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warch This poll is closed. |
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68 | 44.44% |
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85 | 55.56% |
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Khanstant posted:the wholesome business model of noah's ark 3d cannot save you from gamergod if the thread title wasn't already perfect I'd be changing it to this
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Mar 4, 2021 21:34
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cheetah7071 posted:I can't speak for all MMOs but at least in ffxiv most endgame stuff is closer to stamina, in that things have weekly or daily locks on them I dunno, MMO style "you can do this all you want but you only get loot the first time for balance" feels like a good thing to discourage poopsocking. "You can only play this game while you have stamina and then you can't play anymore" feels dramatically worse, that's purely aimed at my pocketbook. Especially since they sell stamina. MMOs don't sell extra weekly lockouts. (yet lol, maybe current blizzard will do it) If Genshin doesn't sell stamina then I guess its not as bad. But do they?
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Mar 4, 2021 21:44
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idk how much of dragonspine was part of the limited time event and how much is permanent, but it was legitimately one of the best updates to any Service Game I've played, ff14 included. just one big mountain to explore full of treasures and puzzles and interesting encounters, and not once does it stop and remind you that you're playing a gacha game by making you wait for stamina or grind to fill up meters or anything. they're supposedly adding another region of similar scope within the next update or two before they add fake japan, and it's like, what if a couple times a year you woke up and botw had a new area. zelda as a serviceZaphod42 posted:If Genshin doesn't sell stamina then I guess its not as bad. But do they? homeless snail fucked around with this message at 21:51 on Mar 4, 2021 |
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Mar 4, 2021 21:45
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Zaphod42 posted:MMOs don't sell extra weekly lockouts. (yet lol, maybe current blizzard will do it)
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Mar 4, 2021 21:45
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Mmorpgs do sell those “skip old content” packs which is pretty wild, I hope at least they’re cheap
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Mar 4, 2021 21:49
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Jay Rust posted:Mmorpgs do sell those “skip old content” packs which is pretty wild, I hope at least they’re cheap They're exceptionally not cheap and its loving insane. WoW at least has the very reasonable stance of giving you a single free level skip with each expansion. This is genius, and all MMOs should adopt this. That way if there's a new expansion coming, all you have to do is decide to buy it and boom you're in on the ground floor playing with friends. No worries about having to grind through old content solo before you are allowed to play with the current toys. FFXIV does not do this, and it almost ruins the game for me and is why I won't recommend it to people. Current FFXIV is a good fun MMO but the first ~30-50 levels are a loving slog and buying a level skip costs way way way too much money. FFXIV splits the "level your job" and "do the main story quests" into two purchases of $25 each, so its $50 to hop into the latest content. (On top of the cost of the game, expansions, and monthly fees, so you're looking at like $120 to start the game if you want to jump up to the latest content) WoW's are $60 to get to the latest content, not counting cost of game or expansions (but again, expansions at least include a single free boost) Literally charging you the cost of a full priced game just to SKIP content. And again, both FFXIV and WoW's skips are per-class, so some people have bought multiple of these things. For what is literally just flipping bits in a database. Its highway robbery. Zaphod42 fucked around with this message at 21:55 on Mar 4, 2021 |
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Mar 4, 2021 21:53
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Kewpuh posted:imagine four balls on the edge of a cliff. say a direct copy of the ball nearest the cliff is sent to the back of the line of balls and takes the place of the first ball. the formerly first ball becomes the second, the second becomes the third, and the fourth falls off the cliff
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Mar 4, 2021 21:53
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with as much of shadowbringers is about ff14 lore poo poo going back to 1.0, I can't imagine how pissed off I'd be if I paid for the game+a skip because someone tricked me into "jumping up to current content"
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Mar 4, 2021 21:56
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I expect the expansion after endwalker to be bundled with a skip. No way they don't use the fact that the story is moving on to a completely new arc to address the biggest player acquisition issue the game has.
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Mar 4, 2021 21:58
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Zaphod42 posted:They're exceptionally not cheap and its loving insane. FFXIV is much different from wow in that the expansions are not standalone. They are a direct continuation of the story and skipping it is not what they want people to do. WoW puts much much less emphasis on having their story make any sense from expac to expac, they just want people to play.
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Mar 4, 2021 21:58
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Zaphod42 posted:I dunno, MMO style "you can do this all you want but you only get loot the first time for balance" feels like a good thing to discourage poopsocking. Speaking from my own personal experience I prefer dailies or weeklies to stamina because they're both designed to make your gamer brain keep playing the game, stamina's just dramatically more clingy If I've got a daily, I can pretty much just do it whenever, as long as I do it in the day Stamina means I'm pretty much constantly checking the drat game because the stamina bars like 5 hours long and if I don't spend my stamina before I hit max I'm wasting it so I gotta check in like 5 times a day
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Mar 4, 2021 21:59
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I always assumed the skips were for already existing players who wanted an extra catgirl or w/e but didn't want to level them up
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Mar 4, 2021 21:59
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They were made for Korea, mostly
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Mar 4, 2021 22:01
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cheetah7071 posted:I expect the expansion after endwalker to be bundled with a skip. No way they don't use the fact that the story is moving on to a completely new arc to address the biggest player acquisition issue the game has.
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Mar 4, 2021 22:01
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homeless snail posted:I'd expect it to not even require skips, and just start for the first time in 6 years a new msq chain with some kind of provision for new players like making the new jobs begin at that level Sure it might not literally be the skip items currently available for sale. It's their game, they can do whatever they want to make it smoother for new players
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Mar 4, 2021 22:03
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Kerrzhe posted:FFXIV is much different from wow in that the expansions are not standalone. They are a direct continuation of the story and skipping it is not what they want people to do. WoW puts much much less emphasis on having their story make any sense from expac to expac, they just want people to play. Yeah but once you're X expansions deep this basically becomes a hard barrier to entry. Its funny because its the direct opposite of the mainline Final Fantasy mentality where each game is entirely standalone so the fact that its Final Fantasy 15 doesn't mean you need to go play the first 14 to understand. And, having played most of FFXIV, I'm not sure I 100% agree. Yeah, the story builds, but you could pretty easily add a "last time on FFXIV!" quest to explain "the story up to now..." to catch people up. They would miss some things but such is the nature of a long running series. People could still enjoy the new content just fine, that's what matters. cheetah7071 posted:I expect the expansion after endwalker to be bundled with a skip. No way they don't use the fact that the story is moving on to a completely new arc to address the biggest player acquisition issue the game has. I would hope so, but we'll see. Arzaac posted:Speaking from my own personal experience I prefer dailies or weeklies to stamina because they're both designed to make your gamer brain keep playing the game, stamina's just dramatically more clingy Yeah, its an intentionally exploitative mechanic designed to prey upon your psychology and FOMO you into playing the game 24/7 and/or buying a poo poo ton of microtransactions you didn't really want.
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Mar 4, 2021 22:06
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https://twitter.com/PlayArtifact/status/1367579335276699648?s=19 Artifact is going F2P and they're canceling development on the reboot.
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Mar 4, 2021 22:07
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Did they even release a single expansion before dying, twice
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Mar 4, 2021 22:08
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Zaphod42 posted:I dunno, MMO style "you can do this all you want but you only get loot the first time for balance" feels like a good thing to discourage poopsocking. In MMOs it's definitely a good thing, or at least it can be. Sometimes that kind of thing is just done as time-gating, which sucks--if there's ever a task in an MMO that'd take you like two hours to do all of but the game makes you take three weeks to do the whole thing, that feels really bad. But for things like raid lockouts, it's definitely an anti-"kill yourself playing the game all day or you get left behind" mechanic and is good.
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Mar 4, 2021 22:10
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Zaphod42 posted:WoW's are $60 to get to the latest content, not counting cost of game or expansions (but again, expansions at least include a single free boost) I dunno about FF but WoW also goes out of its way to slow the game down if you opt to not pay for boosts. They'll sit on their hands for weeks, months, years, about big or current expac issues... but the second somebody finds out an even marginally faster way to level new characters, they scramble and hotfix it away immediately. It feels like they sit back and watch play statistics and instead of using that to guide them to developing features that people seem to gravitate toward, they instead just see that players aren't doing what they say they should be doing. I wonder if or when WoW Classics catch up to modern expansions, will there come a point where you could actually level a character from start to finish with the content designed for that stage of the game along the way. WoW changes so much from expansion to expansion, once content is old, it's basically broken. Old content was designed and tuned for systems that may or may no exist anymore and it creates these really bizarre anachronistic moments. Like you might be leveling a new character, doing some quests in was once a max level zone, that assumed characters there would have all of the game's skills and starting to acquire it's best gear. Meanwhile, today, some of those gear mechanics don't even exist anymore, your class is different, and you only have half of your abilities and you're stuck dealing with this zone full of hollow mobs wearing the skin of an era-past dealing arbitrarily scaled numbers to one another. The old notion of "learning the game" or "learning your class" doesn't apply since you don't get the game's/class' full tools until your max level and none of the content is ever challenging or engaging in a way that would ever force the player to learn the combat beyond mash 1234.
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Mar 4, 2021 22:10
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in other cooler news the Outriders dev team seems to be listening to a lot of feedback on the demo and patching it up nicely https://twitter.com/Outriders/status/1367505469317775364?s=20 adding motion blur toggle, hopefully fixing the ridiculous camera shake in cutscenes, and nerfing the boring chest run farm but leaving the captain kill farm intact (cause it at least involves combat)
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Mar 4, 2021 22:13
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Harrow posted:In MMOs it's definitely a good thing, or at least it can be. Sometimes that kind of thing is just done as time-gating, which sucks--if there's ever a task in an MMO that'd take you like two hours to do all of but the game makes you take three weeks to do the whole thing, that feels really bad. But for things like raid lockouts, it's definitely an anti-"kill yourself playing the game all day or you get left behind" mechanic and is good. This is an odd thing to balance since they're the ones wanting you to be coming back every week. My dream MMO you kill a raid boss once and everyone gets the cool treasure from it and now it's dead, for y'all anyway. Then also there's a last boss and you can beat the game.
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Mar 4, 2021 22:13
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I'm a little bit intrigued by Outriders, if only because I've heard it's closer to Borderlands in structure than Destiny/The Division/etc. (as in, it's being released as a full game that might get DLC/expansions later rather than an intentionally-incomplete live service)
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Mar 4, 2021 22:14
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If I'd bought a level skip and missed even the poo poo parts of FFXIV's story I definitely wouldn't have bothered getting to the end. It'd be like6 like paying extra to start FF7 half way through disc 2.
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Mar 4, 2021 22:16
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Khanstant posted:This is an odd thing to balance since they're the ones wanting you to be coming back every week. My dream MMO you kill a raid boss once and everyone gets the cool treasure from it and now it's dead, for y'all anyway. Then also there's a last boss and you can beat the game. Honestly the closest you're ever really gonna get to this is FFXIV. The game's generally really good about not making you grind for stuff if you're just there for the story. You do quests and dungeons as you level, you beat story bosses, you come back when there's more story to do and just keep on going. If you sit out a couple patches it might take a couple play sessions to get caught up on gear. But yeah MMOs always want you to repeat content because otherwise there's no way they'd have enough content to keep people playing for longer than a couple weeks at a time and there goes the whole house of cards.
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Mar 4, 2021 22:16
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Harrow posted:I'm a little bit intrigued by Outriders, if only because I've heard it's closer to Borderlands in structure than Destiny/The Division/etc. (as in, it's being released as a full game that might get DLC/expansions later rather than an intentionally-incomplete live service) that's correct. people compare it to destiny because it's got elemental-themed classes and the UI borrows very heavily (it looks nice) but the structure is more Borderlands with a story campaign progression and endgame repeatable content. also no pvp.
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Mar 4, 2021 22:17
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Kerrzhe posted:that's correct. people compare it to destiny because it's got elemental-themed classes and the UI borrows very heavily (it looks nice) but the structure is more Borderlands with a story campaign progression and endgame repeatable content. also no pvp. That sounds like it could be fun, then. I watched some gameplay videos and the Trickster class looks like it's pitched directly at me, too. You're telling me I get a time/space magic themed class that is also basically the Mass Effect 2 Vanguard???
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Mar 4, 2021 22:18
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"The Future of Artifact" is a misleading title in implying it has one
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Mar 4, 2021 22:25
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if there was a gaming trivia show I think I would do worse in the shooter round than the sports management sim round. I could definitely pick Borderlands 2 out of a lineup, but I just tried watching 5 minutes of outrider gameplay footage feauturing each class and I couldn't tell you when the class swap happened or when they added a skinny guy to gears of war
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Mar 4, 2021 22:26
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Rarity posted:I feel very attacked by this post I'm sorry 
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Mar 4, 2021 22:27
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Extreme Hard Mode: Identifying 2000s-2010s Shooter Protagonists, portraits only Edit: 
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Mar 4, 2021 22:28
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Harrow posted:Honestly the closest you're ever really gonna get to this is FFXIV. The game's generally really good about not making you grind for stuff if you're just there for the story. You do quests and dungeons as you level, you beat story bosses, you come back when there's more story to do and just keep on going. If you sit out a couple patches it might take a couple play sessions to get caught up on gear. I do own the game and have 33 hours on it, was torn between trying to be a dragoon or ninja eventually. I'll definitely revisit next time I get mmoitis, I reckon I'm only another 30-40 hours from where the good story is supposed to start. I unlocked bird riding the last time I played too so that should help.
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Mar 4, 2021 22:29
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CharlieFoxtrot posted:Extreme Hard Mode: Identifying 2000s-2010s Shooter Protagonists, portraits only I think #7 is Shepard but other than that I have absolutely no clue
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Mar 4, 2021 22:30
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CharlieFoxtrot posted:Extreme Hard Mode: Identifying 2000s-2010s Shooter Protagonists, portraits only 1-12 are male shep, I guess. never made that mistake for myself
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Mar 4, 2021 22:31
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I got a Dragon Quest X character created and going, but of course I have no idea what is going on.
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Mar 4, 2021 22:31
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12 is the main dude from Days Gone and I am not kidding.
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Mar 4, 2021 22:32
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CharlieFoxtrot posted:Extreme Hard Mode: Identifying 2000s-2010s Shooter Protagonists, portraits only I think 5 is Cole from Infamous and 9 is Baldur from Too Human.
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Mar 4, 2021 22:32
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Waffleman_ posted:https://twitter.com/PlayArtifact/status/1367579335276699648?s=19 Valve might as well just shut the game down then.
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Mar 4, 2021 22:33
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Apologies, they're not just shooter protagonists, also third-person action games and stealth games
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Mar 4, 2021 22:34
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| # ? May 29, 2024 04:21 |
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I said come in! posted:Valve might as well just shut the game down then. This way at least means the 8 people who still play it can continue to do so.
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Mar 4, 2021 22:36
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