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Is there a good fix for conditions that people mostly agree on? Reading the thread, I’m tempted to apply them more as emotional conditions, like spooked. Enraged, humiliated, overwhelmed, envious, et cetera.
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Nov 9, 2020 05:00
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| # ? Jun 3, 2024 21:57 |
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I like them in Mage as side effects from spells, so that you can get Beats from those and also so that weird magical mishaps can have lasting weird effects. This is pretty ad hoc, and quite a few conditions got handed out in my long game that sort of faded out instead of being resolved, which was fine.
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Nov 9, 2020 07:57
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So, as you can probably tell, the Conditions ephemeral entities impose were designed alongside the rest of the Conditions systems, and do not mesh especially well. They fall into the great flaw of the Storytelling system of it not consciously knowing if Storyteller characters follow all the rules players' characters do. I cop to the flowchart, and how complicated it is. In my defense, in an *individual case* it's fine - if your Hunter has a friend whose house is haunted, she knows that if she finds the ghost's bones and burns them, (destroying the anchor that the fetter is built on) it'll banish it. Any given entity will only use one to three of the boxes. But if you mush all the powers for ghosts and spirits and angels and goetia together, it looks like... That. What that system needs is a half dozen examples.
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Nov 9, 2020 10:00
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Lord_Hambrose posted:I always knew Wraith was the best White Wolf game, and I am very glad you have provided incontrovertible proof. What is the best option for running Wraith nowadays? It was always the most fascinating setting of the lot, but is W20 the only updated version of it? Please tell me there is a CoD translation because I really can't go back to the old world of darkness system.
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Nov 9, 2020 14:03
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Wraith 20th is really a wonderful book. Like all the 20th anniversary books it is mostly just a clean up and collection, but it has some really nice touches. If you don't want to go back to the old White Wolf system you are pretty much out of luck but I would strongly recommend Wr20 just as a cool book to read if you are interested in Wraith. One of the things I like the most is them fleshing out all the Arcanoi. Locking one set of powers behind Guild membership as their trade secrets makes a ton of sense and it really gives you an incentive to actually engage with politics and the setting in ways you didn't always used to. Extra cool is that each Guild has a buddy Guild that you also get the secrets from at a few levels lower. I was just extremely pleased that my Proctor PC finally had more powers available to learn, and if I was actually influential in the Guild I could also learns secret tricks from the Alchemists and Chanteurs too.
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Nov 9, 2020 14:37
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Conditions seem like they would work really well in a computer version of the games, the machine does all the bookkeeping and you can just read tooltips to remind you what things do until you memorize them. Object Oriented Story Telling
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Nov 9, 2020 14:47
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Lord_Hambrose posted:Wraith 20th is really a wonderful book. Like all the 20th anniversary books it is mostly just a clean up and collection, but it has some really nice touches. If you don't want to go back to the old White Wolf system you are pretty much out of luck but I would strongly recommend Wr20 just as a cool book to read if you are interested in Wraith. The recommendation I have for Wraith is to either bite the bullet and use Wraith 20, which is as good as it'll get within a crunchy system, or to just straight up run it as a custom Fate game. Wraith's themes lend themselves pretty well to Fate from my experience, especially the ever-shifting nature of the underworld, and the way your strengths can be tagged as a weakness is both mechanically and thematically appropriate for Shadowguides.
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Nov 9, 2020 14:54
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Goa Tse-tung posted:Conditions seem like they would work really well in a computer version of the games, the machine does all the bookkeeping and you can just read tooltips to remind you what things do until you memorize them. Congrats you’ve figured out the Crusader Kings temporary trait system
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Nov 9, 2020 15:19
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ZearothK posted:What is the best option for running Wraith nowadays? It was always the most fascinating setting of the lot, but is W20 the only updated version of it? Please tell me there is a CoD translation because I really can't go back to the old world of darkness system.
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Nov 9, 2020 15:31
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Goa Tse-tung posted:Conditions seem like they would work really well in a computer version of the games, the machine does all the bookkeeping and you can just read tooltips to remind you what things do until you memorize them. Wouldn't it be cool if the ip was owned by a video game company?
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Nov 9, 2020 16:04
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Dave Brookshaw posted:Wouldn't it be cool if the ip was owned by a video game company?
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Nov 9, 2020 17:11
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i know it'd be expensive to work out but, if we're buying physical books, there's no reason it shouldn't have index cards for conditions and powers. Or give me a PDF sheet to print out on my own. The last time I ran a game i took screen caps of everything we'd need to reference and it made everything so much simpler.
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Nov 9, 2020 17:24
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PHIZ KALIFA posted:i know it'd be expensive to work out but, if we're buying physical books, there's no reason it shouldn't have index cards for conditions and powers. Or give me a PDF sheet to print out on my own. The last time I ran a game i took screen caps of everything we'd need to reference and it made everything so much simpler. They made cards for this already. You can buy them printed from drivethrurpg and they hold up well. We use them for quick reference at the table, but they only work if everyone can sort through to find what we need. So in the before-times. The blue book set was also very useful for quick reference. In internet games, conditions are just one more thing to track and it’s inconvenient and less useful and very easy to forget (and I do it on purpose because we use group beats and don’t find that we’re missing anything important). I keep wanting to run Geist, but we’re just going to run Cyberpunk2.0.2.0. instead because you know what’s better than tracking conditions? Accounting.
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Nov 9, 2020 18:33
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I still hate how almost 90% of Geist's abilities just say "Give you the X Condition with Y tokens on it" so you have to keep paging back and forth between the front and back of the book to see what your stuff does.
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Nov 9, 2020 19:26
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It's extra sad because Geist 2e is a great game, and the Conditions thing is such a stumbling block.
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Nov 9, 2020 19:33
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Dave Brookshaw posted:So, as you can probably tell, the Conditions ephemeral entities impose were designed alongside the rest of the Conditions systems, and do not mesh especially well. They fall into the great flaw of the Storytelling system of it not consciously knowing if Storyteller characters follow all the rules players' characters do. What gets me is that that was still true about the ghost's bones in 1E. Like, Werewolf: the Forsaken's first printing did a fine job explaining what the difference was between a spirit that was invisibly tied to a tree and a spirit which had materialized in order to eat you was. There's very little actual new information encoded in the spirit manifestations conditions flowchart (and some of it I'd frankly do without, like the step in which an ephemeral being needs to throw one of its Influences at an object or place to render it "Open" - seems superfluous to regular story concerns).
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Nov 9, 2020 20:27
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The structure of Influence Conditions seems to favor accessibility for supernatural powers like Mage spells (you can just say "this makes something Controlled") and PCs with familiar spirits above quick accessibility and intuitive understanding for Storyteller use in play. You can see that it's trying for an intuitive and useful idea ("ephemeral entities need a situation to be Adequately Spooky before they can manifest in proportion to how spooky it is"), but bogs it up with the CofD's tendency to describe everything in playable character terms. You get a lot of words about how a spirit needs to find a hot place and engage in an extended action to stoke associations of fire to build up this Condition to that Condition for X scenes without voicing the important unspoken caveat that the system almost always works best when the Storyteller ignores this level of detail and just eyeballs how spookily resonant the situation is and maybe throws some supernatural mood lighting around to set the stage. Calling them Influence Conditions also rankles, because they're not Influences, only one of them is typically created by Influences, and they're not Conditions. They're just presented to the reader very poorly.
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Nov 10, 2020 00:02
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I found a copy of the Kindred: The Embraced TV show and it is so, so bad. The worst part is that the entire soundtrack is listed from Interview With the Vampire and it is very distracting.
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Nov 10, 2020 01:46
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Oh yeah. It's the one thing in my list that just says 'hahah no'. I tracked down the GURPS supplements over it.
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Nov 10, 2020 02:00
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I liked Kindred: The Embraced better when it was Blade: The Series.
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Nov 10, 2020 02:22
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Loomer posted:Oh yeah. It's the one thing in my list that just says 'hahah no'. I tracked down the GURPS supplements over it. God drat when I own something so dumb even Loomer says "Nah".  At least the copy of the Book of Nod that came with it has a nice binding.
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Nov 10, 2020 03:37
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Mulva posted:I liked Kindred: The Embraced better when it was Blade: The Series.
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Nov 10, 2020 04:12
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Some friends and I got very drunk and watched all of Kindred last year. It was an amazing experience, but not one I'd ever recommend to anyone.
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Nov 10, 2020 04:23
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The only thing I remember about that show is the opening scene where they're chasing a guy and it's in the middle of an extremely sunny day, which killed any and all desire I had to watch the show at that time. Someone please summarize this show so I don't waste time and beer on hunting it down and watching it.
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Nov 10, 2020 04:27
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Yawgmoth posted:The only thing I remember about that show is the opening scene where they're chasing a guy and it's in the middle of an extremely sunny day, which killed any and all desire I had to watch the show at that time. Loomer, how many Cainite daywalkers have you identified over the course of The Project, and what are the odds that counting Kindred: The Embraced would double that list or more
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Nov 10, 2020 04:44
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I Am Just a Box posted:Loomer, how many Cainite daywalkers have you identified over the course of The Project, and what are the odds that counting Kindred: The Embraced would double that list or more Just one if memory serves (outside of a few special occurrences - the 'sprint as far as you can as a dog' guy who doesn't really count, etc), so 100%.
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Nov 10, 2020 05:31
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Is the one Jesus, or did Jesus burn in the sunlight like any other vampire?
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Nov 10, 2020 06:00
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Mulva posted:I liked Kindred: The Embraced better when it was Blade: The Series. Blade: The Series was a solid show and I dug Sticky Fingaz's Blade as much as Snipe's.
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Nov 10, 2020 06:15
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Yawgmoth posted:The only thing I remember about that show is the opening scene where they're chasing a guy and it's in the middle of an extremely sunny day, which killed any and all desire I had to watch the show at that time. Someone please summarize this show so I don't waste time and beer on hunting it down and watching it. shhh you're not supposed to notice that it's a really, really lovely day for night shot. Or sunrise I think? I watched the pilot and it is bad.
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Nov 10, 2020 06:27
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I Am Just a Box posted:Is the one Jesus, or did Jesus burn in the sunlight like any other vampire? Jesus was just a vampire. The story is actually a repudiation of Christianity because Vampire Jesus, as far as he's concerned, already has a religion, and it's Judaism.
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Nov 10, 2020 06:33
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joylessdivision posted:shhh you're not supposed to notice that it's a really, really lovely day for night shot. Or sunrise I think? I watched the pilot and it is bad. I thought they had that "you can go in sunlight if you've fed recently" thing going on? God, I hated that show. Hated it so much I have the box set. Didn't they bring in an assamite towards the end of the season?
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Nov 10, 2020 08:03
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I also remember a wonderful scene in Kindred where C. Thomas Howell falls asleep on the sofa, in front of an open window, while holding an oversized Bugsy Malone-esque 'phosphorus' gun? And a vampire jumps through the window and just stands there in place, doing the menacing vampire hiss at him, but not actually attacking or even moving away from the window? And then C. Thomas just sort of lazily wakes up, focuses, and then picks up the phosphorus gun and then shoots the vampire neatly back out of the window? Great stuff.
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Nov 10, 2020 09:54
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Froghammer posted:Blade: The Series was great how dare you ......? Yes it was, that was the point.
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Nov 10, 2020 12:53
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Kindred was the one where the Brujah were all jackboots about societal control and law and order and how everyone had to fit into and acknowledge a clear hierarchy, right? I swear I saw a review of it on YouTube like six years ago by a WoD fan who basically just shrugged and said its bizarre misunderstanding of the source material wasn't even the worst thing in the show.
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Nov 10, 2020 17:54
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Yeah the brujah were venture, and the gangrel were brujah and everyone could turn into wolves and all the nosferatu looked the same.
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Nov 10, 2020 18:08
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Soonmot posted:Yeah the brujah were venture, and the gangrel were brujah and everyone could turn into wolves and all the nosferatu looked the same. MRH was a loving producer for the series is what baffles me the most. Like it was probably just a "We'll call you a producer but that has no actual power" kinda deal but seriously how do you manage to gently caress up a property like that in 96? LOL executive produced by Aaron Spelling
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Nov 10, 2020 20:14
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Soonmot posted:Yeah the brujah were venture, and the gangrel were brujah and everyone could turn into wolves and all the nosferatu looked the same. Also the Prince learned Protean from the Nosferatu for some reason.
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Nov 10, 2020 20:27
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I like Kindred in spite of how stupid and weird it is. I guess it never bothered me much that the Brujah were kinda mobsters instead of punks and the like. Actually I might re-watch that this week.
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Nov 10, 2020 23:36
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I only ever watched the first one or two episodes, but the only thing I remember literally decades later is a whole-rear end scene of the protagonist being chased around by a wolf. At the end when the wolf catches him it turns into a vampire and says something like "Stop following us." An entire chase scene where the pursuer's message was "don't follow me." Obviously it makes enough sense in context. But it was just so loving goofy. The whole thing is like $30 on Amazon. Might need to pick it up.
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Nov 10, 2020 23:58
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| # ? Jun 3, 2024 21:57 |
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Speaking of giving money to Jeff Bezos: Please excuse the spam~   TG Secret Santa is Back Again
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Nov 11, 2020 01:21
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