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Those machines though, you just put in a coin and turned a knob. There was no competitive element. You got a prize out of it but you just felt a bit empty :/
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Oct 17, 2020 20:21
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https://twitter.com/joe_armitage/status/1317539444694618115 What more can we do to drive down demand for tests and takeup of the app? I know, automatically report people to the police if they do either!
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Oct 17, 2020 20:29
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Jedit posted:We are no longer looking at Yellowhammer. That was the expected scenario, rebranded by the Tories as the worst case scenario after it leaked. The worst case scenario of No Deal with no preparation, which is the scenario we are in, is much worse, and even their projected case for that has been exceeded due to COVID-19. You should expect anywhere between 300,000 and 1 million excess deaths in 2021. Ugh. No, not this depressing reality stuff (I realize it's really bad  ). I want stuff like that the Duke of Marmalade won't have cucumber marmalade (made in Alsace by fragrant monks) for his marmalade jamboree and will lose title to the Marmashire as per the treaty of Toastington.happyhippy posted:Have another just read about. Qualifications. Beyond transport, how common is this? I could imagine this being an issue for medical staff, but I don't know how common it is for UK workers to work or live (not retire) in the EU. I dimly recall that they worked something out for airlines, right?
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Oct 17, 2020 20:32
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crispix posted:I refuse to get married until I find a partner who will be happy to wear his and his big multicoloured plastic rings with whistles on like you used to get from those machines outside Happy Shoppers https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uboKn-Lm5cA
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Oct 17, 2020 20:37
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crispix posted:I refuse to get married until I find a partner who will be happy to wear his and his big multicoloured plastic rings with whistles on like you used to get from those machines outside Happy Shoppers Jaysus, you need to lower your standards a bit! We all can't have trophy partners like this now.
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Oct 17, 2020 20:39
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jabby posted:https://twitter.com/joe_armitage/status/1317539444694618115 If you want to go all China-style authoritarian then at least do it right and make people get tested or be fined so there's no way out. It's still going to work better than whatever shitshow they have going on now.
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Oct 17, 2020 20:45
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Nostalgic Cashew posted:Beyond transport, how common is this? I could imagine this being an issue for medical staff, but I don't know how common it is for UK workers to work or live (not retire) in the EU. I dimly recall that they worked something out for airlines, right? It probably wont affect much, as its 'in theory'. Depends on how pissy the country wants to be really to protect their own job sector against the UK. The airlines is still being worked out at the moment, googled the news and there are a few 'UK flights may be grounded with no deal' scare stories with no substance. I can see that being worked out, as its important for both UK/EU. Flight paths and times may be reworked though.
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Oct 17, 2020 20:50
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jabby posted:This... just... what? Externalities? In my market  ? I think you'll find that if they had simply ignored these and opened themselves up to the same risks as us... and internalised them.... then... their gdp would...... uhhhh.....
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Oct 17, 2020 20:50
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Z the IVth posted:If you want to go all China-style authoritarian then at least do it right and make people get tested or be fined so there's no way out. It's still going to work better than whatever shitshow they have going on now. I mean I'm doing locum work right now, so I only get paid if I show up. I'm also likely to be low risk of catching covid having already had it. I also work with Covid positive patients, and spend a lot of time in or near hospitals. So what's the incentive for me to get the app? I'm already maxing out my risk by being near genuine, certified positive patients while I'm at work. During work hours I'm meant to pause the app, so apparently I'm only at risk when I'm off the clock? But if the app happens to ping me I have to isolate for two weeks (for a third time) with no pay. Or I could just not get the app.
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Oct 17, 2020 20:52
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jabby posted:I mean I'm doing locum work right now, so I only get paid if I show up. I'm also likely to be low risk of catching covid having already had it. I also work with Covid positive patients, and spend a lot of time in or near hospitals. Staff at at least one big Trust have been given written instructions from their CEOs that they must not download or use the app under any circumstances.
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Oct 17, 2020 20:59
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Cassette Boy and a new Covid song! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ISxL-3GSKVA Prob already posted, but just found this randomly suggested to me.
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Oct 17, 2020 21:01
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Plausible deniability again. I mean it actually makes sense for medical staff because we need all of them that are available and their entire jobs revolve around interacting with but trying to mitigate the risk. Less so the cops.
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Oct 17, 2020 21:02
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OwlFancier posted:It actually did help me get an emergency phone charger for my hospital bound friend so I am not feeling that much antipathy. Lots more shops used to work on that principle too - most of the catalogues used to have a retail arm like that, but Argos concentrated on dry goods exclusively on the fairly solid principle that clothing, which was the majority of the other catalogue stores business, is much more fiddly to sell either by mail order or from a catalogue store.
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Oct 17, 2020 21:02
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goddamnedtwisto posted:Lots more shops used to work on that principle too - most of the catalogues used to have a retail arm like that, but Argos concentrated on dry goods exclusively on the fairly solid principle that clothing, which was the majority of the other catalogue stores business, is much more fiddly to sell either by mail order or from a catalogue store. From what I gather it was broadly the normal mode of operation for a store once upon a time, you would have a counter and you would ask the shopkeeper for stuff and they would get it and bring it out to you. As described by the famous documentarians R.W.G. Barker and R.B Corbett.
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Oct 17, 2020 21:06
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I absolutely hate the New Zealand covid response, because all my friends there keep posting stories of themselves enjoying ski season, gigs, restaurants and bars whilst my visa application sits in limbo Perhaps I should write an opinion piece
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Oct 17, 2020 21:10
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jabby posted:I mean I'm doing locum work right now, so I only get paid if I show up. I'm also likely to be low risk of catching covid having already had it. I also work with Covid positive patients, and spend a lot of time in or near hospitals. Well yeah in the context of the half-assed poo poo the govt is doing it's completely counter-productive. It doesn't help combat the virus, and will drive down uptake of the app for all the reasons you've already mentioned. For the record my dept concluded that it was pointless (since our only exposure would be at work and it would have to be paused) and so I don't think any of us have downloaded it. Hypothetically though being very heavy handed about it could work if your aim was to gain control of the virus, people's welfare be damned. Mandate that everyone has to have the app or you get fined, fine/arrest anyone who doesn't self-isolate or breaches quarantine orders, and enforce everything rigorously. Much of Asia is doing this to a greater or lesser degree.
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Oct 17, 2020 21:10
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OwlFancier posted:From what I gather it was broadly the normal mode of operation for a store once upon a time, you would have a counter and you would ask the shopkeeper for stuff and they would get it and bring it out to you. As described by the famous documentarians R.W.G. Barker and R.B Corbett. Strange that that's not one of the gammon's "we need to return to imperial lightbulbs and the noose" complaints, I guess it's because it's more from the era they claim to have lived through rather than the one they did. Funnily enough, our village hardware store has gone back to this model because of covid, they've moved the checkout desk to right near the door and just get things for you, which works much better because they know where things are in their labyrinthine shop, everyone always ended up asking where things were.
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Oct 17, 2020 21:16
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The other point is that linger time in store increases the probability of you impulse buying something, or your kids seeing something they want and badgering you for it. So while I'm not entirely sure if it saves effort (given picking stock for online would likely be much easier in a warehouse) it does perhaps facilitate needless consumption. It is helpful to think of shopping in a physical store as being forced to wander through advertisements for everything in the store before you can finish shopping. I suppose that also applies to hardware stores but for a quite specific kind of Tool Dad. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 21:26 on Oct 17, 2020 |
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Oct 17, 2020 21:23
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I've just read an article about beleagured brexit supporters in towns rife with poverty hoping their fortunes improve with Brexit. And it's like, FFS how loving dumb do you have to be to believe that? e: I suppose it's more uninformed than dumb, but still, that's dire. Private Speech fucked around with this message at 21:33 on Oct 17, 2020 |
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Oct 17, 2020 21:29
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If we wave the flag and vote tory hard enough, the rains will come and our crops will prosper this year.
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Oct 17, 2020 21:30
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Private Speech posted:I've just read an article about beleagured brexit supporters in towns rife with poverty hoping their fortunes improve with Brexit. I think that's incredibly sad more than anything
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Oct 17, 2020 21:35
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It would be sadder if they weren't inflicting it on the rest of us, as it is it's far more annoying than sad.
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Oct 17, 2020 21:36
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OwlFancier posted:The other point is that linger time in store increases the probability of you impulse buying something, or your kids seeing something they want and badgering you for it. So while I'm not entirely sure if it saves effort (given picking stock for online would likely be much easier in a warehouse) it does perhaps facilitate needless consumption.  Maybe we'll start moving more to online due to the pandemic, but back in the 90s when she was reflecting back on the 40s that would have meant ringing up to enquire about a cauliflower and that wouldn't have worked. OwlFancier posted:I suppose that also applies to hardware stores but for a quite specific kind of Tool Dad.
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Oct 17, 2020 21:36
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I did like the couple of interactions I had with a friend's villages's hardware store, where yes "Hello I was wondering if you have any metal files so I can fix the gate" was quickest and easiest. I would happily have wandered around and looked at the mole grips though.
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Oct 17, 2020 21:39
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Nostalgic Cashew posted:Ugh. No, not this depressing reality stuff (I realize it's really bad There Will be Adequate Marmalade (for dukes).
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Oct 17, 2020 21:40
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OwlFancier posted:It would be sadder if they weren't inflicting it on the rest of us, as it is it's far more annoying than sad. this is Thatcher's fault, not the northern paups
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Oct 17, 2020 21:43
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Continuity RCP posted:this is Thatcher's fault, not the northern paups This is perhaps a disconnect I have with some thinkers on the subject but I personally find myself wondering at what point people just... are horrible twats? Like you can (and I do) take the position that they were probably made into horrible twats by society, but at some point it's still what they are and they still gleefully run around and inflict it on other people. Like if you shot all the politicians tomorrow that group of people would try very hard to recreate them and the things they do, they are a malevolent force in the world even if the malevolence is a reflection of their environment. You could equally suggest that it isn't thatcher's fault it's the society that produced thatcher and that would be accurate as well, but if you are prepared to say she was poo poo I don't really see why you should stop there, the world is full of lovely people.
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Oct 17, 2020 21:48
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Continuity RCP posted:this is Thatcher's fault, not the northern paups I'm a northern paup and I somehow managed to throw off the shackles of fate and not vote for self-harm
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Oct 17, 2020 22:02
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Also that, being one it is particularly galling when other people in better positions than me are just massive shitheap people.
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Oct 17, 2020 22:05
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Z the IVth posted:Well yeah in the context of the half-assed poo poo the govt is doing it's completely counter-productive. It doesn't help combat the virus, and will drive down uptake of the app for all the reasons you've already mentioned. For the record my dept concluded that it was pointless (since our only exposure would be at work and it would have to be paused) and so I don't think any of us have downloaded it. Yeah, the lynchpin is madating people get the app though. Or show ID when they go anywhere. Alternatively, you use the carrot approach and pay people's wages when they're self-isolating. They way they're doing it now, you have to opt-in to contact tracing and there are no possible upsides short of a vague feeling of doing something good. And the downsides involve massive loss of cash. Either way it's all academic, we could have the best test and trace system in the world and we won't dig ourselves out of our current hole without another strict lockdown.
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Oct 17, 2020 22:18
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OwlFancier posted:This is perhaps a disconnect I have with some thinkers on the subject but I personally find myself wondering at what point people just... are horrible twats? Like you can (and I do) take the position that they were probably made into horrible twats by society, but at some point it's still what they are and they still gleefully run around and inflict it on other people. I think it's that you try and look at peoples lived experience, examine their stated line of reasoning, what they value and in what order, which seems to be the main bit honestly it's usually a hierarchy of good/okay things that start to get a bit incompatible with other peoples hierarchies of good/okay things, and more often than not people just... aren't horrible twats? There's usually enough common ground that cooperating on the shared things is possible and that shared process would alleviate enough root causes of the actual tensions/create enough solidarity and shared purpose that we'd all just muck along through the small things in the hypothetical better world. That said there absolutely are horrible twats out there. There are absolutely people who are clearly only motivated by gently caress You Got Mine, or even more pathetic by gently caress You Might Be Able To Get Mine If I Cuck Enough, and if base greed no matter the wider harm is what drives someone then gently caress them they can't be on the team. Same 100% goes for people that once you cut through the arguments are motivated by racial or religious supremacy. And honestly it's a recent thing but authoritarian clout-chasing bullies that cloak themselves in this really thin veneer of principle are drifting out of 'eh we all like to feel important sometimes' to horrible twat territory too. There is a really difficult thing of someone being imperfect because their society produced them and if they are allowed to keep being a bit poo poo then they will reproduce those same societal conditions though.
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Oct 17, 2020 22:53
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Private Speech posted:I've just read an article about beleagured brexit supporters in towns rife with poverty hoping their fortunes improve with Brexit. misinformed
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Oct 17, 2020 23:01
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OwlFancier posted:This is perhaps a disconnect I have with some thinkers on the subject but I personally find myself wondering at what point people just... are horrible twats? Like you can (and I do) take the position that they were probably made into horrible twats by society, but at some point it's still what they are and they still gleefully run around and inflict it on other people. How much people are to blame for their actions versus how much they are shaped by society is basically an insoluble philosophical problem. The best thing to do is ignore the question of how much drug addicts/criminals/politicians/horrible assholes/etc. are to blame for their actions, and instead focus on what observable evidence tells us is the best way to improve things, including changing their behaviour. Unfortunately that's an extremely difficult thing to do.
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Oct 17, 2020 23:02
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I am more inclined towards sympathy for addicts/criminals etc because I find their suffering and actions easier to understand. I am disinclined towards sympathy for the right wing bastards because I do not understand them and the only way I can imagine them changing their behaviour given how political beliefs spread across age in this country is for them to die. Statistically there appears to be a large cohort of people who have had lives and opportunities I would literally kill to have, and all they do with it is work to make everyone else's life worse in every conceivable way. There may be some tragic story of why that is but at the end of the day it's still seemingly what they are, and I still just want rid of them. I am still entirely out of patience for them. I don't believe people are born assholes, I don't believe being an rear end in a top hat is inherent to humanity, I don't believe a cooperative society is impossible because it is contradictory to human nature, but god loving help me I don't see how we can have one while people like that constitute a large plurality of the population. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 23:10 on Oct 17, 2020 |
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Oct 17, 2020 23:04
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OwlFancier posted:I am more inclined towards sympathy for addicts/criminals etc because I find their suffering and actions easier to understand. Hear, hear.
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Oct 17, 2020 23:05
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OwlFancier posted:I am disinclined towards sympathy for the right wing bastards because I do not understand them I mean, this is the same reason they don't have sympathy with you. Walk a mile in my shoes etc. might be trite but it's true. The problem is that right-wing bastards are more likely than anyone to focus on blame rather than doing what the evidence says. Blame criminals for rising crime numbers, blame poor people for being poor, blame addicts for using drugs, etc. etc. You can even see it in Boris's response to having coronavirus: he blames himself for being overweight, he's said it multiple times. His mindset won't allow him to believe he fell ill through no fault of his own, because then it means everyone who gets ill isn't at fault. And that sort of thinking leads to giving them sick pay. So it has to be down to his bad choices somehow because then everyone who died must have made bad choices too. I struggle with it myself, like I know logically taking everyone involved in the refurbishment of Grenfell and putting them in front of a firing squad probably wouldn't help because the evidence says harsh punishments don't deter criminals. At the least it would only be as effective as making sure they served time in a decent rehabilitative prison, and probably less so. But if the choice was actually put in front of me, it'd be tough not to start collecting blindfolds and cigarette preferences.
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Oct 17, 2020 23:27
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There are plenty of people in the world who are genuinely really caring and put a lot of thought and effort into trying to make the world a better place. Unfortunately, they don't tend to rise to the top of this scum-filled pond, so the only ones we ever seem to hear from are spiteful cunts whose sole driving motivation is trying to make sure that if everyone in the world has to be miserable, they'll at least be the least miserable one.
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Oct 17, 2020 23:36
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My fella bought me some earrings I figure you'd guys appreciate. 
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Oct 17, 2020 23:37
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OwlFancier posted:I am more inclined towards sympathy for addicts/criminals etc because I find their suffering and actions easier to understand. This was a funny paper from earlier in the year: http://davidyyang.com/pdfs/revolutions_draft.pdf
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Oct 17, 2020 23:37
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OwlFancier posted:I am disinclined towards sympathy for the right wing bastards because I do not understand them and the only way I can imagine them changing their behaviour given how political beliefs spread across age in this country is for them to die. There's your real cunts, of course, the ones who would sit and weigh coins over, as in jabby's Grenfell example, 20p/m2 price differences in cladding vs. people's lives, but the people that believe things that are equally stupid and obnoxious, like "I voted out because of all the blacks coming over from Europe" are trying to wedge their unease about society into a model that gives a simple but wrong answer like "you are worse off because there are African people here" and a simple but wrong solution "and you can send them all back by leaving the European Union." As to whether you can get them out of that or they're in a pit of their own (and the tabloids') making, depends on the person.
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Oct 17, 2020 23:39
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