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Having grown up in the 90s I hate Ferrari as much as the next British F1 viewer but I can't find any reason to get behind FOCA in this shambles. Not that I'd say I was behind FISA either, just more quietly acknowledging that they hold the balance of power here.
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Dec 29, 2020 18:09
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track day bro! posted:It just seems wild the way F1 is now that some random aftermarket wheels company was able to run in the highest level of motorsport at the time. It kinda sucks tbh. For all the talk about growing the sport it’s more difficult to get into it than it has been at any other point in history.
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Dec 29, 2020 18:13
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Frond posted:The guy was a famously huge rear end in a top hat.
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Dec 29, 2020 18:15
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IIRC I think ATS was able to snag some pretty high profile OEM contracts which gave them the budget to go racing.
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Dec 29, 2020 18:15
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Azza Bamboo posted:Having grown up in the 90s I hate Ferrari as much as the next British F1 viewer but I can't find any reason to get behind FOCA in this shambles. Not that I'd say I was behind FISA either, just more quietly acknowledging that they hold the balance of power here. Keeping the DFV competitive was in the interest of the other non-manufacturer teams because it was a readily available customer engine that anyone could buy and win with. I mean, it was likely on borrowed time even with the GE cars helping it’s case but still. A problem that has effected F1 for decades now is the lack of a truly “customer” engine that is competitive enough to win WDCs. The last engine like that was the Ford HB V8.
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Dec 29, 2020 18:21
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Are there any good books on F1 history?
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Dec 29, 2020 18:26
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Frond posted:The guy was a famously huge rear end in a top hat. An F1 team onwner being a massive oval office? Thats a new one on me lol the corona quid posted:It kinda sucks tbh. For all the talk about growing the sport it’s more difficult to get into it than it has been at any other point in history. I mean thats how I feel about it now, everything is so big and corporate. Thats why I switched to watching mainly endurance racing, although I have barely watched any motorsports as of late. Frond posted:IIRC I think ATS was able to snag some pretty high profile OEM contracts which gave them the budget to go racing. Yeah that makes sense, but you wouldn't see a massive company like Rays/Enkei/BBS who also do oem stuff now even considering F1, also those three all have history in f1 as wheel manufacturers
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Dec 29, 2020 18:27
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Cessna posted:Are there any good books on F1 history? Quite a lot, I have this one which I like; https://www.racefans.net/2018/12/09/formula-1-car-by-car-1980-89-reviewed/
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Dec 29, 2020 18:30
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track day bro! posted:An F1 team onwner being a massive oval office? Thats a new one on me lol I was shocked to find out that BBS actually doesn’t even make their own F1 wheels - it’s a little known Japanese Company called Washi-Beam who do the manufacturing for them. Frond fucked around with this message at 18:36 on Dec 29, 2020 |
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Dec 29, 2020 18:32
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ATS also got their start by buying old Penske Chassis, and were a one car team for most of their existence. I would welcome the return of customer chassis and single car teams. I hate to bring it up yet again but Super Formula has a few single car teams that act as satellites for larger ones.
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Dec 29, 2020 18:34
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track day bro! posted:I mean thats how I feel about it now, everything is so big and corporate. Thats why I switched to watching mainly endurance racing, although I have barely watched any motorsports as of late. It’s definitely why I switched over to MotoGP.
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Dec 29, 2020 18:34
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I like what RP did this year.
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Dec 29, 2020 18:36
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Frond posted:Quite a lot, I have this one which I like; Nice, thanks. I followed things in the 90's/00s, but sort of dropped out. I'm getting back in and would like to know more depth.
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Dec 29, 2020 18:40
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Frond posted:I like what RP did this year. MotoGP basically said either your a manufacturer or you buy a bike and it’s worked out really well and it’s basically converged performance as manufacturers have increasingly been more willing to give out current year bikes to get more data.
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Dec 29, 2020 18:46
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track day bro! posted:It just seems wild the way F1 is now that some random aftermarket wheels company was able to run in the highest level of motorsport at the time. Arrows was hugely competitive while sponsored by an Italian bathroom tile company and an American porn magazine, and those probably weren't even the dumbest sponsorships at the time
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Dec 29, 2020 18:52
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track day bro! posted:I mean thats how I feel about it now, everything is so big and corporate. I'm conflicted. Corporations are very sinister and insincere entities. If they were worried about these accusations they'd run workshops and branding around the theme of sincerity, missing the point entirely, but doing just enough to convince themselves. The only cars that can compete are the product of these empires. The only drivers that can race are ones who at least attempt to spout their PR lines. It's all such bullshit. Watching old F1 there's something romantic about the idea of a former driver turned greasemonkey deciding to make their own Marque, like Cooper, Brabham and McLaren. Those are just badges now, stories that can be bought by one of these gargantuan monsters if they want to convince us they're vaguely human and nonthreatening. But the other side of that conflict is that I want F1 to be the best possible machine within safe and reasonable limits. This far into the development of the automobile, I don't think a fat bloke in his garage is going to be able to make quite the difference that these empires can. It's a soulless, sterile world full of the kind of drivel that only PR managers and company directors can shunt out of their face arses. At the same time, who else could make these machines?
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Dec 29, 2020 18:56
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Just discovered the Netflix documentary. I used to think Christian Horner was a smug, two-faced twat even in small doses, and seeing him at length has actually diminished my opinion of him. What an absolute bell-end. (It doesn't help that he reminds me of my old boss.)
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Dec 29, 2020 19:28
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Take the plunge! Okay! posted:Arrows was hugely competitive while sponsored by an Italian bathroom tile company and an American porn magazine, and those probably weren't even the dumbest sponsorships at the time I like the regional sponsors on the little Italian teams;  (It's a Belt Conveyor Company).
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Dec 29, 2020 19:29
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Take the plunge! Okay! posted:Arrows was hugely competitive while sponsored by an Italian bathroom tile company and an American porn magazine, and those probably weren't even the dumbest sponsorships at the time Lotus was sponsored by a dubious Oil Trading Company "Essex" - which from what I can find was a giant scam. A bunch of late 80s teams were also funded by fraud more or less. Moneytron is the most well-known of these but let us not forget Larrousse had one owner who murdered his wife and another who was killed in a gun battle with German Police.
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Dec 29, 2020 19:39
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Payndz posted:Just discovered the Netflix documentary. I used to think Christian Horner was a smug, two-faced twat even in small doses, and seeing him at length has actually diminished my opinion of him. What an absolute bell-end. (It doesn't help that he reminds me of my old boss.) hello christian haha
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Dec 29, 2020 19:43
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Azza Bamboo posted:I'm conflicted. yeah I mean it's never going to be like it was in the past, I started watching F1 in the 90's and even then it was creeping towards being the massive corpororate wankfest it is today. Part of my beef with F1 is that outside of North America for most people F1 is the only motorsport that exists. I mean it's always going to have top billing but then it feels like F1 sortof eclipsed every other motorsport. It's like the Sky F1 channel, that could be used for so many different forms of motorsport. They did have indy car on it for like five minutes. But no it's easier to just show repeated highlights and the same 5 puff pieces on poois shamiltons hairdresser or we Frond posted:Lotus was sponsored by a dubious Oil Trading Company "Essex" - which from what I can find was a giant scam. A bunch of late 80s teams were also funded by fraud more or less. Moneytron is the most well-known of these but let us not forget Larrousse had one owner who murdered his wife and another who was killed in a gun battle with German Police. the sketchy financial poo poo is also amazing, like wasn't leyton house a japanese real estate company or something. I mean that still happens now with smaller endurance teams
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Dec 29, 2020 19:53
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Leyton House (ostensibly) was - late 80s/Early 90s Japanese real estate was psychotic and Akagi was taken out by the Fuji Bank Scandal. It involved forged receipts and money laundering, among other things.
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Dec 29, 2020 20:04
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Frond posted:Lotus was sponsored by a dubious Oil Trading Company "Essex" - which from what I can find was a giant scam. Here in the States in baseball we used to have: 
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Dec 29, 2020 20:19
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Cessna posted:Here in the States in baseball we used to have: In hilariously American fashion it also had a little hill and a flagpole in play in dead center just within the wall—the perfect hazard upon which a hapless center fielder could shred their knee ligaments and strike a concussive blow to their skull on the same tragic play.
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Dec 29, 2020 20:28
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whats wrong with miiller lite
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Dec 29, 2020 20:35
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track day bro! posted:whats wrong with miiller lite It’s like 2.5% or something because Americans can’t handle any sort of mind altering substance.
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Dec 29, 2020 21:13
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track day bro! posted:whats wrong with miiller lite
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Dec 29, 2020 21:31
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MLS had major teams sponsored by pyramid schemes within the last decade
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Dec 29, 2020 22:50
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Tsaedje posted:MLS had major teams sponsored by pyramid schemes within the last decade Okay but what about professional sports?
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Dec 29, 2020 22:57
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https://twitter.com/Jalopnik/status/1343725557956050946 10 years ago and technically just the sponsor "a high-end mens magazine" demanded she pose topless. the team only agreed for her to wear a bikini without asking.
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Dec 29, 2020 22:59
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the corona quid posted:It’s like 2.5% or something because Americans can’t handle any sort of mind altering substance. It’s mostly because we’re the biggest capitalist shithole on earth and if the beer is less strong, they have to pay for more of it to get drunk
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Dec 30, 2020 00:19
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Please don't forget Andrea Moda, ostensibly ran by an Italian shoe designer and sponsored by a light fixture company, but actually just a front for the Sicilian mafia 
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Dec 30, 2020 00:23
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Take the plunge! Okay! posted:Please don't forget Andrea Moda, ostensibly ran by an Italian shoe designer and sponsored by a light fixture company, but actually just a front for the Sicilian mafia Scuderia Cosa Nostra
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Dec 30, 2020 00:32
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the paradigm shift posted:https://twitter.com/Jalopnik/status/1343725557956050946
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Dec 30, 2020 00:52
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the corona quid posted:It’s like 2.5% or something because Americans can’t handle any sort of mind altering substance. You’re thinking of “near beer” which is a terrible creation that allowed beer to be sold in grocery stores and other places where it wouldn’t normally be able to be sold in certain states. It’s an abomination
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Dec 30, 2020 01:03
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Frond posted:I like the regional sponsors on the little Italian teams; I like the Italian tracks for this too, Imola and Monza had lots of colourful sponsors. Imola's didn't change much 81-93 as far as I can tell. I liked the POP84 and SINT 2000 stuff everywhere. I understand Bernie hated it. Silverstone/Brands too.
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Dec 30, 2020 01:17
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Local sponsors and one offs are great. I want to see someone running a TERRY'S GUN EMPORIUM livery at cota or CHELTENHAM EEL CO. at silverstone
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Dec 30, 2020 01:19
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I absolutely love that even when you're sponsored by someone else you're still sponsored by Marlboro. It's like a Bolshevik nanny state except the safety net provided to the population is tobacco sponsorship in motorsports. Bring back tobacco. #forzaPMI
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Dec 30, 2020 01:23
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if drug cartels can come up with good designs they should be allowed to launder their money through f1
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Dec 30, 2020 01:26
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the paradigm shift posted:https://twitter.com/Jalopnik/status/1343725557956050946 This is a bad post FYI
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Dec 30, 2020 01:37
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