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How are they gonna have any interesting stories with this version of the justice league? Superman is shown to be stronger than the entire justice league. Like, not just edging them out but A LOT stronger. He treated them like rowdy children in their fight. I especially disliked how much stronger he was than Wonder Woman. Isn't WW supposed to be really loving strong on her own? Then there's Flash, who if he just tries a little extra, can reverse time. They're gonna have to get creative to write around these insane abilities in any potential future movie
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Mar 20, 2021 12:12
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That's always been the case with The Justice League, they are new gods
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Mar 20, 2021 12:19
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Zzulu posted:How are they gonna have any interesting stories with this version of the justice league? That's literally the exact balance they have in the comics. Superman and especially The Flash are broken powerful, and Martian Manhunter is right below. Sups is typically this exact notch above WW with her just being a better technical fighter and being able to cut him with her weapons. Good writers still work around this though.
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Mar 20, 2021 12:21
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Didn't WW beat Ares who beat Darkseid who, supposedly, is stronger than Steppenwolf who beat WW Powerlevels sseem a bit of a mess
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Mar 20, 2021 12:31
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Zzulu posted:Didn't WW beat Ares who beat Darkseid who, supposedly, is stronger than Steppenwolf who beat WW That was a younger, less powerful, Darkseid. Subtle changes like him not having his omega symbol on his chest or his Omega Beams and such showed that. Even still, it wasn't just Aries, it's Zeus (who is more powerful and comparable to Odin) going all out with his lightning, plus Aries, after getting blasted by a terrible Green Lantern and stuff too. If you're not comic familiar, the movie doesn't make that he was not fully developed yet perfectly clear, but yeah. He was amused by and wanted the Green Lantern ring too, which is kind of funny; fully powered Daekseid wouldn't even care about that. Basically, Darkseid is an actual God of the multiverse, and his true self is above the level of anyone he's seen on screen. To exist in different parts of the multiverse, he basically projects himself physically, and that projection is typically roughly equal to Superman in power. Sometimes a little stronger.
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Mar 20, 2021 12:56
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Zeus was going so hog wild with lightning bolts in that scene I didn't even know which dude was ares
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Mar 20, 2021 13:11
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I was really hoping they were going to do the Greek Gods right right in WW2 instead of whatever the hell we got. Base it off Rucka or Azzerrellos run instead of having a person who knows nothing about comics run to Geoff Johns for inspiration.
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Mar 20, 2021 13:13
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It really is ludicrous how dirty they did Ray Fisher. It felt like even beyond curtailing Cyborg’s story, there were a lot of lines of just incidental dialogue or explanation that they took away from him and gave to other characters, which is just so amazingly petty.
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Mar 20, 2021 13:33
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I can't really get over how bad Cyborgs design is. He just looks terrible
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Mar 20, 2021 13:34
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Roth posted:I'm not sure what the issue is with wanting to talk without having to deal with people assuming you're doing a gimmick for, uh, positively comparing the villain of a DC movie to Marvel villains I was less than thrilled about? You didn't come up with a lovely reductive take for Thanos. Just the Black man. You're being obtuse acting like just preferring DC films to Marvel is the gimmick. Like JL. Like it more than every MCU film. Like it more than every film ever for all I care. Let's just keep the "evil black revolutionary" part to ourselves.
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Mar 20, 2021 14:04
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Leto does really suck as the Joker. He's only good in movies where he does not think or know his role is important and thinks he is just cashing a paycheck. Like I bet he'll be pretty good in Morbius because it's trash and he won't be trying to do some kind of transcendent performance. His best movie is Lord of War and I didn't even know he was in it until a couple months ago despite having watched it a few times.
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Mar 20, 2021 14:34
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I mean, everyone sucked in the joker scene. Batmans dialogue was a joke as well. That whole thing was baffling
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Mar 20, 2021 14:44
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Phylodox posted:It really is ludicrous how dirty they did Ray Fisher. It felt like even beyond curtailing Cyborg’s story, there were a lot of lines of just incidental dialogue or explanation that they took away from him and gave to other characters, which is just so amazingly petty. Yeah I was expecting Cyborg to be a better character in this version but holy poo poo Whedon hosed Fisher over so goddamned bad. Cyborg is really the touchstone character in the film and he was then written to be a total side character. Christ whedon is a huge racist piece of poo poo.
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Mar 20, 2021 14:52
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Zzulu posted:I mean, everyone sucked in the joker scene. Batmans dialogue was a joke as well. That whole thing was baffling No, Joe Manganiello’s mohawk was top tier.
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Mar 20, 2021 15:01
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Also, a lot of attention being paid to Leto, but they also brought back Amber Heard, a similarly terrible person.
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Mar 20, 2021 15:02
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That kind of goes against those rumors that she has been recast in Aquaman 2 for being "out of shape" because they shot this just a few months ago.
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Mar 20, 2021 15:23
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Roth posted:Killmonger's "evil black revolutionary" I’m confused as Killmonger is very clearly the good guy in that movie.
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Mar 20, 2021 15:35
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Also Snyder’s Green Lantern should be an adaptation of Omega Men.
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Mar 20, 2021 15:39
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Zeus carrying that first invasion defense owned. Dude looked the part too would have been cool to see him more maybe turn into some water or swan at the end. CGI issues notwithstanding, I loved all the new Flash and Cybord additions. Especially Flash. His final moment where he is phased out of reality by the Unity and then proceeds to run backwards in time towards it, recreating reality with each step was really, really loving cool. He was running TOWARDS the explosion. Seeing the heroes remade showing that even Superman is completely annihilated by the Unity really does a good job of showing how total this threat was which is something I NEVER got from the Whedon cut. Between the complete dumbass focus on a single family and the stupid race against the tendrils that flash outruns while pushing a truck the stakes never came through. On this one, though? Yeah poo poo’s super loving serious and imminent. I also like how Flash while being fast as he is remains somewhat fragile. He has super healing but it’s definitely something he has to be aware and careful about. Cyborg was pretty drat cool throughout I just feel they needlessly made the design too complicated which made putting it on screen and realistic a tough challenge. Like holy poo poo every single thing Whedon added or changed was a change for the worse. What a stupid loving person.
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Mar 20, 2021 15:45
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Happy Noodle Boy posted:Like holy poo poo every single thing Whedon added or changed was a change for the worse. What a stupid loving person. Now that it's out there for everyone to see, it's fairly amusing to know that warner bros totally shot themselves in the foot on this one. If they went ahead and let Snyder finish the first time around the dceu would probably be in a much better position today
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Mar 20, 2021 15:59
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I think Snyder's 3 hour 20 cut he gave them or guys 2 hour 40 was probably the best version. But no, ya gotta hit 2 hours exactly. RELEASE THE K WASTE 214 CUT
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Mar 20, 2021 16:15
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John Wick of Dogs posted:Leto does really suck as the Joker. He's only good in movies where he does not think or know his role is important and thinks he is just cashing a paycheck. Like I bet he'll be pretty good in Morbius because it's trash and he won't be trying to do some kind of transcendent performance. His best movie is Lord of War and I didn't even know he was in it until a couple months ago despite having watched it a few times. He sucked in The Little Things. He sucked harder here. I still think his best acting was before he got the Oscar for Dallas Buyer Club. I don't think he's gonna be any good in Morbius. I could be wrong, but it seems as he has been in a bad acting streak. Edit: Oh my god John, your new avatar and title. oh no dude nooooo  don't defend creep Leto. Zzulu posted:I mean, everyone sucked in the joker scene. Batmans dialogue was a joke as well. That whole thing was baffling Oh yeah, that was a big negative for me. There wasn't even a need for that scene to be there.
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Mar 20, 2021 16:18
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Leto is best in Fight Club and Panic Room. Because Fincher has him beaten to a pulp in one and shot in the face in the other.
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Mar 20, 2021 16:22
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The Knightmare scene ruled. The instant cut from DeathStroke beginning to hunt Batman to them on the same team was great.
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Mar 20, 2021 16:23
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Zzulu posted:I mean, everyone sucked in the joker scene. Batmans dialogue was a joke as well. That whole thing was baffling It was literally at the level of the cringiest of fanfilms. Like a Bat in the Sun joint with worse costumes.
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Mar 20, 2021 16:23
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site posted:Now that it's out there for everyone to see, it's fairly amusing to know that warner bros totally shot themselves in the foot on this one. If they went ahead and let Snyder finish the first time around the dceu would probably be in a much better position today Well, I dunno about that. I don't think a 4 hour movie would've necessarily done great in 2017. We're in a relative superhero media vacuum and a lot of people are still doing full or partial lockdown, plus this movie had 4 years of hype and a sense of retribution attached to it after Whedon's abusive behavior came out. These are all pretty positive conditions that didn't exist when the theatrical cut came out. And we don't know yet how much legs this cut has, either. Also, you know, I don't think Zack would've necessarily been allowed to release this cut of the film even had he been left in charge of the movie, so it might've suffered from the same problem BvS apparently has where the theatrical edit somehow feels longer despite being shorter due to choppy editing. All of that's assuming he would've been able to finish the movie on time without the extra 70 million, and that his daughter's tragic death wouldn't have left him unable to finish production at the time regardless of WB's decisions. I don't begrudge anyone their enjoyment of this film or their dislike of the theatrical cut, but it's hard to play "what could've been" considering all the exceptional twists and turns involved with this release.
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Mar 20, 2021 16:23
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Lurdiak posted:Well, I dunno about that. I don't think a 4 hour movie would've necessarily done great in 2017. We're in a relative superhero media vacuum and a lot of people are still doing full or partial lockdown, plus this movie had 4 years of hype and a sense of retribution attached to it after Whedon's abusive behavior came out. These are all pretty positive conditions that didn't exist when the theatrical cut came out. And we don't know yet how much legs this cut has, either. In case I wasn't clear via my previous post saying this clearly needing an editing pass, I meant a version of this that was edited for a more suitable theater experience, length wise. Although you aren't wrong in that practically every Snyder film has needed a home release director's cut to be acceptable story wise anyways. Regardless, I'm sure even a very paired down version of the snyder cut would've been better than the whedon cut they put out. At the very least a shorter theater version, plus a bluray extended cut, probably wouldn't have soured people so hard on the franchise (although tbf that was in no small part also the fault of suicide squad)
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Mar 20, 2021 16:33
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SonicRulez posted:You didn't come up with a lovely reductive take for Thanos. Just the Black man. You're being obtuse acting like just preferring DC films to Marvel is the gimmick. Like JL. Like it more than every MCU film. Like it more than every film ever for all I care. Let's just keep the "evil black revolutionary" part to ourselves. Killmonger's motivation is the oppression of black people and his goal is an armed revolution throughout the world for which he is "evil". It sucks poo poo, just as it sucks poo poo that Thanos is an abusive dad that we're supposed to go "Oh he really did love Gamora" when he murders her.
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Mar 20, 2021 16:36
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Killmonger correctly identifies problems, but he's not a revolutionary because he can't imagine a better future. That's inherent in his goals: all he can think to do is do imperialism in reverse, switching victim and oppressor. And the movie goes into how he's been wounded and why he might be like that. He's a really fascinating character. Calling him "evil" is incredibly reductive because the movie agrees with him.
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Mar 20, 2021 16:39
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Arist posted:Killmonger correctly identifies problems, but he's not a revolutionary because he can't imagine a better future. That's inherent in his goals: all he can think to do is do imperialism in reverse, switching victim and oppressor. And the movie goes into how he's been wounded and why he might be like that. Narratives about how the oppressed will become the opressor are not written out of genuine concern. They're written because liberals are terrified of revolution and think everything should be done within the system. It was horrific when Bioshock: Infinite did it, and it's horriric now. Killmonger is one of the better MCU villains, but the movie has him do things like kill his girlfriend in cold blood because it needs a shorthand to show he's the bad guy. If the movie agreed with Killmonger, it wouldn't end with his death and T'Challa doing only the most token of gestures.
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Mar 20, 2021 16:45
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Zzulu posted:How are they gonna have any interesting stories with this version of the justice league? The workaround for this for Superman at least is pretty succinctly explained by the DC Animated version: he holds back all the time because he knows if he uses his full power he’ll kill everybody and level cities, so you don’t see him really let loose until Darkseid invades because he’s the one person that can handle it. Of course Snyder shot this method in the foot because this Superman obliterated Metropolis and murdered his foes on his first outing  Similarly, Flash needs some negative effects from running fast to give him those same limits. From how the Flash’s movie has been described it seems like he’d learn that along the way; he realizes he can rewind time in JL, so then goes to save his mom but creates Flashpoint and by the end of the movie realizes he’s gotta hold himself back.
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Mar 20, 2021 16:50
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Please stop arguing about how the bad reductive take was justified and just take the L.
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Mar 20, 2021 16:57
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In an alternate universe where they didn't use his daughters death to remove him from the project, Snyder most likely would have done reshoots himself and cut about an hour off this thing, and then maybe we would get this version on the blu-ray, just like the ultimate cut of Batman vs Superman. I'm sure that shortened version would have been better received than Whedons Folly.
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Mar 20, 2021 17:02
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Vince MechMahon posted:I'm sure that shortened version would have been better received than Whedons Folly. The league fails and Barry put out his hand like gently caress No, amps himself up, calls on the memory of his father and achieves something amazing. Cyborg realizes he is not broken. Batman has several scenes speaking about just having faith
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Mar 20, 2021 17:06
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FilthyImp posted:Please stop arguing about how the bad reductive take was justified and just take the L. If people were capable of doing that this thread would be down to a dozen pages.
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Mar 20, 2021 17:06
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FilthyImp posted:I mean, yeah. For all the whining (me included) about how dour the Snyderfilms were, this one's earnestly hopeful despite really serious and terrible poo poo happening. Agreed. The way Clark's two father's are intercut with each other as he's suiting up is maybe a perfect Superman moment. It shows an understanding of the character I previously didn't think snyder had in him, and retroactively made a lot of his choices with that aspect of the character in the previous films work.
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Mar 20, 2021 17:11
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FilthyImp posted:Please stop arguing about how the bad reductive take was justified and just take the L. Wait, so people in this thread really think Killmonger shooting his girlfriend was a good and/or necessary action? Or his torching the ancient garden they use to communicate with their Wakandan ancestors? Why are you guys reducting his literal actions in the movie? E: it’s even weirder because this thread applauds the movie’s reductive history with the CIA and the BPP. ruddiger fucked around with this message at 17:32 on Mar 20, 2021 |
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Mar 20, 2021 17:28
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FilthyImp posted:I mean, yeah. For all the whining (me included) about how dour the Snyderfilms were, this one's earnestly hopeful despite really serious and terrible poo poo happening. Batman telling Alfred he has faith was so good. Just a great moment showing how far he's come since BvS
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Mar 20, 2021 17:30
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I think Roth is using "evil black revolutionary" to characterise the film's much-lauded but ultimately rather limp approach to post-colonial politics, rather than because of any particular contempt for, uh, Killmonger specifically
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Mar 20, 2021 17:34
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Roth posted:It sucks poo poo, just as it sucks poo poo that Thanos is an abusive dad that we're supposed to go "Oh he really did love Gamora" when he murders her. I really don't agree with this read. He never loved Gamora.
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Mar 20, 2021 17:37
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