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I guess I was wrong about the "Rosanne" style 90s episode since that shot turned out to be a part of the "Family Ties" style 80s episode, really don't know what's coming next outside of an episode with "Modern Family/The Office" style testimonials (as was mentioned earlier in the thread) which, in the context of the show as it is, is potentially insane. I'm not watching anymore trailers or promos so I'm kinda enjoying the mystery. Obviously there's the Halloween episode but who knows how or where that fits in.
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Feb 8, 2021 03:33
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There's a scene in the midseason trailer which looks exactly like a confessional interview from Modern Family. Also the big bit that I'm surprised hasn't been talked about more is from one of the earlier trailers which had Vision and Agnes talking about how Agnes thought she might be dead and how she knew Vision was. Doctor Spaceman fucked around with this message at 03:48 on Feb 8, 2021 |
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Feb 8, 2021 03:46
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The 90's episode is supposedly taking a lot of influence from Malcolm in the Middle
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Feb 8, 2021 03:48
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I'd love if they got up to the 2010s and did Fresh Off The Boat, complete with Jimmy going "This seems oddly familiar"
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Feb 8, 2021 03:56
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I'm game. Liked the shot of USAgent doing the modern-day equivalent of War Bonds Patriotism.
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Feb 8, 2021 04:24
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Codependent Poster posted:The 90's episode is supposedly taking a lot of influence from Malcolm in the Middle I don't buy it. It's not an ABC IP or even from the 90's. Imagine this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWSvRrv7Sq4
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Feb 8, 2021 06:44
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Both Olsen and Bettany have mentioned Malcom in the Middle so I doubt they'd just say that to say that.
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Feb 8, 2021 06:58
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Codependent Poster posted:Both Olsen and Bettany have mentioned Malcom in the Middle so I doubt they'd just say that to say that. Oh. Yeah it's probably that then. 
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Feb 8, 2021 07:07
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alright, I just watched five episodes of Wandavision last night after not reading anything about it. Is Agnes Agatha Harkness? Like she's got most of the name, just smushed together, and she seems to be either conscious of what's going on or actually manipulating it a little Also I'd buy that the town was originally getting controlled by Puppet Master. You could say Wundagore was in Sokovia, get you a backdoor FF connection, and it's pretty similar to the couple times he put his daughter into a perfect little Americana zone
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Feb 8, 2021 14:10
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Karma Tornado posted:alright, I just watched five episodes of Wandavision last night after not reading anything about it. I think this strengthens my argument, any explanation other than "Wanda did it" would only be satisfying to people who have read a lot of comics.
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Feb 8, 2021 14:33
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why, they still have two hours or so to introduce things and basically all the movies have been loose adaptations of a bunch of comics with no prior context given for people who hadn't read them
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Feb 8, 2021 14:52
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It's been very clear that someone is setting up situations and manipulating Wanda into certain things here. She's doing it but she's not fully in control. It's really obvious if you go through it again.
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Feb 8, 2021 14:58
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Gripweed posted:I think this strengthens my argument, any explanation other than "Wanda did it" would only be satisfying to people who have read a lot of comics. people have said this about so many MCU moves and its never true
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Feb 8, 2021 15:05
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It would only make sense if you read the comic with the talking tree in it. Otherwise it's just too much for audiences.
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Feb 8, 2021 15:16
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X-O posted:It would only make sense if you read the comic with the talking tree in it. Otherwise it's just too much for audiences. groot.....?
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Feb 8, 2021 15:20
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scary ghost dog posted:groot.....? I'm agreeing with the post you made by saying the same thing people were saying when Guardians of the Galaxy was announced.
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Feb 8, 2021 15:21
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X-O posted:I'm agreeing with the post you made by saying the same thing people were saying when Guardians of the Galaxy was announced. ah. i dont know who agatha harkness, wundagore or puppet master are so i thought it was possible one of them were a talking tree but i didnt want to embarrass myself by making an assumption.
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Feb 8, 2021 15:24
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Agatha Harkness is a witch who babysat Franklin Richards but also gave Wanda magic training when she decided to be an actual witch in addition to using her mutant powers Puppet Master is a Fantastic Four villain who makes sculptures out of radioactive clay (from, coincidentally, the weird mountain where Wanda and Pietro were born) to control the subjects of the sculpture
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Feb 8, 2021 15:30
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Karma Tornado posted:Agatha Harkness is a witch who babysat Franklin Richards but also gave Wanda magic training when she decided to be an actual witch in addition to using her mutant powers i notice you havent specified whether either of these characters are trees.
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Feb 8, 2021 15:32
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all of them are raccoons
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Feb 8, 2021 15:36
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scary ghost dog posted:i notice you havent specified whether either of these characters are trees. All comic characters are trees if you think about it. Unless they're just from webcomics.
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Feb 8, 2021 16:09
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Gripweed posted:That's not interesting, that sucks. Then all she has to do is beat the bad guy. And it means that all the terrible things she did to the townspeople are forgiven because actually a bad guy did it. It would retroactively make the show up to this point bad, because this has all just been faffing around until Wanda beats the bad guy. That doesn't track with the last episode. "A bad guy started it, but Wanda is perpetuating it" doesn't absolve her of wrong-doing. That was Vision's point. He wanted to understand and give her an out. She denied it, but we didn't get a resolution. Even after the bad guy has been beaten, the voice in everyone's head was Wanda and they will rightfully feel violated. At least that's what Monica had to say about it. Even in the scene where someone says "This is more power than we've ever seen" someone has the rebuttal of "Well she nearly single-handedly obliterated Thanos." She blew up an infinity stone. I feel like I'm misunderstanding how Wanda could believe she was starting a private and small illusion that accidentally became real and affected a larger area without her realizing it immediately. Because she knows she is spatially in a city in New Jersey and made the active choice to eject several people who attempted to bring that reality to light. I guess I'm struggling to get from "this is an accident she started that is now out of control" without getting to "that makes Wanda seem a bit dim wrt her own powers". Because she supposedly carried Vision's corpse to this location. There has to have been a purpose.
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Feb 8, 2021 16:17
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Gavok posted:All comic characters are trees if you think about it. :weebay:
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Feb 8, 2021 16:19
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Gavok posted:All comic characters are trees if you think about it. The plot thickens... I for one welcome our new behind the curtain secret villain theory, I'm really enjoying this show and I'm sure I'll be satisfied with the outcome whether it's Puppet Master, Mephisto, Grim Reaper, AIM, SWORD, just Agnes, or just Wanda because so far so good.
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Feb 8, 2021 16:27
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hoping its claymation modok from the new patton oswalt show
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Feb 8, 2021 16:28
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Sgt. Politeness posted:The plot thickens... Edit: On a side note, people keep saying "she" and "her" when it comes to being controlled, obviously Monica would have said if it wasn't Wanda's "voice" in her head but what if it wasn't? Like it's definitely made to look like Wanda is controlling all this but she hasn't really been able to stop things from happening, sure she can manipulate things here and there by altering, editing, rewinding, etc but she hasn't been shown doing anything close to mind controlling yet right? Like she could break the radio and edit the transmission but she didn't make the blonde lady like her which would have been the simple way if she was outright controlling her. I guess it could still be her subconscious
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Feb 8, 2021 16:43
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I have a weird idea/theory Maybe the Wand we see in the "shows" is a construct and the Wanda that came out of the anomaly is the real deal. Kind of like how she had a construct for public appearances in House of M. In other shows, the SB clip for FatWS was so good, I am hype as gently caress for that show.
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Feb 8, 2021 16:46
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Sgt. Politeness posted:Edit: On a side note, people keep saying "she" and "her" when it comes to being controlled, obviously Monica would have said if it wasn't Wanda's "voice" in her head but what if it wasn't? Like it's definitely made to look like Wanda is controlling all this but she hasn't really been able to stop things from happening, sure she can manipulate things here and there by altering, editing, rewinding, etc but she hasn't been shown doing anything close to mind controlling yet right? Like she could break the radio and edit the transmission but she didn't make the blonde lady like her which would have been the simple way if she was outright controlling her. I guess it could still be her subconscious Obviously Wanda understands sitcom writing and that conflict is necessary.
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Feb 8, 2021 17:14
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scary ghost dog posted:people have said this about so many MCU moves and its never true I don't think anyone has ever said "any answer other than 'Wanda did it' would be unsatisfying" halfway through an MCU movie before. I'm not saying audiences wouldn't accept those characters in general. I am saying that those characters being responsible for the events of Wandavision would be unsatisfying.
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Feb 8, 2021 17:57
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Gripweed posted:I don't think anyone has ever said "any answer other than 'Wanda did it' would be unsatisfying" halfway through an MCU movie before. full disclosure, i havent watched any of the show
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Feb 8, 2021 18:12
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It's not going to be "Wanda did it" because 1) the showrunner wrote Captain Marvel and Black Widow movies and can probably to be trusted to not assassinate Wanda's character like some trashy comic book and 2) that's the obvious misdirection answer they give you half way through an ongoing mystery.
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Feb 8, 2021 20:00
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Another thought. If decade-appropriate things from the outside world can enter the Hex, and Wanda's decade-jumping, then doesn't the barrier effectively come down when she hits Modern Family mockumentary-style? In the MCU, repulsor tech existed by the 2010s.
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Feb 8, 2021 21:12
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Cocks Cable posted:It's not going to be "Wanda did it" because 1) the showrunner wrote Captain Marvel and Black Widow movies and can probably to be trusted to not assassinate Wanda's character like some trashy comic book and 2) that's the obvious misdirection answer they give you half way through an ongoing mystery. How is it character assassination? I don't understand the opposition some people in this thread have to Wanda doing bad things. And I don't think the fact that the showrunner wrote Captain Marvel and Black Widow is proof that she can only write stories about Good Girls.
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Feb 8, 2021 21:38
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Gripweed posted:How is it character assassination?
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Feb 8, 2021 21:46
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CapnAndy posted:"Lady hero does something bad because ~emotions~ and women are dumb and so goddamn crazy, so now she's a baddie because powerful women are inherently sinister, am I right, fellas" is an overworn comics cliche that has long since worn out its welcome and was never as cute as it thought it was in the first place, and Wanda's gotten way more than her share of it over the years. We don't want to see MCU Wanda go down the same road. OK this is gonna be a big response because I think every clause in that post is a bad argument, some of them in multiple ways. Wanda isn't doing something bad because "~emotions~", it's because she's been through some truly horrific trauma, which the audience has seen. She is relatable, and her reacting to her trauma in a bad way is understandable. If you think Wanda being willing to hurt other people in order to create a happy family for herself after everything she's been through is "dumb and so goddamn crazy", that's entirely a you problem. Wanda is not the only powerful woman in the MCU. There's Captain Marvel and Black Widow and Gamora and Nebula, all female characters who have also been through trauma and responded in positive ways. To have one woman react in a negative way is not misogynist. It would not be a triumph of feminism to make a rule that women can only be good guys. There have been lots of male villains in the MCU motivated by a past trauma. Helmut Zemo is a bad guy because his family died. But Wanda having the same motivation for doing bad things is unacceptable? Why does she have to be a baddie? She can have done this and come out the other end as not a straight up villain. Especially if we assume she didn't know she was doing it in the beginning. We could end up with a morally complex character, which I, for one, would like. I don't care about Wanda in the comics, and frankly I assume that neither does the majority of the Wandavision audience. And on top of that, if they do they might disagree with you. Like, for example, Elizabeth Olson, who read the comics where Wanda goes "dumb and so goddamn crazy" and sad yes this rocks, I want to do this. You know what road I don't want to see MCU Wanda go down? The one where she just keeps getting batted around from tragedy to tragedy by powers outside of her control. Stark, Stucker, Ultron, Thanos, S.W.O.R.D., now Mephiston, Wanda's life is just that gif of Homer falling down Springfield Gorge, bumping his head on every horrific personal tragedy on the way down. That sucks. That loving sucks. The story of a powerful woman who just gets the rug pulled out from her life over and over again and can't do anything about it except for at the end after the villain has completely hosed her over, then she gets the pointess moral victory of shooting him with a laser beam, is not actually in any way better than the story of a powerful woman becoming evil. It's just misery porn, and it can absolutely gently caress off. I will take evil Wanda over that in a heartbeat.
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Feb 8, 2021 22:25
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There's four episodes left, so we can probably stop writing epitaphs for Wanda's character development at this time.
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Feb 8, 2021 22:41
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I'd say that taking a beloved hero character and turning them into a straight up mind-raping villain is as heavy handed as you can get in terms of character assassination. Just because Wanda did terrible things in the comics and had very questionable story lines does not justify repeating them on a more prestige format where you can and should be more selective and aware of the implications of what you're presenting to audiences. Besides, creating a whole TV series just to turn Wanda into a villain seems awfully bizarre and pointless. Victims of abuse turning into an abuser themselves is not empowering.
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Feb 8, 2021 22:53
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Cocks Cable posted:I'd say that taking a beloved hero character and turning them into a straight up mind-raping villain is as heavy handed as you can get in terms of character assassination. Just because Wanda did terrible things in the comics and had very questionable story lines does not justify repeating them on a more prestige format where you can and should be more selective and aware of the implications of what you're presenting to audiences. She doesn't have to be a villain. We can have a complex character outside the hero/villain dynamic, I firmly believe this is a goal humanity could achieve in our lifetime. And you're wrong, a person who has had their family destroyed by an uncaring world deciding that they will do whatever it takes to rebuild their family even if it means hurting other people is an empowering story. Empowering is not the same as good.
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Feb 8, 2021 23:08
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Gripweed posted:She doesn't have to be a villain. We can have a complex character outside the hero/villain dynamic, I firmly believe this is a goal humanity could achieve in our lifetime. We've already seen MCU Wanda do bad things prior to this show, intentionally and not, and no matter what happens here, she's clearly complicit. But if she's straight up independently responsible for everything that's happening in Westview, especially after everything laid out in the most recent episode, seems like she just becomes irredeemably villainous. If that's where they wanna go, sure, but it doesn't seem like the angle to me, in part because that also completely vindicates Hayward over Rambeau/Woo/Darcy, and if there's anything I'd put money on, it's that that dude is not in the right.
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Feb 8, 2021 23:39
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double negative posted:We've already seen MCU Wanda do bad things prior to this show, intentionally and not, and no matter what happens here, she's clearly complicit. But if she's straight up independently responsible for everything that's happening in Westview, especially after everything laid out in the most recent episode, seems like she just becomes irredeemably villainous. If that's where they wanna go, sure, but it doesn't seem like the angle to me, in part because that also completely vindicates Hayward over Rambeau/Woo/Darcy, and if there's anything I'd put money on, it's that that dude is not in the right. Once again we come back to my sincere belief that as a species we are capable of creating fiction that features moral complexity. I believe that a character can do something very bad and still not be irredeemably villainous. I believe that this can all be Wanda's fault but "murder Wanda and her children with a missile" is still not a reasonable response. You may say I'm a dreamer,
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Feb 8, 2021 23:49
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