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Taear posted:I wish lovely peasant factions were a separate tab from actual factions that matter, it's really frustrating to discover one of these ten ones is something actually bad that's going to gently caress me and it's too late to do anything about it I'm not sure this is the game for you, really. Empires changed hands between dynasties fairly regularly in this timeframe. Between this and you never wanting to lose a title in succession, it seems like you'd be much happier playing Europa Universalis 4, where there's technically a king somewhere in there but you're really just doing map-painting as some sort of immortal country-spirit. 
Gort fucked around with this message at 16:12 on Oct 1, 2020 |
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Oct 1, 2020 16:08
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Taear posted:I wish lovely peasant factions were a separate tab from actual factions that matter, it's really frustrating to discover one of these ten ones is something actually bad that's going to gently caress me and it's too late to do anything about it The populist rebellions need a rework. First - their relative strength is extremely overrated. Second - they happen way too often. I'm in an MP game where me and another goon started as Catholic counts on the Iberian peninsula in 1066. I think I started as a Galacian Count, and the other goon started as a Castilian count. Eventually, we established Portugal and worked our way to the Empire of Hispania. But this means in the process we had to push out the Muslim rulers leaving behind a significant Muslim population. Which means revolts. The entire southern portion of Iberia revolts every ~1.5 years. Their relative strength is always predicted to be about 20% stronger than me and I receive messages about how dangerous this faction is, but I crush them easily. Then, I'll execute the leader. But the moment the war officially ends: "A faction has been created against you: Andalusian Muwawaldi Populists" and it fills up immediately. Just after I slaughtered ~10k men and burned their leader at the stake. At this point I have personally wiped out several generations of fighting age muslim peasants and executed dozens of would be popular leaders but they still. keep. revolting. Even being 100 dread doesn't prevent them from doing something. Either they need to stop overestimating their strength, or there need to be some other kind of mechanic where these guys lose hope or something. It's really irritating. You know, I expect that taking over an area that has a hostile religion and a different culture is going to be a pain in the rear end. I anticipate rebellions because it takes a long loving time to convert culture/religion. But this is absurd.
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Oct 1, 2020 16:21
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I appreciate that Paradox got the 1.1.2 hotfixes out quickly. The claim/revoke thing was annoying the heck out of me, and I know a lot of people play the marriage game for claims so that was also a pretty big issue (I wasn't in my current game, but I remember doing it in CK2 during the Charlemagne start as the Byzantines to get a quick claim on Italy and jumpstart Roman restoration).
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Oct 1, 2020 16:26
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that's where the Control mechanic is supposed to come in, but it also snowballs - sustained high control makes it harder to dip, but rebellious counties revolting will lead to even lower Control
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Oct 1, 2020 16:27
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Broken Cog posted:Man, neighbouring tribal rulers can be kinda spooky now that they actually build stuff. In my game, Mongolia conquered all the way to the borders of the Byzantine Empire by like 930. Tribal AIs are definitely working now.
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Oct 1, 2020 16:30
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It's probably that the "peasant revolt crushed" modifier just isn't powerful enough. It should be like in EU4 where you're safe for at least a decade following a revolt.
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Oct 1, 2020 16:30
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The Little Kielbasa posted:Did Rise From the Ashes and was surprised to find that I lost the automatic primogeniture feature Byz starts with and got kicked all the way back to confederate partition after forming the Roman Empire. If you wait until you get the primogeneture law, post 1200, you won't drop to confederate on forming Rome. Feels like a bug right now though, given Byz already IS the Roman Empire.
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Oct 1, 2020 16:34
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Ice Fist posted:
Bro maybe u should consider pulling out of Afghanistan and Iraq
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Oct 1, 2020 16:36
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Fintilgin posted:Feels like a bug right now though, given Byz already IS the Roman Empire. Yeah sure buddy, I say as I click the Dismantle the Greek Pretenders decision
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Oct 1, 2020 17:04
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I'm the queen of Scotland, Ireland and Burgundy. I'm married to someone of the Byzantine Empire and I'm thinking about swearing fealty to them. It'd give me a really powerful ally and I could just poo poo all over everyone I think? However, I'm not sure I'll ever be able to become emperor myself. Seeing I have a different culture, religion, am a woman etc. Playing iron man so I can't just savescum to see how it'd go. Any thoughts?
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Oct 1, 2020 17:09
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What’s a use case for ultimogeniture? Why is that appealing?
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Oct 1, 2020 17:13
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Trevor Hale posted:What’s a use case for ultimogeniture? Why is that appealing? (statistically) longer reigns at the expense of less-experienced new rulers coming into power
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Oct 1, 2020 17:15
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Trevor Hale posted:What’s a use case for ultimogeniture? Why is that appealing? You have more time for direct control over how the ruler develops instead of having to play someone who's been under the control of the AI for 30 years so he already has a dozen affairs and a fistful of secrets that vassals will abuse for hooks.
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Oct 1, 2020 17:19
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Hmm, can't decide if I want to break from HRE and go under Byzantine to usurp that empire to attempt to get primogeniture early. Does pressing a claim (from the meritocracy plot) result in keeping primogeniture? What about pressing it via faction? Actually should go and experiment with that in non-ironman
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Oct 1, 2020 17:19
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shut up blegum posted:I'm the queen of Scotland, Ireland and Burgundy. I'm married to someone of the Byzantine Empire and I'm thinking about swearing fealty to them. It'd give me a really powerful ally and I could just poo poo all over everyone I think? However, I'm not sure I'll ever be able to become emperor myself. Seeing I have a different culture, religion, am a woman etc. Being a vassal is a great way to either destroy an empire from the inside out or potentially usurp it with that one stewardship perk. You will be limited to king rank so if you want to be emperor you will eventually have to go independent or steal your liege's title.
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Oct 1, 2020 17:21
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OctaMurk posted:Bro maybe u should consider pulling out of Afghanistan and Iraq 
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Oct 1, 2020 17:23
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Excelzior posted:(statistically) longer reigns at the expense of less-experienced new rulers coming into power Magil Zeal posted:You have more time for direct control over how the ruler develops instead of having to play someone who's been under the control of the AI for 30 years so he already has a dozen affairs and a fistful of secrets that vassals will abuse for hooks. Ah that makes sense. I do think the most fun I’ve had has been taking over as a child after my player unexpectedly dies.
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Oct 1, 2020 17:23
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Can you found more than one university if you own enough sites
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Oct 1, 2020 17:24
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Trevor Hale posted:What’s a use case for ultimogeniture? Why is that appealing? Marry someone too old for kids, seduce all the ladies to produce zounds bastards, pick the nicest one and legitimize it. If a newer, shinier bastard shows up later, legitimize that one instead.
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Oct 1, 2020 17:28
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CharlieFoxtrot posted:Can you found more than one university if you own enough sites yes it's trivial as england (oxford and cambridge)
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Oct 1, 2020 17:33
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buglord posted:Besides Bohemia, what are some good tall countries in 867? Also some nice vassal starts? I tired playing as a vassal in the UK and got gobbled up by my neighbor who had 100 extra soldiers than me. Pretty much anywhere you see a lot of farmland baronies (there is a terrain map mode under additional, easy to miss). Paris, London and Cologne in Europe all have good concentrations, and you can use any of those to be strong and small. That said it's weird af that the Po valley is devoid of farmland baronies. PittTheElder fucked around with this message at 17:36 on Oct 1, 2020 |
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Oct 1, 2020 17:33
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Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
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freebooter posted:I've jumped straight into this with zero experience of any of the past games and I'm completely at sea, but one irritating thing that I've tried googling and can't find an answer to: why am I losing prestige? I'm getting -0.1 every month. Assuming you haven't changed any of the control settings, hover over your prestige gain in the top right until the window locks in place. Then you can hover over the modifiers and see what they're coming from, and why.
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Oct 1, 2020 17:46
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Gort posted:It's probably that the "peasant revolt crushed" modifier just isn't powerful enough. It should be like in EU4 where you're safe for at least a decade following a revolt. This is specifically the reason, I would say. The Locals Pacified modifier you get for winning a peasant revolt is +20 public opinion for 10 years. Holding a county of the wrong religion and culture gives a base -60 PO until either is converted. This means that that county will literally always be in a populist faction, even immediately after a populist revolt is crushed, and with enough strength (ie, holding enough such provinces) that revolt will fire again immediately. There's a mod on the workshop that raises the modifier to +60 for 20 years, which IMO is a bit TOO powerful because: OctaMurk posted:Bro maybe u should consider pulling out of Afghanistan and Iraq Frequent peasant revolts are bad because they're boring walkovers, IMO the fix is to make them Not Boring Walkovers - ie, tweak the relative strength calculation and/or the actual armies they generate so that when they happen they are actually a threat. (same for vassal revolts, arguably).
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Oct 1, 2020 17:48
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Speaking of peasant rebellions, I discovered the reason the Norse vassals get a ton of those, even in home counties with matching culture/religion, is that they get an increasing "At peace" negative public opinion modifier due to their religious tenets. This can be prevented by raiding, or declaring war on someone, but vassals in the 867 start often don't have enough troops to do that, and so get constant peasant rebellions that often kill off random members of the vassals family (since peasant rebellions don't take prisoners, they just flat out kill them if they capture someone during a siege). I'm not sure if this is supposed to be intended, but it is pretty annoying when you keep losing dynasty members to these rebellions, since you don't even get a warning when they trigger. Broken Cog fucked around with this message at 18:08 on Oct 1, 2020 |
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Oct 1, 2020 17:55
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My guess is it’s another symptom of the wonky estimation of strength. They should start building up to a revolt as soon as one is crushed... but they should wait until they actually pose a threat, instead of revolting with 800 guys spread between three provinces and getting instantly massacred.
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Oct 1, 2020 17:57
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Dallan Invictus posted:This is specifically the reason, I would say. The Locals Pacified modifier you get for winning a peasant revolt is +20 public opinion for 10 years. Holding a county of the wrong religion and culture gives a base -60 PO until either is converted. This means that that county will literally always be in a populist faction, even immediately after a populist revolt is crushed, and with enough strength (ie, holding enough such provinces) that revolt will fire again immediately. I don't think just making the yearly revolts super strong is the way I'd like to deal with the problem of the revolts being yearly.
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Oct 1, 2020 17:59
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yikes! posted:I don't think just making the yearly revolts super strong is the way I'd like to deal with the problem of the revolts being yearly. there should be decisions you can take to appease the local population at the cost of slowing down their cultural/religious conversion and granting you considerably less taxes/levies/etc the average peasant did not give a flying gently caress who his lord actually was until he came by to collect
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Oct 1, 2020 18:02
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yikes! posted:I don't think just making the yearly revolts super strong is the way I'd like to deal with the problem of the revolts being yearly. Yeah, the solution to "peasant revolts are incredibly annoying because the way they're coded they will literally pop every year" isn't "let's make them lethal in addition to annoying!".
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Oct 1, 2020 18:13
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I at least meant they should be stronger but also less frequent. They happen so often because they overestimate their strength and thus gain whatever the “readiness to revolt” stat is called super fast.
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Oct 1, 2020 18:18
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They should certainly have a limit on how strong they have to be before they pop, just like all the other revolts. I wonder if the limit should be based on your kingdom's average development, representing the ability for the local forces to put it down on their own. It would also mean if you capture lots of low development territory very rapidly you're more likely to have issues than if you grow more slowly.
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Oct 1, 2020 18:23
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peasant revolts are the games overexpansion punishment mechanism and have been in ever crusader kings game. convert the province to your culture/religion or give them independence
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Oct 1, 2020 18:23
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yikes! posted:I don't think just making the yearly revolts super strong is the way I'd like to deal with the problem of the revolts being yearly. They're yearly for three reasons: 1) the local populace's cultural and religious practices and the county holder's don't tolerate each other, 2) they fire before they're actually strong enough to be a threat, 3) pacifying them via force isn't effective enough, so goto 1 1 is Working As Intended, fixing the threat calculation in 2 will make them happen less often and also make them more interesting when they do happen, 3 is arguably a Perceptive Commentary on Social Issues (but I do think the modifier should be stronger, just not strong enough to entirely negate 1). Also: Excelzior posted:there should be decisions you can take to appease the local population at the cost of slowing down their cultural/religious conversion and granting you considerably less taxes/levies/etc Hard agree. My point is not "make them lethal" it's "make them interesting", whether that means a military challenge, or some other kind of challenge, or merely an actual grand-strategic consideration you have to make when deciding whether to expand, as opposed to what they are now, which is "anti-snowballing mechanism that operates mainly via tedium". PittTheElder posted:Yeah this is what to do. The peasant rebellions are so weak that they're a non-factor (at least to the player, the AI doesn't seem to understand how weak they are and won't fight them even when they could defeat them) Actual Peasant Rebellions are relevant enough to the setting that I wouldn't want them removed, but the reason I even mentioned the idea of giving them bigger armies is basically this - they're so weak that they're a boring nonfactor, and because of the way the combat system works this time around it may well be that they actually need bigger numbers to actually be relevant vs. noble armies that include MaA. Whether those numbers come from "wait until the revolt faction is stronger before firing" or "revolt faction strength needs to translate into more pitchforks and torches than it currently does" is an open question, it may actually need to be both. quote:and it would be much better to just make culture/religion mismatch a penalty to barony productivity, possibly in the form of a control ceiling. If you want the most out of that land, convert it, convert yourself, or put a local in charge. Coulda sworn this part already happens honestly, but if it doesn't it should. Dallan Invictus fucked around with this message at 18:43 on Oct 1, 2020 |
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Oct 1, 2020 18:24
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Excelzior posted:there should be decisions you can take to appease the local population at the cost of slowing down their cultural/religious conversion and granting you considerably less taxes/levies/etc Yeah this is what to do. The peasant rebellions are so weak that they're a non-factor (at least to the player, the AI doesn't seem to understand how weak they are and won't fight them even when they could defeat them), and it would be much better to just make culture/religion mismatch a penalty to barony productivity, possibly in the form of a control ceiling. If you want the most out of that land, convert it, convert yourself, or put a local in charge.
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Oct 1, 2020 18:34
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I like proper peasant revolts, not just income penalties, but to be realistic a) they should be rarer and b) you should not be able to recruit the leader into your army, convenient as that is.
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Oct 1, 2020 18:39
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If you are being plagued by constant rebellions, consider taking the +50 public opinion skill. That pretty much nixed all my rebellions caused by constant offensive warfare.
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Oct 1, 2020 18:53
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How do you get access to people with multiple good inheritable traits? I just married my son to his cousin because at this point, only my house is producing quality kids. It's hard enough finding someone who is just quick or pretty to marry. I saw a genius once and married him to my beautiful sister, that's how we got the quality cousins. Geniuses are mostly not around and literally no one has multiple good traits. I'm trying to avoid inbreeding as it feels super gamey.
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Oct 1, 2020 19:02
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A God drat Ghost posted:How do you get access to people with multiple good inheritable traits? I just married my son to his cousin because at this point, only my house is producing quality kids. It's hard enough finding someone who is just quick or pretty to marry. I saw a genius once and married him to my beautiful sister, that's how we got the quality cousins. Geniuses are mostly not around and literally no one has multiple good traits. I'm trying to avoid inbreeding as it feels super gamey. I arrange the Find Spouse window by Sum of All Skills and then just go down the list until I find someone worthwhile.
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Oct 1, 2020 19:08
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Oh wow, they removed the unnecessary 'accepted the ransom offer screen'. Such an improvement.
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Oct 1, 2020 19:09
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Magil Zeal posted:Better yet, you can set it so that the middle mouse button locks tooltips in place. That's my preferred setting anyway. I've started automatically trying this in other games and then getting irrationally angry when it doesn't work. Hell, not even other games; it's happening in work applications now.
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Oct 1, 2020 19:12
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A God drat Ghost posted:How do you get access to people with multiple good inheritable traits? I just married my son to his cousin because at this point, only my house is producing quality kids. It's hard enough finding someone who is just quick or pretty to marry. I saw a genius once and married him to my beautiful sister, that's how we got the quality cousins. Geniuses are mostly not around and literally no one has multiple good traits. I'm trying to avoid inbreeding as it feels super gamey. Blimpkin posted:I arrange the Find Spouse window by Sum of All Skills and then just go down the list until I find someone worthwhile. You can also just filter the marriage options by traits, just enter the trait into the search bar and choose it when it pops up on the menu. Edit, or just use the manual search function for anyone nearby in general with the traits you want, even if they don't want to marry. If they don't to want to join your court, just befriend them, and they should usually be willing to come over. Once they are in your court you can marry them to whomever you want.
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Oct 1, 2020 19:13
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