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I feel like there's a lot I'm missing in The Medium because I don't know anything about mid-20th-century Polish history. What's weird is that in the level where you explore Richard's background, the letter in the fireplace shows that his father was killed in something like 1965, but then it delves into a whole mess of anti-Semitism with what happened to Rose, which seems to make people think that Richard's flashbacks were mostly set during the German occupation in WWII?
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Jan 30, 2021 21:27
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Basic Chunnel posted:Apparently they patented their “innovative” play-through-two-maps-at-once technology, definitely not something done years ago by a better studio in a better game. Wow really? Because honestly it kind of sucks. Sometimes it is done okay but often it's the game setting up problems that wouldn't exist without the main character being a medium. The ability that makes her stand out is limiting, not freeing, but not in a way that is really interesting. Like the part where the stairway collapses in the lobby, most of those duel world games would allow you to spirit walk up them, but because of how they did it here you just get a magical barrier in the middle of a perfectly functional stairway. I find the story interesting so I'm keeping at it, but idk why they would consider it so good they had to patent it
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Jan 30, 2021 21:57
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Their patent is actually for the simultaneous control method and they've had it since 2016. It doesn't appear to have anything to do with the renderer. You can read it here.
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Jan 30, 2021 22:35
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Software patents are weird anyway- you can't patent an output, only the process/device used to achieve that output, but for some reason when it's computer programs you're allowed to patent vague concepts and end results?
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Jan 30, 2021 22:57
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Basic Chunnel posted:The patenting of game mechanics is a death knell for indie gaming and, frankly, good AAA gaming. Innovation in games is never a spontaneous thing, it’s a dialogue between games that is antithetical to patent. An easy thought experiment you can try at home is think of a famous game from your childhood, imagine that they’d patented the most basic and exciting mechanic, and extrapolate what games could not have been made as a result. Congratulations you've just made the dumbest post on the forums
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Jan 30, 2021 23:02
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exquisite tea posted:Their patent is actually for the simultaneous control method and they've had it since 2016. It doesn't appear to have anything to do with the renderer. You can read it here. The question I have is what the practical execution means? Brothers is a game where you control two characters with one controller? If the simultaneous nature is the important thing I can probably prove The Medium uses a single character controller and the whole thing is smoke and mirrors.
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Jan 30, 2021 23:25
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It's very specific and only applies to scenarios where a player uses one controller to control two characters in two viewports that display separate story scenarios at the same time without switching. That's the kind of patent which is probably legitimately about a specific implementation of a control technology, but IANAL.
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Jan 30, 2021 23:29
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Well, completed The Medium and my thoughts gonna do some spoilers: The game is a love letter to Silent Hill, yes, you have Akira Yamaoka doing music, and Mary Elizabeth McGlynn comes back for vocals. Presentation is absolutely beautiful even though the gimmick of the game causes most systems to chug. Combat: There's really not any, if you come into this expecting to play a game like Silent Hill you'll be disappointed, there's one enemy and you have very little interaction, they generally catch you, you're dead Puzzles: I spoiler combat because details give away the game, but puzzles here are ultra simplistic, you find a part, you don't really back track all that much and most puzzles are confined to the room you find items in. Story: It's ok, I guess? There's not much here in the way of layers, it's presented in a straight forward format and if you don't know something, chances are, you'll find out before the end of the game. The ending though? So to keep the monster from escaping, even though it's shown it can be everywhere, and interact with the real world, it has to possess the main character, and for the ending to be left ambiguous of who is shot is just really dumb, unless its opening up for DLC but it seems highly unlikely. Overall: It's an ok game, there's nothing new here, it's got cool fixed camera angles, and it'd been fine in the era it harkens back to. It tries REALLY hard to be a new Silent Hill game without being Silent Hill, and IMO it falls flat. Do we really know what makes a Silent Hill game anymore? We are slightly blinded by nostalgia and reverence, when the last game to even come close by the very same team that made Silent Hill was nearly 20 years ago. I would HIGHLY say don't pay full price for this, I got this part of Game Pass and I was annoyed with a bunch of issues with the game and the ending that would've really sunk this hard had I paid full price. If you want something with a few jump scares and looks really good, but not much more beneath the surface, give it a shot for the cheap, or part of Xbox Game Pass. Edit: Sorry if I ramble a bit, not exactly a writer.
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Jan 31, 2021 22:53
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Hot take: Silent Hill has been Silent Hill'd as much as Silent Hill can be Silent Hill'd. Only through something new(TM) can there be more Silent Hill. Attempts to recreate Silent Hill can effectively mimic the atmosphere and even the themes, but they can't recreate loving 2001 and who we all were (much younger and less jaded by tons of horror games) in 2001, and are thus spinning their wheels trying to do the impossible. You can ape the classics, but you can't go back.
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Jan 31, 2021 23:46
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Lotta people don’t get that lightning in a bottle is exactly that- the moment, culture, tech, exposure, and circumstances just as much as the actual game and its quality.
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Jan 31, 2021 23:50
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Danknificent posted:Hot take: Silent Hill has been Silent Hill'd as much as Silent Hill can be Silent Hill'd. Only through something new(TM) can there be more Silent Hill. Attempts to recreate Silent Hill can effectively mimic the atmosphere and even the themes, but they can't recreate loving 2001 and who we all were (much younger and less jaded by tons of horror games) in 2001, and are thus spinning their wheels trying to do the impossible. But surely my 3rd person horror adventure game where the main character is actually a murderer will be The One
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Jan 31, 2021 23:51
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I honestly don't know what "something new" is at this point.
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Jan 31, 2021 23:52
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Blockhouse posted:I honestly don't know what "something new" is at this point. That's sort of the point. Someone would have to try some newer mode of horror. Crawling through dark places uncertain of reality while (optionally, because this takes a style of gameplay that many games seem to shy away from now) beating things to death with a pipe has been done.
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Jan 31, 2021 23:55
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Even hotter take: Silent Hill was always a fairly mediocre series of games with only one or two stand-out titles and the reason no game seems to live up to our memory of the series is because it's really only that good in our memories, so making a game as good as the real Silent Hill games were doesn't make it that good of a game.
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Jan 31, 2021 23:59
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It demands a new level of complexity with that rote horror to make it fresh, and importantly, topical. How and why did they become a murderer? Start with the murder being a given, and use horror from there to explore the fallout, as well as the circumstances leading to it. Oh no, bad dad murderer. Why? Well, job and economic stress, trauma destroying decision making, unrealistic expectations of adequacy, medical system not treating mental illness- all of it made more palatable with theater bombast. Hell, fallout could be no consequences because horror of broken police system, misogyny lacking care for a murdered wife, and other signs of a shattered society. Horror is catharsis by seeing the formless nameless mundane dreads we have given theatrical life. Stop copying and ask why something was successful down to the meta level, and build from there. On that note? Climate/Weather horror will be big.
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Feb 1, 2021 00:01
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Black August posted:It demands a new level of complexity with that rote horror to make it fresh, and importantly, topical. How and why did they become a murderer? Start with the murder being a given, and use horror from there to explore the fallout, as well as the circumstances leading to it. This doesn't sound like fun horror, it just sounds depressing. which in hindsight as someone who thought Omori was their horror game of 2020 maybe a little hypocritical for me to say
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Feb 1, 2021 00:03
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Blockhouse posted:This doesn't sound like fun horror, it just sounds depressing. Yeah, that’s why I said theatrical. Horror is always unfun and depressing! That’s why we art it up with genital monsters and menacing soundtracks to portray ‘dude’s wife sick, sexual frustration, kills’ If you’re willing to really dive into the gross complexity, you can dress it up with work into something playable/readable and share that nameless dread, in the form of standing on the other side of a dark door and wondering what the gently caress the noise you hear on the other side is.
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Feb 1, 2021 00:08
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That's a one-sided oversimplification. Horror doesn't have to be depressing and it's not only true horror if it is depressing.
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Feb 1, 2021 00:11
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one of my biggest beefs with Homecoming was that, on its face, playing a soldier in Silent Hill could have done a lot with the horrors of unending foreign wars, what being a soldier does to people, the general industry of blood and oil that's as strong today as it ever was; it could have been contemporary and really gone directions we hadn't seen yet in regard to the protagonist's psyche and how that affects the transformative nature of Silent Hill just kidding though the protagonist is crazy and fights good because ????, also Pyramid Head is back yeah whoo it's hard to say if the Silent Hill concept can't do anything new because honestly, hardly anyone tries; everyone's too caught up in trying to do Silent Hill 2-2 because I can't stop editing: Book of Memories had some neat concept to it but then everything else about it sucked wieners and also might've worked better not being called Silent Hill Lunatic Sledge fucked around with this message at 01:00 on Feb 1, 2021 |
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Feb 1, 2021 00:56
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Yeah. You could have an incredible motif of a town constantly drowning in oil and fire until sand dries it all away, before bombs returns it to blown bloody oil again.
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Feb 1, 2021 01:19
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So were you the murderer after all or a sad parent in the medium
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Feb 1, 2021 02:02
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What are some good horror titles where the horror is the general crushing hopelessness of everything? I know there have to be a bunch but atm only icepick lodge's stuff comes to mind.
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Feb 1, 2021 02:39
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First thing comes to mind is Corpse Party which I think is genuinely good horror if it didn’t have so much fetish stuff. So instead of recommending Corpse Party I’ll recommend the excellent classic manga The Drifting Classroom which recently got a series of reprints.
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Feb 1, 2021 03:35
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Drifting Classroom is... something. In a good way.
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Feb 1, 2021 03:38
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FirstAidKite posted:What are some good horror titles where the horror is the general crushing hopelessness of everything? I'm sure you're aware of Dark Wood, but that's the most oppressive and hopeless game I can think of outside of IPL's catalogue. It's got plenty of spooky jumps and fear of the unknown as well, but I'd argue the bleakness is the most affecting aspect of its horror. I can feel this hollow pit in my chest just thinking back on my time with it. Also, I'm planning to play Stars Die tonight, which I've heard is similar to Pathologic in that it's disquieting, time is relentless, and outcomes depend on who you interact with and how you interact with them. I have no idea if it fits the bill but I'll report back if it does.
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Feb 1, 2021 03:50
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treat posted:I'm sure you're aware of Dark Wood, but that's the most oppressive and hopeless game I can think of outside of IPL's catalogue. It's got plenty of spooky jumps and fear of the unknown as well, but I'd argue the bleakness is the most affecting aspect of its horror. I can feel this hollow pit in my chest just thinking back on my time with it. I just spent about 5 hours with Stars Die and it's certainly a bite-sized little experience with 5 total endings (4 + 1 secret, plus a 6th ending that's just silly if you want to count that too) that is worth $4.99 in my opinion, but the whole "characters have their own motives and will act with or without you" is kind of disappointing in actual practice. If you play the game at a "normal" pace, taking some time to explore and interact with everybody you encounter, it seems unlikely that you'll see any NPCs move to their next scripted location due to time (as opposed to your conversation triggering the move); I only saw NPCs move on their own after I started my third playthrough and was wasting a ton of time crawling all over the island looking for secrets. If you play the game multiple times to see the different endings, you'll pretty quickly pick up on each of their locations and where they are in the story. Also, as far as I can tell, each of the characters is essentially a cleverly disguised "button" for each of the endings, and you "press" the button by following whichever character you choose to the story's conclusion. I don't think you can affect the things they do or change their endings by saying something different. EDIT: Actually I don't know, maybe Eldridge refuses to let you on the Zodiac if you're a huge rear end in a top hat to him, locking you out of his ending--I didn't try that. It's definitely an interesting little cosmic horror story nonetheless. I think I'd feel pretty nonplussed if it was like $12.99 or something (I did say I spent 5 hours with it but the reality is that like 3 of those hours were doing the same part of the game over and over again) but for $4.99 you could do worse. Cream-of-Plenty fucked around with this message at 04:42 on Feb 1, 2021 |
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Feb 1, 2021 04:35
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Fyi, if anyone bought the Bundle for Racial Justice and Equality from itch.io, Stars Die is included in that so you might already own it.
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Feb 1, 2021 05:05
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What jump scares are you complaining about in The Medium? I've cleared the game and I can't think of one.Cardiovorax posted:Even hotter take: Silent Hill was always a fairly mediocre series of games with only one or two stand-out titles and the reason no game seems to live up to our memory of the series is because it's really only that good in our memories, so making a game as good as the real Silent Hill games were doesn't make it that good of a game. Nope. You're really living down to that red text. While the fact that every survival horror fan ritually genuflects in SH2's general direction does get a little tiresome, it's not wrong. It does have the issue where it's a unique case of lightning in a bottle, so a lot of attempts to follow it up are doomed to failure simply because you can't make it 2001 again. As far as I'm concerned, the primary problem here is that nobody who's interested in doing a sequel to SH2, spiritually or directly, seems to understand what it is that worked about SH2. A lot of the games that are influenced by it are focusing in on one specific feature or quality of SH2 as it's the secret key to the whole thing. SH3 comes pretty close, but then SH4 throws away the match and the descent starts. Even The Medium, which feels like the most honest shot at an SH2 follow-up of anything in the last 10 years or so, seems to be relying heavily on the world-switching and Yamaoka's soundtrack as if they're all it needed. That, in turn, comes from how SH2 has a lot going on at the surface level, but the stuff that makes it memorable for the superfans all comes from the deeper reading. A lot of people play it and are like, "Okay, great music, creepy environments, giant psychopath pursuing you, the enemies all look like they're made of bacon. Got it." However, SH2's real worth as a horror experience comes, to my mind, from how every element of it is quite specifically about James, from the basic enemies to why Pyramid Head in particular is after him to why Maria keeps dying and coming back to life, and that's not something that a lot of people seem inclined to catch on an initial run. It probably also doesn't help that Konami doesn't give a poo poo about keeping the game in circulation.
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Feb 1, 2021 05:12
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yeah sh2's strength wasn't just its allegory but its suffocating all-encompassing solipsism, which a) isn't as obvious or immediately entertaining as meat textures and cacophonous music and b) really really loving hard to replicate bloober team is notoriously awful at capturing anything but the most superficial qualities of the horror they try to emulate so The Medium is true to form in that regard
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Feb 1, 2021 05:26
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Wanderer posted:What jump scares are you complaining about in The Medium? I've cleared the game and I can't think of one. There's one early on in the hotel involving a blood bathtub, as is customary for survival horror games. It got a good chuckle out of me since it ran that trope in reverse, if you know what I mean. The jump scare comes before you drain the blood from the bath instead of after.
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Feb 1, 2021 05:53
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Oxxidation posted:yeah sh2's strength wasn't just its allegory but its suffocating all-encompassing solipsism, which a) isn't as obvious or immediately entertaining as meat textures and cacophonous music and b) really really loving hard to replicate I always thought that'd have been a great format for a sort of revolving horror anthology, but of course, it never happened: Silent Hill as an evolving honey trap for people suffering from guilt, where each game is both marauding through an empty town with a chainsaw and an intense metaphorical character study. SH3 is about as close as they ever got again. treat posted:There's one early on in the hotel involving a blood bathtub, as is customary for survival horror games. It got a good chuckle out of me since it ran that trope in reverse, if you know what I mean. The jump scare comes before you drain the blood from the bath instead of after. Oh, yeah, good point. I beat the game in two sessions and that was in the first one, so I'd forgotten about it.
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Feb 1, 2021 05:59
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FirstAidKite posted:What are some good horror titles where the horror is the general crushing hopelessness of everything? I never played it but I heard Pathologic was great because it's just like that, you're miserably hopeless.
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Feb 1, 2021 06:04
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Silent Hill 2 had an extremely powerful aesthetic which helped to serve it more than anything else. It wasn't just about the work put into tying every part of the aesthetic to James, it was the cohesion of the art direction and the sound direction backing up that good core horror. Everything in the game very clearly follows a water theme. The colors are all grays, blues, greens. It's always rainy and misty. There's mildew everywhere. Everything feels damp, rotted, soaked, but in a way that feels as though it's right after the rain. The sounds are slow, heavy, wet, dull. But they all make sure they're referencing the same theme in cohesion together. It has a slow dream logic interspaced with real happenings without drawing excessive movie-like shock to them, such as Eddie puking. It doesn't constantly draw attention to itself, it just walks right past you with the freakshow going on. Also, I think this is overlooked, what a ton of horror games don't do at loving all is the subtle padding horror. Example: the single invisible giant in the dark world prison of SH2 that just stomps around in a cell, mutters 'ritual', and can be shot dead. Why is that there? Doesn't matter, it's genuinely creepy and just leaves you OFF. It pads out the bigger scares, the combat, and creates an atmosphere of dread. Another example from Silent Hill 3 that had me tearing off my headphones to look around when it first happened to me- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JT0Im48hjRk&t=40s SH2 (and 3) had a lot of those little padding moments that create constant anxiety. Most games will do those moments by having the titular monster visibly run by in a hall with a music sting, and it just doesn't work. You can go so far without needing a single jumpscare (or having a single memorable one like the prison toilet scream in SH2).
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Feb 1, 2021 07:32
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I like the bit in the re8 demo where you just hear a clip saying "I'm watching you"
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Feb 1, 2021 09:19
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Even knowing in advance this is a compilation video clip of spooky sounds from a game I've beaten half a dozen times, I got a little anxious and uncomfortable watching this. It really cannot be overstated how sublime those first three silent hills were at creating environments that felt innately hostile even when they were completely empty.
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Feb 1, 2021 09:57
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Black August posted:
No, more toddlers running into walls!
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Feb 1, 2021 10:03
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King of Bleh posted:Even knowing in advance this is a compilation video clip of spooky sounds from a game I've beaten half a dozen times, I got a little anxious and uncomfortable watching this. It really cannot be overstated how sublime those first three silent hills were at creating environments that felt innately hostile even when they were completely empty. It does so much to make you want to stand in a death-silent corner and never move again because you constantly feel jumpy, just from simple ambience in a totally safe area. It made the environment feel alive with hate instead of a haunted house ride. It’s important to keep the player constantly unsure if they’re in danger, even with no combat. Even save rooms feel menacing since they have no music and are in unsafe-feeling places.
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Feb 1, 2021 10:20
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The Saddest Rhino posted:No, more toddlers running into walls! The thing that bothers me is that that bit is so clearly meant to be a joke and I see it get brought up like a mark against the game for having a funny joke in it. A lot of horror games have funny stuff in them to lighten the mood.
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Feb 1, 2021 10:41
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Silent Hill 3’s ufo end is the canon
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Feb 1, 2021 10:46
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My favorite ufo ending is the one from Silent Hill Arcade. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wS3ivcCwoYA
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Feb 1, 2021 10:52
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