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punk rebel ecks posted:I'm so tempted to post the greatest I want a Chile edition just for all the loving losers crying that Pinochet's work is being burned.
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Oct 26, 2020 04:30
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from Latin American Reddit/Twitter over the past few days.
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i say swears online posted:what's the reason for ~50% of the right voting to ditch the constitution? The 50% estimation is debatable since you gotta take into account previous voter turnout rates, actual right-wing militants versus casual / independent voters (if I'm not mistaken, the percentage of chilean voters registered with a party is extremely slim compared to, say, the US, though there is a general tendency) and other elements, but overall it's a mixture of the core social demands behind the call for a new constitution resonating with an overwhelming majority of the electorate, even among those who identify as conservative, and a lack of leadership among the right-wing establishment to waste effort and political capital on a lost cause. There's a general perception of "we're getting hosed over" that has been present for years - it was not expedient for right-of-center voters to publicly acknowledge it, but it was very much there. When things blew up in october 2019, it did seem like a global expression of anger that transcended labels of right or left (though the causes that were championed were broadly associated with the left). I believe the right-wing establishment believed that over time its electorate would go back to the corral with the usual talk of public security, personal responsibility, "they want free stuff", etc, but the final results from tonight suggest that social class outweighed political affiliation as a deciding factor. Las Condes, Vitacura and Lo Barnechea have been the more traditional bastions of the right wing, but they weren't the only ones - what set them apart was that they were the only districts that were BOTH extremely wealthy and extremely right-leaning. Everything else, from Araucanía to Providencia, didn't just swing for the Apruebo, it swung HARD. The other, more immediate explanation, is that pretty much everyone in the mainstream political establishment saw the writing on the wall. A few public figures on the right, like Lavín, Desbordes or Ossandon, were, in my opinion, astute enough to identify very early on with a sort of "soft Apruebo", because they knew the Rechazo would be obliterated (everyone knew, really, the polls were very clear and did not budge significantly over the months), and they didn't want to show up to the next presidential elections as part of the loser squad. Lavín and Ossandón in particular have spent many years carefully curating an image of "I'm not like the other fachos, I'm a cool facho", so it was on brand for them. Lavín specifically was the first right-wing presidential candidate since the return to democracy to understand that the right can't win on a national level though Pinochetist rhetoric, which makes him a dangerous contender in the upcoming presidential, even if today's results would suggest that the left has the next election in the bag. Piñera himself took distance from Rechazo because at his core he's a self-absorbed sociopath who felt he could somehow spin the referendum as his ~legacy of democracy~ and end up in the history books for anything other than being a mass murderer. The establishment right would still make noise about the communists and street violence and blue (green) lives matter and whatnot, but when it came to end message they were more interested in positioning themselves for the next elections (constitutional assembly, legislatives or presidential) than burning themselves on the fool's errand of going against an extremely obvious majority. And since that left the heavy pulling of the Rechazo campaign to the crazies, I'm assuming that ended up turning even more traditionally right-wing voters over to the Apruebo camp. SexyBlindfold has issued a correction as of 04:51 on Oct 26, 2020 |
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Oct 26, 2020 04:42
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ty ty for the good post
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Oct 26, 2020 04:47
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D1LhlVtbW_U
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Oct 26, 2020 05:15
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quote:I hope daddy trump wins and antifa and blm get added to the fbi terrorist list. I hope the wall gets built, the dacas get deported and ACB confirmed as a SCOTUS. I hope Roe v. Wade gets overturned and I hope federal IDs get implemented for 2024 which will be mandatory for voting (no more illegals voting in sanctuary cities) and I hope tucker Carlson both runs and wins 2024. Did I get your attention yet?? What I meant to say is: Same dude: quote:It must be depressing to go through life looking at everything through the lens of the false dichotomy of left vs right. Evil Moraless was nothing but a corrupt pedophile who abused the position of power for personal gain (just like Biden and his son hunter). Your bike-lock college professor lied to you. Sad. A post right after the Bolivian coup: quote:The problem with the international media, especially the American and Argentinian is that they make it a problem of typical leftist vs rightist views. It seems that these articles support Evo simply because of what he claimed, without looking into it in detail. They think the issue is as simple as it looks from their computers, without having gone to Bolivia or knowing what the politics situation really was. They claim it was a right wing coup simply because it was against a socialism, the military got involved, those protesting are catholic and the rebellion was against an-indigenous president. Now for the last thing they argue that it is BECAUSE he is indigenous, which of course is not the case. They use the fact Camacho used the Bible for symbolism to justify the “extreme right” definition, without knowing that most South American countries, especially Bolivia, are catholic (but often include indigenous culture). The ignore the fact that evo called for violence and focus on the military being involved, also oblivious to the fact that they only stepped in when protesters clashed violently (again mostly encouraged by evo and his supporters). Finally they use evos “socialism” as a justification for his politics. They ignore the fact that he likely has ties to the cocaine industry, that he makes millions, that he uses socialism as a front for his truly imperialist structure of the country. Evo used socialism and the “plurinational state” as fronts for his truly opposite intention. He divided the country and its indigenous groups by only supporting the Aymara from his hometown area. He uses socialism as a front for capitalist intentions, burning the Amazon to create cattle farms to be exported. DesertIslandHermit posted:I want a Chile edition just for all the loving losers crying that Pinochet's work is being burned. Truth be told I can't really find much. Unlike Bolivia, Reddit and Twitter aren't dominated by the right wing (there are pro-MAS Bolivians in Reddit and Twitter but the majority seem to be on Facebook). I did find this while searching for stuff: On Pinochet: quote:If are from far right wing you love it. If you are from left wing you hate it. He is a controversial figure till this day and a very important one in modern chilean politics. Same guy: quote:Chileans here have no idea of what fascism really is.Chile doesn't have a fascist party. The closest thing is "Partido Republicano".
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Oct 26, 2020 05:49
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I checked r/Chile and the top post is a meme about how everyone’s gonna be an antifa catgirl now so I’m guessing that they’re left leaning I wonder if the fact that they seem to be a Spanish language sub while r/Bolivia was inexplicably English speaking has much to do with it
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Oct 26, 2020 05:54
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I’m so happy for the Chilean people, I’m so happy for all the Latin Americans finally breaking free of the fascist chains, as a middle easterner I’m incredibly happy for them and jealous of them.... god bless the Chilean people... I hope one day I can vote away fascism like they did......
Al-Saqr has issued a correction as of 06:19 on Oct 26, 2020 |
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Oct 26, 2020 06:15
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FrancisFukyomama posted:I checked r/Chile and the top post is a meme about how everyone’s gonna be an antifa catgirl now so I’m guessing that they’re left leaning I do know that the case for Venezuela reddit was that the PSUV supporters were in the Spanish sub-reddits.
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Oct 26, 2020 06:23
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EDIT - I'm a loving idiot. Feel free to ridicule me.
punk rebel ecks has issued a correction as of 06:44 on Oct 26, 2020 |
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Oct 26, 2020 06:25
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Granted, a lot of the outcomes of "springs" are geopolitical, in the case of Latin America, the US has been phoning it in lately.
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Oct 26, 2020 06:30
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Yeah from what I gather r/chile used to be very neckbeardy and very fashy but at some point there was a change of mods and a tightening of the rules (re: hate speech, apologism et al) that ended up peeling a lot of the alt-right elements away and now it's just very neckbeardy. If I'm not mistaken this change coincided with a popular local message board with a heavy alt-right presence imploding due to a tangentially related CP sting (eesh), this made a lot of alt-right users migrate to other networks like Twitter or Facebook where they failed to gain an organized presence. You can find a lot of far-right accounts on Twitter (most of them pledge allegiance to former presidential candidate José Antonio Kast and post poorly re-formatted MAGA memes with his face superimposed) but they've a very closed circle. I know it's typical for both sides of the political aisle in social media to dismiss the other as an echo chamber, but at least on Twitter, the chilean right is distinctly insular and has very little organic engagement other than amplifying each other's chilezuela talking points. Both chilean twitter and r/chile lean left, though reddit's kinda dudebro about it and it's not rare to come across generic "anti-SJW" sentiments.
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Oct 26, 2020 06:31
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punk rebel ecks posted:You had your chance and blew it. Though Tunisia is doing well. Sorry none of us had guns and tanks to not get killed and tortured en masse by American/Russian/Israeli /iranian backed dictators who would rather kill everyone than give people the vote. Sorry about that. You could always say nothing rather than poo poo on helpless and powerless people you know. I’m just expressing happiness for other people getting freedom you don’t need to poo poo on people who tried their best but died in the process. Al-Saqr has issued a correction as of 06:35 on Oct 26, 2020 |
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Oct 26, 2020 06:31
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Al-Saqr posted:Sorry none of us had guns and tanks to not get killed and tortured en masse by American/Russian/Israeli /iranian backed dictators who would rather kill everyone than give people the vote. Sorry about that. I did it mean it like that, but yes my post was extremely insensitive. I apologize.
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Oct 26, 2020 06:42
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Ardennes posted:Granted, a lot of the outcomes of "springs" are geopolitical, in the case of Latin America, the US has been phoning it in lately. That's one of the things I'm worried about. Biden winning would be a net good for the world (mostly thinking about climate change here) but I'm pretty sure the US having a more competent president can't be good for latin america.
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Oct 26, 2020 06:46
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lmao at biden being a "net good for the world"
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Oct 26, 2020 06:49
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bedpan posted:lmao at biden being a "net good for the world" I meant only compared to Trump
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Oct 26, 2020 06:50
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lunar detritus posted:That's one of the things I'm worried about. Biden winning would be a net good for the world (mostly thinking about climate change here) but I'm pretty sure the US having a more competent president can't be good for latin america. it's not and you shouldn't focus on biden you should focus on everyone else around him
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Oct 26, 2020 06:51
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Joe “fracking is good” Biden doesn’t give a poo poo about climate change.
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Oct 26, 2020 06:51
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lmao at biden being a "net good for the world" when compared to trump
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Oct 26, 2020 06:51
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lunar detritus posted:That's one of the things I'm worried about. Biden winning would be a net good for the world (mostly thinking about climate change here) but I'm pretty sure the US having a more competent president can't be good for latin america. I would say he would be somewhere between Obama and Trump, not insane but I don't know if he (i.e the consultants) would be able to get work done. I would say Biden would probably take a more covert approach than Trump's sledgehammer but it really depends on how the Latin American left reacts. (The job done in Brazil was impressive, but I don't know how much of it was planned in DC.)
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Oct 26, 2020 06:53
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Ardennes posted:Granted, a lot of the outcomes of "springs" are geopolitical, in the case of Latin America, the US has been phoning it in lately. TRUMP!
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Oct 26, 2020 07:29
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Trump's too stupid to be good at coups and that makes him objectively better for Latin America, and I also implore US leftists to vote him out because it will crush what little spirit the chilean far-right has left after tonight.
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Oct 26, 2020 07:53
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Ardennes posted:I would say he would be somewhere between Obama and Trump, not insane but I don't know if he (i.e the consultants) would be able to get work done. It means they go back to lawfare instead of trying to be go go 80s guys. Theres a reason all the hawks, spooks, and coup mongers are screaming out loud for Biden. They see in him a guy who will turn every one of these rambunctious imperial holdings into Brazil
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Oct 26, 2020 09:19
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What exactly is this constitutional change in Chile?
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Oct 26, 2020 10:01
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None yet, they voted if the constitution should be replaced and who would rewrite it. They decided that an extra elected committee would be in charge of that.
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Oct 26, 2020 10:08
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Jose posted:What exactly is this constitutional change in Chile? They were voting to bin the old constitution and have a new constitutional convention. Fun fact about one of the men behind the 1980 constitution, Jaime Guzmán. His main influences in writing it were lunatic Friedrich Hayek's economics with literal member of the Nazi Party Carl Schmitt, to perfectly merge economic liberalism with repressive government. Rules.
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Oct 26, 2020 11:24
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Jose posted:What exactly is this constitutional change in Chile? They've voted to establish a constitutional convention, which will be elected at a future date and is not allowed to include current elected officials and must have gender parity (and representation for indigenous people? The source I read was fuzzy about this), and then that convention will have 9-12 months to write a new constitution from scratch to replace the Nazi/neoliberal Pinochet constitution, and then there will be another referendum to either accept the new constitution or reject it and keep the current one. So nothing immediate but it starts a 2-ish year process of writing a brand new constitution that will hopefully undo a lot of the right-wing garbage that's been oppressing Chileans for the last half-century.
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Oct 26, 2020 14:55
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*taps microphone; Plaza Italia/Dignidad falls silent* Ahem... "mazorcado."
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Oct 26, 2020 15:27
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SexyBlindfold posted:Trump's too stupid to be good at coups and that makes him objectively better for Latin America, and I also implore US leftists to vote him out because it will crush what little spirit the chilean far-right has left after tonight. Crush the spirit of Chilean fascists so we can crush every people's movement south of the US
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Oct 26, 2020 15:39
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Ardennes posted:I would say he would be somewhere between Obama and Trump, not insane but I don't know if he (i.e the consultants) would be able to get work done. In terms of things that we have direct evidence of (rather than trying to fill in the blank ourselves): - The 1st ambassador to Brazil in the Obama admin has since said that the Obama admin saw Brazil establishing partnerships with other pink wave nations as a threat and feared an independent block in the region - NSA was extensively wiretapping Dilma and other high level PT members. - The car wash operation team had a deal with the US DoJ that violated terms of a Brazil-US treaty and intentionally hid its activities from the executive branch of Brazil - The DoJ, ICE and FBI were illegally cooperating with the car wash team in Brazilian territory - The intercept leaks show coordination between carwash and the US, including getting access to Swiss files that they were not legally allowed to access - High level US DoJ members bragged about helping put Lula in jail (e.g., Kenneth Blanco) - The day of Dilma's impeachment members of the opposition had meetings with the state department in the US. Now, this isn't to say that the members of the Brazilian judiciary were just errand boys. But it is clear that the US was at least a co-equal partner on the venture. And I think it is notable that the pink wave in Latin America happened after the Bush admin became primarily preoccupied with Iraq. Back in 2004 I knew plenty of PT people who were rooting for Bush because there were still a ton of democratic operatives in Latin America trying to push the FTAA, while Bush had essentially given up on the region after the failed 2002 coup.
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Oct 26, 2020 15:52
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https://twitter.com/caiomrb/status/1320755672015949825 Vote against the constitution change won on the rich areas of santiago
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Oct 26, 2020 16:56
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Oct 26, 2020 17:01
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the US is just the mafia https://twitter.com/SiggonKristov/status/1320457991406166018 straight up extortion/protection racket Fast Luck has issued a correction as of 17:23 on Oct 26, 2020 |
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Oct 26, 2020 17:02
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hm should we call it "p******t" or just "the p-word"
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Oct 26, 2020 17:17
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Doc Hawkins posted:hm should we call it "p******t" or just "the p-word" pino-american
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Oct 26, 2020 17:19
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https://www.telesurenglish.net/news/venezuela-announces-effective-medicine-against-covid-19-20201026-0008.html venezuela purportedly cured the coronavirus?
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Oct 26, 2020 17:35
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Plutonis posted:https://twitter.com/caiomrb/status/1320755672015949825 Keep in mind that in this map yellow means that Apruebo "only" got between 60% and 70%
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Oct 26, 2020 17:38
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SexyBlindfold posted:Keep in mind that in this map yellow means that Apruebo "only" got between 60% and 70% Victoria Rechazo (perdido en un 4-16 por ciento) e: nvm, misread the map lol
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Oct 26, 2020 17:41
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Fast Luck posted:the US is just the mafia Kamala Harris, smiling and cheering,
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Oct 26, 2020 17:50
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One thing about the Bolivian right on Reddit and what not is that they are t typically of the far right flavor of say Latin American Trump. They seem more like privileged liberal "centrists", Pete Buttigieg types.
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Oct 26, 2020 17:57
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