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Hedgehog Pie
May 19, 2012

Total fuckin' silence.
I once had an epic game that I won 3-2 in extra time. No one will ever believe me but it happened!

(it was after having played the game for many hours before so I understood it pretty much fully)

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BioEnchanted
Aug 9, 2011

He plays for the dreamers that forgot how to dream, and the lovers that forgot how to love.
I only managed to win that game once in all my playthroughs. Never happened again.

It is pretty funny though if you go after Wakka's ultimate weapon and sigil.

"I retired from Blitzball after 23 years and only one win. Then I played 73 tournaments in 3 months and dominated them all."

BioEnchanted has a new favorite as of 08:38 on Feb 25, 2021

Qwertycoatl
Dec 31, 2008

I think a lot of the Sen's Fortress love comes from how if you've played the game a ton then you know where all the traps are and you can use them against the enemies. On the first playthough it's a lot of bullshit dying though.


The first Blitzball game is a great introduction, it teaches you everything you need to know - that blitzball is terrible and unfun and not worth bothering with.

exquisite tea
Apr 21, 2007

Carly shook her glass, willing the ice to melt. "You still haven't told me what the mission is."

She leaned forward. "We are going to assassinate the bad men of Hollywood."


I replayed FFX last year and Wakka's celestial weapon was the only one I didn't bother to get. Somehow it manages to be the most tedious sigil in the same game where you have to dodge lightning 200 times.

Leal
Oct 2, 2009
Its because even in the most optimal situation you're still playing blitzball where each game is timed for 5 minutes, even ignoring the timer stopping for all the menu fuckery. It has a time floor that you simply cannot bypass that measures multiple hours.

Maxwell Lord
Dec 12, 2008

I am drowning.
There is no sign of land.
You are coming down with me, hand in unlovable hand.

And I hope you die.

I hope we both die.


:smith:

Grimey Drawer
All SE minigames are a reminder of why they really need to stick to RPGs.

(Exception: Slime Quest)

serefin99
Apr 15, 2016

Mikoooon~
Your lovely shrine maiden fox wife, Tamamo no Mae, is here to help!

Nuebot posted:

So I've been replaying Digimon Story: Cyber Sleuth because I felt like doing a simple rear end grindy JRPG and I'm really starting to feel my original complaints about this game's systems. For example, there's one skill that lets you double your next attack's damage. Except it can only be cast on the monster that has the skill, which means you're just kind of innately taking two turns to do double damage :shepface: and the game is full of small things like that, where they had pretty good ideas that just fall flat of being actually useful because of restrictions that render them kind of useless.

To be fair, the point of Acceleration Boost isn't to increase your damage, it's to conserve your SP. Sure, you can just use your big huge 35 SP twice to same effect, but if you do that, you just spent 70 SP- in a game where some Digimon will barely break 100 even at max level. Whereas if you use Acceleration Boost, you're only using 35+6=41 SP.

Nuebot
Feb 18, 2013

The developer of Brigador is a secret chud, don't give him money

exquisite tea posted:

You basically have to savescum the Jecht Shot trial to have any chance of winning the blitzball tournament in Luca. I know some nerd is currently spinning up some 10,000 word defense of how it's totally possible to win without the Jecht Shot because I did it myself at the age of 13 after playing FFX for 500 hours, but it's true.

To be fair it's as easy as any other blitzball game if you know that one trick: you score one goal then afk behind your own net until the time runs out and hope wakka doesn't screw you over. But yeah blitzball sucks if you try to play it legit.

serefin99 posted:

To be fair, the point of Acceleration Boost isn't to increase your damage, it's to conserve your SP. Sure, you can just use your big huge 35 SP twice to same effect, but if you do that, you just spent 70 SP- in a game where some Digimon will barely break 100 even at max level. Whereas if you use Acceleration Boost, you're only using 35+6=41 SP.

Yeah I realized that like right after I posted. I'm still somewhat early on where most of my attacks are barely using like 15 SP, but I realized with higher level dudes it'd probably matter a lot more.

The Moon Monster
Dec 30, 2005

The Jecht shot trial minigame is weird because if you don't what you're supposed to do it's completely baffling, can't do it kid. If you actually know how it works though it's extremely easy.

Ibblebibble
Nov 12, 2013

Maxwell Lord posted:

All SE minigames are a reminder of why they really need to stick to RPGs.

(Exception: Slime Quest)

You take that back about Triple Triad.

Cleretic
Feb 3, 2010


Ignore my posts!
I'm aggressively wrong about everything!

Ibblebibble posted:

You take that back about Triple Triad.

Someone at Square-Enix needs to answer some questions as to why they made a physical Final Fantasy TCG, and based exactly none of it off of Triple Triad.

Hedgehog Pie
May 19, 2012

Total fuckin' silence.
I've occasionally started FFX up just so I can play some blitzball. :shobon:

Kennel
May 1, 2008

BAWWW-UNH!
I'm pretty bad at Dark Souls, but Sen's Fortress was somehow the easiest area for me so far (I'm still in Anor Londo). I think I died maybe twice before reaching the top despite playing blind. It was very stressful, but also satisfying.

Gerblyn
Apr 4, 2007

"TO BATTLE!"
Fun Shoe

Hedgehog Pie posted:

I've occasionally started FFX up just so I can play some blitzball. :shobon:

I have to admit I much prefer the blitzball challenge to that awful "Race the chocobo along the beach" thing you have to do for Cloud's weapon. I suck at it badly, and the margin for error is tiny.

Also, every time I try to go for the celestial weapons in FFX I always miss getting one of the precursor materials in the main playthrough, then when I try and go back to get it later, it's always guarded by some insane super boss who one shots the whole party :(

An Actual Princess
Dec 23, 2006

Gerblyn posted:

I have to admit I much prefer the blitzball challenge to that awful "Race the chocobo along the beach" thing you have to do for Cloud's weapon. I suck at it badly, and the margin for error is tiny.

Also, every time I try to go for the celestial weapons in FFX I always miss getting one of the precursor materials in the main playthrough, then when I try and go back to get it later, it's always guarded by some insane super boss who one shots the whole party :(

that's only an issue in the rereleases; those bosses didn't exist in the base version. their placement is super dumb and hosed me over the first time I played the remaster

My Lovely Horse
Aug 21, 2010

The way the Dark Aeons are implemented is one of the dumbest things I've ever seen in an enhanced version of a game. Actually exemplifies why I tend to dislike them altogether.

exquisite tea
Apr 21, 2007

Carly shook her glass, willing the ice to melt. "You still haven't told me what the mission is."

She leaned forward. "We are going to assassinate the bad men of Hollywood."


Just give Yojimbo some Gil and have him one-shot all the Dark Aeons for you. Pay 2 Win, baby!

Hedgehog Pie
May 19, 2012

Total fuckin' silence.

Overwatch Porn posted:

that's only an issue in the rereleases; those bosses didn't exist in the base version. their placement is super dumb and hosed me over the first time I played the remaster

Unless you're a European like me, then you've never known a FFX without the Dark Aeons! :pseudo:

Joey Freshwater
Jun 20, 2004

Always playing with my meat
Grimey Drawer
Didn't the Dark Aeons exist in the original version of the Japanese release? I thought they were just added to the remaster because of that

exquisite tea
Apr 21, 2007

Carly shook her glass, willing the ice to melt. "You still haven't told me what the mission is."

She leaned forward. "We are going to assassinate the bad men of Hollywood."


They were not present in the original JP release and not present in the NA version, either. The Dark Aeons first appeared in the International Release, which was the first version to be released in Europe and the definitive standard for all future ports and remasters moving forward. The version history of FFX is pretty interesting because there were significant balance and content changes between editions, even beyond the Dark Aeons.

Joey Freshwater
Jun 20, 2004

Always playing with my meat
Grimey Drawer
Ah yeah that's what it was, thanks

Inspector Gesicht
Oct 26, 2012

500 Zeus a body.


The original JP release of FF7 was practically unfinished since it lacked the Weapon fights and numerous QOL features from later versions.

John Murdoch
May 19, 2009

I can tune a fish.
For me I like Sens because of how clear and blatant it is from literally the first steps inside: This is a trap-filled gauntlet full of wacky bullshit, and hopefully by now you've figured out how to deal with that stuff. It's the final exam for the game's level design in the same way O&S waiting beyond it are the final exam for fighting bosses. Aside from the fuckiness with the boulders and some other minor quirks, I really don't think it's that bad at all.

And as I've oft-said, I like roughly half of Blighttown. Not a clean split between upper and lower, though upper definitely has more going on overall compared to "so what if there were like...um...six giant leeches? and they attacked you...?" down below.

Hedgehog Pie
May 19, 2012

Total fuckin' silence.

exquisite tea posted:

They were not present in the original JP release and not present in the NA version, either. The Dark Aeons first appeared in the International Release, which was the first version to be released in Europe and the definitive standard for all future ports and remasters moving forward. The version history of FFX is pretty interesting because there were significant balance and content changes between editions, even beyond the Dark Aeons.

Yeah, the one that pops into my head is Quick Hit, which I think was massively overpowered in the original version? The rerelease changed how it prioritises certain attacks, so while Quick Hit is still super useful it can't exactly be spammed constantly any more. Or something like that, idk. I know a bunch of other abilities were added too, most of which are negligible and are locked behind multiple locks anyway, but I appreciated the "extract" abilities that made getting spheres a bit easier early on.

I think the worst thing about the Dark Aeons blocking stuff off concerns Auron's limit break. After you defeat Spherimorph, if you want to get all four of Auron's limit breaks while they're still remotely useful, you pretty much have to instantly backtrack all the way from Macalania to Besaid, just so you can pick up a Jecht sphere from outside the temple there. I imagine most players weren't even aware that you could go back to Besaid at that point, not to mention that the story is ramping up at that point so it seems silly to stop it dead in its tracks. Tidus' crest is obviously a dick move too, though I can't think of much else of note that's blocked unless you missed the temple treasure in either Besaid or Macalania the first time through.

Van Kraken
Feb 13, 2012

Gay Rat Wedding posted:

most importantly sunsetting simply meant most of my favorite guns were arbitrarily dumpstered in any new content because those guns committed the crime of being added to the game slightly more than a year ago. they weren't even my favorite because they were powerful and needed to be nerfed or were really recommended by other players, they just looked cool and made satisfying sounds. but nope, more than 1 year old so they gotta go

Fortunately, Bungie just admitted today that sunsetting was a huge failure that everyone hated, and they’re cancelling it immediately.

RareAcumen
Dec 28, 2012




The Moon Monster posted:

The Jecht shot trial minigame is weird because if you don't what you're supposed to do it's completely baffling, can't do it kid. If you actually know how it works though it's extremely easy.

When has knowing how things worked not made things easier in a game though?

Owl Inspector
Sep 14, 2011

Van Kraken posted:

Fortunately, Bungie just admitted today that sunsetting was a huge failure that everyone hated, and they’re cancelling it immediately.

:captainpop:

orcane
Jun 13, 2012

Fun Shoe
They still locked like 99% of the content I paid for and mostly enjoyed in the ~content vault~ so gently caress these scammers forever.

christmas boots
Oct 15, 2012

To these sing-alongs 🎤of siren 🧜🏻‍♀️songs
To oohs😮 to ahhs😱 to 👏big👏applause👏
With all of my 😡anger I scream🤬 and shout📢
🇺🇸America🦅, I love you 🥰but you're freaking 💦me 😳out
Biscuit Hider
Apparently the early Destiny 2 content was built in a very different way that sucks compared how how they did the later content, so I wonder if the vault isn't just a way of taking it out of the game and slowly reintroducing optimized versions down the line. Still annoying though.

FactsAreUseless
Feb 16, 2011

Hedgehog Pie posted:

I've occasionally started FFX up just so I can play some blitzball. :shobon:
I found it very relaxing as a kid. The game doesn't integrate it well but JRPG soccer is a pretty fun idea. I'd love to see more sports in JRPGs.

BioEnchanted
Aug 9, 2011

He plays for the dreamers that forgot how to dream, and the lovers that forgot how to love.
Same, now that I've put an evening into it and a bunch of the Besaid Aurochs actually have levels and techniques now. The playing field is evening.

The Moon Monster
Dec 30, 2005

RareAcumen posted:

When has knowing how things worked not made things easier in a game though?

What I was getting at is that the game tries but does a really poor job of explaining how it works.

Phigs
Jan 23, 2019

The big problem is the game makes you play blitzball. If it was just a side-game only the people who like it would play it and only when they wanted to play it. Making you fight a really hard game (if you don't know how to exploit it) during the story and then requiring dozxens of games for Wakka's ultimate weapon ultimately made a lot of people who don't like blitzball play an awful lot of blitzball so of course they hated it.

Triple Triad is fondly remembered in part because anybody who didn't like it could forget about it. The only complaints you really hear about it are the rules spreading fuckery.

christmas boots
Oct 15, 2012

To these sing-alongs 🎤of siren 🧜🏻‍♀️songs
To oohs😮 to ahhs😱 to 👏big👏applause👏
With all of my 😡anger I scream🤬 and shout📢
🇺🇸America🦅, I love you 🥰but you're freaking 💦me 😳out
Biscuit Hider
I'd say the way to do it is by having it as a single mandatory mission that doubles as a glorified tutorial so easy you could sleep through it with every other instance being totally optional. That way you force players to engage with the mechanic exactly one time and if they like it there's plenty more of it for them, and if they don't it's easy enough to get it over with and then you never have to think about it again.

Lobok
Jul 13, 2006

Say Watt?

ilmucche posted:

Despite being primarily online I think live for speed would train its ai in single player based on the player profile's driving. They'd start off real bad and improve to roughly the player's level across multiple races.

That's cool. And yeah, I didn't say it before but I think a key part at the beginning would be going easy on the player while the game learns.

Alhazred posted:

I just don't understand why there's so much stealth in my Spider-Man game.

And the thing is, even when it's Spider-Man doing the stealth it's something mostly invented for videogames. Players expect it but because of past games and other games like Arkham. Stealth is not really a big thing for the character. His whole thing is making a flashy entrance with a wisecrack and putting on a show for his automatic camera.

Crowetron
Apr 29, 2009

Been playing River City Girls and while the core of the combat is fun and satisfying, every time I engage with the other mechanics I feel like I'm missing something.

Weapons feel like a trap. They knock down enemies but it feels like they do less damage and doing a big fight with a baseball bat seems to take a lot longer than just sticking to my punches and kicks. And your basic jab attack is the same button as picking up a weapon, which leaves you wide open. So they are both riskier and less effective than basic moves. I guess some of them have big ranges, but so do most of my heavy and special attacks.

The assist characters are a cute idea but are hugely underwhelming. They all have a big windup and can get shut down by a stray punch, but when they do hit its almost never worth the tiny amount of effort it takes to time the hit. The basic dude's that stun enemies by throwing dust at them are the first one you can get and the only one that I've found to have a use beyond novelty. I've gotta be doing something wrong with these attacks, or maybe they were crazy strong at some point and got balance patched into oblivion?

The special moves are tied to a meter than you refill by landing basic attacks, which sure, good idea. But the meter refills really fast, like empty to full in 4-5 hits. And the specials aren't super strong either. They're solid combo enders/extenders, but seem just barely stronger than heavy attacks, which don't use a meter. The special moves also don't have armor or guard breaks or special properties that make them particularly spammable that I can tell. So, why is there a meter? If they cost nothing, I still wouldn't use them all the time because a lot of them are open as hell at the start and trying to land them against enemies who aren't already stunned from another hit is asking for trouble. Apparently the two girls have different specials, so maybe Kiyoko's are batshit and I just haven't seen them yet.

I also don't get the leveling system, since the progression of enemy strength seems pretty normal for a brawler so I don't know what these stats going up are actually doing since different colored henchmen still take progressively more hits.

Killer soundtrack, though.

Captain Hygiene
Sep 17, 2007

You mess with the crabbo...



In Resident Evil 6, it turns out you have a different HUD, inventory screen, and in-game options menu for characters on each campaign. Ugh. It took me a couple evenings just to learn the first ones, since they're so weird and fiddly after the last two games, but that turned out to be the best one and the others I've seen are weirder and more distracting. Why not just go for consistency :psyduck:

MisterBibs
Jul 17, 2010

dolla dolla
bill y'all
Fun Shoe
Sorry if repeating this is a dead horse, but ugh someone make me stop playing Spacebase Startopia. Every time I load it, because I've forgotten all the shittiness so far, it throws another, entirely different brand of shittiness at me.

What killed my last eh-I'll-load-it game was... well, vermin spawn around garbages piles. Except not, sometimes, because :ii-a-loving-mystery:

Somehow, garbage spawned inside a building, the brig. This caused the entire loving floorplan to somehow be covered in vermin.

:negative:

Nuebot
Feb 18, 2013

The developer of Brigador is a secret chud, don't give him money

christmas boots posted:

Apparently the early Destiny 2 content was built in a very different way that sucks compared how how they did the later content, so I wonder if the vault isn't just a way of taking it out of the game and slowly reintroducing optimized versions down the line. Still annoying though.

When Destiny 2 was first launching they made a big song and dance about how Destiny's engine sucked and that was really why they couldn't update things as fast as they wanted (despite the fact that updates, like that time they completely nuked the sunsinger subclass, often came quickly and seemingly randomly while others just kind of didn't come at all for years.) and that they were making a brand new engine that would let them just plug values in and load content on the fly!

But that wasn't true at all, allegedly, because within months of launch someone let it slip that it took them basically half a day just to load up basic rear end assets to do anything. Whether that was true or not was hard to gauge, because any time a bug or exploit was found that, say, let players get even slightly more bright dust or a weapon was letting them exploit something to skip chunks of the raid and so on; those would be fixed asap. But anything that made the game poo poo and not fun? Well that wouldn't even be touched until the next expansion. And even then it'd be half fixed at best. In fact Bungie's shown they have no issue disabling an entire weapon like the Telesto when it was giving people too much super energy, for months on end over bugs. But yet when there's a severely pressing issue that impacts people's gameplay experience, or a game mode comes out barely functional, or anything else really: they just don't bother. Just like how they've shown, many times, that they literally can balance PVE and PVP separately, they just don't want to. But they'll happily say they can't when people press them on the issue.

It's kind of a legit issue that bungie doesn't communicate their intent at all, and often just straight up lies when they do talk to their playerbase at large, and even when it's proven that they're lying or misleading people (as was the case with the throttled exp gains in early D2) they just keep on keeping on as if it never happened.

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Tender Bender
Sep 17, 2004

I'm glad the thread is talking about Dark Souls. I just got around to playing it for the first time, and... I'm not sure I like it? The overall experience is fine, but it's not blowing my mind and in terms of pacing it's kind of a slog due to the "git gud" design. I do feel myself getting better as I progress but the combat feels too limited for that to really be satisfying.

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