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Retrowave Joe posted:My source says he’s up on the moon, watching over everyone. 
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Mar 27, 2021 19:27
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Forgive me if this was explained and I missed it. Is Steve considered dead or missing? How did Sam explain where he got the shield in the first place? Also Bucky & Sam have a few conversations about "what Steve would've wanted" but neither seem to think to ask him, so it comes across like he's not around. I'm sure Steve has some opinions about New Cap too, or that Walker's handlers would try to seek out his endorsement or whatever.
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Mar 27, 2021 19:33
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I'm sorry, what?
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Mar 27, 2021 19:39
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Hobo Clown posted:Forgive me if this was explained and I missed it. Is Steve considered dead or missing? How did Sam explain where he got the shield in the first place? It's lampshaded as open ended. I'm assuming in case Chris Evans ever wants back in. I figure Sam just told people exactly what happened in Endgame. It seems like, according to this and Far From Home, the public knows exactly what went down.
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Mar 27, 2021 19:41
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Let's discuss something really important: Is Sam right? Is a sorcerer just a wizard without a hat?
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Mar 27, 2021 19:43
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Hobo Clown posted:Forgive me if this was explained and I missed it. Is Steve considered dead or missing? How did Sam explain where he got the shield in the first place? I think they're being deliberately hazy about that because a) Chris Evans has already walked away from the role and probably not coming back, and b) Far From Home made a really big deal over Stark dying in Endgame so to decide that Roger's also officially 'died' then but nobody cared would be a little weird for continuity. He is gone and inaccessible to the characters permanently.
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Mar 27, 2021 19:43
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Davros1 posted:Let's discuss something really important: Is Sam right? Is a sorcerer just a wizard without a hat? That was absolutely just Bucky being contrary.
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Mar 27, 2021 19:50
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Speculation: Isaiah is going to pass away, maybe naturally (dude's gotta be nearly 100 even if he was a teenager when he got the serum) or maybe the bad guys get him. Either way, young Eli is gonna come to Sam with some stuff his grand-pop wanted him to have, which will include pictures from his service in the Korean War. Including him during that mission with Bucky, wearing a familiar uniform, and a certain triangular shield.
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Mar 27, 2021 19:53
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Going to guess that Cap went back to the timeline he married his wife in so they could be buried together when he does die. Also 100% convinced that Cap changed history in that timeline for the better so all the Cap is married timelines are good timelines. And there is still the native Cap buried in the ice in that timeline that wakes up and now has an old man Cap mentor to help him adjust and understand that eventually Thanos is coming, with a non-winter soldier Bucky to help found the Avengers. This also leads open possibilities that the native Cap randomly returns to our timeline via time travel in emergencies for when they drive enough dump trucks full of money and offers to direct for Evans to return, and making him a bit older in the time jumps can easily explain away him not being in tip top shape.
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Mar 27, 2021 19:53
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Davros1 posted:Let's discuss something really important: Is Sam right? Is a sorcerer just a wizard without a hat? Isn't a sorceror usually defined as a dangerous wizard? Like a hat is just symbolic of the official sanctioned education a wizard receives. Whereas who knows what and where a sorc got their spells.
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Mar 27, 2021 19:55
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Wizards are magic nerds, sorcerors are magic jocks.
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Mar 27, 2021 19:56
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Gaz-L posted:Speculation: Isaiah is going to pass away, maybe naturally (dude's gotta be nearly 100 even if he was a teenager when he got the serum) or maybe the bad guys get him. Either way, young Eli is gonna come to Sam with some stuff his grand-pop wanted him to have, which will include pictures from his service in the Korean War. Including him during that mission with Bucky, wearing a familiar uniform, and a certain triangular shield. I think this is plausible, him specifically passing on his own legacy to Sam would feel Poignant in some ways I think, given Sam's issues with the legacy of Steve Rogers (which are deeply mired in the sort of systematic racism that destroyed Isaiah's life, even if they manifest in new ways in the modern era). Bucky getting Steve's Shield from Sam and perhaps fully embracing a new title (or finally finding the option to just stop fighting at all in another direction) seems like it would end up being meaningful too, perhaps in a we'll share this shield because neither of us can be Steve alone, but together maybe we can make the world better the way he strove to. I think what's telling for Bucky is he corrects Sam to White Wolf almost instantly (even if it's for a comedy bit), and I could see him fully deciding he wants that to be his new title, even outside the Wakandan thing he's no longer a lone wolf, and it keeps his mind on the ice without delving into being THE WINTER SOLDIER.
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Mar 27, 2021 19:59
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Gaz-L posted:Wizards are magic nerds, sorcerors are magic jocks. Yeah, a sorcerer is a wizard without a book.
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Mar 27, 2021 19:59
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Aren't sorcerers natural talents with a limited range, while wizards learn it all from books (and wear dumb hats)? Or something. In the MCU they seem to be interchangeable though.
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Mar 27, 2021 20:00
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Man, I kinda wish they'd taken a break between these two shows. Like, I'm enjoying it, but my 13-year-long desire to keep up with the MCU is turning this into a weekly job, I can feel Kevin Feige's presence my TV screen saying "your Fridays belong to me now" and gently caress, I'm here for it but this is exhausting. Am I the only one? I'm also too depressed to play video games so maybe it's just me!
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Mar 27, 2021 20:02
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Wizards are just stoned vampires
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Mar 27, 2021 20:02
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smoobles posted:Man, I kinda wish they'd taken a break between these two shows. Like, I'm enjoying it, but my 13-year-long desire to keep up with the MCU is turning this into a weekly job, I can feel Kevin Feige's presence my TV screen saying "your Fridays belong to me now" and gently caress, I'm here for it but this is exhausting. I get the fomo, but there will be a little reprieve after Loki (and What If?, if you care about that), Hawkeye isn't supposed to start until "late 2021" so who knows how that will work with Star Wars stuff coming out later this year too.
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Mar 27, 2021 20:12
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Sentinel Red posted:Aren't sorcerers natural talents with a limited range, while wizards learn it all from books (and wear dumb hats)? Or something. That's the distinction in tabletop RPGs like D&D but in general they're interchangeable. In the MCU, Wanda is a "Witch" (natural talent) and Strange is a "Sorcerer" (learned skill) but comic titles are just poo poo that sounds cool.
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Mar 27, 2021 20:17
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ONE YEAR LATER posted:I get the fomo, but there will be a little reprieve after Loki (and What If?, if you care about that), Hawkeye isn't supposed to start until "late 2021" so who knows how that will work with Star Wars stuff coming out later this year too. Couldn't they slot Ms Marvel in there? And Loki is gonna wrap up right around the time Black Widow comes out finally. (Now that they've finally accepted the inevitable and are doing the premium release on D+)
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Mar 27, 2021 20:33
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Who knows what they'll end up doing but I feel like there's a lot of crossover between MCU and Star Wars fans and it would be wise to not burn people out but then again this is Disney and they'll release whatever as long as it's profitable/meets their internal metrics.
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Mar 27, 2021 20:43
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I’m just tossing this out there, but I am officially shipping Bucky and Sam’s sister, Sarah. This is mostly because I enjoy the amongst of angst it would generate in both the RL internet and the character of Sam Wilson, himself.
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Mar 27, 2021 20:48
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Marsupial Ape posted:I’m just tossing this out there, but I am officially shipping Bucky and Sam’s sister, Sarah. This is mostly because I enjoy the amongst of angst it would generate in both the RL internet and the character of Sam Wilson, himself. Between director Kari Skogland saying Bucky's looking for love/family and Sarah pointedly mentioning she's a widow in the bank scene in ep1, I don't think that's too out there? I think it could be cute, I'm sure they'll meet at some point so hopefully there's some chemistry there.
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Mar 27, 2021 21:17
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Bust Rodd posted:Extremely lol at them making the flagsmashers 1 wheelchair short of the Burger King Kids Club, it's an orgy of evidence that the Flagsmashers are beloved, multiethnic, and "woke" enough to have a small ginger woman as the leader.
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Mar 27, 2021 21:21
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Azhais posted:https://youtu.be/wKbGnzmidsw Corrected that for you because Anthony Mackie (born Sept 23, 1978) is literally old enough to be Erin Kellyman's (born October 17, 1998) father. Marsupial Ape posted:I’m just tossing this out there, but I am officially shipping Bucky and Sam’s sister, Sarah. This is mostly because I enjoy the amongst of angst it would generate in both the RL internet and the character of Sam Wilson, himself. I think Bucky might flirt a little with her (more to mess with Sam than anything else) but she has kids. I don't think Bucky sees himself as someone who is at all fit to help take care of children. So I don't think anything serious will come of it.
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Mar 27, 2021 21:24
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I can see that. They flirty, Bucky leaves the room and Sam's all "Really? You gonna hook up with Rip Van Cyborg?" while she's all "You're not our daddy, and he's cute for a white boy!"
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Mar 27, 2021 21:39
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Gaz-L posted:I can see that. They flirty, Bucky leaves the room and Sam's all "Really? You gonna hook up with Rip Van Cyborg?" while she's all "You're not our daddy, and he's cute for a white boy!" I can actually hear that dialogue in head. I still want to check back with Yori and Leah, especially Leah. I think there's a little more to her than meets the eye.
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Mar 27, 2021 22:13
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Everyone posted:
I think he'll be great with kids. Those Wakandan kids were all over him in IW
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Mar 27, 2021 22:39
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Black Falcon, you say? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mOyE_l80D4Y
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Mar 27, 2021 22:45
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Everyone posted:I can actually hear that dialogue in head. I still want to check back with Yori and Leah, especially Leah. I think there's a little more to her than meets the eye.
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Mar 27, 2021 23:25
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Holy poo poo, everything from when they walked up to to Isiah's house talking to the kids through to those police coming up to mess with Sam for Speaking While Black and needing to be told off was perfect. What a loving gut punch everything about that section of the episode was. And everything else was also great! From the new world building about the Blip and post-Blip world to the twists on expectations from the previous episode with the Flag Smashers and the set-up for The Power Broker as the REAL villain, even the action scene was great. This show is firing on all cylinders. Did it stick out to anyone else just how many black people Good Morning American made sure were around for the big stadium show to introduce the Guy Who Is Now Using The Shield The Black Man Gave Up, from front-row seats in the stadium to doing handshakes with the band on the way to the stage? The US government very clearly knowing what it did and taking steps to proactively muddy it during their propaganda show to head off criticism is real Chef's Kiss stuff. Also the dialogue and acting from US Agent is so perfect. He's 100% earnest and nice, but something about him just oozes entitlement. For all his angst over if he can live up to Steve, and all his protestation that he's not sure he's the right man for the job, he wears it with borderline nonchalance and that arrogance just oozes off him. And when he gives his speech to Sam about how they need to be in this together and he understands why he and Bucky are angry with him, the absence of an apology for the clear wrong to Sam he's been party to speaks even louder than "that last line." What a perfect foil for the protagonists.
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Mar 27, 2021 23:47
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This show is doing well, already I can't wait to see if they're going to find some ultra-satisfying way to kill off US Agent at the end
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Mar 27, 2021 23:54
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I think it's easy to see these very un-Captain-American traits and faults in John Walker given our metatextual knowledge of what the character becomes in the comics, but that's not really something anyone would consider, or even could consider, from an in-world perspective. It's not like the government HR people are gonna go "What, we need someone weak for the role instead of someone strong?" And if they did, who knows what kinda shut-in weirdo they'd find. Point being, from anyone's perspective in-universe, Walker absolutely seems like the best choice that would work out the best. I can't really see his eventual...failure?...collapse?...as something that anyone should have seen coming.
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Mar 27, 2021 23:58
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BrianWilly posted:I think it's easy to see these very un-Captain-American traits and faults in John Walker given our metatextual knowledge of what the character becomes in the comics, but that's not really something anyone would consider, or even could consider, from an in-world perspective. It's not like the government HR people are gonna go "What, we need someone weak for the role instead of someone strong?" And if they did, who knows what kinda shut-in weirdo they'd find. Point being, from anyone's perspective in-universe, Walker absolutely seems like the best choice that would work out the best. I can't really see his eventual...failure?...collapse?...as something that anyone should have seen coming. Anyone with any like ability to sense bullshit or fake people would. Like Sam essentially said with "it's always that last line", people like Walker can't help but show their rear end no matter how hard they try to hide it.
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Mar 28, 2021 00:03
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BrianWilly posted:I think it's easy to see these very un-Captain-American traits and faults in John Walker given our metatextual knowledge of what the character becomes in the comics, but that's not really something anyone would consider, or even could consider, from an in-world perspective. It's not like the government HR people are gonna go "What, we need someone weak for the role instead of someone strong?" And if they did, who knows what kinda shut-in weirdo they'd find. Point being, from anyone's perspective in-universe, Walker absolutely seems like the best choice that would work out the best. I can't really see his eventual...failure?...collapse?...as something that anyone should have seen coming. So you see no problem with the government putting up absolutely no resistance to Sam Wilson giving up the shield that Cap gave him and then turning right around and putting a white, veteran, hick jock in the position as fast as humanly possible?
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Mar 28, 2021 00:06
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BrianWilly posted:I think it's easy to see these very un-Captain-American traits and faults in John Walker given our metatextual knowledge of what the character becomes in the comics, but that's not really something anyone would consider, or even could consider, from an in-world perspective. It's not like the government HR people are gonna go "What, we need someone weak for the role instead of someone strong?" And if they did, who knows what kinda shut-in weirdo they'd find. Point being, from anyone's perspective in-universe, Walker absolutely seems like the best choice that would work out the best. I can't really see his eventual...failure?...collapse?...as something that anyone should have seen coming. I don't agree that its pure meta-text on our part. The show goes out of its way to start off showing this person extremely humanized: he is humbled by what's in front of him, leaning on his loved ones for support, wants to avoid the fanfare and glamour and just use his position to do good works without need to be lauded, and has to be reminded that being lauded IS part of the job. The contrast between every other scene he's in and that introduction both in terms of the on-the-page writing and how he's performed is not an accident, its foreshadowing. Who he is as Captain America isn't right, and we're meant to pick up on that in very short order. And the same thing goes for Bucky and Sam in-universe as well. Yeah, a lot of it is bitterness on their part, but they're both reluctantly willing to open the window a crack during the car ride if only out of professional courtesy and the humbling they just got at the Flagsmasher's hands... and it only takes a few minutes of talking to him for them to pick up that this dude is not someone they want to deal with. The writers didn't put the words "Bucky," and "Captain America's wingman," into his mouth by accident, and their reactions to him talking to them like that are entirely consistent with them getting pissed they were even willing to entertain giving this guy a chance when they should have just kept walking down that road. Sanguinia fucked around with this message at 00:17 on Mar 28, 2021 |
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Mar 28, 2021 00:10
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Sanguinia posted:I don't agree that its pure meta-text on our part. The show goes out of its way to start off showing this person extremely humanized: he is humbled by what's in front of him, leaning on his loved ones for support, wants to avoid the fanfare and glamour and just use his position to do good works without need to be lauded, and has to be reminded that being lauded IS part of the job. The contrast between every other scene he's in and that introduction both in terms of the on-the-page writing and how he's performed is not an accident, its foreshadowing. Who he is as Captain America isn't right, and we're meant to pick up on that in very short order. The sort of "AHA! He slipped up and demeaned Sam! This proves he's hosed!" perspective is the exact mindset I'm referring to where we're extrapolating any and all small bits of damning content to confirm the downfall that we already know is coming. Like Steve Rogers was actually perfect? Like he didn't also mess up and say the wrong things sometimes? I don't think the actual Captain America would have held up to this sort of scrutiny either.
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Mar 28, 2021 00:27
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BrianWilly posted:I don't really get this part. I think every one agrees that the way Walker was depicted in the locker room was actually very humanizing and made him seem more suited for the role and not less, right? So how was his depiction in the rest of the episode, like, dramatically different from that? It goes beyond the dialogue. Everything about him comes off as forced. His smile is artificial, he's got an aura of smugness around him constantly, he's just... not right in a way Steve only ever was once, in that Star Spangled Man bond-selling montage from First Avenger. The time when he wasn't being what Captain America was meant to be. And what a coincidence, this episode is called The Star Spangled Man! I don't think its up to me knowing from a comic book that US Agent is "The bad Captain America." They picked this actor because he could give off that feeling of plastic wrongness and false genuineness, and he's playing it perfectly. The way the dialogue is written only enhances that, and the obvious difference between the one scene where he's NOT in his suit and holding Cap's Shield only underscores it. This was all by design. I can't believe that its just fans being totally unwilling to discard their suspension of disbelief, especially when the MCU is full to bursting with examples of characters that took broad divergences from their comic incarnations in personality and storyline.
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Mar 28, 2021 00:37
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I’ve got a bunch of ideas, so I’m separating them into topics. Otherwise I sound insane. Johnny Walker has no reason to be fake with his friend and his girlfriend. But he has no reason to believe that our heroes are our heroes when they react in such an aggressive way to what he thinks is helpful behavior. I support even more a disclaimer before every episode, “the characters in the show do not watch marvel movies”. —- Knob Creek might’ve been humble when he got the gig, but then he immediately had a marching band in his hometown, an appearance on good morning America, likely a pay bump, and now everyone he meets loves him and calls him captain. One of the themes is that giving people power amplifies their bad instincts. It’s like the Stokely Carmichael quote. It’s interesting that we see desperate people robbing banks, and trustworthy people being denied wrongly by banks, the use of Robin Hood as shorthand for “you are a good character“. “If a white man wants to lynch me, that’s his problem. If he’s got the power to lynch me, that’s my problem. Racism is not a question of attitude; it's a question of power. Racism gets its power from capitalism.” The Macallan uses Bucky’s probation against him. He uses redwing. It’s almost certain he’ll pull future strings. —- The big three is interesting, because Captain America didn’t fight any of them in his core movies. It was a country and secret society, a nation, and the rest of the superhero community. Golden Bee fucked around with this message at 00:59 on Mar 28, 2021 |
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Mar 28, 2021 00:55
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BrianWilly posted:I don't really get this part. I think every one agrees that the way Walker was depicted in the locker room was actually very humanizing and made him seem more suited for the role and not less, right? So how was his depiction in the rest of the episode, like, dramatically different from that?[/spoiler] It's a very believable slide. We start with Walker at his most human, overwhelmed by the title put in front of him. We see him give the interview and he's doing a good performance with just enough sincerity. Then in the heat of battle we see him butt in and while he's got some chops he's also clearly way out of his depth (and he doesn't seem to realize it). The next scene with him involves trying to extend an olive branch but he betrays that he has a very human arrogance about the title. Then in the final bits we see him full-on abusing his privilege and becoming standoffish when denied what he wants. They didn't put scenes of him succumbing to the perks of being celebrated wherever he goes or flashbacks to him having a black-and-white morality doing missions for US Imperialism to help spell it out, but did they really have to when we've been following Sam and Bucky and literally see Wal-Mart style ads of Walker-Cap being broadcast like a new sports drink pushing in on their scenes in-between moments with the cops or the bank? Like you really can't connect that dot yourself? The show has to spell it out in explicit text that this dude is a beneficiary of the system to the point of corruption while people like Sam and Bucky and Isiah aren't and it's making Walker a total douche in record time? quote:The sort of "AHA! He slipped up and demeaned Sam! This proves he's hosed!" perspective is the exact mindset I'm referring to where we're extrapolating any and all small bits of damning content to confirm the downfall that we already know is coming. Like Steve Rogers was actually perfect? Like he didn't also mess up and say the wrong things sometimes? I don't think the actual Captain America would have held up to this sort of scrutiny either. mind the walrus fucked around with this message at 01:08 on Mar 28, 2021 |
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Mar 28, 2021 01:04
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Walker says "Stay out of my way". Good people don't say that.
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Mar 28, 2021 01:28
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