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commielingus posted:Is this a serious question I remember hearing "the Chinese are going to take over the world and own us" when I was in high school. Also good job partially quoting a single sentence. That's definitely something someone operating in good faith does.
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Mar 24, 2021 23:56
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SpiderHyphenMan posted:Is Kim Jong Un also the victim of anti-communist lies? how many times has he "died" because he didn't make enough public appearances
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Mar 24, 2021 23:59
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SpiderHyphenMan posted:I remember hearing "the Chinese are going to take over the world and own us" when I was in high school. Fact: american sinophobia is worse in 2021 than in 2008. I’m sorry you’re dumb
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Mar 25, 2021 00:00
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Gringostar posted:im sure a global pandemic that originated in china has literally no bearing on these numbers at all lmao it goes up to 60/26 unfavorable in 2019, do you think people then were subconsciously sensing that covid would break out the next year or do you think there might be some other explanations?
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Mar 25, 2021 00:01
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SpiderHyphenMan posted:Is Kim Jong Un also the victim of anti-communist lies? wtf kind of dumbass question is this lol
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Mar 25, 2021 00:01
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commielingus posted:Fact: american sinophobia is worse in 2021 than in 2008. I’m sorry you’re dumb Because of covid, you loving moron.
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Mar 25, 2021 00:01
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THS posted:see and this is why it’s a good analogy - because no one would say that 1/6 was “good” or that reactionaries pose zero threat, just like no one thinks what is happening in xinjiang is a Good. but it is the degree to which you think there is a threat or how close we were from Dictator For Life Trump or the relative scale of state repression on the level of assimilation vs. cultural genocide vs. death camps which determines how accurate a view you probably have of the world, what a reasonable response to the situation in question is, etc. on the one hand, the world isn’t black and white and things actually involve nuance to which no loving poo poo on the other hand... THS posted:you really don’t think there is increasing media coverage over xinjiang and a certain narrative gaining steam over the past months? apparently it’s only the increased media coverage over xinjiang that’s to blame for anti-china sentiment that’s grown over the past year
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Mar 25, 2021 00:02
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fanfic insert posted:It kind of is when you consider the history of Hong Kong and how the british forced a parliamentary system onto hong kong which they knew would clash with mainland china as they were leaving, as a final "gently caress you" to China, and the fact that their economic decline is directly linked to western capital moving on from hong kong into Singapore as an asian capital holding place. In 2004 there were a few Tibetans willing to tell an American tourist that they saw the Chinese as an occupying force and liked the US because of our support for the Dali Llama. I can’t say how common this opinion was. A railroad was being built at the time and people feared it was going to be a tool of oppression from the Chinese. During the cultural revolution thousands of Tibetan monasteries were destroyed by the Maoists. But to be fair to China, Mao had a lot in common with Trump and Deng Xiaoping made drastic changes for the better when he took over. Also, Tibet had been a religious oligarchy before the Chinese took over so those monasteries were also buildings of state. And while people said they didn’t like the Chinese rule, they also didn’t want to return to a theocracy. I don’t know how the Tibetans feel about things these days. Maybe the railroad brought economic prosperity and they’re now happy in their relationship with China.
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Mar 25, 2021 00:02
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SpiderHyphenMan posted:Because of covid, you loving moron. Perhaps you were asleep the last 5 years you tool
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Mar 25, 2021 00:04
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SpiderHyphenMan posted:Is Kim Jong Un also the victim of anti-communist lies? SpiderHyphenMan posted:Because of covid, you loving moron. why do you think the american public's view of china jumped to 60/29 unfavorable a year before the pandemic, SpiderHyphenMan
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Mar 25, 2021 00:05
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it’s because it seems really absurd on its face to not see that in the context of China starting to outpace the US economy, and questions of challenging US hegemony, that there isn’t a concurrent rise in the US going completely insane over this on a level it didn’t before. in 2008 China didn’t have a larger economy by some measures than the US. it really seems nuts to look at social media, traditional media, and public attitudes at this point in time, and try to argue that there hasn’t been a rapid increase in both the amount of reporting on China, and an increase in the tenor of how big a threat this is. https://twitter.com/isgoodrum/status/1372203536579133443?s=20 https://twitter.com/isgoodrum/status/1372205044552986624?s=20 https://twitter.com/isgoodrum/status/1372209559117295619?s=20
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Mar 25, 2021 00:05
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Cao Ni Ma posted:The China rhetoric is not a conservative only thing. It is the entire US political zeitgeist coming to the rightful conclusion that if they don’t do SOMETHING in the near future we will be the new UK, a has been super power rapidly losing geopolitical power as our electorate becomes increasingly idiotic causing ourselves to Balkanize That's probably gonna happen no matter what the US does. Anyway, it seems like the thread in here is entirely capable of a pretty reasonable discussion of whatever is going on in China. I do wonder how many people in this thread are being reported for genocide denial though, can we get a running tally?
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Mar 25, 2021 00:07
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QUEER FRASIER posted:lmao it goes up to 60/26 unfavorable in 2019, do you think people then were subconsciously sensing that covid would break out the next year or do you think there might be some other explanations? considering the spike started to occur after 2016 i can’t think of a single other explanation https://youtu.be/RDrfE9I8_hs not a one
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Mar 25, 2021 00:08
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assuming chinese treatment of minorities is as bad as US treatment of minorities succ posters should still put their own house in order and leave the china posting to us, the experts, western online communists
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Mar 25, 2021 00:09
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As this is the subject i was furious enough about to get banned over, i'm going to hope for a small amount of posting amnesty to chime in: Like Rime, I fully believe that the situation in Xinjiang is closer to Canadian residential schooling than anything else. It's unquestionably a concerted effort to dilute a culture until it can be fully absorbed by the mainstream. However, I think that taking Zenz and Falun Gong seriously in any way, shape or form is complete loving dogshit lunacy and treating their word as gospel is just throwing your lot in with the new Cold War. There is no form of international intervention that would do anything but make the situation exponentially worse, and treating dissenting opinions on the scant few reliable facts we DO have as genocide denial is just going to lead to every thread in C-SPAM having the tone of the GBS china thread. I like this forum, man  don't fall for obviously embellished propaganda and free larry + lollontee
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Mar 25, 2021 00:09
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Gringostar posted:considering the spike started to occur after 2016 i can’t think of a single other explanation cheeto propaganda: bad, warmongering, who would believe this nonsense?? democrat propaganda: good, can't even feel the thought waves penetrating my brain
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Mar 25, 2021 00:10
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Gringostar posted:considering the spike started to occur after 2016 i can’t think of a single other explanation i dont understand, anti-china rhetoric doesnt count if it comes from the guy who won the presidency? have you also ignored that the democratic party has taken great pains to appear Even Tougher on China? and what is the use, exactly, in trying to artificially separate that some of this rise in anti-china rhetoric is attributable to covid - does that make it less important? do you see it going away soon? there is a lot of media focus on xinjiang, hong kong, taiwan, and the entire asia pivot occurring. what is the point in denying all of this?
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Mar 25, 2021 00:12
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free homex
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Mar 25, 2021 00:12
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SpiderHyphenMan posted:I remember hearing "the Chinese are going to take over the world and own us" when I was in high school. I remember this over a decade ago being mostly centered around the debt, so at that point it certainly was a point used to conservatives to try to get us into even more austerity while giving themselves tax cuts. Things have changed ALOT in the past few years. We probably thought that Xi would continue Hu's liberalization of the market and hoped that capital would just have its way with the political structure.
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Mar 25, 2021 00:13
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a few DRUNK BONERS posted:cheeto propaganda: bad, warmongering, who would believe this nonsense?? cspam: a known bastion of love for the democratic party
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Mar 25, 2021 00:13
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THS posted:it’s because it seems really absurd on its face to not see that in the context of China starting to outpace the US economy, and questions of challenging US hegemony, that there isn’t a concurrent rise in the US going completely insane over this on a level it didn’t before. in 2008 China didn’t have a larger economy by some measures than the US. it really seems nuts to look at social media, traditional media, and public attitudes at this point in time, and try to argue that there hasn’t been a rapid increase in both the amount of reporting on China, and an increase in the tenor of how big a threat this is. I've been seeing this poo poo my entire adult life lol. if you had asked americans "are you okay with China being the world's biggest economy" the numbers would be overwhelmingly against the acceptability of that notion.
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Mar 25, 2021 00:13
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THS posted:i dont understand, anti-china rhetoric doesnt count if it comes from the guy who won the presidency? have you also ignored that the democratic party has taken great pains to appear Even Tougher on China? and what is the use, exactly, in trying to artificially separate that some of this rise in anti-china rhetoric is attributable to covid - does that make it less important? do you see it going away soon? there is a lot of media focus on xinjiang, hong kong, taiwan, and the entire asia pivot occurring. what is the point in denying all of this? do you seriously loving think cspam likes the democratic party? no really because lol if you do
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Mar 25, 2021 00:14
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iirc 2016-2017 was about when the first rumblings of concentration camps/organ harvesting/forced pork eating, etc etc started
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Mar 25, 2021 00:14
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Gringostar posted:cspam: a known bastion of love for the democratic party im not even talking about democrats good or bad, this is about an increasingly negative media focus overall from both wings of the capitalist party, and both sides of the media - everything from marketplace morning report with kai rhysdal to alex jones. you are making serious errors here in thinking
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Mar 25, 2021 00:15
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Also interesting to note that back in the late 80s/early 90s there was a huge amount of discussion in US politics and newspapers etc about Japan overtaking the U.S's economy, and subsequently the American public's dislike for Japan grew immensely until their economy went into perma-slump and everyone warmed up to the country. It's almost like the U.S. reacts really badly to perceived threats to its hegemony Gringostar posted:considering the spike started to occur after 2016 i can’t think of a single other explanation
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Mar 25, 2021 00:16
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Gringostar posted:do you seriously loving think cspam likes the democratic party? whoosh god drat holy poo poo
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Mar 25, 2021 00:16
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China has infinitely more credibility than the United States in tyool 2021, and it's no coincidence that the next generation of Project for a New American Century right-wing foreign policy ghouls are making Xinjiang the next cause celebre in the west right as China is posed to become the largest economy in the world after successfully controlling covid (unlike most of the west). Given that, I'm absolutely inclined to give the CPC the benefit of the doubt in this matter.
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Mar 25, 2021 00:16
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SpiderHyphenMan posted:Is anti-China rhetoric really any worse than it was in 2008, outside of covid-related racism? until relatively recently i never heard anyone talk about china as anything other than "that communist country where they make all our stuff" and only in the past few years have i begun to see and hear people talking about china as a threat to the united states
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Mar 25, 2021 00:16
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people really need to calm down and act like they are in a thread with "don't be a dickhead" as its #1 rule or I'm gonna have to give out some time outs
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Mar 25, 2021 00:17
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Hairy Marionette posted:In 2004 there were a few Tibetans willing to tell an American tourist that they saw the Chinese as an occupying force and liked the US because of our support for the Dali Llama. I can’t say how common this opinion was. A railroad was being built at the time and people feared it was going to be a tool of oppression from the Chinese. Thanks! also lol at people not remembering Obamas pivot to asia and the purpose of it, which was to contain china. if not for the arab spring and south & central america stealing their focus the trade war wouldve been kicked off 4-5 years earlier.
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Mar 25, 2021 00:17
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SpiderHyphenMan posted:I've been seeing this poo poo my entire adult life lol. if you had asked americans "are you okay with China being the world's biggest economy" the numbers would be overwhelmingly against the acceptability of that notion. China has been outpacing the US economically since the 1980s. They’ve just now gotten to the “arguably surpassed” state.
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Mar 25, 2021 00:17
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THS posted:im not even talking about democrats good or bad, this is about an increasingly negative media focus overall from both wings of the capitalist party, and both sides of the media - everything from marketplace morning report with kai rhysdal to alex jones. you are making serious errors here in thinking im not the one thinking that anyone in cspam actually subscribes to the notion that corporate or right wing media is good
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Mar 25, 2021 00:18
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Hairy Marionette posted:China has been outpacing the US economically since the 1980s. They’ve just now gotten to the “arguably surpassed” state. I meant as a hypothetical.
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Mar 25, 2021 00:18
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Mar 25, 2021 00:19
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it seems like an extremely simple observation backed up by polls i posted that general attitudes toward china have been worsening well before covid, and it seems extremely obvious that an imperial power on the decline relative to a rising one is going to increase hostile rhetoric toward its competitor. am i really going insane? none of this seems the least bit controversial to me!
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Mar 25, 2021 00:19
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Probes and bans for people who say *nothing* is happening, but also probes for people claiming there are mass graves in the hills without any kind of evidence. Clearly *something* is going down in Xinjiang, and there is room for discussion about whether its merely Indian Residential Schools bad (still very bad), or mass incarceration of minorities under vague pretexts to serve as an involuntary labor force without even a constitutional amendment legalizing it bad. As a corollary, start ramping up probes for any apologists for the US penal or immigration systems.
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Mar 25, 2021 00:20
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Gringostar posted:im not the one thinking that anyone in cspam actually subscribes to the notion that corporate or right wing media is good what are you talking about? i am not making a value judgement i am pointing out relative increases in rhetoric and tone, and in negative public perceptions over time.
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Mar 25, 2021 00:20
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The coronavirus did have a hand in raising animosity against China, but specifically because western politicians and media weaponized that fact to stir up a sinophobic reaction. It’s obvious to anyone not brain dead that China isn’t to blame for a novel virus originating in its territory. And despite much bluster from from the western press, China was able to provide information about the virus to the US and Europe, up to and including its genetic sequencing, early enough to give a real edge to those countries in their response. But those states have utterly failed in their response and thus seek to scapegoat China
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Mar 25, 2021 00:22
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QUEER FRASIER posted:Also interesting to note that back in the late 80s/early 90s there was a huge amount of discussion in US politics and newspapers etc about Japan overtaking the U.S's economy, and subsequently the American public's dislike for Japan grew immensely until their economy went into perma-slump and everyone warmed up to the country. trump is a “bizarre historical aberration” in that he let the mask slip and right wing/corporate media got to stop beating around the bush also lol if you think the us is somehow a “bizarre historical aberration” when it comes to desperately trying to hold onto its economic hegemony in however many years from now this exact same discussion will happen in china when it comes to whatever nation state is overtaking them economically or it would if humanity wasn’t headed for extinction due to climate change lol
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Mar 25, 2021 00:23
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Nix Panicus posted:As a corollary, start ramping up probes for any apologists for the US penal or immigration systems. this will never never happen because d&d runs things, but people aren't going to apologize for american crimes. they're going to hem and haw about how this is the way things are and there's no alternatives at the moment and we just have to keep voting blue and eventually something good will happen
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Mar 25, 2021 00:23
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