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Yeah give Butcher money or don't, but the real story is that his books this year were just on the okay end of the spectrum.
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Nov 18, 2020 00:18
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docbeard posted:Yeah give Butcher money or don't, but the real story is that his books this year were just on the okay end of the spectrum. Going to disagree here and say that Peace Talks and Battle Ground were dumpster fires. Meanwhile, re-read Verus while I've been stuck at home with COVID and its held up. First three books were kinda hokey but after that the series picked up and got better. It helps that Verus finally says gently caress it and embraces being ruthless with people that gently caress with the people and magical creatures he cares about.
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Nov 18, 2020 03:57
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For an alternative perspective, Peace Talks and Battle Ground were 1 book that was actually pretty good overall. Battle Ground in particular contained a lot of "holy poo poo" moments, so if you want to see what it looks like when people besides Dresden cut loose I would read them.
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Nov 18, 2020 04:10
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The only real issue with the PT+BG set is that they should have been one book, and editing them into two screw up the pacing a little.
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Nov 18, 2020 05:19
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biracial bear for uncut posted:Going to disagree here and say that Peace Talks and Battle Ground were dumpster fires. Well, it's not like Verus was exactly super-nice toward those types in the first place. It's more that he's got the power to go after the bigger game asshle. Meanwhile, given that you seem to utterly despise Jim Butcher's works, why do you continue to read them? And you are reading them. You can discuss them intelligently and are fully conversant with even somewhat minor plot and character points. So, why? I used to read Laurell K. Hamilton's "Anita Blake" series. I stopped reading in the middle of Narcissus in Chains because the "poly" strangeness and other stuff just got to be too much. And for the most part I haven't looked back. I know I certainly can't discuss anything that happened after that book. Even when earlier books come up in discussion here I sometimes have to hit Wikipedia to remind myself of some plot and characters because I literally haven't read any of her works in almost 20 years (NiC came out in 2001). So, why are you continuing to read and discuss an author for whom you seem to have nothing but contempt? Forget us, why do you put yourself through that? I'm not even taking shots at you. I'm honestly curious to know.
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Nov 18, 2020 05:41
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Everyone posted:Well, it's not like Verus was exactly super-nice toward those types in the first place. It's more that he's got the power to go after the bigger game asshle. They don't need to justify themselves to you. I see this question pop up a lot in this thread and it's always to try and dogpile someone for not liking something that they clearly have read and actually understand.
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Nov 18, 2020 06:18
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Kchama posted:They don't need to justify themselves to you. I see this question pop up a lot in this thread and it's always to try and dogpile someone for not liking something that they clearly have read and actually understand. I'm not asking for justification. I'm just curious. If I don't like something, I avoid it. I'm not into basketball, so I don't watch it. I don't follow it closely and then write various screeds against it. It just seems odd to me. Maybe they're a professional book reviewer who is required to read the books. I'd just like to know, that's all.
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Nov 18, 2020 11:16
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biracial bear for uncut posted:Going to disagree here and say that Peace Talks and Battle Ground were dumpster fires. In a rare "agreeing with you" moment I'd say that's fair for Peace Talks on its own. I enjoyed the combined two books a fair bit more (and certainly more than you seem to have) but it wasn't exactly a return to the glory days of the series for me. I'm just getting over COVID myself and what an absolute bastard of a disease. Hope you're okay, friend. I've been meaning to try out Verus for a while after seeing it talked up here. The time I've felt like devoting to pleasure reading has gone way downhill of late, though.
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Nov 18, 2020 12:29
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Peace Talks, while necessary to set up the plot for Battle Ground, wasn't that great. The only thing that really saves it is the fact that Battle Ground came out shortly after. If we had had to wait even another year for BG, I think a lot of people would be angry instead of just disappointed with it.
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Nov 18, 2020 15:22
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I have a feeling all the Thomas garbage was added in as filler, because I can't imagine wanting to put that in.
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Nov 18, 2020 15:35
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Everyone posted:I'm not asking for justification. I'm just curious. If I don't like something, I avoid it. I'm not into basketball, so I don't watch it. I don't follow it closely and then write various screeds against it. It just seems odd to me. Maybe they're a professional book reviewer who is required to read the books. I'd just like to know, that's all. Buddy, I have had this exact same thought over so many things on the Internet over the years that I have stopped questioning it. I've transitioned into a more laissez-faire attitude, where people can be free to hate something or like something regardless of the why of it all. "No why" if you will.
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Nov 18, 2020 21:04
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Gologle posted:Buddy, I have had this exact same thought over so many things on the Internet over the years that I have stopped questioning it. I've transitioned into a more laissez-faire attitude, where people can be free to hate something or like something regardless of the why of it all. "No why" if you will. As long as they've submitted the proper "Permission To Hate <X> On The Internet" forms and schedules, sure. I assume bbfu's paperwork is up to date.
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Nov 18, 2020 21:06
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Everyone posted:I'm not asking for justification. I'm just curious. If I don't like something, I avoid it. I'm not into basketball, so I don't watch it. I don't follow it closely and then write various screeds against it. It just seems odd to me. Maybe they're a professional book reviewer who is required to read the books. I'd just like to know, that's all. Hey man, I get it. I also have no idea why someone would do a hate-watch or hate-read or hate-whatever on the regular. One offs, sure. Sometimes you just need to know more about something even if you hate that thing. But to regularly consume a form of entertainment that you loathe? I don't understand why anyone would do that instead of anything else. I could say that it's confused us both--buh-dum-tsh! In the end, though, it doesn't matter. People can hate-read whatever they want. It's not my time they're wasting.
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Nov 18, 2020 21:25
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Next Alex Verus (the second to last?), Forged, is out on Tuesday next week. Get your preorders in.
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Nov 18, 2020 22:06
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Everyone posted:I'm not asking for justification. I'm just curious. If I don't like something, I avoid it. I'm not into basketball, so I don't watch it. I don't follow it closely and then write various screeds against it. It just seems odd to me. Maybe they're a professional book reviewer who is required to read the books. I'd just like to know, that's all. Explain yourselves screed writers!
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Nov 19, 2020 00:51
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Drone Jett posted:Next Alex Verus (the second to last?), Forged, is out on Tuesday next week. Get your preorders in. I'd like to know what the imbued dress does for Anne, seeing as its the last thing Arachne made before leaving forever, so it seems like a big deal. Also, seems like Alex could solve the Dark-Anne dilemma with the Dreamstone by opening a portal in Elsewhere and asking Dark-Anne to let Light-Anne go through it to the "real" world, or vice-versa. There is no reason they couldn't then "grow" replacement sections of their personalities once free to do so.
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Nov 19, 2020 03:37
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Also I keep reading Dresden because this thread keeps talking about that series and I can't say "thing that happened in the book was bad" if I didn't read the book.
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Nov 19, 2020 04:16
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Drone Jett posted:Next Alex Verus (the second to last?), Forged, is out on Tuesday next week. Get your preorders in. Oh boy looking forward to this. I was probably gonna do a Verus re-read over the holidays too.
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Nov 19, 2020 05:22
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Isn't new Verus coming out Dec 1st? Not next week. But regardless, I am saving it for Dec 3rd when I have a 5 hour train journey.
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Nov 19, 2020 06:29
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Darkrenown posted:Isn't new Verus coming out Dec 1st? Not next week. But regardless, I am saving it for Dec 3rd when I have a 5 hour train journey. US Amazon has it next Tuesday.
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Nov 19, 2020 09:21
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Ah, UK Amazon is a week later.
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Nov 19, 2020 09:25
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biracial bear for uncut posted:It helps that Verus finally says gently caress it and embraces being ruthless with people that gently caress with the people and magical creatures he cares about. I gotta disagree. His continual lack of suffering any consequences of the endless bullshit he pulls is exactly what put me off.
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Nov 19, 2020 12:49
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OscarDiggs posted:I gotta disagree. His continual lack of suffering any consequences of the endless bullshit he pulls is exactly what put me off. How far into the series did you get?
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Nov 19, 2020 13:13
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:How far into the series did you get? Not very. I think I quit after the book that really put me off. The brother of the woman he killed trying to get revenge. And the ultimate consequence for that was He then killed the brother of the sister he killed I think actually what really put me off was how entitled he was about it. "A bloo bloo bloo. Doesnt he know how sad killing his sister made me?" Just utterly full of himself and mad at the fact any consequence might be coming back to bite him.
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Nov 19, 2020 13:23
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OscarDiggs posted:Not very. I think I quit after the book that really put me off. Pretty entitled of him not to want to be murdered and to prefer any way to stop it other than being forced to kill in self defense.
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Nov 19, 2020 13:48
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Drone Jett posted:Pretty entitled of him not to want to be murdered and to prefer any way to stop it other than being forced to kill in self defense. He was pretty eager to get on the murder train as I recall. It was basically his plan from the get go. It was only when he found out he actually deserved it that he started getting all whiny about how unfair it all was. And call me uneducated, but I don't think it should count as a consequence if to solve it, you do the exact same thing that caused you suffer that consequence in the first place, only more so.
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Nov 19, 2020 13:54
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OscarDiggs posted:Not very. I think I quit after the book that really put me off. He starts facing consequences after that point and for that reason. Friends cut him off, he loses allies, etc. I liked it though because it's a much more honest and realistic "dark past" than what Dresden has. Verus actually has a legitimately criminal past.
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Nov 19, 2020 13:55
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:He starts facing consequences after that point and for that reason. Friends cut him off, he loses allies, etc. So I basically quit at exactly the wrong time, which was way to early?
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Nov 19, 2020 13:58
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Without even reading back, I'm assuming the new title of this thread is a Anita Blake reference right?
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Nov 19, 2020 14:01
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biracial bear for uncut posted:Also I keep reading Dresden because this thread keeps talking about that series and I can't say "thing that happened in the book was bad" if I didn't read the book. While I still can't understand this, it's vastly preferable to the Games version wherein people quit playing a game but hang around and post for years about it's bad they don't like it
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Nov 19, 2020 14:08
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feedmegin posted:Without even reading back, I'm assuming the new title of this thread is a Anita Blake reference right? I've not heard anything about Anita Blake. Is it worth a read?
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Nov 19, 2020 14:18
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OscarDiggs posted:I've not heard anything about Anita Blake. Is it worth a read? I liked the early books. The character is a necromancer who solves crimes and is menaced/romanced by a vampire, then various were-things turn up. Over time, there's less crime solving and more badly written sex; the thread quote made me think of 'Micah', where there's a single scene of some necromancing going on, then an entire book of bad erotica about Anita shagging the author's stand-in of her new post-divorce boyfriend (including lots of description of how massive his cock is), then a single scene of some more necromancing. I gave up after that.
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Nov 19, 2020 14:23
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OscarDiggs posted:I gotta disagree. His continual lack of suffering any consequences of the endless bullshit he pulls is exactly what put me off. Pretty much every single book after the Nightstalkers has been things getting worse for him based on things he did in the first few books.
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Nov 19, 2020 14:27
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I'm a few books behind on Verus, but yeah he's basically spent his entire life trying to get out from under his Dark upbringing and then later what he had to do to survive the first few books and failing.
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Nov 19, 2020 14:50
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OscarDiggs posted:So I basically quit at exactly the wrong time, which was way to early? I mean, your mileage may vary. I basically agree with what the other folks are saying but there’s definitely also a "fuckhead is getting away with it after all" analysis. Some of his [former] allies express such sentiments with some force!
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Nov 19, 2020 15:16
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:I mean, your mileage may vary. I basically agree with what the other folks are saying but there’s definitely also a "fuckhead is getting away with it after all" analysis. Some of his [former] allies express such sentiments with some force! Okay, well I came here specifically to find books to read because I hit a drought, so if there are honest to god consequences, most of my complaints are gone. Because aside from that issue, I enjoyed most aspects of the series. It was just that this specific thing was unignorable. So I'll be happy to give it another shot knowing about this.
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Nov 19, 2020 15:40
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OscarDiggs posted:Okay, well I came here specifically to find books to read because I hit a drought, so if there are honest to god consequences, most of my complaints are gone. Read Piranesi if you haven't, even though it's short.
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Nov 19, 2020 15:54
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From what I remember, Verus didn't murder his sister, though he was complicit in getting her captured. And it was the thing which made him break with Drakh, and he risked his life to save her, and got tortured for it for a while when imprisoned for doing that, before finally escaping. So to me it looked a lot more complex than murderer getting off without consequences.
His Divine Shadow fucked around with this message at 11:20 on Nov 20, 2020 |
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Nov 19, 2020 16:25
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His Divine Shadow posted:From what I remember, Verus didn't murder his sister, though he was complicit in getting her captured. And it was the thing which made him break with Drakh, and he risked his life to save her, and got tortured for it for a while when imprisoned for doing that, before finally escaping. So to me it looked a lot more complex than murderer getting off without consequences. Well, technically, he'd still be guilty of felony murder under American law & the "hand of one is the hand of all" doctrine. Like, yes, everything you say is correct, but legally he still could be found guilty of murder if brought to trial. He literally, technically, got away with murder. For me at least that's the most interesting thing about the Verus series. The "dark pasts" of most urban fantasy protagonists generally need quotation marks; his doesn't, it's real. Added spoiler tags for new readers just in case Hieronymous Alloy fucked around with this message at 16:34 on Nov 19, 2020 |
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Nov 19, 2020 16:30
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Speaking of dark pasts, and the way they keep alluding to poo poo in Dresden, I wonder how long it'll be before they end up revealing that the White Council orchestrated events so that Harry's dad would die and he'd end up with Justin and subsequently at the Council's mercy, some lovely "forge him into the tool we need" thing, kinda like Terry in Batman Beyond.
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Nov 19, 2020 17:32
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