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South, Quality
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Nov 12, 2020 05:19
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North, Quantityy The Tarim Basin was Tibets once, it should be Tibet's again.
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Nov 12, 2020 06:03
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Sanzh posted:South, Quantity
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Nov 12, 2020 07:12
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South dont care about what ideas we use as long as we go south 
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Nov 12, 2020 11:47
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Sanzh posted:South, Quantity There's an argument I can support, South, Quantity
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Nov 12, 2020 13:18
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South, Trade The spice must flow.
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Nov 12, 2020 15:01
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East Quantity We must
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Nov 12, 2020 17:05
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Southern Trade will make us rich beyond belief
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Nov 12, 2020 17:12
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South, Plutocratic
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Nov 12, 2020 19:29
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Tulip posted:South, Quality
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Nov 12, 2020 19:43
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Jeoh posted:South, Trade 
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Nov 12, 2020 22:29
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Jeoh posted:South, Trade
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Nov 13, 2020 02:13
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South, Quantity
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Nov 13, 2020 02:40
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Pacho posted:South, Trade Yyyyyyyyyee-up.
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Nov 13, 2020 04:44
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 Great NingSouth, Plutocratic
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Nov 13, 2020 20:41
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Republicanism means anyone can now stab their way to the top! North, Espionage
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Nov 13, 2020 22:05
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South And how can we stand to be Sacred in name only? Religious!
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Nov 13, 2020 23:38
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Coward posted:And how can we stand to be Sacred in name only? We're not, we're Heavenly in name only. The Sacred Empire are losers.
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Nov 14, 2020 01:19
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South, and Quantity. It is too late for Tibet to have a colonial empire that is anything but what Germany had: Small and useless. But we could control the World Island.
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Nov 14, 2020 01:52
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megane posted:We're not, we're Heavenly in name only. The Sacred Empire are losers. A good point, supported only by the so-called "correct and actual facts" and even more reason to further Religious ideas if even I can screw up our divine standing while hastily tapping on my phone while taking my two-year old to toddler dance classes.
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Nov 14, 2020 10:28
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South Trade
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Nov 15, 2020 01:58
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 The vote is closed. Campaign Directions Go North: 3 (Technowolf, zealouscub, Chatrapati) Go South: 21 (Freudian, Sanzh, idhrendur, TheFlyingLlama, megane, Pacho, Tulip, Rody One Half, ThatBasqueGuy, RabidWeasel, Jeoh, Lynneth, frankenfreak, Lord Cyrahzax, HereticMIND, Rubix Squid, TinTower, Viola the Mad, Ikasuhito, Coward, South) Go West: 1 (habeusdorkus) Go East: 1 (QuoProQuid) To the east, in China, is the king of divination; In the south, in India, is the king of religion; To the west, in Persia, is the king of wealth; In the north is Gesar, the king of soldiers and war. The Rgyal po bka’ thang, translated by F. W. Thomas, cited in Stein (1959). Ideas: Expansion: 1 (habeusdorkus) Trade: 8 (Freudian, Pacho, Jeoh, Lynneth, HereticMIND, Rubix Squid. Viola the Mad, Crazycryodude) Quantity: 8 (Sanzh, megane, zealouscub, Rody One Half, RabidWeasel, QuoProQuid, TinTower, Fivemarks) Quality: 4 (idhrendur, Technowolf, Tulip, Lord Cyrahzax) Plutocratic: 3 (TheFlyingLlama, frankenfreak, Ikasuhito) Espionage: 1 (Chatrapati) Religious: 1 (Coward) (Abstentions: 1 (ThatBasqueGuy)) With 26 votes, our decision is to Go South. Our ideas are tied, between Trade and Quantity. The next post in this thread will decide which one it is. Kangxi fucked around with this message at 02:04 on Nov 15, 2020 |
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Nov 15, 2020 02:01
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TRADE BABY
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Nov 15, 2020 02:02
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Trade it is.
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Nov 15, 2020 02:03
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Freudian posted:TRADE BABY Knowingly casting two votes. Cant believe you'd subvert Sacred Democracy like this. You're right though 
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Nov 15, 2020 02:05
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It's definitely the better choice than Quantity and since we're not in a position where we're getting a lot of extra merchants elsewhere, it's actually pretty good.
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Nov 15, 2020 02:07
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Alikchi posted:Knowingly casting two votes. Cant believe you'd subvert Sacred Democracy like this. You're right though One was my dead mother's.
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Nov 15, 2020 02:12
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Chapter 72: 1626 to 1638 - Mergers and Acquisitions The Life of Hnin Yi is the chronicle of the personal life and business affairs of Daw Hnin Yi, a Burmese merchant and minor aristocrat who played a role in the organization of trading companies in the first decades of the Tibetan republic. Her reproduced and excerpted memoirs provide an intriguing portrait of the life and concerns of a non-aristocratic property owner in the late 17th century.  Some interesting news coming out of court - new decrees on trading companies and interest in funding merchants' expeditions. It was the kind of news I was hoping desperately to hear. Trade and commerce do not come up out of the ocean like the foam; it relies on kings and governments to make way for it. It cannot be done by dead traditions or patrimony alone; it can be done by law or negotiation. It can be done by living individuals.  It is about time. We can't fall behind where the rest of the world makes its plans, you have to find something to do when your guests show up late.  The new empress is not the most popular figure, from what I've heard. She was a veteran of the wars of Gyalyum II. While she was known for her bravery, she is an obsessive manager who will interfere in the most trivial matters and demand that even the most minor officials in the army and bureaucracy adhere to her standards.   But I must give her credit; she follows her promises. The army is moving through the central Burmese provinces and hopes to seize the port of Pathein, owned by Mogadishu. We do need more ports, not just those on the Bay of Bengal. And what can the King of Pegu give us that the Tibetans can't?   The court takes in money and spends it; at least it's on useful things like warships.  I make sure to have a long lunch with officials from Delhi and elsewhere on shipping routes overland and what might be done once we have the routes further east.   These guilds and the nobles have had too much of a comfortable hold on weaving for too long. I'll have the cotton weavers work outside of the cities if I have to, drat the consequences. The problem is that there just aren't enough buyers as there used to be - the wealthy nobles can hold on and wait it out, but the smallholders are panicking.  But I do feel some confidence in seeing all those new warships being built in port - marvels of engineering and design. The ports feel more alive, in any case.  But months later, I get the news from a coffee convoy that headed back from Ethiopia: the fleet was defeated. Those sons of flea-bitten dogs can't help themselves, now can they? How do you win with fewer cannons and ships? Half of these captains think they're Lasya the Great and can always win with fewer sailors and cannons.  Now they're blockading the ports and getting anything out is a pain. We're losing money hand over fist with all this ivory and tea just sitting in Dhaka or Mrauk U or what have you.  And if that wasn't enough, the Tamils are cutting us off. We'd have to go to Andhra.... or all the way around to Gujarat. All that's left are the eastward routes.  But when the Mogadishu fleet does split up, we can recover at least.  What the army does now, I don't claim to understand, but I know they needed cannon for it.    The war did finally break in our favor - when Ethiopia decided that now was the time to crush Mogadishu. A captain of a coffee ship from Yemen told me the war started when they left and it would be over by the time they returned. They took apart Mogadishu like I'd pull apart warm noodles.  But the war was over and we have a new river port in Pathein. I think that was the first war Tibet won in my lifetime that wasn't a civil war. It's a little thing, but a lot of people are cheerful about it. Confidence is the kind of thing that commerce relies upon. And that short gap in travel time meant so many more goods might arrive on time.   The next and most obvious move would have been to advance on Hanthawaddy Pegu, but as it turns out there's some drat fool business in the old empire that demands attention. The Rajputana kingdom has gone too far in invading one of Tibet's remaining allies in the Empire. Really, there's one other reason why-  Always kick the motherfucker when he's down.  No secrets or hidden techniques can be kept forever.  While I was at first suspicious of the new empress, I admire the fact that she will still go out and lead the army herself. She learned a lot from her namesake.  Though I wonder what the original would have done with cannons and muskets.   The war was decided quickly, near Ajmer,   and a fair tribute was paid.  Delhi would continue its campaign against Multan with Rajputana defeated. And Delhi would be proud in achieving glory for itself.  Palkye Gyalyum, 'Gyalyum III', as they've already started to call her, began to reform the state church. She organized a series of local militias and officer recruitment programs for the Warriors of the First Empress Gyalyum - everybody just calls them the Knuckle Slammers, after an ancient epithet for Gyalyum I. They're a tough lot, but very stiff to deal with. I can't pay them off to do business for myself, which is unusual. They look like they're wearing theatre costumes, really, but they're still good shots with a musket and decent sword fighters, as well...  But finally, in 1631, the campaign against Hanthawaddy Pegu began - and we Burmese who are subjects of the empire would prove our loyalty as best we could. It's up to us to do our part; even though I am from no senior family or ally of Gyalyum I, the republic is a place where I can still prove my worth.    Jharkand meanwhile joined Pegu - betraying their own alliance with Tibet!!! - and were defeated. Our own navy bested Pegu's navy.   Our armies marched south and west, and their cannon fired true, and could be reloaded quickly.  It's premature, but 'Gyalyum III' issued coins with her name embossed on them. I saw them while taking care of some payments and I almost got in an argument with client over if they were real. Lhasa really is far away, sometimes that's the first time you hear we have a new head of state.  Our armies would take the cities of Jharkhand,   and Pegu, Dagon, and Pyay were conquered.  I went to a stupa to meditate, as one does, and found chants and sutras in dedication to boddhisvatas I no longer recognized. The Bon temples had new local gods. What is happening here? What has changed...?  Our convoys were protected and were guaranteed through imperial law. A new set of laws and courts was established to address all these matters; and while Tibet is not as strong as it was, it will have some sway over the rest of the empire, I'd imagine. Now here is some standard for comparing customs and laws.   After defeating the Thai armies once more, the Tibetan armies marched on the great city of Ayutthaya.  Victory was within our grasp. All the glory of Dagon and Ayutthaya...a great march south...   And then.... and then... the war with Delhi had broken out again. All the southern empire had decided to invade, and Tibet would have to join in, else it might lose its only ally within the empire and its western flank be totally exposed.  The western army was defeated.   In a panic, Gyalyum III declared peace before the capital of Ayutthaya fell.  It was as if a great crystal vessel had been knocked off its pedestal and shattered, and could not be put back together. This was still a victory, but not the decisive one she had wanted. It was likely that chance would not come for her again.  While the army was short of troops, as ever, the treasury somehow grew even in wartime. The court took in so much more from more trade, and the farms and workshops that were ruined from the past decades of war had recovered.  The enemy armies soon invaded Delhi,  and many remaining powers within the false Empire soon went to oppose us.   Our armies were defeated not only by sheer force of numbers; that's the easy story someone would tell to make themselves feel better. Their generals were also skilled. Their troops were well trained and supplied. What, do you think that all the rest of India is a blank canvas for the rest of us to write upon? Where do you think they learned this from?   When we we're caught on the backfoot, they sent armies at us, Delhi, and Nepal. There were rumors of treason. I doubted then and still doubt it - so much as there are people who have pocketed a bit too much and hid it. Sloppy sloppy.   It was a bit of back and forth.   But the armies still rampaged,  and Tibet had to pay an indemnity and Delhi was hit the worst. They would lose all infuence over Multan. A defeat, but not a catastrophe. This was a loss that Tibet could recover from, and it sure matters that we're not running out of money and begging for our creditors to leave us alone. Even in bad moments, we are still above the time of troubles. But what matters now is that we have to avoid any further entanglements with the false Empire before we move anywhere else. If somebody's lashed for stealing, or pays a fine, he can still recover; it's not like the prisoner who is left to die of exposure in Mongolia.  We still have our fanatics to deal with; enough people who talk about the rise of Gyalyum II or the corruption of the state church, and so on,  And the lands around us are beset by people also calling themselves Gyalyum, but the second one. She's become more than a blessed or deified empress, she's something that everyone else projects their ambitions on.  The empire still prospers.  And for the first time in decades, it expands. Even if the empress had to end the war quickly, we now have all the towns along the Irrawaddy, and whoever orders the armies next can win.  Well, as soon as these damned fanatics are killed. Bad for business when you've got more rebels, but it's just something that the army must combat.  It would be nice if they put them down any time soon.  In 1635, 'Gyalyum III' passed away. She was almost 70. She was not a bad ruler; she was the first ruler in decades to win a war. She had no idea how to speak to people aside from giving orders to them in the field, and she had no idea how to understand what other rulers could do.   The news from the sortition and the name drawn from the golden urn was a mystery to all - who was Jekundag Palden? There was some doubt over the wisdom of the gods. I had first heard from my friends in Lhasa that he was a modest and tolerant man.  But at least one willing to crush thieves and bandits in the countryside, so he's not a monk or anything like that. Or that pretty boy in the play I saw who kept second-guessing himself and had problems with just stabbing people.  The next news I heard wasn't from Lhasa. A caravan guard who worked the Pu'er tea routes told me this about his last trip from China.  Dali, a buffer state set up and administered by the Bai, has moved east, overthrowing Yue and Ning, and they seem to be the real heirs to China at this point.  Our new ruler doesn't seem very interested in doing much at this point -- not the worst fault for a ruler. But still a serious one.   Very passive and reactive. He doesn't decide what happens, he desperately wants everybody to like him.  But the rest of us can just make the case for what we need; and so the imperial republic continues to function.   As for the Sacred Empire to the south, Rajputana can't control everything either; the Tamils have gobbled up one of their neighboring city-states like a samusa.  I admit sometimes I envy them; they are not so beholden to other customs or old laws; the aristocracy which is a dead weight on the rest of the empire is not so powerful there, and those with ambition and ability are free to do as they choose. If there was a state like that... where the drive for self-improvement and improving ones circumstances could be allowed to flourish... that would be a world away from the deadening world of the old aristocracy.  And now the emperor builds forts on the frontier with the old empire - where such a thing would have been unthinkable years before. Now that's another set of tolls and payments we have to deal with when moving goods through.  If I were to pull out my new looking glass and gaze upon all the peoples of the world, what would I find?  The components of the Sacred Tibetan Empire still squabbling over some remnant of other emperors' glory,  A patchwork of Taira trading posts over a vast and unknown wilderness,  The Malians march east and now may venture close to Ethiopian lands.  I hear sailors tell of distant rivers, waiting to be explored and mapped,  On the other side of the world, the half-dead remnants of ruined empires still cling to life,  Distant lands now have their owner or claimant.  And for us, well, our newly elected leader is a timid man, but I will at least grant the recognition that he won't be another tyrant. The Great Powers: 1638 
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Nov 17, 2020 23:14
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Told you we should've gone with Quantity. We can be rich, we can be prosperous, we can have elite troops. But when Manpower hits 0, that's it, we've lost a war. The Republic needs to reform how it recruits and trains its army: we need a Mass Levy, and a system for amalgamating veteran battalions with recruit battalions, We need Quality Ideas.
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Nov 18, 2020 08:20
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We need to break up Dali is what we need to do. The Republic's reclamation of our rightful Indian territory is inevitable, but our long term stability can only be ensured by preventing unification in the east.
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Nov 18, 2020 08:43
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Jekundag Palden is trying his best. 
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Nov 18, 2020 17:37
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VOTE: 1638 Jekundag Paltsen, in his usual process of administration, has summoned a group of nobles and representatives from the commoners on a regular basis and reads to them from his notes about the state of the realm. This involves a massive set of prepared remarks, which he reads aloud, ceaselessly, after donning his eyeglasses and going through them page by page. For the most part, you haven't been paying attention, either staring at an elaborate mural of Gyalyum I, trying to catch the eye of one of the cute guards, or trying to avoid the combative gaze of one of the Knuckle Slammers who looks almost as bored as you are. To be honest, there are worse things than a boring government. At the mention of the word "Burma", everyone else suddenly bolts to attention. You see one of the Knuckle Slammers jostling the woman next to her so she wakes.  Jekundag continues: "With the improving situation in recruitment, as well as the ability to maintain a stable income from taxation, I believe we can resume the war with the Burmese sometime after 1641 at the earliest.  Given the overwhelming popularity of the previous campaign, I see no reason to change the direction of the current military buildup and expenditure - if the Burmese campaign is successful with the capture of either Dagon or Mawlamyine, I may anticipate moves further south towards the Kra Isthmus, or east towards Hsipaw and Ayutthaya. However, I will continue to accept input over further campaigns." The expected murmurs from the crowd. You swear he almost smiles. (This is an informal vote; I'll keep in mind any majority the thread reaches here after at least one more campaign against the south; broad or narrow suggestions welcome and I'll work from there.)  "Finally, there is the expected matter, which has been raised to me from multiple interested persons, of the standardization and regulation of those procedures involved in our republican government..."  "Over the reorganization of a parliament with representatives across all the people for the discussion of issues,"  "Or if some concentration of power is to be established in the executive authority of the government. I am not going to provide an argument for one way or the other; as you are no doubt aware of the advantages and disadvantages of both. It must be known that the procedures of our government should be standardized." Vote for A) Parliament or B) Presidential System; A) will restore parliamentary mechanics and more thread votes and B) will make Tibet act based on specific rulers and their personalities.  THE WORLD: 1638 The vote will close on Saturday, November 21, at 9 PM EST.
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Nov 19, 2020 02:25
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Tibet needs a B) Presidential System.
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Nov 19, 2020 02:28
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A Parliament! Democracy! Votes! Also good god that Ghana(?). And that mess in Central Asia, somebody needs to unify all those states.
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Nov 19, 2020 02:31
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A
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Nov 19, 2020 02:38
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A
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Nov 19, 2020 02:40
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B
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Nov 19, 2020 02:46
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A
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Nov 19, 2020 03:01
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A!
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Nov 19, 2020 03:21
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B We must become the America of the East.
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Nov 19, 2020 03:29
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