|
Gunder posted:I recently discovered another important aspect to improving my pour-over technique that's both easy to replicate and makes a large difference in flavour: pour height. It's flow rate since at higher pour heights are going to cause more agitation in the coffee bed. I'd imagine that you want a higher height earlier in to make sure that you getting all the coffee soaked. There was a pretty good blog post I saw about this a while back. https://coffeeadastra.com/2019/10/20/what-affects-brew-time/
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2021 00:59
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 12, 2024 15:14 |
|
|
RichterIX posted:
Congrats. It’s a great grinder. Don’t put vise grips on your new or old burr. Just follow the baratza video where they hold your hand and show you how to do this step by step. It is easy and will not take a lot of time.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2021 01:29
|
|
|
ThirstyBuck posted:Congrats. It’s a great grinder. Thanks,I will probably do this. For what it's worth though, the vise grip method was from a Baratza video too so that's why I was planning on trying that initially.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2021 03:46
|
|
|
Finally got a Baratza Encore yesterday and wow. I had really tempered my expectations that it would actually make my coffee taste noticeably better vs. my Hario Slim hand grinder. (I had other reasons for wanting it, not just taste.) But it actually really is noticeable. So much smoother. Bad day for democracy, good day for coffee.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2021 13:48
|
|
|
I agree, the difference a grinder makes is very surprising. Even between grinders at a similar price point. One might highlight acidity, while another mutes it. Neither is bad necessarily, just different. I love my Niche. Gunder fucked around with this message at 13:56 on Jan 7, 2021 |
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2021 13:52
|
|
|
Sir Lemming posted:Finally got a Baratza Encore yesterday and wow. I had really tempered my expectations that it would actually make my coffee taste noticeably better vs. my Hario Slim hand grinder. (I had other reasons for wanting it, not just taste.) But it actually really is noticeable. So much smoother. Bad day for democracy, good day for coffee. Please stop mine isn't coming until next Tuesday and I probably won't be able to try it until the weekend
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2021 15:48
|
|
|
Sir Lemming posted:Finally got a Baratza Encore yesterday and wow. I had really tempered my expectations that it would actually make my coffee taste noticeably better vs. my Hario Slim hand grinder. (I had other reasons for wanting it, not just taste.) But it actually really is noticeable. So much smoother. Bad day for democracy, good day for coffee. It really is crazy how much of a difference it makes, I was super skeptical as well. Love my Encore, and there's an even bigger step up when you replace the stock burr with an M2.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2021 20:20
|
|
|
Gunder posted:I agree, the difference a grinder makes is very surprising. Even between grinders at a similar price point. One might highlight acidity, while another mutes it. Neither is bad necessarily, just different. I was all set to order a Niche but they’re sold out once again. I think after I get that, my pour over setup will be complete.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2021 20:32
|
|
|
Furious Lobster posted:I was all set to order a Niche but they’re sold out once again. I think after I get that, my pour over setup will be complete. It's worth the wait. It's a spectacular grinder. To get something better, you'd have to spend almost twice the price.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2021 20:53
|
|
|
I just got my refurbished Encore today and tried it out. I tempered expectations heavily, but I do see the improvements. It's not as explosively different compared to the lovely $15 hand grinder I've been using but it led to a good amount more clarity (less brownness in flavor) and the mouth feel of the coffee improved tremendously, along with improving the aftersip aeration in the nose. It also poured and filtered dramatically more smoothly compared to hand grind. I have it set to 17 and did the 4:6 method on a Kalita Wave and it came out like that near equivalent to yesterday when I did Scott Rao's method with hand grinder (of which I'd been using for a good week now since it came out so well). On some note of that, I guess it might be the pour technique that might be influencing a ton since idk if I'm just Doing It Wrong, but the 4:6 always felt weak and unflavorful to me which made the Scott Rao method shine a lot more explosively when I tried it out back when I hand grinded. I will see what the specs of the coffee are when I combine both the Encore grind and the Scott Rao.
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2021 23:04
|
|
|
Futaba Anzu posted:I just got my refurbished Encore today and tried it out. I tempered expectations heavily, but I do see the improvements. It's not as explosively different compared to the lovely $15 hand grinder I've been using but it led to a good amount more clarity (less brownness in flavor) and the mouth feel of the coffee improved tremendously, along with improving the aftersip aeration in the nose. It also poured and filtered dramatically more smoothly compared to hand grind. I have it set to 17 and did the 4:6 method on a Kalita Wave and it came out like that near equivalent to yesterday when I did Scott Rao's method with hand grinder (of which I'd been using for a good week now since it came out so well). On some note of that, I guess it might be the pour technique that might be influencing a ton since idk if I'm just Doing It Wrong, but the 4:6 always felt weak and unflavorful to me which made the Scott Rao method shine a lot more explosively when I tried it out back when I hand grinded. I will see what the specs of the coffee are when I combine both the Encore grind and the Scott Rao. Encore grinders are not calibrated equally like higher-end grinders are so your 17 may be closer to my 19 since you can calibrate the gear slip on the inside control collar with some set screws. I would recommend to try playing around with your grind sizes as well and to make some smaller adjustments of one or two notches one way or the other. Approaching pourover in your situation methodically should give you a better idea of what's wrong if you intentionally change only one thing per brewing round. I didn't experience appreciable grind difference from my Knock Feldgrind (rip its crankshaft) to a Virtuoso or Encore we had the office, just that I didn't have to hand grind and I could put more beans in the hopper.
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2021 23:31
|
|
|
Futaba Anzu posted:I just got my refurbished Encore today and tried it out. I tempered expectations heavily, but I do see the improvements. It's not as explosively different compared to the lovely $15 hand grinder I've been using but it led to a good amount more clarity (less brownness in flavor) and the mouth feel of the coffee improved tremendously, along with improving the aftersip aeration in the nose. It also poured and filtered dramatically more smoothly compared to hand grind. I have it set to 17 and did the 4:6 method on a Kalita Wave and it came out like that near equivalent to yesterday when I did Scott Rao's method with hand grinder (of which I'd been using for a good week now since it came out so well). On some note of that, I guess it might be the pour technique that might be influencing a ton since idk if I'm just Doing It Wrong, but the 4:6 always felt weak and unflavorful to me which made the Scott Rao method shine a lot more explosively when I tried it out back when I hand grinded. I will see what the specs of the coffee are when I combine both the Encore grind and the Scott Rao. I've noticed that Japanese methods like the 4:6 tend to favor higher doses, and less extraction whereas the Rao/Hoffman methods tend to favor more extraction. Ultimately there are like a billion ways to do pour over, so you just need to figure out which works best for you. https://cafec-jp.com/brewing-guide/ Here's Chad Wang's which is the complete opposite of what Hoffman/Rao do. https://www.baristamagazine.com/world-brewers-2017-recipe/
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2021 23:40
|
|
|
aldantefax posted:Encore grinders are not calibrated equally like higher-end grinders are so your 17 may be closer to my 19 since you can calibrate the gear slip on the inside control collar with some set screws. I would recommend to try playing around with your grind sizes as well and to make some smaller adjustments of one or two notches one way or the other. yeah i plan on doing some daily changes to narrow down to what i like starting with switching back to scott rao tomorrow. i guess though this is where dialing in starts which i'm scared of because i don't really know how to perceive 'is this better?' haha. Like, I assume clicking to a smaller number would result in more extraction obviously but since it was hard to really gauge that with hand grinder I don't know what exactly that does to flavor profile, exciting but also scary AnimeIsTrash posted:I've noticed that Japanese methods like the 4:6 tend to favor higher doses, and less extraction whereas the Rao/Hoffman methods tend to favor more extraction. it's also stuff like extraction methods that make me completely freeze because dialing in on one variable might be good for one type of extraction method but might even be the complete opposite direction for another, at least that's what it feels like in my head I guess to narrow down a tiny bit, would you consider a 20-30g grind amount to be a 'lesser' dose which would benefit more from likeminded extraction styles? Futaba Anzu fucked around with this message at 23:43 on Jan 8, 2021 |
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2021 23:40
|
|
|
Futaba Anzu posted:I guess to narrow down a tiny bit, would you consider a 20-30g grind amount to be a 'lesser' dose which would benefit more from likeminded extraction styles? A old trick Bob McBob once taught me when I first bought my Encore many moons ago was to go a lot of notches from a base line in both directions and brew a normal cuppa. They will likely both be lovely for grinding too fine and too coarse and then you'll very rapidly find what is the sweet spot. You should also just flat out trust your palate. If you want, take notes about the coffee in terms that you relate to and compare from one grind to the next. It sounds intimidating but it's just part of the fun and games when you're dialing in, even for pourover. You'll know if something's better if you are suddenly like, "woah, that's a pretty good cup", or if you are like "you know what, this tastes pretty good" and if that isn't the general sense you get from one cup to the next, just keep fiddling with it To answer your specific question: I use three primary weights for a very aggressive ratio: 20g beans in to 300g water 30g beans in to 500-550g water 40g beans in to 600g water These are all at my Encore's grind setting of 20-ish. If I went from 20 to 15, it would be too fine and the extraction would slow to a crawl; if I went from 20 to 25, the extraction would be too coarse. Bigger number = coarser, smaller number = finer. This grind works for basically 100% of my brew methods with three very specific exceptions: espresso (which I got a Sette 270Wi for), cupping, and cold brew (which I just crank the Encore to the highest number possible). I've tried this with V60-01, V60-02, Wave, Chemex, Origami S, Origami M, and I'm sure I'm forgetting something I'll just record a demo when I'm making coffee tomorrow (too late tonight to do so) and put that up. If you want, pick the method you need help with and the equipment you are using and I will make do (I don't actually know what your setup is currently like).
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 03:12
|
|
|
I signed up for Trade Coffee a few months ago and I’ve been very happy with them. The price is kinda high but the stuff is always fresh and gets delivered, the packaging is compostable, I’m happy with it. But between the variety of different beans, how they change as they age over the week it takes me to drink them, and my own inconsistencies, I’m constantly chasing the ‘perfect’ grind setting. On the plus side, I always smother my shots with heaps of hot milk so I don’t know the difference anyway. 
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 03:22
|
|
|
Lots of folks in the thread told me to adjust to taste and I can confirm worrying less about the specific number on the grinder made it a lot more fun to experiment with. Still tweaking, still learning, but my worst cups are better than the stuff I'd get in the kitchen at work.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 03:40
|
|
|
aldantefax posted:A old trick Bob McBob once taught me when I first bought my Encore many moons ago was to go a lot of notches from a base line in both directions and brew a normal cuppa. They will likely both be lovely for grinding too fine and too coarse and then you'll very rapidly find what is the sweet spot. quote:This grind works for basically 100% of my brew methods with three very specific exceptions: espresso (which I got a Sette 270Wi for), cupping, and cold brew (which I just crank the Encore to the highest number possible). I've tried this with V60-01, V60-02, Wave, Chemex, Origami S, Origami M, and I'm sure I'm forgetting something Currently I have just the Wave and usually do a 20g grind for 340g water. I've actually been thinking of picking up the V60 once I got the Encore off the recommendation of same friend which is further persuaded by that nice attractive package on Amazon which comes with the filters and a serving carafe, as I am in great need of having one of those when I do make coffee for more than myself (embarrassed to say I spill a lot of coffee pouring from glass to cup eheu). not to mention that it seems like the v60 filters are seemingly half as expensive as the wave ones which were like 20 dollars for a 200 pack, oof.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 03:42
|
|
|
You can do probably do better online. Then again, 20 bucks for 200 filters means if you only drink coffee once a day, you have coffee for 200 days. Worthwhile investment, but your mileage may vary. I'll throw the Wave on with that recipe and record and report back tomorrow. The only thing that will be meaningfully different will be my kettle, which is a Kalita Pelikan Red kettle. https://thecoffeeregistry.com/products/kalita-pelican-enamel-kettle-red It doesn't perform noticeably better or worse than any other gooseneck but it is a pleasure to look at and I like nice things, plus it's induction friendly and can also travel well (can be used over a direct flame if needed for camp duty as well).
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 03:46
|
|
|
aldantefax posted:You can do probably do better online. Then again, 20 bucks for 200 filters means if you only drink coffee once a day, you have coffee for 200 days. Worthwhile investment, but your mileage may vary. Gooseneck is definitely on the list as well along with a more accurate scale just for better granularity (current one is only per gram, it can measure more granularly for sure since it measures ounces by thousandths but I don't know if I can unlock that for grams). Those along with what I already mentioned I'd also like to buy some nice mugs meant for hot drinks as well I think that'd be nice.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 04:23
|
|
|
I mean, I've made okay coffee using a pot of boiling water pouring into a glass jar using an analog scale with preground coffee. You'll have to trust me on this one when I say it doesn't matter what precisely you use as long as you're familiar with the brew process. There are countless well-produced videos and people that talk about the perfect brew, but at the end of the day, you have what you have, and it is well attainable to make a good cup reliably even without doing weight measurements and dialing in the exact grind and whatnot. Regarding scales, I also wouldn't bother with thousandths, one decimal place for grams is all you need and a reliable scale costs as much as those Kalita Wave filters. Unless you really want to pretend you're dealing in pharmaceuticals even two decimal places is too much. The kit I would recommend to someone who is brand spanking new that wants to pourover for the first time is probably something like... - Origami S or Hario V60-01. Filters are cheap and the Origami allows for multiple filter types and allows for more experimentation, plus it looks nice. - One mug from a thrift store - Anything stove-safe that can boil water - If you don't have a good grinder, buy your beans from a good roaster and ask them to grind it for you for your pourover method of choice - A MyWeigh T2 scale or Coffee Gator knockoff scale w/ timer - A phone (in case you don't have a scale with a timer) That'll be about 30-40 ameribucks plus beans. Hell, you could omit the pourover and just do a cupping in your mug with a bigass spoon, if you're just trying to figure out what good coffee tastes like. Anyway, the main point is, use what you have, and don't try to change too many things. It is highly likely that since you are going through the trouble of grinding just before service you are doing leagues better than Folger's. I recommend a camp mug because they are easy to handwash and typically have lids and are highly durable. Miir makes a good one and it's likely your local roaster has one waiting for you so you can support local too. Plus, you can bring it with you camping!
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 04:59
|
|
|
Maybe something is wrong with me but coffee just doesn't taste right in those double wall steel mugs. It has to be ceramic or glass for me.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 07:51
|
|
|
Mu Zeta posted:Maybe something is wrong with me but coffee just doesn't taste right in those double wall steel mugs. It has to be ceramic or glass for me. Double wall? I just use a single wall and it works fine. I don't mind it but I can see how it could be offputting.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 08:15
|
|
|
yeah i don't know why I mentioned cups, dad just inserted subliminal ideas in my head since he wanted to splurge on expensive cups, but obviously we have fine mugs at home... i've actually been using a thermos style lined korean 'Cafe Mug' that have been great for keeping water cold, but I don't know, maybe it's just the nature of coffee going harsh after a while but the last few sips out of it always feel so sharp and I guess, more acidic than usual? I should just swap back to a regular cup instead lol, prewarming it with hot water should keep it warm enough not to go too cold by the time I get to the end. I guess if it matters, the daily driver recently has been this bag from bottomless  also though on a tangent, I don't really know what to think about bottomless as a service because I greatly vehemently dislike how their subscription is set up and how much of it seems to want to be automated, that really bit me the wrong way just recently.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 08:16
|
|
|
My eyes glazed over at that copy. Subscription services are hit and miss mostly because they're dependent on their roaster selection pool and, yeah, automated subscriptions can bite you hard. I did Trade for about a year but it was one really lovely Portland roast that I was like "you know what, I'm good thanks" and ended up subscribing to my local roaster whom I both really like, won an award last year for best national roaster (first Austin roaster to do so!) and donates a portion of every sale to local pet shelters and other goody two-shoes things. You mentioned something interesting about the last bit of a cup being really acidic, which I find can happen when coffees are a little bit on the underextracted side. My palate isn't particularly well developed for coffee but as I understand it, acidity and brightness are tempered with over-bitterness as the two kind of poles to determine your extraction. Could also just be the beans too.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 08:42
|
|
|
Sounds like you're getting the general taste of the coffee. The higher elevation coffees will be far more acidic than ones grown at lower levels. I'd recommend some kind of blend next time rather than single origin. You'll get a more balanced cup that way. I'll second the local roaster recommendation. In my experience local baristas are pretty good sources for information and are usually very happy to talk coffee.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 08:54
|
|
|
Futaba Anzu posted:I don't really know what to think about bottomless as a service because I greatly vehemently dislike how their subscription is set up and how much of it seems to want to be automated, that really bit me the wrong way just recently.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 09:13
|
|
|
https://youtu.be/RkG5CrercLk Unedited so this is the sleepy audio whole I brew Came out pretty good
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 18:02
|
|
|
This noob is getting his first induction-compatible moka pot. I understand that I won't get real espresso, but hopefully it will give me a close-enough mocha without spending $1k. What's a good grinder (<$200, refurbished is fine) to pair it with?
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 19:29
|
|
|
bizwank posted:I mean that is literally the point of their service, and the name is a dead giveaway. If a subscription that ensures you never run out isn't what you're looking for, I was using Mistobox before Bottomless and was perfectly happy with them. There may be better options too, those are just the only two I've tried. I think subscription services can be a good way to try a bunch of different roasters, but I don't care for them past that. I used Mistobox for a while, but noticed they really weren't paying attention to my preferences and I kept getting coffee profiles that I didn't like. I took the time to rate them each time, but little changed. I finally got a really burnt coffee and just straight up cancelled the subscription. This was early in their existence, so hopefully that part has gotten better. They did send some good coffee and I did find a few new roasters that I still order coffee from, just direct instead.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 19:29
|
|
|
theHUNGERian posted:This noob is getting his first induction-compatible moka pot. I understand that I won't get real espresso, but hopefully it will give me a close-enough mocha without spending $1k. What's a good grinder (<$200, refurbished is fine) to pair it with? Encore would be fine with a moka pot, you want it a bit coarser than espresso and the adjustability doesn’t matter as much
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 19:36
|
|
|
theHUNGERian posted:This noob is getting his first induction-compatible moka pot. I understand that I won't get real espresso, but hopefully it will give me a close-enough mocha without spending $1k. What's a good grinder (<$200, refurbished is fine) to pair it with? buy 30 bags of Cafe Bustelo Supreme and just use that for the authentic Moka experience
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 19:47
|
|
|
hypnophant posted:Encore would be fine with a moka pot, you want it a bit coarser than espresso and the adjustability doesn’t matter as much Thanks. aldantefax posted:buy 30 bags of Cafe Bustelo Supreme and just use that for the authentic Moka experience I have ground coffee on the way, but I also wanted to experiment with different beans, and not all come ground, so I will need a grinder eventually.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 20:06
|
|
|
Don't believe the people that tell you moka pots are meant to be dirty
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 20:08
|
|
|
Ah, "authentic Moka experience" was supposed to be a joke. I'm sure I'll get it eventually.
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 20:25
|
|
|
aldantefax posted:buy 30 bags of Cafe Bustelo Supreme and just use that for the authentic Moka experience
|
|
#
?
Jan 9, 2021 23:03
|
|
|
Looking for some advice. After doing a variety of pour over methods and using the Breville Precision brewer James Hoffmann recommended a year ago, I finally got the greenlight to get more into making espresso. My lady and I have slightly different wants in this regards and I'm looking for opinions on potential differences and/or what people would recommend The main 3 machines we are eyeing are the Crossland CC1, Breville Barista Pro Espresso and the Gaggia Anima Prestige Super Automated. I have a Baratza Encore with the Virtuoso burrs installed My lady likes the idea of just pushing a button to get a cappuccino or whatever while I'd like to practice and get good at pulling espresso. Pretty different goals there. I know the Gaggia has some minor tweaking I can do on grind and what have you but definitely less then the Crossland If it came down to just the Crossland and the Barista Pro, would you pick one over the other? Thanks
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2021 07:03
|
|
|
The encore isn’t really up to espresso grind even with the virtuouso burr so in that sense the barista pro has a leg up on the cc1 (because it includes an espresso grinder), although I have no experience with either. Be aware with super autos that they tend to have fairly involved cleaning routines which must be performed regularly. They’re somewhat idiot-proof when making a drink, but you pay for that convenience with time spent soaking parts and running cleaning cycles. Hang on to the manual, and make sure to pick up whatever cleaning solutions the manufacturer recommends, especially for the milk system
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2021 07:34
|
|
|
I have never really been too critical of coffee, typically drinking Foldgers or whatever with a bunch of half and half and sugar. My buddy brought in Black Rifle Coffee "Beyond Black" and I instantly fell in love. I can no longer drink Chock full of nuts swill anymore. I however, would rather not purchase BRC so I need some alternatives. I just do a cheapo drip machine on the days I work from home, and would just like something better than this cheap crap. I am not a real big fan of bitter tasting. Any suggestions?
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2021 15:44
|
|
|
It's a good time to like coffee. The exact machine that you use is not very important. The most important thing is that you buy beans and grind them shortly before brewing. All other parts of the process - which brew method you use exactly, whether you filter your water, which beans you use - are less important than that. I would propose that you get yourself a sampler pack with different kinds of beans and a reasonably priced hand grinder, like a Hario slim. If you have 5-10 bucks left, also get a french press (assuming you have a water cooler / kettle of course). Then just grind the beans and put the coffee in your machine or french press and go. Typical dosages are around 1:15, or one gram of coffee for every 15 gram of water. To start with, your coffee can be ground as finely as the pre-ground coffee you buy. Then experiment a little with grinding finer and coarser. If you are grinding too fine, you will introduce harsh and bitter notes (you over-extracted the grounds). Grind too coarse keeps the brew sour (you under-extraced the grounds). If you are not using your automatic drip maker you can also experiment with brew temperature and duration. Higher temperatures and longer durations increase extraction, but the impact of these variables is smaller than that of your grind coarseness. James Hoffmann and Scott Rao offer excellent coffee explanations, tutorials and what not. Your first 2 or 3 cups might be poo poo but after that it'll be massively better than pre-ground coffee, with a minimal investment in effort.
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2021 16:02
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 12, 2024 15:14 |
|
|
Yeah even though I was just in here raving* about my new Baratza Encore being so much better than a cheap Hario hand grinder, I still recommend that (and everything else the guy above me said) as your entry point, unless you're ready to spend. Fresh ground vs. pre-ground is just a whole world of difference right off the bat. I'd also emphasize that if you don't have a food scale, get one. It's another very inexpensive thing that will make a significant difference, and it's useful for way more than just coffee. It makes it so much easier to stay consistent, especially if you buy a variety of different roasts from different sources. (Which you probably will.) *Crazy Old Maurice, hmm
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2021 16:12
|
|