|
They try to do it in WW84 with stuff like "who is this mystery woman?" in the mall fight but yeah, it is pretty dumb. Also there isn't a good explanation as to the costume change.
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 05:40
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 24, 2024 23:45 |
|
|
I still think its just that the BvS intro of her was as someone who just did nothing for a 100 years was real dumb so they're just kind of dancing around it. Same as how the second Suicide Squad movie is a "reboot" even though it doesn't seem to reboot anything and carries over characters and stuff just like a sequel but they just don't want to talk about the first film. The DCEU is very poorly thought out. Its like if the MCU started with the Ang Lee Hulk and then an Ang Lee Hulk vs Iron Man movie that intro'd Thor as a random guy no one heard of before but who had been around during a World War. And then James Gunn made a really bad Guardians of the Galaxy movie and then a real bad Avengers film where Cap, Vision, and Black Widow just kind of show up that Lee started but Joss Whedon finished and then Kenneth Branagh made a couple of Thor movies that kinda contradicted Lee's intro and Robert Downey Jr was in and out and in on an Iron Man film and David Ayer was making a Suicide Squad sequel he was calling a reboot because he didn't want to be associated with Gunn all while Ang Lee was remaking Avengers as a mini series as a rabid fanbase salivated. STAC Goat fucked around with this message at 05:54 on Dec 29, 2020 |
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 05:43
|
|
|
Taking what works and dropping the rest, and not caring about how it affects anything or if it makes sense is pretty on brand for DC
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 06:21
|
|
|
STAC Goat posted:I still think its just that the BvS intro of her was as someone who just did nothing for a 100 years was real dumb so they're just kind of dancing around it. Same as how the second Suicide Squad movie is a "reboot" even though it doesn't seem to reboot anything and carries over characters and stuff just like a sequel but they just don't want to talk about the first film. Or it's like if the MCU did Thanos inconsistently in every single appearance.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 06:22
|
|
|
The real, massive, actually ruinous problem with WW1 is that in its desperation to be Not Captain America Again they set the movie in world war one instead of two but just end up making the German Army into nazis anyways. It really undercuts the movie trying to have a theme of “all sides are bad” when the Germans are the main and only antagonists until the final act of the film, when a terrible godawful fight scene occurs.Big Bad Voodoo Lou posted:Was it bad? I don't have any nostalgia for Disney stuff, so I didn't pay any attention when it came out. Lion King is literally so bad I walked out of the movie theater in the middle of watching it. Despite having not paid a cent to go see it. At FREE, the movie cost too much to watch. NieR Occomata fucked around with this message at 07:57 on Dec 29, 2020 |
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 07:54
|
|
|
The CGI Lion King movie essentially completely removed the best Disney villain song ever. That's all you need to know about how empty and soulless it is.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 11:18
|
|
|
Timby posted:The CGI Lion King movie essentially completely removed the best Disney villain song ever. Hellfire wasn't a Lion King song.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 11:41
|
|
|
The Germans as a whole in Wonder Woman aren't Nazis. First off not a single character in the movie holds that ideology. Second, it's just like red skull in cap 1 where the villain is explicitly leading a splinter cell. His motivation is that he still thinks Germany can win, which was not just a Hitler thing but a widely held belief among both the German command in WW1 and the general population. It's why Hitler was able to use that to get into power. The villains in the movie are very much WW1 based in every respect. The fact that so many people continue to miss this despite the fact that it's said the first time he shows up, explained a second time when Steve and Diana get to England, and then they literally show him killing several of his superior officers really makes me lose faith in people's ability to just pay attention to a drat movie.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 15:41
|
|
|
Hard to fault someone for not paying attention during the ww movies
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 16:18
|
|
|
site posted:Hard to fault someone for not paying attention during the ww movies This is a fair point.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 16:19
|
|
|
Vince MechMahon posted:The Germans as a whole in Wonder Woman aren't Nazis. First off not a single character in the movie holds that ideology. Second, it's just like red skull in cap 1 where the villain is explicitly leading a splinter cell. His motivation is that he still thinks Germany can win, which was not just a Hitler thing but a widely held belief among both the German command in WW1 and the general population. It's why Hitler was able to use that to get into power. The villains in the movie are very much WW1 based in every respect. You're taking the point excessively literally. The point being made is more that the german side is cartoonishly evil (and the allied side simplistically good). E.g. showing the Germans gassing a village for no real reason, and making the final plan attacking London. This is a problem in WW unlike in Captain America because WW is trying to make some point about *humanity* being messy, and depicting the conflict in black and white terms undermines that. The film is essentially no different to how it'd have been if it was set in WWII.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 16:20
|
|
|
Fangz posted:You're taking the point excessively literally. The point being made is more that the german side is cartoonishly evil (and the allied side simplistically good). E.g. showing the Germans gassing a village for no real reason, and making the final plan attacking London. This is a problem in WW unlike in Captain America because WW is trying to make some point about *humanity* being messy, and depicting the conflict in black and white terms undermines that. The film is essentially no different to how it'd have been if it was set in WWII. Except the message of the movie is that humanity is capable both of extreme evil, the general, and extreme good, Steve, and if both things are possible there's still hope for us. Again, they literally say this out loud in the movie, because Jenkins is neither deep nor subtle.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 16:25
|
|
|
Vince MechMahon posted:The Germans as a whole in Wonder Woman aren't Nazis. First off not a single character in the movie holds that ideology. Second, it's just like red skull in cap 1 where the villain is explicitly leading a splinter cell. His motivation is that he still thinks Germany can win, which was not just a Hitler thing but a widely held belief among both the German command in WW1 and the general population. The general population did not believe that in 1918: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kiel_mutiny A better movie would have included this if the point was to show that people are capable of being good.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 16:45
|
|
|
Vince MechMahon posted:The Germans as a whole in Wonder Woman aren't Nazis. First off not a single character in the movie holds that ideology. Second, it's just like red skull in cap 1 where the villain is explicitly leading a splinter cell. Wellll, in the real world Ludendorff was an early member of the Nazi Party.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 16:46
|
|
|
I want to be clear that I was an idiot for calling them Nazis.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 17:11
|
|
|
My favorite one of those excessive vaporware DC movies is the one that's a horror spinoff based entirely around the monsters from one scene in Aquaman, which is apparently unlikely to have Aquaman in it.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 17:36
|
|
|
theironjef posted:My favorite one of those excessive vaporware DC movies is the one that's a horror spinoff based entirely around the monsters from one scene in Aquaman, which is apparently unlikely to have Aquaman in it. I believe this was between ASM2 and Homecoming.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 18:00
|
|
|
theironjef posted:My favorite one of those excessive vaporware DC movies is the one that's a horror spinoff based entirely around the monsters from one scene in Aquaman, which is apparently unlikely to have Aquaman in it. That’s some “Sony’s insane slate for spider man spinoff” level stuff.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 18:03
|
|
|
Fangz posted:You're taking the point excessively literally. The point being made is more that the german side is cartoonishly evil (and the allied side simplistically good). E.g. showing the Germans gassing a village for no real reason, and making the final plan attacking London. This is a problem in WW unlike in Captain America because WW is trying to make some point about *humanity* being messy, and depicting the conflict in black and white terms undermines that. The film is essentially no different to how it'd have been if it was set in WWII. Not really? The British leaders were portrayed as assholes and most of the German leaders wanted to negotiate peace. That’s why Ludendorff gassed them. The soldiers following him were said to be loyal to him specifically.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 18:22
|
|
|
You could do Alien but on a boat with a couple of them sneaking on a cruise ship or something I guess but that's about the only way I can think of to go.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 18:23
|
|
|
STAC Goat posted:My impression is that they wanted to "reboot" it because the first was such a disaster and Idris Elba was cast as Deadshot to replace Will Smith but Margot Robbie and a bunch others got brought back. Then someone realized that was very stupid too so they made Elba someone else and now its a "soft reboot" which I guess just means they're gonna not directly reference the first one. But who cares unless you like bring Enchantress back or something? DCEU is so unnecessarily messy. And the funny thing is, for a "disaster", domestically, Suicide Squad only made 5 million less than BvS.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 18:29
|
|
|
howe_sam posted:Wellll, in the real world Ludendorff was an early member of the Nazi Party. And he was expelled for being too extreme.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 18:38
|
|
|
Aphrodite posted:You could do Alien but on a boat with a couple of them sneaking on a cruise ship or something I guess but that's about the only way I can think of to go. It's just amusing to me because of how cold that iron is now. By the time it would actually come out no one is gonna remember what the hell they are. People will just think it's a weird sequel to Underwater.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 18:42
|
|
|
Davros1 posted:And the funny thing is, for a "disaster", domestically, Suicide Squad only made 5 million less than BvS. Yeah, its silly. No one likes the movie but it made Margot Robbie became a cultural thing so they're definitely putting her back in it. So the "soft reboot" is just having your cake and eating it too.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 18:44
|
|
|
Vince MechMahon posted:Except the message of the movie is that humanity is capable both of extreme evil, the general, and extreme good, Steve, and if both things are possible there's still hope for us. Again, they literally say this out loud in the movie, because Jenkins is neither deep nor subtle. I’m more saying the movie continuously undercuts this point by instead of actually portraying all sides as deeply flawed and World War I as a disaster that literally led to II due to how everyone just blamed Germany for all their problems at Versailles, it just sort of throws its hands up and goes “Germans bad, oh wait CGI boss fight okay we’re all done”. It could easily be argued that the Nazis as a political party don’t exist if the sheer fuckery against Germany in 1919 didn’t happen, and the point is that it’s genuinely gross that in the course of trying to distance itself from Cap 1 they end up relitigating history by doing this revisionist poo poo all over again. Wonder Woman 1 is a genuinely troubling film if you think about what it’s supposedly “trying” to say versus what it ends up saying because of just basic elements of its filmmaking being so flat and “uh well Germans are the bad guys okay done”.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 19:44
|
|
|
Except the Germans are explicitly not bad. Just that one guy.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 19:50
|
|
|
Davros1 posted:And the funny thing is, for a "disaster", domestically, Suicide Squad only made 5 million less than BvS. It made more than Justice League. Trying to figure out how some DC movies make so much while being fairly reviled is difficult. Not to say that Justice League went over great but it was better liked than Suicide Squad.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 20:24
|
|
|
Hey guys I hate it when film makers don't do proper historical research and look into various theories and outcomes of the great war when making a movie about a magical woman fighting the god of war. Where is my nuance and and historicity in my comic book movie?
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 20:30
|
|
|
A lot of people don’t look at reviews. BvS was always going to do well financially because it’s Batman and Superman and there was no trend of bad movies yet. Suicide Squad’s Hot Topic aesthetic and Joker/Harley sold to a lot of people, plus sure BvS wasn’t good but this could be. But by Justice League, you’ve now had 2 pieces of crap in a row.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 20:31
|
|
|
Madkal posted:Hey guys I hate it when film makers don't do proper historical research and look into various theories and outcomes of the great war when making a movie about a magical woman fighting the god of war. Where is my nuance and and historicity in my comic book movie?
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 22:01
|
|
|
Vince MechMahon posted:Except the Germans are explicitly not bad. Just that one guy. That is contradicted by the No Mans Land/village scenes which were shot in a sort of Saving Private Ryan style, which means that the distinction in the wars/"villainy" is scrubbed. Similarly, a lot of the espionage scenes are reminiscent of WW2 films (or Indiana Jones). The latter wouldn't have been as much of an issue if the former didn't exist, or did a better job of depicting how much a total meatgrinder the trenches were for everyone. Obviously different people will have different takes on WW1 but I was reading Tardi's It Was the War of the Trenches and Goddamn This War! at the time and the idea of a heroic charge with sweeping music as they vanquish those dastardly germans came across as really failing to depict the pointlessness of the deaths.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 22:07
|
|
|
I want to see a German crying as he is forced to beat a Frenchman to death.Alhazred posted:Watchmen managed to both educate people about the Tulsa massacre and have a magic blue man. So I'm not sure what you're trying to say here. Pfft they had like 8 extra hours to do that. Aphrodite fucked around with this message at 23:28 on Dec 29, 2020 |
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 23:20
|
|
|
Iirc from the interview with whatshisname the tulsa massacre intro was solely because of black writers in the room
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 23:28
|
|
|
site posted:Iirc from the interview with whatshisname the tulsa massacre intro was solely because of black writers in the room it was from him reading Ta-Nehesi Coates Case for Reparations the same time he got the offer to make a Watchmen show. he did talk about not knowing about it beforehand and realizing how hosed up that was
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 23:38
|
|
|
I dug it up and apparently you are correct, I retract my statement
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 23:47
|
|
|
STAC Goat posted:Yeah, MCU's just a machine at this point. They can throw the Guardians, Ant-Man, the Eternals, or Shang Chi into it and it spits out a movie. Everything except apparently the Inhumans. I feel like i can actually make sensible predictions and guesses at the future of the MCU because its established a direction. I've heard recently a quote from someone who worked for the big two. It's a few years old at this point, but I just heard it last week. "Marvel is like a tank. DC is like a Taxi with no one behind the wheel" That was in reference to the comic production but it really seems to fit the movie making method as well Marvel took some time to get going, and you could argue that it is crushing everything in front of and around it, but you are not likely going to stop it anytime soon. On the other hand, by comparison DC is driving wildly, crossing lanes and doing a lot of property damage. Maybe you get to your destination, maybe you get wildly detoured, and for some people, that's fun. But at the end, I just want that ride to be over.
|
|
#
?
Dec 29, 2020 23:56
|
|
|
It's honestly weird how DC is unable to make good movies about characters that isn't Batman related.
|
|
#
?
Dec 30, 2020 00:21
|
|
|
Alhazred posted:It's honestly weird how DC is unable to make good movies about characters that isn't Batman related. I will not stand for this continued Shazam erasure.
|
|
#
?
Dec 30, 2020 01:07
|
|
|
Plus it might have been dumb as hell but Aquaman was at least a fun ride.
|
|
#
?
Dec 30, 2020 02:12
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 24, 2024 23:45 |
|
|
Madkal posted:Hey guys I hate it when film makers don't do proper historical research and look into various theories and outcomes of the great war when making a movie about a magical woman fighting the god of war. Where is my nuance and and historicity in my comic book movie? This is a dumb argument not only because literal actual comics have been doing this for half a century now, but also because the actual movie actually made this a central issue and then completely hosed up the execution. If they wanted to make a movie all about them evil 1918 era Germans being all evil and committing war crimes (that literally every nation was perpetuating, whatever), that’s fine. But instead it wanted to be a movie about how actually all sides are bad when it was incapable of portraying the Germans as anything but Nazis Lite. If they didn’t want the movie to be criticized for being historically inaccurate and being revisionist maybe don’t tread in those waters and attempt to be something more high minded than it was.
|
|
#
?
Dec 30, 2020 02:24
|
|