Stellaris: a second Astral Planes has hit the game

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punishedkissinger: Sep 20, 2017

isn't growth basically just determined by number of planets and not number of pops?

# ? Jan 16, 2021 17:50

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# ? May 24, 2024 07:38

Noir89: Oct 9, 2012; I made a dumdum

SirTagz posted:

People playing tall.. what is the game end for you? For me it feels natural to try achieve dominance across the galaxy by either conquering or vassalizing everyone. And maybe deal with the various crises.

What about the tall play? You just vassalize or do you have some different goals altogether? And do you also play tall in multi and how does that work for you?

It vary between playthroughs, but when I do a tall playthrough planet bonsai(stealing that one) is the goal since I actually enjoy it and find it sort of calming :v:

# ? Jan 16, 2021 17:53

Truga: May 4, 2014; Lipstick Apathy

if you play wide you have to make alloys and minerals to support the expansion

if you play tall, you can just spam science labs and coast on space minerals and the 2 starter forges forever if you know what you're doing, hitting repeatable techs and your last unity tree less than 100 years into the game

snowball mechanics dictate wide is strictly better in the long run, but haphazardly managing 100 planets, dealing with robot pops, and whatnot, is less fun than lesurly managing 20 planets/habitats, to me, and against the AI, it really doesn't matter on any difficulty. and then,100 years in, you're so far ahead of the AI anyway that you can explode and let sectors manage all the bullshit planets AI built and still win easily

e: and yeah, bonsai planets makes sense lol

twistedmentat posted:

If the problem is that fe are too beefy for the ai to slow them down, that seems like more bad game design than a player not being able to counter. It also means that hippy peaceful empires are completely pointless bevause you need to I start prepping for war with a fe from the start.

pacifist empires are ridiculously powerful in wars, ironically, because you're always fighting with a 15% fire rate bonus

Truga fucked around with this message at 18:14 on Jan 16, 2021

# ? Jan 16, 2021 18:01

ilkhan: Oct 7, 2004; I LOVE Musk and his pro-first-amendment ways. X is the future.

[new game]
Life-seeded devouring swarm.
Yeah, that sounds good.

# ? Jan 16, 2021 18:41

The Cheshire Cat: Jun 10, 2008; Fun Shoe

punishedkissinger posted:

isn't growth basically just determined by number of planets and not number of pops?

Yeah this is the main issue. Because of the way pop growth works, there is a ceiling on how fast pops can grow on an individual planet but no limit on how fast they can grow across your entire empire. So more planets just means more pops growing in parallel and there isn't really any penalty for having a bigger empire. Admin cap is a lot like overextension from EU4 where it's meant to just slow down the pace of your expansion so you have to spend a bit of time integrating newly acquired territory before conquering more, rather than something that actually serves as a limit on how big your empire can get.

Basically the main reason to play tall is that you just find it annoying to have to manage so much territory, rather than it being mechanically beneficial to remain a smaller empire.

# ? Jan 16, 2021 21:24

SirTagz: Feb 25, 2014

Is there any reason now to backfill all planets? I remember in some iteration of the admin cap/something.. having lines to unowned systems caused piracy or some whit. I am just wondering atm how much I would win by ignoring all but the best systems while expanding

# ? Jan 16, 2021 22:41

Vienna Circlejerk: Jan 28, 2003; The great science sausage party!

SirTagz posted:

Is there any reason now to backfill all planets? I remember in some iteration of the admin cap/something.. having lines to unowned systems caused piracy or some whit. I am just wondering atm how much I would win by ignoring all but the best systems while expanding

There used to be an "empire cohesion" score that gave you a sprawl penalty for having more than a certain number of hyperlanes extending outside your borders or having isolated unowned systems within your borders but that disappeared sometime around when Federations came out, I think. There's still a +2 piracy protection all your owned systems get that you would not have for trade routes passing through unclaimed territory but that's pretty trivial.

Edit: Be careful if you have open borders with anybody, though. AI empires will be absolute assholes about taking even the most garbage unowned bubbles inside your borders if they start to run out of room to grow elsewhere.

Vienna Circlejerk fucked around with this message at 22:59 on Jan 16, 2021

# ? Jan 16, 2021 22:53

ilkhan: Oct 7, 2004; I LOVE Musk and his pro-first-amendment ways. X is the future.

Speaking of which, is there a best way to handle trade stations? 6 trade hubs for range or 3 trade hubs plus 3 strike craft hangers for protection? 3+3 would take a lot more starbases.

# ? Jan 16, 2021 23:01

Libluini: May 18, 2012; I gravitated towards the Greens, eventually even joining the party itself.

The Linke is a party I grudgingly accept exists, but I've learned enough about DDR-history I can't bring myself to trust a party that was once the SED, a party leading the corrupt state apparatus ...; Grimey Drawer

SirTagz posted:

Is there any reason now to backfill all planets? I remember in some iteration of the admin cap/something.. having lines to unowned systems caused piracy or some whit. I am just wondering atm how much I would win by ignoring all but the best systems while expanding

Another thing to take into account: Both number of owned systems and number of districts built on a planet count towards your station cap. Therefore, the more systems you control, the more stations you can make.

# ? Jan 16, 2021 23:03

Yami Fenrir: Jan 25, 2015; Is it I that is insane... or the rest of the world?

ilkhan posted:

Speaking of which, is there a best way to handle trade stations? 6 trade hubs for range or 3 trade hubs plus 3 strike craft hangers for protection? 3+3 would take a lot more starbases.

Trade lanes go through wormholes and gateways. build those.

# ? Jan 16, 2021 23:04

Bobfly: Apr 22, 2007; EGADS!

Apropos of the planet management discussions, do any of you have any experience with the improved planet and sector automation mod? It certainly is convenient, but it'd be nice to know if it'll gently caress me over in the long run.

# ? Jan 16, 2021 23:09

MrL_JaKiri: Sep 23, 2003; A bracing glass of carrot juice!

SirTagz posted:

Is there any reason now to backfill all planets? I remember in some iteration of the admin cap/something.. having lines to unowned systems caused piracy or some whit. I am just wondering atm how much I would win by ignoring all but the best systems while expanding

There's no particular benefit to it and a lot of reasons not to

# ? Jan 16, 2021 23:19

Kaal: May 22, 2002; through thousands of posts in D&D over a decade, I now believe I know what I'm talking about. if I post forcefully and confidently, I can convince others that is true. no one sees through my facade.

ilkhan posted:

Speaking of which, is there a best way to handle trade stations? 6 trade hubs for range or 3 trade hubs plus 3 strike craft hangers for protection? 3+3 would take a lot more starbases.

It's much better to have dedicated trade stations than hybrid ones. Plant a Bastion nearby if you need to, but often the border Bastions are sufficient. Generally you can get by with only a handful of trade stations once you have Starholds or Citadels. And then you get Gateways and you only need a single trade station that propagates through all of them.

# ? Jan 16, 2021 23:20

The Cheshire Cat: Jun 10, 2008; Fun Shoe

MrL_JaKiri posted:

There's no particular benefit to it and a lot of reasons not to

Yeah in the early exploration game it's better to snake out your empire to grab choke points, keep borders closed with other empires, and backfill only once you've run out of room to expand. Unless a sector has a resource you absolutely need right now or planet you want to settle, it's generally a better idea to just save it for when you have some spare influence.

# ? Jan 16, 2021 23:38

Vienna Circlejerk: Jan 28, 2003; The great science sausage party!

Yami Fenrir posted:

Trade lanes go through wormholes and gateways. build those.

And until then, patrols aren't a complete waste now that admirals gain experience from piracy suppression.

# ? Jan 16, 2021 23:48

Dareon: Apr 6, 2009; by vyelkin

Vienna Circlejerk posted:

Edit: Be careful if you have open borders with anybody, though. AI empires will be absolute assholes about taking even the most garbage unowned bubbles inside your borders if they start to run out of room to grow elsewhere.

I had to declare three loving wars because this dipshit wouldn't stop colonizing inside my borders. Wouldn't have been so bad except the truces from those wars were interfering with the war I wanted to declare on him.

# ? Jan 17, 2021 00:03

Yami Fenrir: Jan 25, 2015; Is it I that is insane... or the rest of the world?

Dareon posted:

I had to declare three loving wars because this dipshit wouldn't stop colonizing inside my borders. Wouldn't have been so bad except the truces from those wars were interfering with the war I wanted to declare on him.

Protip: AI's never colonize through other's border further than 1 system. So if you build an outpost in the systems directly corrected to your chokepoints, you can block them off.

# ? Jan 17, 2021 00:09

Splicer: Oct 16, 2006; from hell's heart I cast at thee
🧙🐀🧹🌙🪄🐸

The robot amenities traits don't give the +20%/-20% amenities they say they do, they give a flat +1/-1 amenities on a base of 4.

# ? Jan 17, 2021 01:40

Eimi: Nov 23, 2013; I will never ~~log off~~shut up.

Having to find out where pirates come from and map out proper patrol routes is massively unfun so I just download a mod that disables pirates because gently caress them.

# ? Jan 17, 2021 01:45

PittTheElder: Feb 13, 2012; Yes, it's like a lava lamp.

ilkhan posted:

Speaking of which, is there a best way to handle trade stations? 6 trade hubs for range or 3 trade hubs plus 3 strike craft hangers for protection? 3+3 would take a lot more starbases.

There's no single best way because it depends on where the trade is being generated (mostly where your planets are). I try to get my star bases all in a continuous line back to the capital if possible, with a few all trade hub stations to collect it all, and am not afraid to lose out on small amounts of trade in the process.

Then when gateways come online use gateways.

# ? Jan 17, 2021 06:13

Koorisch: Mar 29, 2009

It's kind of staggering how much energy you can get from a properly protected trade lane, it's good.

# ? Jan 17, 2021 12:42

Guilliman: Apr 5, 2017; Animal went forth into the future and made worlds in his own image. And it was wild.

Splicer posted:

The robot amenities traits don't give the +20%/-20% amenities they say they do, they give a flat +1/-1 amenities on a base of 4.

Almost all +% specific resourse bonuses from traits are raw + X number bonuses in the pop jobs rather than a %. It's done like this so it shows the extra resources in building and district tooltips.

# ? Jan 17, 2021 12:57

Splicer: Oct 16, 2006; from hell's heart I cast at thee
🧙🐀🧹🌙🪄🐸

Guilliman posted:

Almost all +% specific resourse bonuses from traits are raw + X number bonuses in the pop jobs rather than a %. It's done like this so it shows the extra resources in building and district tooltips.

It's just amenities, crime, stability, and trade in vanilla (and possibly some weird stuff going on in event specific jobs I've never looked at), everything else runs off planet_jobs_minerals_produces_mult style modifiers embedded in the trait itself. None of which changes the fact that 1 isn't 20% of 4 :v:

# ? Jan 17, 2021 13:28

Libluini: May 18, 2012; I gravitated towards the Greens, eventually even joining the party itself.

The Linke is a party I grudgingly accept exists, but I've learned enough about DDR-history I can't bring myself to trust a party that was once the SED, a party leading the corrupt state apparatus ...; Grimey Drawer

Splicer posted:

It's just amenities, crime, stability, and trade in vanilla (and possibly some weird stuff going on in event specific jobs I've never looked at), everything else runs off planet_jobs_minerals_produces_mult style modifiers embedded in the trait itself. None of which changes the fact that 1 isn't 20% of 4

Could be the background calculations round up. Wouldn't be the first time this happens. The game does the same to your influence, after all.

Could also mean that when you see 1 displayed, the game actually really uses 0,8 and doesn't tell you this. :v:

# ? Jan 17, 2021 13:57

Yami Fenrir: Jan 25, 2015; Is it I that is insane... or the rest of the world?

Libluini posted:

Could be the background calculations round up. Wouldn't be the first time this happens. The game does the same to your influence, after all.

Could also mean that when you see 1 displayed, the game actually really uses 0,8 and doesn't tell you this.

This is 100% a thing that happens.

It's especially a thing with influence, where it shows you as 3.75 as 3 or something like that iirc.

# ? Jan 17, 2021 14:10

Splicer: Oct 16, 2006; from hell's heart I cast at thee
🧙🐀🧹🌙🪄🐸

Libluini posted:

Could be the background calculations round up. Wouldn't be the first time this happens. The game does the same to your influence, after all.

Could also mean that when you see 1 displayed, the game actually really uses 0,8 and doesn't tell you this.

Nope

code:

triggered_planet_modifier = {
	potential = {
		OR = {
			has_trait = trait_robot_emotion_emulators
			has_trait = trait_charismatic
		}
	}
	modifier = {
		planet_amenities_no_happiness_add = 1
	}
}

All the other amenities things do 1.6 or whatever is the right number. Just a weird stealth buff to maintenance drones

# ? Jan 17, 2021 14:19

SirTagz: Feb 25, 2014

Koorisch posted:

It's kind of staggering how much energy you can get from a properly protected trade lane, it's good.

Slightly confused about this to be honest. Most of the guide videos I have seen, have touted never to build commercial zones as the clerk jobs are least effective or something. But that is how you mostly get commerce for your tradelines.. So.. If you do not use clerk jobs.. how do you get that energy from trade lanes?

Or are commercial zones still worth it?

# ? Jan 17, 2021 20:51

jng2058: Jul 17, 2010; We have the tools, we have the talent!

SirTagz posted:

Slightly confused about this to be honest. Most of the guide videos I have seen, have touted never to build commercial zones as the clerk jobs are least effective or something. But that is how you mostly get commerce for your tradelines.. So.. If you do not use clerk jobs.. how do you get that energy from trade lanes?

Or are commercial zones still worth it?

I use the Consumer Benefits Trade Policy, so half my Trade Value makes Consumer Goods. So by providing both Energy and Consumer Goods, I do find Commercial Zones to be worthwhile.

# ? Jan 17, 2021 21:45

Yami Fenrir: Jan 25, 2015; Is it I that is insane... or the rest of the world?

Planets can sort of passively produce some trade via housing districts (which gives clerk jobs) as well as merchants and stuff.

Trade honestly isn't worth it still - you DO end up with a bunch but that's mostly because it's all of your empire's trade value added together. It just looks like a big number, but it's not enough to carry your energy upkeep on your own.

The trade policies are good if you want to save on space for things (I usually go with consumer goods). Megacorps with a Trade League and a bunch of trade bonuses can make it almost worthwhile.

The biggest problem is still that building slots are way too valuable to waste them on clerk jobs.

Yami Fenrir fucked around with this message at 22:00 on Jan 17, 2021

# ? Jan 17, 2021 21:50

Jazerus: May 24, 2011

trade is your least important resource, but it's still worth juicing if there are no better options. it can be a good idea to raise your capital's trade value above certain thresholds to make it more likely to become the market hub, which carries very significant bonuses.

# ? Jan 17, 2021 22:32

Phosphine: May 30, 2011; WHY, JUDY?! WHY?!
🤰🐰🆚🥪🦊

I don't know if it's actually a good idea, but I like plopping down a resort world eventually, and there I mostly just rotate luxury housing and commercial. It feels like a good idea at least

# ? Jan 17, 2021 22:33

PittTheElder: Feb 13, 2012; Yes, it's like a lava lamp.

The bonus you get from resort worlds (global +Amenities) is extremely good, but it usually comes so late as to not make a deal difference.

# ? Jan 17, 2021 23:06

MrL_JaKiri: Sep 23, 2003; A bracing glass of carrot juice!

Fun thing: got a spectral wraith rampaging through my systems, and I joined a federation to avoid having to build any ships (literally just 10 starting corvettes built all game). Fortunately it ran straight into VLUUR and got itself killed within 6 months.

# ? Jan 17, 2021 23:13

Serephina: Nov 8, 2005; 恐竜戦隊
ジュウレンジャー

Trade is a huge pain in the rear end, but it's a solid thing to expand into when you run out of space as a pacifist midgame and have pops bursting from the seams. So suddenly clerks, which are a bad deal per-capita, become a good deal per-building-slot.

# ? Jan 18, 2021 00:20

Eimi: Nov 23, 2013; I will never ~~log off~~shut up.

PittTheElder posted:

The bonus you get from resort worlds (global +Amenities) is extremely good, but it usually comes so late as to not make a deal difference.

Yeah, I wish you could unlock it earlier because I'd love to set one up, but it's a very deep tech for some reason.

# ? Jan 18, 2021 00:57

Anita Dickinme: Jan 24, 2013; Grimey Drawer

I haven't played for a couple years but I reinstalled to play and now there's a launcher but the game isn't launching. Just says game failed to launch. Searched online and there's a whole bunch of gently caress poo poo like changing settings on my PC and I tried some of those suggestions but nothing's worked so far. Any recommendations?

# ? Jan 18, 2021 01:32

ilkhan: Oct 7, 2004; I LOVE Musk and his pro-first-amendment ways. X is the future.

Anita Dickinme posted:

I haven't played for a couple years but I reinstalled to play and now there's a launcher but the game isn't launching. Just says game failed to launch. Searched online and there's a whole bunch of gently caress poo poo like changing settings on my PC and I tried some of those suggestions but nothing's worked so far. Any recommendations?

Make sure mods are disabled. And you're clicking play not resume.

# ? Jan 18, 2021 01:58

Relevant Tangent: Nov 18, 2016; Tangentially Relevant

Espionage. Might be fun. Infiltrating a hivemind seems silly though. The kind of job you give the diplomat you hate. Hey Ted, remember when you told the boss that joke about Blorgs and pre-sapient species? Yeah, looks like you're running intelligence operations on Gravlax the Hungerswarm, the entity that presents as a flock of murderous toucans. Have fun with that.

# ? Jan 18, 2021 02:12

ilkhan: Oct 7, 2004; I LOVE Musk and his pro-first-amendment ways. X is the future.

uhh. Can hive/swarm empires not build robots? I'm not seeing the tech pop up and I'm pretty sure I've got the pre-req social tree tech complete and know I have the exoskeletons one.

# ? Jan 18, 2021 02:31

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# ? May 24, 2024 07:38

Horace Kinch: Aug 15, 2007

Hive Minds can't build robots, they make up for it with their innate boosts to pop growth though.

# ? Jan 18, 2021 03:17

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > Stellaris: a second Astral Planes has hit the game

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