 2020 23:56
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Yesterday we had the first heavy rain for a while after some lovely spring weather but only a few drivers seemed to notice it, tailgating and risky merges at the speed limit with their lights off just like a regular commute. There were a few spots with hastily-erected roadwork-style speed limits slowing gradually down from ~65 mph to ~25 that again most people ignored because they couldn't see any actual roadwork; the petty part of me hopes some of them damaged their cars on the massive new potholes the signs were warning about.MomJeans420 posted:You haven't explained why I should follow traffic laws. Do you think legality and morality are the same thing? If I was gay and lived in Texas should I have avoided having sex in the early 2000s? That is a really dumb comparison and nobody here is obligated to explain why you should obey traffic laws. Sounds like you have a bit of a lead foot though, have you tried not accelerating when approaching a long red light?
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Sep 23, 2020 00:48
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uvar posted:That is a really dumb comparison and nobody here is obligated to explain why you should obey traffic laws. Sounds like you have a bit of a lead foot though, have you tried not accelerating when approaching a long red light? So you're saying you don't have a good explanation for why one should do 65mph on an empty freeway with no one around other than the fact that some bureaucrat said 65mph makes as much sense there as it does on a crowded freeway in the middle of a city? By the way it's literally impossible to follow every law written in the US, so how are you choosing which ones to obey and which ones to ignore? Also, please tell me the correct way to drive between these two lights. I haven't quite reached the ability to see red lights around the corner from almost a mile away. 
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Sep 23, 2020 00:55
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nm posted:Rolling rights are quite dangerous for peds and cyclists.
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Sep 23, 2020 01:20
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KozmoNaut posted:There are a lot of roads where the speed limit is set lower than would immediately appear applicable or "rational" at first glance. For instance, there may be treacherous lines of sight, intersections with less than optimal geometry, nearby forests and historical animal tracks/crossings, there are plenty of reasons that may not be immediately obvious to the common driver, and which do not necessitate artificially reducing the comfort or apparent niceness of the road in order to reduce speeds. Sure it does. People pay some attention to speed limit signs but if you actually prioritize safety you should adjust the road in those areas.
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Sep 23, 2020 01:24
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Just so you know, this is getting exhausting. You probably want to back away from the keyboard for today.
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Sep 23, 2020 02:30
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KozmoNaut posted:There are a lot of roads where the speed limit is set lower than would immediately appear applicable or "rational" at first glance. For instance, there may be treacherous lines of sight, intersections with less than optimal geometry, nearby forests and historical animal tracks/crossings, there are plenty of reasons that may not be immediately obvious to the common driver, and which do not necessitate artificially reducing the comfort or apparent niceness of the road in order to reduce speeds. It's not artificially reducing anything, it's correcting the fact that the existing road design artificially increases driver confidence beyond the desired level. I have never been able to understand how it's so controversial that the natural speed of the road should match the desired speed.
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Sep 23, 2020 02:38
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KozmoNaut posted:95% of drivers consider themselves above average in competence. And if they feel going at the posted speed limit on a road is beyond their capabilities, then they should re-evaluate this. *Especially* in areas where the posted limit is below the 85th percentile speed. KozmoNaut posted:Like it or not, the limit is the limit. If you want to go faster, go to a track or somewhere with a higher speed limit. Lack of self control is not an excuse. No. I am neither a robot nor a trained monkey and I will violate laws when it is appropriate (and yes, safety is a factor in appropriateness) to do so. I have even, in the past, smoked marijuana, and even had a drink before I turned 21. Phanatic fucked around with this message at 02:58 on Sep 23, 2020 |
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Sep 23, 2020 02:40
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Phanatic posted:So, this is my first experience in a vehicle that wants to turn me into one of those people I share a road with. Awful Mitsubishi crossover rental, the DRLs are bright enough that when you get in and it's twilight or cloudy you really think your headlights are on. And of course they're not, and of course that means your taillights aren't on either, but it's very easy to believe they are. I feel like I must have driven the same thing a little while ago. Did a few hours at dusk and full dark on the highway before I realized what was going on.
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Sep 23, 2020 02:41
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wolrah posted:The whole point is to match appearance to reality. If the road feels like you should go faster, people are going to do it. That's just human nature, you have to work with it, not against it. Haifisch posted:A rational speed limit is set at the speed the road naturally makes motorists want to go. Designing roads to make people go certain speeds is an actual thing, and a lot of too-low speed limits are the result of people wanting roads that encourage everyone to go fast(because they feel nicer to drive on than roads that naturally encourage people to drive slower and more cautiously) but wanting people to drive slower. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ra_0DgnJ1uQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q57sa7tjSNk
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Sep 23, 2020 02:51
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