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I can't believe anyone actually kept up with cutting grass beyond the first time you get like a 60g drop and realise it's not worth it.
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Mar 6, 2021 12:54
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Same goes for the boat thing really. Think I got less overall from my last 12 hour maxed trip than 2 fights overall.
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Mar 6, 2021 13:05
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The boat kicks rear end. Getting a bunch of free jp for putting the Switch to sleep is very good. E: It should be a menu option though.
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Mar 6, 2021 13:09
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I don't know how the game expects me to believe that Seth is cruising around the ocean while the Switch is asleep then suddenly back in a dungeon when I turn it back on. 0/10
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Mar 6, 2021 13:12
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SyntheticPolygon posted:I can't believe anyone actually kept up with cutting grass beyond the first time you get like a 60g drop and realise it's not worth it. A few times I got several hundred gold, like maybe ten % of the time. I had about 6k gold but I spent most of it buying equipment, which I didn't end up needing much because I got it from the grass
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Mar 6, 2021 13:30
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Borsche69 posted:Yeah, you shouldn't be spending like an hour and a half in any of the dungeons lol. The mobs should all be running away from you on sight, and if they aren't, just take like a couple minutes to grind a little. Use monster food and just level up some jobs. Once the monsters run from you, getting through an dungeon shouldn't really take any time at all. To me grinding ruins JRPGs completely. What's the point in playing if I'm a living god when I fight every boss? Also it's boring as sin. Mainly the onus shouldn't be on a player who is playing the game as predictably as possible to grind outside dungeons to make the actual dungeons tolerable.
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Mar 6, 2021 13:43
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SyntheticPolygon posted:The boat kicks rear end. Getting a bunch of free jp for putting the Switch to sleep is very good. There's no reason to not have it going if you're putting the game down for a long time, but there's also no reason to think "well, I wanna play for an hour or two but the boat is 40 mins away from finishing so I won't bother" either. Natural 20 posted:To me grinding ruins JRPGs completely. What's the point in playing if I'm a living god when I fight every boss? Also it's boring as sin. I think grinding out JP (and as a result, EXP) to try out job combos to find something you like is the predictable path for all three games in the Bravely series. I think your points are valid, but also doing A to B isn't especially expected in this series and isn't the predicted behaviour of series fans.
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Mar 6, 2021 14:07
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I've been doing zero grinding and I've found it makes the boss fights challenging in an exciting way, and perfectly doable; at worst I wipe once and reconfigure my team setup to counter what they do.
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Mar 6, 2021 14:24
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Natural 20 posted:To me grinding ruins JRPGs completely. What's the point in playing if I'm a living god when I fight every boss? Also it's boring as sin. It's much easier for developers to throw a lot of trash mobs at you than it is to curate each interaction
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Mar 6, 2021 14:33
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raditts posted:Kinda feels like you spent more time writing this list than playing the game, maybe you should just play the game more. There are some quests that require you to cut grass but I've gotten some useful things from cutting grass AND it's satisfying to just do it in dungeons. I'm glad the feature is in.
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Mar 6, 2021 14:48
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This game is very grindy already for me and I'm early on. I dont mind though cause that's basically the whole point of the game
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Mar 6, 2021 14:58
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Josuke Higashikata posted:I think grinding out JP (and as a result, EXP) to try out job combos to find something you like is the predictable path for all three games in the Bravely series. As a person who absolutely loves all the bravely games, grinding in the middle of the game is something I'd never do (aside from like, a couple of fights to get that one cool or whatever). I'd loving hate these games if they expected me to grind in the middle of the story. That grinding stuff is for the endgame poo poo where you maximize your brokenness imo.
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Mar 6, 2021 15:13
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stev posted:Now that black mage and vanguard are maxed and dealing monster damage monk really doesn't seem worth the HP cost. Most of the attacks deal more damage to me than to the enemy. Pressure point and their last move whose name I forget are both huge damage for monks. Monk's thing is "get bp, pop invigorate, then 4x brave next turn and dump 4 pressure points/blasts as the enemy fall down." Godspeed strike, on the other hand, is just busted as hell.
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Mar 6, 2021 15:22
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lot of people itt discovering they only like or are accustomed to easy RPGs I'm playing on hard mode and the enemies in every dungeon as I leave it are red and angry. don't grind
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Mar 6, 2021 15:59
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grieving for Gandalf posted:lot of people itt discovering they only like or are accustomed to easy RPGs i don't think the difficulty has much to do with the dungeons being too long
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Mar 6, 2021 16:02
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Andrast posted:i don't think the difficulty has much to do with the dungeons being too long sounds like you're talking about something different to what I'm talking about, but that's okay the dungeons aren't too long, they give you ample teleport pads, teleport stones, and ward lights. you could cruise past most enemies in your way if you so choose. hell, you can set your game down and walk away from it if you've been doing one gameplay segment for too long. take a break!
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Mar 6, 2021 16:09
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None of these games have particularly good dungeons IMO. Like I loved Bravely Default 1 but its dungeons were long and boring, no way around it. Octopath also had boring dungeons, though they tended to be shorter.
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Mar 6, 2021 16:10
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Harrow posted:None of these games have particularly good dungeons IMO. Like I loved Bravely Default 1 but its dungeons were long and boring, no way around it. Octopath also had boring dungeons, though they tended to be shorter. Most Dungeons in BD1 were like half the length than the ones here
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Mar 6, 2021 16:10
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the dungeons in BD1 didn't feel great because you'd end up running through them with the encounters off and not even looking at the actual dungeon, you were looking at your map, which ends up feeling wack. it's good they put the map away
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Mar 6, 2021 16:12
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grieving for Gandalf posted:it's good they put the map away 
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Mar 6, 2021 16:12
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He’s just here to show us how hardcore a gamer he is and how awesome that makes him and tell us we’re playing wrong and are bad. Just ignore him lmao
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Mar 6, 2021 16:15
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it's more fun to get to know a dungeon and remember which way to go than steering around while looking at your map, which would get you owned in this game because an enemy would come bop you while you're not looking where you're going e: I am hardcore. thank you, Captain Monkey
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Mar 6, 2021 16:16
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I don't think the dungeons are particularly long, they're just quite boring to go through and don't have interesting enough layouts to bother learning.
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Mar 6, 2021 16:19
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stev posted:I don't think the dungeons are particularly long, they're just quite boring to go through and don't have interesting enough layouts to bother learning. I think that's more fair to say, although I've been enjoying seeing how they connect with other locations in the world, like (Chapter 2) the sewers dungeon having a midpoint break at the Institute, and then connecting to the research labs. it's neat!
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Mar 6, 2021 16:23
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Captain Monkey posted:He’s just here to show us how hardcore a gamer he is and how awesome that makes him and tell us we’re playing wrong and are bad. Please see a doctor about your very concerning rear end situation.
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Mar 6, 2021 17:10
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Ugh I might be done with the boat system. I left off yesterday at a save point right before a boss. I wasn't gonna play at all this morning (got other things I'd rather do) but I wanted to cash in on the boat rewards. For whatever reason there wasn't a teleporter near this save point and I didn't wanna have to walk back through much dungeon so I went ahead and fought the boss first. Boss wasn't difficult but I forgot I'd used all of my Phoenix Downs just killing the trash mobs faster, so when my healer went down slowly everyone else did too. All right, fine, I'll load and use a teleport crystal just so I can get my boat bucks and I'll worry about walking through the dungeon again later. Turns out if you load your game the boat timer gets reset to 0. Thanks for that, game. Good in spite of itself is an increasingly apt description.
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Mar 6, 2021 17:19
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Andrast posted:So your advice for someone thinking the dungeons are too long is to waste time grinding *before* the dungeon so the dungeons are a bit faster? Depends on the kind of dungeon. The monster food grind works best when there's a plethora of one enemy type, so if the dungeon is spawning lots of insects, then yeah I'll grind there. If its spawning a big variety and has an awkward format (like the tower in Wiswald) then its probably quicker to grind in a different area. Either way, the monster food grinding speed things up an insane amount - certainly a lot faster than being chased by every enemy in the dungeon. Alternatively, if he doesn't want to do any grinding and wants to stay underleveled he can simply just use Ward Lights so that he can ignore all the enemies.
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Mar 6, 2021 17:36
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Andrast posted:So your advice for someone thinking the dungeons are too long is to waste time grinding *before* the dungeon so the dungeons are a bit faster? Yes, the total amount of time will be less. Grind a little bit now to save time later. Edit: I found decent weapons in the grass in the underground waterway, what you find is dependent on the area and gets better as the story progresses. Probably not worth going out of your way to do but still not useless.
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Mar 6, 2021 17:38
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Natural 20 posted:To me grinding ruins JRPGs completely. What's the point in playing if I'm a living god when I fight every boss? Also it's boring as sin. Yeah, sure, that's fine. But all I was saying was that the complaint about the dungeons being 'too long' is a false claim. I don't think they're super cool or anything - they're mostly just 'fine'. But if they are 'too long' for someone, then its just because they are underleveled and constantly getting into monster fights. You can either grind such that the encounters run away from you, or use Ward Lights. The dungeons themselves are kinda short for what they are, and I think the only one up to the end of Chapter 3 that I spent an extended period of time in was the Wayward Woods because they pull the stupid Lost Woods poo poo there. The snowy area where you grab the dream plant also kinda sucks because of the blizzard mechanic slowing you down. But again, that's a tiny dungeon that probably takes all of 5-10 minutes to actually run through.
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Mar 6, 2021 17:51
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Hammer Bro. posted:Ugh I might be done with the boat system. Even if that was a full 12 hour boat, you missed out on like 4 JP orbs. The boat system asks very little of you and gives pretty minor rewards. It’s just not that big of a thing at the end of the day.
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Mar 6, 2021 17:52
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Borsche69 posted:Yeah, sure, that's fine. But all I was saying was that the complaint about the dungeons being 'too long' is a false claim. I don't think they're super cool or anything - they're mostly just 'fine'. But if they are 'too long' for someone, then its just because they are underleveled and constantly getting into monster fights. You can either grind such that the encounters run away from you, or use Ward Lights. I'd argue that you are overleveled. Like I really doubt the design intent here is the devs assuming that everyone just pre-grinds things to trivialize poo poo. and if that is the design intent, that's moronic and makes me think less of the game
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Mar 6, 2021 17:54
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Squinky v2.0 posted:Even if that was a full 12 hour boat, you missed out on like 4 JP orbs. The boat system asks very little of you and gives pretty minor rewards. It’s just not that big of a thing at the end of the day. Not true - my brother's friend said that the only way to get the true ending is to get a random special item drop from maxed out 12 hour boat (0.01% drop rate).
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Mar 6, 2021 17:54
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Andrast posted:I'd argue that you are overleveled. Like I really doubt the design intent here is the devs assuming that everyone just pre-grinds things to trivialize poo poo. Sure, whatever. Then use Ward Lights.
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Mar 6, 2021 17:56
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Borsche69 posted:Yeah, sure, that's fine. But all I was saying was that the complaint about the dungeons being 'too long' is a false claim. I don't think they're super cool or anything - they're mostly just 'fine'. But if they are 'too long' for someone, then its just because they are underleveled and constantly getting into monster fights. You can either grind such that the encounters run away from you, or use Ward Lights. Like that's obviously incorrect for a lot of reasons. If the level curve is off so you're constantly underleveled in dungeons that's a problem with the game. Again, I am playing this as predictably as anyone reasonably could do. If the claim then is "But the game assumes grinding" then I'm going to call it a bad game because no RPG in 2021 should assume that the player spends their time grinding trash mobs to stay on curve. It equally should not be an expectation that the player goes into the dungeon overleveled without fighting anything for it to be of a tolerable length. I actually don't think being underleveled is significantly impacting me because I snapped the job system over my knee and it's only just catching up now. But in a world where I fight what comes to me, kill every encounter inside two rounds and continue on, these dungeons are taking upwards of two hours. That is far too long and really bad design. The dungeons have impact and ideas for half an hour of content, not two. You could cut this game down by half and it would be a much breezier and fun RPG. The fact that there are teleport points doesn't change the fact that I'm already really bored of the dungeon by the time I hit the midpoint. Most dungeons should end by the first teleport point as they stand. For what it's worth I still enjoy the game because it's an FFV job system so how can I not. But it's such a step down from the previous titles in so many ways that I'm disappointed
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Mar 6, 2021 17:59
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Tested a bit (absolutely not extensively at all) and I think Black Mage's problem is moreso M. Atk not being boosted easily . Roughly equal M. Atk and P. Atk stats (144 magic vs. 143 physical) resulted in similar outputs between Firaga and Fires of War. (Firaga did ~100 more damage but it was, like. one of each because I'm lazy, so I'm not sure how much is variance, how much is skill power, etc.). Lack of M. Atk and costing a ton of MP when it's not as easily restorable as HP. I know dual-wielding wands was a strat in Second (that they explicitly pointed out, even) but that's not quite feasible here due to weight. stev posted:Now that black mage and vanguard are maxed and dealing monster damage monk really doesn't seem worth the HP cost. Most of the attacks deal more damage to me than to the enemy. The key is that you can top yourself off with a Cura really, really easily, which is not a luxury your enemies have. Firebird also combos really well with itself. ...Also where are you? Monk should be doing good damage easily, especially with Bare-Handed Brawling and P. Atk-up gear.
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Mar 6, 2021 18:02
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Natural 20 posted:Like that's obviously incorrect for a lot of reasons. Dude. My man. It's taking you 2 hours to get through a dungeon. It should not be taking 2 hours to get through a dungeon. No one else is having that problem. Either use Ward Lights or just level up. If the monsters are avoiding you (and you avoid the chests I suppose), you can run to the end of a given dungeon in like 10 minutes. Even if you go for every chest, that might boost the time to like half an hour? The dungeons are physically pretty small. The only real offender is Wayward Woods, but, again, it's pulling Zelda Lost Woods poo poo on you.
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Mar 6, 2021 18:05
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I feel like the mob levels wrt the underdog bonus are overtuned; I don't grind, I just fight whatever gets in my way as I'm going from one point to the next. And the difficulty curve in playing this way seems fine to me (and this is on hard mode, too) but I am perpetually getting that underdog bonus even when it seems I'm at just the right level for enemies in the area.
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Mar 6, 2021 18:06
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Borsche69 posted:Dude. My man. It's taking you 2 hours to get through a dungeon. It should not be taking 2 hours to get through a dungeon. No one else is having that problem. Either use Ward Lights or just level up. If the monsters are avoiding you (and you avoid the chests I suppose), you can run to the end of a given dungeon in like 10 minutes. Even if you go for every chest, that might boost the time to like half an hour? The dungeons are physically pretty small. If the monsters are avoiding you you are explicitly overleveled according to the game. There is a loading screen tip that literally says you need to find stronger enemies. Of course if you don't fight any enemies the dungeon is going to be short. You're not actually doing the dungeon, you're just running through a corridor.
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Mar 6, 2021 18:11
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If you're having trouble clearing random encounters level up anyone in Berserker until they get Level Slash, brave twice and unload. That poo poo just mows through random encounters. All for the cost of one Cura spell!
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Mar 6, 2021 18:24
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Natural 20 posted:If the level curve is off so you're constantly underleveled in dungeons that's a problem with the game. The game's already been beaten on a no-EXP-gained new game plus on hard so I dunno what you want from it. 
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Mar 6, 2021 18:28
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