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Before I put the game down in early access I was having more fun by seeing how fast I could dive down. It sounds counter intuitive but it generally leads to more fun runs, and you still tend to get something along the way to help out with tougher enemies. Magic missiles are a lot more appealing when you really only need to kill 5 things on a floor, tops Now, the extended 'endgame' is like pulling teeth with how much you have to minmax and I have no patience for it. That's where the cheats come in
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Oct 23, 2020 06:47
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IronicDongz posted:I'm going to go record myself beating hisi base with just some basic bitch damage wand and no trigger multi-cast or chainsaw shenanigans out of spite, brb I suppose I should re-word my previous hiisi base statement to be more in line with what I was trying to say: it's fully possible to beat hiisi base (and the whole game for that matter) with basic no-frills wands. However, it will be generally very slow and not very fun. I remember a while back in this thread someone posted a video clearing hiisi base with just spark bolt on the starting bomb wand, and a lot of the thread consensus was "yeah it's possible, but boy does that look boring and tedious" Also I was more lamenting the fact that the game's pacing kind of works against the urge to create crazy unique wands. I always would love to do some bullshit like creating a cloud of electrified exploding booze when the spark bolt i fired lands, but by the time I'm lucky enough to get all that stuff together the game is more or less at the "okay, you need a REAL wand now, or it's going to be slow going" stage. I'll also fully admit maybe I'm just bad at making wands and can't find a way to make reliable high-damage wands without trigger-multicast or chainsaws. I'd love for someone to explain how to make great wands that can reliably clear late-game levels that don't rely on those gimmicks. CodfishCartographer fucked around with this message at 06:58 on Oct 23, 2020 |
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Oct 23, 2020 06:54
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that video was me  time is a flat circle, etcThe thing is, and this was my original point back then as well, you don't ever actually need to play like that because the game always gives you plenty of spells and wands with which to craft a murdergun, so you don't ever realistically find yourself clearing later areas with sparkbolt or whatever. Trigger spells are fairly common, as are multicasts and explosive spells. And really, the limited ammo explosive spells are strong enough to kill most enemies quite quickly until the end of the game by themselves, by which point you have had way more than enough time to gather resources to make a good wand out of-and while you are doing that you can also put together more weird stuff. Trigger multicast or chainsaw shenanigans will always be really powerful, but I don't know how exactly you get away from stuff like that when those options exist in the game, and I think it's fine for there to be straightforward kill poo poo wand builds and more rare wonky stuff like summoning water with a tentacle and then electrifying it showing up sometimes.
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Oct 23, 2020 07:20
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The combination of the breathless perk and a wand that always casts water trail (plus if you manage to find sea of water too) is a fun way to drown all the enemies until someone decides to electrify the whole level. With electricity immunity perk it would probably be unstoppable until you run into mechanical enemies who won't drown? e: This is probably still the theme of most of my runs 
TeaJay fucked around with this message at 11:24 on Oct 23, 2020 |
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Oct 23, 2020 11:21
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Yea, for me it's always "I know I shouldn't, but I will anyway" usually involving acid...
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Oct 23, 2020 12:41
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(caveat: this advice dates from like six months ago) I want to give a particular shout-out to firebolt and magic missile wands. They're powerful enough to one-shot most enemies in the game, they dig, and you can get multikills pretty easily with the bigger firebolts. And wands that are just "here, have six copies of the same spell" aren't uncommon. If you have 60 explosive shots you can do a lot, let alone if you have 150. I'll also second using mods if they make the game better for you. Vanilla Noita is written towards a very specific kind of player, and there's nothing wrong with changing the game if you aren't that specific target audience.
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Oct 23, 2020 14:52
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gently caress it, I'm installing start with more health and tinker wands anywhere mods. The only really fun runs I had were with the tinker perk and an hours worth of health-up scrounging
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Oct 23, 2020 15:53
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Considering how prevalent instant-kill punishes for experimenting or just randomly getting noita'd simply for existing are, and how tedious longer orb collection runs are (one easily takes longer than i've played 90% of my steam library games), after a few dozen hours of getting that "authentic" experience including meme-y death gifs it's kinda lost its charm a bit and I mostly wish there was a mod that just added a proper quicksave/load slot system to lower the stakes a bit (but mainly to cut down on boring repetitive playing 1-1 with starting wands that's kept me from diving back into the game). I know there's meta-batch scripts that copy the game's existing state files and kill/restart the process but that feels like the clunky workaround it is. I guess it's the best i'll get for now. RoadCrewWorker fucked around with this message at 16:03 on Oct 23, 2020 |
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Oct 23, 2020 16:00
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RoadCrewWorker posted:Considering how prevalent instant-kill punishes for experimenting or just randomly getting noita'd simply for existing are, and how tedious longer orb collection runs are (one easily takes longer than i've played 90% of my steam library games), after a few dozen hours of getting that "authentic" experience including meme-y death gifs it's kinda lost its charm a bit and I mostly wish there was a mod that just added a proper quicksave/load slot system to lower the stakes a bit (but mainly to cut down on boring repetitive playing 1-1 with starting wands that's kept me from diving back into the game). There is a mod that turns off permadeath and gives every holy mountain a checkpoint where you'll respawn if you die. The world state stays the same so it's not exactly the save/load you're looking for, but it's something
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Oct 23, 2020 16:37
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Greenplastic posted:gently caress it, I'm installing start with more health and tinker wands anywhere mods. The only really fun runs I had were with the tinker perk and an hours worth of health-up scrounging Yeah I use tinker everywhere, faster movement, and no shuffle wands. All you really need for this (and a LOT of other poo poo) is the Gokki mod, one of the features lets you pick perks to start with and you can just choose the relevant ones.
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Oct 23, 2020 16:38
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goferchan posted:There is a mod that turns off permadeath and gives every holy mountain a checkpoint where you'll respawn if you die. The world state stays the same so it's not exactly the save/load you're looking for, but it's something Oh I like that a lot, what's it called?
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Oct 23, 2020 16:53
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I use a polymorph immunity mod because gently caress one-shot instadeath. I've weaned myself off of it, but if you want to take a bit of the edge off Noita's brutality, the HP regen mod is nice. You can customize the speed at which HP regens and the max it will regen to (so you can set it to, say, regen to 25% of your max HP before stopping, or 50% or 72% or whatever). If you get busted up but survive you can go hide somewhere and recover some HP. Just try to resist the temptation to combine it with the Saving Grace perk, as it will make you almost invincible.
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Oct 23, 2020 17:12
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Bad Munki posted:Oh I like that a lot, what's it called? Dead Isn't Dead but it sounds like it got a little broken with the 1.0 release and sometimes you'll respawn trapped in the rubble of a collapsed Holy Mountain. So keep an eye on it and wait for an update or just make sure you have a way to dig yourself out?
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Oct 23, 2020 17:13
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been playing this non-stop for the last three days or so. I could never make it past the Hiisi base, until I found a wand that I casually stuffed chainsaws in to test for mining ability. I uh, didn't realize it had Always Cast Concentrated Light. It murdered poo poo so fast I broke the audio in the game and it couldn't keep up until I did a save and reload. That was a hell of a way to get my first clear. This game will kick your teeth in, but unlike a lot of the traditional Roguelikes like Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup, I feel like it still gives fair access to the esoteric bullshit you can stumble upon. Speaking of which, time to go take the time to discover lots of esoteric bullshit! EDIT: I also started using some mods to help with general survivability. Glowing Chests and Glowing Hearts make taking the time to explore feel worthwhile. Edit Wands Always makes experimentation feel quick. For HP regeneration, I've been using Therapeutic Gold which seems to fit well with the game's meta-plot. By default it gives 4HP for every 10 Gold you pick up, but that includes gold nuggets which feels a little much for me. Krysmphoenix fucked around with this message at 18:47 on Oct 23, 2020 |
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Oct 23, 2020 18:43
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There is a perk called Blood Money in the base game that does something similar, for any enemy death that you did not directly cause. Really enjoyed it when I had elec charge and More Hate.
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Oct 23, 2020 20:51
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Krysmphoenix posted:EDIT: I also started using some mods to help with general survivability. Glowing Chests and Glowing Hearts make taking the time to explore feel worthwhile. Edit Wands Always makes experimentation feel quick. For HP regeneration, I've been using Therapeutic Gold which seems to fit well with the game's meta-plot. By default it gives 4HP for every 10 Gold you pick up, but that includes gold nuggets which feels a little much for me. yeah i feel like it's one roguelike where the game is so hard and random that you can definitely make it easier without feeling like you're totally cheesing it, and you'll still get better at things that will make your vanilla gameplay experience much better (especially since so much of surviving is just having seen all the enemies/spells/environments and being able to make good decisions based on that knowledge) hopefully new players will see the huge amount of sandbox options there are for tuning this instead of just giving up due to the high vanilla difficulty
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Oct 23, 2020 20:56
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I tried vanilla with 1.0 but now I'm using my old system with Edit wands anywhere perk at the start and one perk at the mine entrance. That gives some nice leeway. More health would not probably help since most of my deaths are due to my own hubris instead of mobs doing too much damage.
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Oct 23, 2020 21:02
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Sage Grimm posted:There is a perk called Blood Money in the base game that does something similar, for any enemy death that you did not directly cause. Really enjoyed it when I had elec charge and More Hate. Vampirism really needs an update since now trying to drink blood is even more tedious than before, if you're trying to avoid poisoning/slowing yourself by drinking whatever water/oil/etc happens to have collected. Yay, I barely survived that fight, now time to grind up corpses with a Digging Bolt so I don't accidentally eat Rotten Meat. This is Fun. Also speaking of materials... is there some way to toggle bloodstains/scorch marks/etc and textures, so a colorblind player can tell wtf things are without having to mouse over each pixel? Or at least like "hold down [foo button] to highlight all materials that will hurt you on contact, [bar] for a custom filter/list"
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Oct 23, 2020 21:04
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Stoca Zola posted:I think it's easy to get bogged down trying to "finish" each zone before moving on and that's not really necessary most of the time. Probably one of the most important early game tips is to remember to use terrain for cover and environmental things to help you deal more damage when your wand is still a bit underpowered, such as using water on fire enemies, using typical rogue-like doorway/corridor/pinch point tactics to control where you can be attacked from, ducking into cover to avoid being hit, kicking and throwing items for physics damage which is much higher than wand damage at early levels. I go through the mines usually with a couple of goals in mind before I move on - get "enough" gold, I'd say 400 is plenty to start with, find a fast wand (the yellow or green shuffle wands are fine for this and there's a rarer red one now too), find an improved no-shuffle wand as an upgrade to the starter blue wand, grab the tablet. If I get anything better than that it's a bonus but if my health hits 25 I'll head to the exit regardless of how many goals I've hit. Loading up a fast wand with cheap spells can spam out a ton of damage, or alternatively a slow but steady stream of heavier hitting spells such as energy sphere or magic arrow are fine too. Even if you don't find a good fast wand you can get a bit of mileage out of spark bolt on the starter red wand. I will try some mods, maybe, when they are compatible. I did do all the stuff with the environmental kills and stuff initially, but after dying so many times I just... don't have the patience any more, I just want to find some new spells and play with them and I don't have the patience any more to slowly find ways to kill things creatively when I know I'm just going to die from something before it achieves anything. I've been fighting the same crap with the same crap in the same place for 30 hours and I just want it over with. I would probably enjoy it more if it just... wasn't a roguelike. I don't really understand why it is because everything else about it seems to encourage slow, plodding play, which I don't necessarily mind, I like playing dark souls like that, I play most games very slowly just because I like looking around, but Noita simultaneously requires it for you to get a competitive health pool and wands, but also punishes you for it because when you die you have to do it all again. It's just a very confused and conflicting design, I think. I think it would make a much better metroidvania, with you trying to find different capabilities from spells across the map to unlock access to new areas. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 21:41 on Oct 23, 2020 |
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Oct 23, 2020 21:22
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Another really nice couple of options in Goki's Things is Quick Swap in Options page 2, which gives you an additional set of wand and item slots that you can swap to with right-click, as well as a "Kick Spells off Wands" option in Game Modifiers. It makes it a lot easier to experiment while being slightly less cheesy (if that matters to you) than always having Edit Wands Everywhere.
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Oct 23, 2020 22:37
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OwlFancier posted:I will try some mods, maybe, when they are compatible. I did do all the stuff with the environmental kills and stuff initially, but after dying so many times I just... don't have the patience any more, I just want to find some new spells and play with them and I don't have the patience any more to slowly find ways to kill things creatively when I know I'm just going to die from something before it achieves anything. I've been fighting the same crap with the same crap in the same place for 30 hours and I just want it over with. One thing that helps me is remembering you can always get back to the mines from the far right of the ice level, so I have no problems just blasting through the first 2 holy mountains if I'm bored/not finding anything interesting. That way if you get some good poo poo you can go back and clean up when you have some acceleratium and levitatium.
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Oct 23, 2020 23:39
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I have never reliably managed to get much use out of that because I struggle to get through the ice level at the best of times. I downloaded the edit wands anywhere and the health pickup dropper thing, and edited it to make the health drops give you an extra hitpoint each time you collect one so hopefully that will allow more chance to play with wands and give an actual incentive to explore levels. I also started a game and it's raining, which seems like it would cause problems in the long run. Also why do the collapsed mines have someone taking a difficult poo poo on the soundtrack? OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 00:04 on Oct 24, 2020 |
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Oct 23, 2020 23:46
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Radical 90s Wizard posted:One thing that helps me is remembering you can always get back to the mines from the far right of the ice level, so I have no problems just blasting through the first 2 holy mountains if I'm bored/not finding anything interesting. That way if you get some good poo poo you can go back and clean up when you have some acceleratium and levitatium. That route is no longer quite so simple as it used to be. There's a miniboss that will chase you and can dig through any terrain, and unlike the pyramid spider it doesn't just gently caress off into space if you leave, so it'll eventually catch up unless you can teleport away to outrun it until it ends up outside the simulation boundary. (That part is theoretical, I've never succeeded in getting away yet because the only time I met it when I had a teleport wand was when I killed it. Which took like 10 minutes. The bosses in this game spend so much time invincible and/or forcing you to dodge continuous missile barrages that they must have come from some weird danmaku shmup)
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Oct 24, 2020 00:13
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That guy only shows up if/when you pick up the orb.
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Oct 24, 2020 00:14
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Just had a really sweet run and got my first post-1.0 victory! This build was super powerful and fun:
 Later on I got a 10-cast wand with tons of copies of the dark fire trail spell which got sucked into the gravity field and killed stuff even faster, setting off bombs at the same time. This was a fun setup for a minute until the healers needed to be put down after one decided to pick up a wand and attempt mutiny:  And this scared the piss out of me, I'm glad I had the intuition to back away at the last second:  What a magical game. I love 1.0, but I really hope they fix the jungle spiders digging into the holy temple. They didn't do that before 1.0 right? It never happened to me before anyways, and now it happens almost every time I get to the jungle, a lot of times before I even make it to the perks. Thankfully I was OP enough to fight steve on this run, but I've had a few other good runs ruined by that, which is super frustrating when it's not a consequence of anything you did and impossible to avoid.
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Oct 24, 2020 00:21
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dizzywhip posted:What a magical game. I love 1.0, but I really hope they fix the jungle spiders digging into the holy temple. They didn't do that before 1.0 right? It never happened to me before anyways, and now it happens almost every time I get to the jungle, a lot of times before I even make it to the perks. Thankfully I was OP enough to fight steve on this run, but I've had a few other good runs ruined by that, which is super frustrating when it's not a consequence of anything you did and impossible to avoid. Spiders digging into the temple and upsetting the gods has been a thing for as long as I've been playing. It's been brought up enough times that the devs are certainly aware of it so I have to assume it's an intended part of the game. Surely they could code in some sort of "spiders can't damage temple rock" thing if they actually wanted to get rid of it.
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Oct 24, 2020 00:32
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Oh okay, I guess I've just gotten really unlucky recently
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Oct 24, 2020 00:42
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Basically it works out to "you have to be able to kill Steve by the time you reach the underground jungle" which is pretty dependent on what wands/spells the RNG gives you. The holy mountain is supposed to be the one place you can safely chill out and mess with your wands, but I guess the devs think that should only apply for the first 3 levels. After that, you have to either be able to kill Steve or just grab a wand/spell and a perk and book it out of there, because you have somewhere between 10 and maybe 40 seconds before a spider digs into the temple and angers the gods. Eric the Mauve fucked around with this message at 01:02 on Oct 24, 2020 |
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Oct 24, 2020 00:43
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Sage Grimm posted:There is a perk called Blood Money in the base game that does something similar, for any enemy death that you did not directly cause. Really enjoyed it when I had elec charge and More Hate. Blood Money is absolutely incredible with the right build. https://i.imgur.com/6u4LGRF.mp4
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Oct 24, 2020 00:56
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Mischievous Mink posted:Blood Money is absolutely incredible with the right build. What is that wand?
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Oct 24, 2020 01:01
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Man, I previously stumbled through making a mod that would totally let me cheese whatever perks and custom wand I wanted in at the start, just for screwing around with builds. But then I put this down like a year ago and between that and the update to 1.0, my mod doesn't work at all and the new example mod isn't helping me one bit. Anyone know of a "babby's first guide to adding a wand" for the latest update? Or any good guide that actually teaches more than what's briefly shown in the example mod. I just don't even know where to start anymore.
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Oct 24, 2020 01:04
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Cheatgui hasn't been updated but still works in 1.0 for me, and I assume it can't access the new perks/spells, but it has a functional custom wand builder.
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Oct 24, 2020 01:05
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Sailor Dave posted:What is that wand? It's called "Magic Guard", if you cast it multiple times it becomes incredibly effective at killing. Doesn't damage explosive barrels and boxes, either!
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Oct 24, 2020 01:05
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Eric the Mauve posted:Cheatgui hasn't been updated but still works in 1.0 for me, and I assume it can't access the new perks/spells, but it has a functional custom wand builder. Ah cool, thanks
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Oct 24, 2020 01:07
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silentsnack posted:That route is no longer quite so simple as it used to be. There's a miniboss that will chase you and can dig through any terrain, and unlike the pyramid spider it doesn't just gently caress off into space if you leave, so it'll eventually catch up unless you can teleport away to outrun it until it ends up outside the simulation boundary. (That part is theoretical, I've never succeeded in getting away yet because the only time I met it when I had a teleport wand was when I killed it. Which took like 10 minutes. The bosses in this game spend so much time invincible and/or forcing you to dodge continuous missile barrages that they must have come from some weird danmaku shmup) Oh man that's been added since 1.0 right? That complicates things...
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Oct 24, 2020 01:10
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Oh high there, just trying to edit some comically stupid wands... ...and forgetting to remove a key spell and subsequently intercepting a polymorph projectile by teleporting myself directly into it, in the middle of a laserstorm deathsplosion. Eric the Mauve posted:Basically it works out to "you have to be able to kill Steve by the time you reach the underground jungle" which is pretty dependent on what wands/spells the RNG gives you. You can kill Steve by dropping the ceiling on him, if he's close to the Altar when you cross the exit threshold.
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Oct 24, 2020 01:10
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silentsnack posted:You can kill Steve by dropping the ceiling on him, if he's close to the Altar when you cross the exit threshold. Ideally you want to still be able to sit around in the temple though.
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Oct 24, 2020 01:27
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TeaJay posted:The combination of the breathless perk and a wand that always casts water trail (plus if you manage to find sea of water too) is a fun way to drown all the enemies until someone decides to electrify the whole level. With electricity immunity perk it would probably be unstoppable until you run into mechanical enemies who won't drown? I did that run with the electrify stuff around you + don’t get electrocuted yourself perk! It is basically unstoppable until hubris makes you stand next to something which explodes when electrocution catches stuff on fire.
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Oct 24, 2020 01:56
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tildes posted:I did that run with the electrify stuff around you + don’t get electrocuted yourself perk! It is basically unstoppable until hubris makes you stand next to something which explodes when electrocution catches stuff on fire. there's always that magical moment when you get a source of electricity + either explosion or elec immunity, and you know for sure you will eventually die to whichever one you don't have
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Oct 24, 2020 05:11
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Speaking of the new miniboss in the chasm between ice caves and mines it feels like he's completely overpowered to the level I'm usually at that point. I even got a pretty good fast-shooting wand with magic arrows and was doing like 1-2 damage to him and barely dented his health bar when he pulverized me with one nuke. I generally do not have an end game capable wand at that point and he definitely seems like he needs very good one to kill with.
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Oct 24, 2020 07:50
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