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Gaz-L posted:There's literally a conspiracy theory that many of them adhere to, though? I don't know why I bothered
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Feb 5, 2021 21:42
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site posted:I want to see a show with Fury and Maria contemporaneously starting up shield and sword, both knowing what they know from CM1, with everyone thinking they're completely batshit, and the whole thing is being overseen by hydra Maybe an element of the upcoming Secret Invasion mini?
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Feb 5, 2021 21:44
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Roth posted:I don't know why I bothered So you're actually trying to argue that the conspiracy theory that Disney bribes critics to badmouth the DC movies, and WB are completely powerless to stop this, and that it somehow only applies to Snyder's films, not the other recent entries that have been well-received, is something that should be validated? Gaz-L fucked around with this message at 21:47 on Feb 5, 2021 |
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Feb 5, 2021 21:44
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Yikesarooni. For what it's worth I haven't seen snydertalk go that route
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Feb 5, 2021 21:48
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STAC Goat posted:Maybe an element of the upcoming Secret Invasion mini? Was that one of the shows announced? It feels like forever ago I only remember a handful off the top of my head.
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Feb 5, 2021 21:49
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Gaz-L posted:So you're actually trying to argue that the conspiracy theory that Disney bribes critics to badmouth the DC movies, and WB are completely powerless to stop this, and that it somehow only applies to Snyder's films, not the other recent entries that have been well-received, is something that should be validated? No, because that's insane and I think it's absurd that in the same page where you bemoan Snyder fans for not treating you with respect you pull this out about how it's totally cool to talk poo poo in return. It's about as insane as if I had started claiming that the MCU fans all agree that Martin Scorsese is evil and think way too highly of the only movies they appear to have seen. Ignore dumb people on twitter.
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Feb 5, 2021 21:50
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FilthyImp posted:Yikesarooni. Roth posted:No, because that's insane and I think it's absurd that in the same page where you bemoan Snyder fans for not treating you with respect you pull this out about how it's totally cool to talk poo poo in return. The comments you mentioned about 'cultists', in my experience, are aimed at that specific crowd. Gaz-L fucked around with this message at 21:55 on Feb 5, 2021 |
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Feb 5, 2021 21:52
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A talking coyote posted:Was that one of the shows announced? It feels like forever ago I only remember a handful off the top of my head. Yeah it's one of those in the pipeline without a set date iirc
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Feb 5, 2021 21:52
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That theory has also not been relevant in years, and I've certainly never seen it uncritically posted on SA.
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Feb 5, 2021 21:53
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Uh... I think you're conflating "Disney threatens no Future access in response to bad reviews" with "DISNEY is trying to DESTROY the DCEU?!" It's also kind of bugfuck that you go straight to that as some kind of weird Q theory that Snyderbros spout? Like poo poo, I've read "Peter Parker Child Soldier" and "Actually the Black MCU film is bad because CIA handjob" so many times on these forums but I'm not going straight to that well in an argument. VvV Man, if anyone buys that MRA/Reddit adjacent trash as anything more than trolling... I dunno what to say. FilthyImp fucked around with this message at 21:56 on Feb 5, 2021 |
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Feb 5, 2021 21:53
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FilthyImp posted:Yikesarooni. It reach its zenith when Capt Marvel came out. The "argument" was that the critics HAD to be getting paid off to give it positive reviews, because, you know "Brie Larson is the worst, most hated person EVER!!!"
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Feb 5, 2021 21:54
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Gaz-L posted:The idea of being able to experience art in a vacuum, 'without knowing what fascism is' as Lt Danger said, is functionally impossible, we all bring our own context as well as knowledge of the artist and the metatext of other works, including other works by the same artist. who is "we"? what do "we" "know"? different individuals are going to have different backgrounds, perspectives and, yes, knowledges. this is going to change the reader's understanding of a work depending on which specific "individual" that is the time traveller does not experience art in a vacuum, but merely experiences art without knowledge of fascism. consider an alternative thought experiment: an unabashed fascist watches Starship Troopers. do they see it as a satire? is that because of Verhoeven, or the fascist? Starship Troopers is not a satire. you can read it satirically, like any other film, if you choose - and if enough of you get together, you can get the broader culture to call it a satire. but you still construct the reading, like anything else quote:Honestly, that's kind of what I'm hoping for, is to have my point of view acknowledged without being dismissed, and it's very frustrating that with these specific films by this one film-maker, that that seems to be impossible unless that point of view is unabashed praise, otherwise you're a monster who hates artistic freedom. you should unpack this a little. as said everyone in this thread can claim "you dismissed my point of view!" if you just want people to be able to say they liked/disliked something then okay but discussion will be somewhat solipsistic - how can you interact if your differing individual opinions risk invalidating one another? if you want more substantive discussion then I suspect we will discover that opinions in fact can be right or wrong (specifically: inaccurate, irrelevant, immoral) - that, or irreconciliable perspectives shall force us apart
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Feb 5, 2021 21:57
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FilthyImp posted:Uh... I think you're conflating "Disney threatens no Future access in response to bad reviews" with "DISNEY is trying to DESTROY the DCEU?!" Oh, i'm not making any point about whether or not the MCU reviews are inflated, but the notion that WB can't pull the same tactics is absurd. Roth posted:That theory has also not been relevant in years, and I've certainly never seen it uncritically posted on SA. Which is good. I was in no way saying that someone here was saying that. Just that it should be reasonable to call that poo poo out and saying you can't is really not good.
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Feb 5, 2021 21:58
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A talking coyote posted:Was that one of the shows announced? It feels like forever ago I only remember a handful off the top of my head. Yeah. It has a writer and stars Fury and the Skrull from Captain Marvel, and is supposed to start filming in April. So like I could see it being a show set between Captain Marvel and Endgame or something and factor into the retconning of SWORD into the universe. That makes more sense to me than having a whole massive Skrull invasion of super heroes in a 6 episode mini series on Disney+. The announced shows so far are: WandaVision - now Falcon & Winter Soldier - March Loki - May What If...? - "mid 2021" Ms. Marvel - "late 2021" Hawkeye - "late 2021" Moon Knight - "2022" She-Hulk - "2022" Guardians of the Galaxy Holiday Special - "2022" Secret Invasion - ??, but filming in April Iron Heart - ?? Armor Wars - ??, but set to film soon Wakanda series - ??
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Feb 5, 2021 21:59
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Gaz-L posted:Which is good. I was in no way saying that someone here was saying that. Just that it should be reasonable to call that poo poo out and saying you can't is really not good. Again, it is absurd to demand people treat you with respect for your opinion, and then turn around and be all "Yeah, but you all believe this specific crazy thing so it's ok"
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Feb 5, 2021 22:01
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Davros1 posted:It reach its zenith when Capt Marvel came out. The "argument" was that the critics HAD to be getting paid off to give it positive reviews, because, you know "Brie Larson is the worst, most hated person EVER!!!" lmao you are conflating two different groups, because I genuinely don’t remember that poo poo being that prominent on DCEU Twitter when Captain Marvel came out.
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Feb 5, 2021 22:01
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Gaz-L posted:The comments you mentioned about 'cultists', in my experience, are aimed at that specific crowd. Earlier in the thread you had a post about how you can only think a 4 hour movie is good if you're a deluded Zack Snyder cultist.
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Feb 5, 2021 22:03
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STAC Goat posted:Yeah. It has a writer and stars Fury and the Skrull from Captain Marvel, and is supposed to start filming in April. So like I could see it being a show set between Captain Marvel and Endgame or something and factor into the retconning of SWORD into the universe. That makes more sense to me than having a whole massive Skrull invasion of super heroes in a 6 episode mini series on Disney+. Oh wow I didn’t realize so many of them come out this year that’s awesome!
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Feb 5, 2021 22:05
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Roth posted:Again, it is absurd to demand people treat you with respect for your opinion, and then turn around and be all "Yeah, but you all believe this specific crazy thing so it's ok" OK. I'll be as frank and self-reflective as I can here. I will apologise without reservation for that comment. It was said in frustration but that is no excuse. This whole discussion has riled me up a fair amount over the last few days, not helped by personal stuff, and I may have responded poorly to your words specifically because your earlier comments about disliking things for 'petty' reasons made me pretty angry. Again, that is no excuse to let those feelings get the better of me, and I should probably step away from this thread, if not the subforum/forums for a day or two and engage with other things.
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Feb 5, 2021 22:06
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Roth posted:I don't know why I bothered I don't either. You have been screeching into the abyss about Snyder's movies for days straight at this point. Take a breath, mate. Let some people be wrong if that's really how you feel. This thread and all the threads before it have had the EXACT same tone and response to unabashed DCEU praise for forever now. It never changes. It just gets more and more snide and bitter. The thread's been locked once already in the last week because nobody is willing to just agree to disagree. I know we don't have movies anymore, so everyone is just bored and stuck inside, but sheesh. Like drat bro you liked 300 and wish people were nicer to people who liked BvS. You're heard. You're loved.
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Feb 5, 2021 22:07
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Gaz-L posted:So you're actually trying to argue that the conspiracy theory that Disney bribes critics to badmouth the DC movies, and WB are completely powerless to stop this, and that it somehow only applies to Snyder's films, not the other recent entries that have been well-received, is something that should be validated? I'm not sure if this is a post made in bad faith or just utterly tone deaf McCloud fucked around with this message at 22:12 on Feb 5, 2021 |
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Feb 5, 2021 22:08
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If Marvel really wants to do this multiverse thing, they better include poo poo like Lou Ferrigno Hulk, Roger Corman Fantastic Four, Reb Brown Captain America, etc. Go real dumb with it, please.
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Feb 5, 2021 22:09
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Equeen posted:lmao you are conflating two different groups, because I genuinely don’t remember that poo poo being that prominent on DCEU Twitter when Captain Marvel came out. Oh no, I'm not confused. There were people upset that Capt Marvel was getting positives reviews from reviewers that gave negative reviews to BvS. They just also managed to throw in some misogyny in there as well.
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Feb 5, 2021 22:09
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A talking coyote posted:Oh wow I didn’t realize so many of them come out this year that’s awesome! It feels like they're trying to create a HBO like streamline where there's always a new show airing. So Falcon/Winter Soldier premieres a week after WandaVision ends and Loki premieres right after that ends. Covid just delayed everything (and could again).
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Feb 5, 2021 22:10
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Gaz-L posted:OK. I'll be as frank and self-reflective as I can here. I will apologise without reservation for that comment. It was said in frustration but that is no excuse. For what it's worth, I did not mean that it was bad to dislike things for petty reasons. I dislike a lot of things for incredibly petty reasons, so apologies for posting like I was being an elitist snob.
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Feb 5, 2021 22:13
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Roth posted:For what it's worth, I did not mean that it was bad to dislike things for petty reasons. I dislike a lot of things for incredibly petty reasons, so apologies for posting like I was being an elitist snob. It's the implication that the reasons are petty in the first place, if I may elaborate, that stuck with me, because the reasons I was expressing are not, to me, petty. I certainly have had things I dislike for petty reasons, because I find an actor's voice annoying for instance. Those reasons I was expressing are not, to me, petty; they're kind of fundamental McCloud posted:I'm not sure if this is a post made in bad faith or just utterly tone deaf Generally assume the one that's incompetent/dumb on my behalf. Gaz-L fucked around with this message at 22:19 on Feb 5, 2021 |
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Feb 5, 2021 22:16
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Davros1 posted:Oh no, I'm not confused. There were people upset that Capt Marvel was getting positives reviews from reviewers that gave negative reviews to BvS. They just also managed to throw in some misogyny in there as well. Who, specifically?
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Feb 5, 2021 22:18
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Davros1 posted:Oh no, I'm not confused. There were people upset that Capt Marvel was getting positives reviews from reviewers that gave negative reviews to BvS. They just also managed to throw in some misogyny in there as well. This is about as productive as pointing out all the MCU fans that made jokes about Snyder's daughter committing suicide because he makes bad movies. Regressive shits are everywhere, and I'm not going to pretend that one set of fans is better about it than another.
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Feb 5, 2021 22:21
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Jamesman posted:If Marvel really wants to do this multiverse thing, they better include poo poo like Lou Ferrigno Hulk, Roger Corman Fantastic Four, Reb Brown Captain America, etc. Go real dumb with it, please. Corman F4 showing up would make me absurdly happy, but are any of those people still acting?
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Feb 5, 2021 22:22
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Phylodox posted:I mean...no? I actually quite like 300. It kind of frightens me, given everything I've discussed here, but I don't...not like it. It's a fascinating movie, especially given its context as a post-9/11 thesis on war and propaganda. I apologize, then. I read too much into your posts which wasn't there, and I may have come off a little rude because of that. I do think you're onto something with your reaction, here. 300 is a very uncomfortable film in a lot of ways, bit I think it's exactly that discomfort which makes it a powerful film. You have the baby skulls, and child abuse, and slavery, but its not presented slyly. There's no jokey "would you like to know more" TV bits, or NPH wearing an SS uniform. (Although I think there's a blink-and-you'll-miss it shot of someone fighting a literal straw man.) It's a very raw depiction of a how a harmful society can none-the-less be portrayed as virtuous and how a rudimentary conflict can be twisted into something of a tribal/national mythos. This is clearly a different approach than what Verhoeven takes, but I think it works quite well. The film's depiction of the Spartans is disturbing. I think its appropriate for the film to come away from it feeling uncertain. As such, I do think the film is effective. Schwarzwald fucked around with this message at 01:10 on Feb 6, 2021 |
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Feb 5, 2021 22:22
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McCloud posted:Who, specifically? It was a big thing with the comicsgate crowd at the time, which is why you don't see it much anymore, as the movement itself has fractured and died
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Feb 5, 2021 22:23
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McCloud posted:Who, specifically? Thinking on it for a bit, there probably were some Snyder fans who are also obnoxious self-proclaimed anti-SJWs. But I don't understand the point of bringing that up in the first place. You, Roth, and I won't excuse that poo poo, and no one has made the argument that the Snyder fandom is entirely made up of uwu perfect babies who never do anything bad, so what purpose did it serve?
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Feb 5, 2021 22:29
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Sorry to bring this up, and I understand that there is some bleedover between movies and tv shows and whatnot but could the WandaVision chat go to the tv thread. Just in general there is a TV thread and a movie thread and it's a bit annoying seeing black spoiler boxes for a tv show here. Thanks for reading my annoying whiny post about forums and have a good day
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Feb 5, 2021 22:30
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It annoys me too tbh
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Feb 5, 2021 22:33
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Feb 5, 2021 22:36
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Apologies.
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Feb 5, 2021 22:37
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Wait a minute... WandaVision TeleVision Mother of god...
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Feb 5, 2021 22:37
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STAC Goat posted:Apologies. No worries and I didn't want to say anything because there's definitely a cross between the mcu movies and this show that makes it a bit of a grey area. (plus you're trying to distract from snyder chat which is understandable)
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Feb 5, 2021 22:40
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Roth posted:This is about as productive as pointing out all the MCU fans that made jokes about Snyder's daughter committing suicide because he makes bad movies. Regressive shits are everywhere, and I'm not going to pretend that one set of fans is better about it than another. I was replying to the post where someone brought up the theory a few years back where there was a vocal, albeit probably small, portion of people who were accusing Disney of paying off/bribing/strong-arming reviewers to give Disney/Marvel films good reviews, possibly at the expense of other films. I wasn't saying one set of fans are better than another set of fans, I was just pointing out that I remember, when Capt** Marvel came out, and had positive reviews, there was, at least on my feed, people who were upset that CM got good reviews when BvS did not. ** Why does my computer continually suggest "Captaincies" when I start to type "Capt"? I have never used the word "Captaincies" before. Be helpful, auto-fill!
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Feb 5, 2021 22:41
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site posted:It was a big thing with the comicsgate crowd at the time, which is why you don't see it much anymore, as the movement itself has fractured and died I recall seeing neckbeards angry about captain marvel. I don't recall them being mad about the same reviewers giving BvS bad reviews, but then again I actively go out of my way to avoid anything related to the -gate people Equeen posted:Thinking on it for a bit, there probably were some Snyder fans who are also obnoxious self-proclaimed anti-SJWs. But I don't understand the point of bringing that up in the first place. You, Roth, and I won't excuse that poo poo, and no one has made the argument that the Snyder fandom is entirely made up of uwu perfect babies who never do anything bad, so what purpose did it serve? I'm sure there were. Just as there were MCU fans that harassed the girl that played Tony Starks daughter or celebrated dropping nukes on japan because Disney almost lost Spider-man or liked BP because they thought it was a pro-trump movie. Drawing a comparison between outliers and a group as a whole is incredibly disingenuous. McCloud fucked around with this message at 22:48 on Feb 5, 2021 |
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Feb 5, 2021 22:45
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