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Borrovan posted:It's racist because it is literally giving unfavourable treatment to people on the basis of nationality (thus, indirectly, race), OP. Also, whilst you could talk about having a system of legal controls in place to, for example, prevent making people stateless, or deportation to countries where they will be subjected to torture &c, we already have those rules & the State tries its very best to ignore them anyway. You could strengthen those rules up all you like, and the State would still try to ignore them, sometimes successfully, meaning that foreign nationals have to live under the damoclean threat of complete withdrawal of human rights protections, whatever the law says. I think one aspect that gets overlooked is that the criminal system does get things wrong in about 1 in 30 times or so, and destroying lives of those who end up falsely convicted more than it already does is not great. Also the whole windrush thing obviously, where there's undocumented people who may be either British citizens or residents without it being clear. The bigger issue is honestly barriers to entry and gaining status - even if you have long-term residence (as I and other EU migrants now do with ILR) you can get in trouble for minor transgressions like car tickets if you travel a lot, nevermind those on a visa. And you won't get citizenship if you have significant fines/cautions/bankruptcy, not to mention any serious stuff. Really it should be the 12 months for everything. This is genuinely a factor for why I won't get a car or go on demonstrations unless I become a citizen. e: Of course as with a lot of things should be doesn't mean ever will. Private Speech fucked around with this message at 12:35 on Dec 14, 2020 |
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Dec 14, 2020 12:20
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Sanford posted:Sorry for self posting but for some unfathomable reason I trust people in this thread. My wife is on new medication for depression and was advised it might take a couple of weeks to “stabilise”. She spent most of Saturday moping around looking sad until finally admitting she just wanted some quiet, so I ran her a bath and sent her to bed. Yesterday she was bright and cheerful and said it helped loads, we had a lovely time doing Xmas decs with our daughter, but today she’s very down again. She says she’s fine but clearly isn’t, is there anything I should be doing other than checking in with her, and hourly deliveries of tea/mince pies? We’re both working from home but it’s very quiet so she’s tied to her desk without having much to do. Want to help but don’t know how! I don't have experience in this but various relatives have been on depression meds, and I'd say contact the doc and let them know what's happening and keep tabs on it, maybe try and get an appointment sooner than 2 weeks (which will be xmas - new year week). Also, maybe she could get a sick note to be officially NOT working if being tied to an inactive work computer isn't helping so she could at least go out for walks or whatever helps.
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Dec 14, 2020 12:21
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Guardian running damage control https://twitter.com/peterwalker99/status/1338413678778077184?s=19
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Dec 14, 2020 12:22
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https://twitter.com/tristandross/status/1338443262428934144?s=19
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Dec 14, 2020 12:25
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Jose posted:Guardian running damage control
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Dec 14, 2020 12:29
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Re Peace & Justice party: I can't find it now but late last night I saw some tweets going on about why was Corbyn's new project registered as a limited company not a charity with the sort of responses you'd expect "because it would be subject to scrutiny" etc. Thread favourite Tweetman actually posted a sensible reply about it not being so easy to set up as a charity (can't remember the exact things she said - something about not being allowed to set up a charity if you have 'political aims' then of course the replies to that went off onto so you can only fight for peace and justice if you're political, eh? kind of stuff ).
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Dec 14, 2020 12:31
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Borrovan posted:It's racist because it is literally giving unfavourable treatment to people on the basis of nationality (thus, indirectly, race), OP. Also, whilst you could talk about having a system of legal controls in place to, for example, prevent making people stateless, or deportation to countries where they will be subjected to torture &c, we already have those rules & the State tries its very best to ignore them anyway. You could strengthen those rules up all you like, and the State would still try to ignore them, sometimes successfully, meaning that foreign nationals have to live under the damoclean threat of complete withdrawal of human rights protections, whatever the law says. Thanks for taking the time to respond. I am not entirely convinced by the racism argument, as the law applies to all foreign nationals, and discriminating on the basis of nationality is similar to but not quite the same as racism. The law applies to Americans, Canadian, Australians etc (i.e., English speakers) as well as Poles, Nigerians etc (i.e., those against whom the State traditionally discriminates). I do agree, though, that the application of the law would almost certainly be racist and that the protections put in place would be circumvented or simply ignored by the State where possible. You're saying that even if protections were in place it's racist. I'm flipping it: even if it isn't racist per se, because of how the State would apply it it would effectively be racist. It's a bit like the death penalty in the US (which I do oppose) - even if one agrees with it in principle, the way in which it is applied in the US is so patently racist that the death penalty itself is a racist punishment. Jose posted:There is this about the guardian Yes, you posted that a couple of months ago (maybe in C-SPAM?) and I read it then. it was eye-opening. As I recall that applied more to security matters and less to domestic politics but perhaps I recall wrongly.
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Dec 14, 2020 12:38
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therattle posted:
Maybe I'm misunderstanding but what's the difference? Attacking Corbyn was still a matter of national security and the public interest after all. Domestic political matters always are.
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Dec 14, 2020 12:44
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Communist Thoughts posted:Maybe I'm misunderstanding but what's the difference? I thought it was a change to how the paper handled stories to do with MI5/6 rather than a broader shift in domestic policy coverage but it was a few months ago.
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Dec 14, 2020 12:48
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Sanford posted:Sorry for self posting but for some unfathomable reason I trust people in this thread. My wife is on new medication for depression and was advised it might take a couple of weeks to “stabilise”. She spent most of Saturday moping around looking sad until finally admitting she just wanted some quiet, so I ran her a bath and sent her to bed. Yesterday she was bright and cheerful and said it helped loads, we had a lovely time doing Xmas decs with our daughter, but today she’s very down again. She says she’s fine but clearly isn’t, is there anything I should be doing other than checking in with her, and hourly deliveries of tea/mince pies? We’re both working from home but it’s very quiet so she’s tied to her desk without having much to do. Want to help but don’t know how! As someone with a long history of anti-depressants this doesn't seem out of the ordinary depending on a few factors. Is it a new medication or increase in dose? A change of medication, doubly so depending on if its SSRI or SNRI, or from one to the other, can make you feel like you're straight up taking happy drugs one day and others like the world has eaten you. It literally can take weeks to get to a "new normal". Also, it isn't a magic pill that suddenly fixes everything. In general it can often help you get to a point where you can focus and cope on day to day tasks, but singing and dancing in the rain may still never happen. The best thing you can do, is regular gentle check ins and ask if anything is needed. Again, I want to emphasis that weeks is NOT an exaggeration here.
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Dec 14, 2020 12:58
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https://twitter.com/peterwalker99/status/1338445422294130692 ah well nevertheless
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Dec 14, 2020 13:04
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Sanford posted:Sorry for self posting but for some unfathomable reason I trust people in this thread. My wife is on new medication for depression and was advised it might take a couple of weeks to “stabilise”. She spent most of Saturday moping around looking sad until finally admitting she just wanted some quiet, so I ran her a bath and sent her to bed. Yesterday she was bright and cheerful and said it helped loads, we had a lovely time doing Xmas decs with our daughter, but today she’s very down again. She says she’s fine but clearly isn’t, is there anything I should be doing other than checking in with her, and hourly deliveries of tea/mince pies? We’re both working from home but it’s very quiet so she’s tied to her desk without having much to do. Want to help but don’t know how! How long has she been on them? Because it can take up to 2 months before they actually work, and in those 2 months you can deal with side effects which are pretty lovely and can be a blow to self esteem (total lack of sex drive and erectile issues from my own, male, experience). Really just let her know you're there, and not to get worried if they don't kick in immediately
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Dec 14, 2020 13:11
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dispatch_async posted:https://twitter.com/peterwalker99/status/1338445422294130692 I had to bite my fingers there to stop myself signing in to twitter (I read it but have avoided signing in for weeks now because that way lies madness.) and fortunately saw a couple of other comments along the lines of 'if it had been Jermy Crobyn you wouldn't be excusing it' (eg as in that Ruth Smeeth business when, having spoken from a platform to a large audience myself, it is most unlikely he could see them let alone hear what was said.)
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Dec 14, 2020 13:12
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LordVorbis posted:As someone with a long history of anti-depressants this doesn't seem out of the ordinary depending on a few factors. Thank you. It’s a change due to a conflict with some other medication she’s taking. I guess I’ll just keep doing what I’m doing.
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Dec 14, 2020 13:14
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I don't really put much credence into the "MI5 forced the Guardian to hate Corbyn" theories, because that doesn't really explain why all its writers vociferously defend it on Twitter. The newspaper does seem to accurately reflect the worldview of the people who write it, it doesn't seem like anyone has been coerced.
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Dec 14, 2020 13:16
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The Graun always has and always will be a liberal paper. It having decent people on its staff doesn't override the majority of them being shitbags and editor in particular is another blot on the Austrailian people being involved with British paper editorial decisions.
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Dec 14, 2020 13:20
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dispatch_async posted:https://twitter.com/peterwalker99/status/1338445422294130692 Sounds like the unconscious bias training he went through didn't work very well if he's unable to recognise even overt bigotry.
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Dec 14, 2020 13:27
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Just catching up on that Burchell story, and the accounts gone? So think twitter just banned her.
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Dec 14, 2020 13:28
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Jaeluni Asjil posted:This came up on my FB: Lol at the plea regarding home learning materials. Yeah they pretty much did fall out of your apparently collective arseholes. Released on sunday evening with about 30 mins top spent on formulating the a4 sheet of hyperlinks to shite online games. Much the same every week. Total shite.
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Dec 14, 2020 13:30
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dispatch_async posted:https://twitter.com/peterwalker99/status/1338445422294130692 he's just had his racism training so he should have been all over it
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Dec 14, 2020 13:31
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NotJustANumber99 posted:Lol at the plea regarding home learning materials. Yeah they pretty much did fall out of your apparently collective arseholes. Released on sunday evening with about 30 mins top spent on formulating the a4 sheet of hyperlinks to shite online games. Much the same every week. Total shite. I know the experience has varied considerably from school to school. However, think that the teacher who prepared that '30 minutes top formating links on a Sunday' also had to do that for 20 other classes that week so that is 10 hours of work on a Sunday, let alone all the other stuff they have to do. Once at work, a guy in the office said that his son's teacher didn't spend enough time marking his book. I said "how much time should she spend" - "30 mins" - "how many in your son's class" - "28" - "so that is 14 hours to mark the work of one class how many classes a week does she teach and set homework for?"
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Dec 14, 2020 13:34
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NotJustANumber99 posted:Lol at the plea regarding home learning materials. Yeah they pretty much did fall out of your apparently collective arseholes. Released on sunday evening with about 30 mins top spent on formulating the a4 sheet of hyperlinks to shite online games. Much the same every week. Total shite.
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Dec 14, 2020 13:36
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https://twitter.com/peterwalker99/status/1338445662590029829?s=20 lol what a loving moron
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Dec 14, 2020 13:38
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insanely funny that kier starmer was the actual antisemitic labour leader
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Dec 14, 2020 13:43
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Sanford posted:Sorry for self posting but for some unfathomable reason I trust people in this thread. My wife is on new medication for depression and was advised it might take a couple of weeks to “stabilise”. She spent most of Saturday moping around looking sad until finally admitting she just wanted some quiet, so I ran her a bath and sent her to bed. Yesterday she was bright and cheerful and said it helped loads, we had a lovely time doing Xmas decs with our daughter, but today she’s very down again. She says she’s fine but clearly isn’t, is there anything I should be doing other than checking in with her, and hourly deliveries of tea/mince pies? We’re both working from home but it’s very quiet so she’s tied to her desk without having much to do. Want to help but don’t know how! I would say from personal experience (with my own and others' depression, not your wife) that she may be feeling under pressure to perform happiness around others, especially if she is on meds that "should" help. So I would try to make it clear that if she feels crap that's fine and she can go to bed if she likes, and the best thing to make you happy would be for her to be doing whatever makes it easiest for her. If she's on a good day that's great, if she's not then she's not, and if she needs time to herself that's fine too. Even the it probably still won't actually be very nice for her, cos if you could guarantee good results it wouldn't be depression. But if she's pushing herself out of a sense of obligation that's not unusual in my experience, you're often aware that other people don't want you to be miserable and so you pretend not to be.
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Dec 14, 2020 13:49
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Jaeluni Asjil posted:I know the experience has varied considerably from school to school. However, think that the teacher who prepared that '30 minutes top formating links on a Sunday' also had to do that for 20 other classes that week so that is 10 hours of work on a Sunday, let alone all the other stuff they have to do. I'm talking about a primary school so no there were no other classes and they didn't need to do it on a Sunday. We explicitly had to ask them if they could do it sooner so we could actually prepare. Although there basically was nothing to prepare. And to send the one pager in black and white rather than block colour background so printing it wasn't a ballache. Also I was on a zoom chat with actual teachers drinking their way through lockdown. So was I so whatever, but that message is bollocks. Borrovan posted:gently caress off Why the gently caress should I you toad?
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Dec 14, 2020 13:50
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Here's the call, btw: https://twitter.com/OwenJones84/status/1338460360114905089
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Dec 14, 2020 13:54
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forkboy84 posted:How long has she been on them? Because it can take up to 2 months before they actually work, and in those 2 months you can deal with side effects which are pretty lovely and can be a blow to self esteem (total lack of sex drive and erectile issues from my own, male, experience). I had to stop taking a SSRI because it conflicted with more important medication and goddamnit I miss the total lack of sex drive as a "side effect". Totally being able to zone out other people and not worry what they think about me and I think about them? Giev. I was like an emotionless robot on them. Miss it real bad. Now, getting used to them (and being without them too) gave me the zaps and just constant zoning out and nausea. That part wasn't fun.
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Dec 14, 2020 13:55
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Aphex- posted:https://twitter.com/peterwalker99/status/1338445662590029829?s=20 lol it's not even a particularly nasty insult for the record I definitely would tell him he had potato brain irl
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Dec 14, 2020 13:55
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NotJustANumber99 posted:I'm talking about a primary school so no there were no other classes and they didn't need to do it on a Sunday. We explicitly had to ask them if they could do it sooner so we could actually prepare. Although there basically was nothing to prepare. And to send the one pager in black and white rather than block colour background so printing it wasn't a ballache. Also I was on a zoom chat with actual teachers drinking their way through lockdown. So was I so whatever, but that message is bollocks. Sorry to hear about your kid’s lovely teachers
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Dec 14, 2020 13:56
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XMNN posted:lol it's not even a particularly nasty insult i'd have said pease pudding
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Dec 14, 2020 13:57
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crispix posted:i'd have said pease pudding ok now this is taking things too far
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Dec 14, 2020 13:58
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Comrade Fakename posted:Here's the call, btw: loving hell, there's not even a vague suggestion that it could have been unclear, misheard or misinterpreted. Can't win in 2024 if we don't have the white supremesist vote! 
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Dec 14, 2020 13:59
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NotJustANumber99 posted:Why the gently caress should I you toad?
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Dec 14, 2020 13:59
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Tesseraction posted:The Graun always has and always will be a liberal paper. It having decent people on its staff doesn't override the majority of them being shitbags and editor in particular is another blot on the Austrailian people being involved with British paper editorial decisions. So when they see Corbyn and his supporters who are genuinely upset and angry about injustices, that's not 'being nice.' Calling people out on twitter and explaining why their comments are hurtful to marginalised people is not 'nice.' One of the most illuminating phrases I've learned from being on these forums is 'liberals police tone and not content.' So for example the BBC will censor swear words, but not a 'geneticist' on question time who sits and uses misrepresented data to imply that non white people are inferior and should be used as a post-brexit food source. They will nail you to the wall for swearing, threatening and confronting them with the uncomfortable realities. But at the same time they will happily share a dinner table or stage with tories who's policies lead to the deaths of thousands, as long as the tories in question are polite and well spoken. Not like those scary, impolite Corbynistas. Ultimately this is because they don't understand why things are bad, just that a prescribed list of things are bad, and if you do them you're therefore bad. But they still want to speak on it as an authority without doing the reading. With the terf example, they know feminism is good. They don't understand why, nor do they want to think about difficult gender theory, so they wade in blithely, make a blanket statement that seems to support feminism but excludes trans people, and get rightly criticised by people who do understand it. To the lib however, their feminism is under attack by trans supporters! Trans supporters must be against feminism! Feminism good! Trans bad! And so on. Once they reach this point the 'gender critical' trolls jump in with a hug bomb and get them on side, whispering enough talking points to arm them against most casual angles of attack, solidifying their slide into terfdom. It's very similar to what's happened with Rachel Riley / Corbyn, and Laurence Fox / racism. People who believe they have a god given right to be an authority about something they are unwilling to do any deeper research on. The problem with middle class libs is that they absolutely do not want to look at anything at more than a surface level, because it undoes the fabric of the rug they've thrown over all the problems in the world in order to convince themselves the system works and they are on the right side of history (now that it's ended of course). TLDR: They're dickheads, but they want to sound clever. If you point out they're not clever, that's mean and you're mean for making them think about things.
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Dec 14, 2020 14:05
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Borrovan posted:Because teaching is a woefully undervalued profession that has been under sustained political attack for years & is now expected to take the full blame for poo poo Government policy, teachers aren't trained (or paid enough) to deal with this kind of situation, and cunts like Liddle are just fuelling the idea that they should just get straight back into the meat grinder & die of Covid. Yes some of them are half-arsing it but frankly idk wtf else anyone expects in this situation. The State has sorely let down kids & teachers alike, & if the response to that is to blame the teachers then I'm gonna tell you to gently caress off, just a bit of education worker solidarity. Make sense? I dunno what rod liddle or anyone else has to do with it. I was replying to a probably made up facebook post from a teacher bitching about how other people were sitting at home in their pants whilst they... I spoke from my experience and was a bit flippant. But the schools, and they were not alone, assistance during lockdown was poo poo. Maybe don't tell people to gently caress off if what you mean is all that stuff. I dunno
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Dec 14, 2020 14:06
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As an honourable man, he would step aside. *Boris continues to not even pretend to be an honourable man* Ah, well nevertheless.
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Dec 14, 2020 14:08
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Bobby Deluxe posted:The problem with middle class libs is that they absolutely do not want to look at anything at more than a surface level, because it undoes the fabric of the rug they've thrown over all the problems in the world in order to convince themselves the system works and they are on the right side of history (now that it's ended of course). Better tl;dr - they're more concerned with being right than improving anything at all. You'll see that pattern repeat a lot.
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Dec 14, 2020 14:11
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Comrade Fakename posted:Here's the call, btw: He's just really bad at this. He looks so uncomfortable. Even just taking his first reponse about what Les Ferdinand said. All he needs to say is "Yes we need more than just gestures, that is why a Labour government would do policy X, to start to solve this problem".
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Dec 14, 2020 14:16
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The problem with liberalism being the dominant ideology is it attracts the utterly incurious and stupidest people around, because you don't have to think, you just babble things you heard somewhere else and ape the tone of others and everyoe nods along like an idiot.
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Dec 14, 2020 14:17
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