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Fun fact, the human stomach has such a massive cluster of nerves, it’s one of the parts of the human body that can most auto-function without commands from the brain. It’s sometimes thought of as a “second brain”. I wonder what a onerun would look like where the Trash Compactor is the one most behind the wheel. 
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Apr 9, 2021 05:26
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FAT BATMAN posted:Fun fact, the human stomach has such a massive cluster of nerves, it’s one of the parts of the human body that can most auto-function without commands from the brain. It’s sometimes thought of as a “second brain”.
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Apr 9, 2021 05:32
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Why are people voting for lord strats T_T. We have yet to even decide that we actually need to kill any, in case that's the bad ending path, so any strats based on killing em are very likely to be useless. Maybe if it has tips for traversing the megalith but /shrug. (The reason i'm wondering is that the other 2 options are guaranteed to have some degree of use no matter what, so)
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Apr 9, 2021 07:38
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Lord strats may be useful down the road, but right now anxiety management should be prioritized I think.PetraCore posted:Thinking about the Sixpack Self. I thought six-pack here referred to, well, six-pack abs. I think that's just our muscles. The writing is probably doing that Disco Elysium thing where different parts of our self are given dialogue as if they were independent entities. We've also seen Garbage Disposal (the anus, I assume) and Compromised Cranial (the brain) Grond fucked around with this message at 11:47 on Apr 9, 2021 |
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Apr 9, 2021 08:17
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Regallion posted:Why are people voting for lord strats T_T.
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Apr 9, 2021 08:26
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Just because we don’t want to kill some of them doesn’t mean we don’t want to kill any of them, and it certainly doesn’t mean we won’t have to defend ourselves against any of them. We might well have to kill Bleeder, and we’ll almost certainly have to defend against Hunter in our dreams.
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Apr 9, 2021 11:15
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Yeah, the sense I'm getting is that some lord deaths are going to be unavoidable. I don't think we should go for a pure pacifist run, if a lord is a massive rear end in a top hat, I'm not going to feel bad about killing that one. And we've already seen Hunter who is really not giving us much of a choice.
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Apr 9, 2021 16:37
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Yeah, as far as I'm concerned, Hunter and Bleeder need to die, while Dancer and Burner are good peeps. Considering the other two High Lords are supposed to be completely unhinged, we'll probably end up having to put them down as well, though we may be able to do it "peacefully".
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Apr 9, 2021 16:45
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Hunter doesn't have to die. If we can figure out what's pissing her off so much about us and make it not piss her off, she might stop trying to kill us? Because she clearly isn't going after everyone entering the Dreamlands, is she?
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Apr 9, 2021 16:53
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Grond posted:I thought six-pack here referred to, well, six-pack abs. I think that's just our muscles. The writing is probably doing that Disco Elysium thing where different parts of our self are given dialogue as if they were independent entities. We've also seen Garbage Disposal (the anus, I assume) and Compromised Cranial (the brain)
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Apr 9, 2021 17:06
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Actually, just re-reading the encounter with Hunter... it almost sounded like she was protecting Dancer's territory in the Dreamlands. I remembered her being more pissed that we were also a Tyrant, but she just locked off the Tyrant after laughing at us. That being said, after what Blue did to her, I don't know if Dancer could have been used as a way to get better acquainted with her. I still don't trust Bleeder though.
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Apr 9, 2021 17:11
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voted disquiet management. if only the voices would stop etc
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Apr 9, 2021 17:39
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VOTING CLOSED - User Manual Class Mechanics - 6 Lord Strategies - 18 Disquiet Management - 7 code:LOADING...  ...LOADING
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Apr 10, 2021 02:39
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I don't get the hatred for Bleeder. It sounded like he was just a kid, for starters, and he clearly had some kind of affection for the weird swamp witch we Schrodinger'd. He definitely seems jumpy and mistrustful, and he did drain us, but I don't think a peaceful resolution there is impossible, and I'd rather try. All of these characters have more going on under the surface than is immediately obvious.
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Apr 10, 2021 02:50
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Princey posted:I don't get the hatred for Bleeder. It sounded like he was just a kid, for starters, and he clearly had some kind of affection for the weird swamp witch we Schrodinger'd. He definitely seems jumpy and mistrustful, and he did drain us, but I don't think a peaceful resolution there is impossible, and I'd rather try. You mean other than their presence being a literal blight on the Valley that's spreading, who's followers are fleshy abominations, and who has turned at least one person into a living... blood? bank? Or that their blood has been stated to be dangerous to the touch? Or who, when we first saw them, were making threats and acting like a mafiosa? We have seen literally 0 redeeming qualities for Bleeder or their followers, other than calling the old swamp witch (who was literally turned into a blood bank and that they were threatening) "Momma", which is a term they also used for someone else.
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Apr 10, 2021 03:13
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Randalor posted:You mean other than their presence being a literal blight on the Valley that's spreading, who's followers are fleshy abominations, and who has turned at least one person into a living... blood? bank? Or that their blood has been stated to be dangerous to the touch? Or who, when we first saw them, were making threats and acting like a mafiosa? We have seen literally 0 redeeming qualities for Bleeder or their followers, other than calling the old swamp witch (who was literally turned into a blood bank and that they were threatening) "Momma", which is a term they also used for someone else. EDIT: Basically it feels like the Lords are being punished as much as they've been blessed, so while Bleeder has some horrific stuff going on around them that's not specifically why I'm wary of them. Even if they're just a kid, kids can be scary as gently caress.
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Apr 10, 2021 05:26
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Also i really love how "Blood is poisonous" and "Followers are fleshy abominations" are stated to be reasons for extermination. That's like prejudice 101. Also, i do believe lordly territories are stated to be uniquely habitable for the followers, so if bleeder's is like, full of flesh, that's because that's how he and his followers like it, not because he's an rear end of some kind. It's like begrudging a fish wishing to live in water.
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Apr 10, 2021 10:23
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The lords having more going on under the surface cuts both ways. For all we know they all committed horrible atrocities as part of this "island", are harmful to the environment and people around them just by their supernatural presence, or are living miserable tortured existences and killing them would be a mercy. I think most of our views are coloured by Blue being nice, but we still know next to nothing about her or the lords.
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Apr 10, 2021 10:34
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bleeder is just an incredibly committed goth
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Apr 10, 2021 13:00
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Eh, maybe I am being too harsh and jumping to conclusions on Bleeder, and there probably is a "pacifist" way of dealing with him, but I'm still not going to trust him yet.
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Apr 10, 2021 16:20
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Randalor posted:Eh, maybe I am being too harsh and jumping to conclusions on Bleeder, and there probably is a "pacifist" way of dealing with him, but I'm still not going to trust him yet.
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Apr 10, 2021 17:52
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Interesting to compare who has a born from the island page and who has a harrowing of the island page. Wonder what Dancer did.
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Apr 10, 2021 22:00
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code:The Blue Book posted:MARTINET [Tyrant+Ranger] [Still loading. More time to go deeper into some other pages. Everyone has their own style, their own page content and manner of keeping and sharing information learned. Sometimes the information was suspect or outright wrong, but that was rarely with malice, or even mistake - variables changed all the time between oneruns depending on actions taken. Even after all this time, most things are a best-guess.]
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Apr 11, 2021 01:47
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It's interesting that, based on that information, Hunter is the only Lord whose class is Tyrant-based; presumably that's why she's so proactive against us, and if she's also a Tyrant, that suggests it may not be possible to deal with her non-violently. (I'm just gonna hazard a guess that Tyrants can't coexist with each other.)
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Apr 11, 2021 02:16
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It's... really hard to say. Looking back at when we encountered her, it almost reads like she was surprised to see another Tyrant, rather than angry, then amused that we were still a Tyrant Child (low level Tyrant?) before locking the Tyrant away. And then Blue showed up and we don't know what would have happened.
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Apr 11, 2021 02:36
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Immediate takehomes from this: - We already knew Hunter's stats, but the message is the same: if we can get to her physical form and get the first blow, we can probably kill her in one hit. Unfortunately her physical form is in a gigantic airship above the clouds surrounded by cultists, and her astral form is invulnerable (or at least close enough to it that Smiercia didn't consider it a missed chance). - Doubler's low willpower, perception and intelligence mean he's probably very weak to mental attack if we can stop him from duplicating, which is a big if. His low IQ also most likely means we won't be able to negotiate with him, although stopping him from eternally duplicating drowning might be an alternative. - Hider sounds lethal if we have to fight her. She's a psychic with S+ perception, so our powers won't help us except maybe in defense if we're very lucky. And while her F health makes her a glass cannon, her S dexterity and her foresight mean it will be extremely difficult to land a hit. The one piece of good news is that she has very close ties to Jandoubi and therefore presumably Dancer and the Backup, so we might well be able to go for a pacifist route. If not, our best shot might be singing if we really are the Singer of Cadenza, since it affects a wide enough area that it's not really dodgeable, and since it can in principle block out the sound of the rain and thunder she relies on for her foresight. - Burner and Dancer's stats are hopefully irrelevant because we're not going to fight our BFFs Red and Blue.  - Bleeder looks pretty weak to mental attack, although we already have a strong indication that singing will be the most effective path there. He's also a berserker, which might explain why he shifted into murder mode so suddenly. - Moulder looks like some sort of Azathoth-like eldritch abomination, especially given its pronoun is "it", borderline unkillable and blindly destroying everything in its path with unshakable willpower. - Moulder and Doubler are both existentially horrifying, both intellectually crippled, both born on the Island, and both in service to the Island (Moulder as a guardian and Doubler as a priest). I think the Island is probably a bad thing and the other lords probably had a good reason to try and harrow it, although given that Bleeder serves the island by protecting the cults it seems to have conquered them somehow. - Every single lord has been killed at least once. The fact that Hunter and Moulder only have one known drop suggests they haven't been killed often. I know this is a while in the future, but I definitely want to pump singing next level now - it's key to too many of our goals not to. pumpinglemma fucked around with this message at 02:58 on Apr 11, 2021 |
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Apr 11, 2021 02:53
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Hunter's drop being a wilted flower crown is the kind of thing where you just go with "yeah, let's double-check the murderin' path". The 2 eldritch lords might need to be saved for last as i'm guessing the solution to them isn't negotiation, it might be magical decoupling rituals or something of the sort. Gotta dig on that.
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Apr 11, 2021 13:32
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Wasn't there a blue notes entry about Hunter being the oldest one as well? I'm kind of wondering if there's a way of convincing her to train us to better control/harness the Tyrant that ends with her peacefully passing away.
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Apr 11, 2021 14:12
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Just binged this thread. This is incredible and I absolutely adore it. Looking at the recent information, it seems like Doubler is a shapeshifter what with the 'base killing form' and 'mutant meat' as a drop. (That said, the stats are again said to be for only one form, so Doubler might have alternate forms for when IQ or WLL is required. I think Moulder might be the tanky lord that was in one of the Blue Book snippets considering its WL and HT. pumpinglemma posted:- Moulder looks like some sort of Azathoth-like eldritch abomination, especially given its pronoun is "it", borderline unkillable and blindly destroying everything in its path with unshakable willpower. I feel like Azathoth might be explicitly a thing with the Mythos and "AZA AZA AZA". (Also, your analysis is great.)
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Apr 11, 2021 16:21
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If Hunter is actively guarding the Dreamlands Lord territories, maybe that's how we'll have to take down some of them. Can't use your impossibly high toughness in your dreams after all.
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Apr 11, 2021 16:35
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pumpinglemma posted:- Moulder and Doubler are both existentially horrifying, both intellectually crippled, both born on the Island, and both in service to the Island (Moulder as a guardian and Doubler as a priest). I think the Island is probably a bad thing and the other lords probably had a good reason to try and harrow it, although given that Bleeder serves the island by protecting the cults it seems to have conquered them somehow. In our encounter with the World King, he mentioned that the back keeps him safe and away from the sight of "the Island and its victims". At that moment I thought it was a metaphor but it may have turned out to be more literal than I thought it was back then. Smiercia also noted how the Lords were now faithful to that which hurt them, and that it gifted them power obscene. And, I mean, they're cults, right? I'd assume they worship something, and Paprika Blue wasn't talking about Dancer the way you'd talk about your god. Bella also referred to the Island as a living, conscious, malicious entity: quote:"You poor thing! Doomed sweet thing. Did you hear it coming hence? The Island came looking for them, and it cost the city their all. Over and over the wall of night... you sad suffering thing. Remember this, remember it- my name is Bella, Bella, Bella." So I think they worship the Island, or whatever is behind it. And in turn it granted them power, in the most horrific way possible. I wouldn't be surprised if slaying this god the cults worship would end up being key to overcoming the game, provided it even can be killed. Also I found this snippet from the book: quote:"...and retreats at the end of the battle before she can be truly killed, unless you are ENORMOUSLY powerful, enough to one-shot her. The opposite applies as well- any blue items worn can and will be possessed, leading to immediate death checks when..." I think that refers to Paprika Blue. It seems she can both possess something blue to escape mortal danger as well as to attack the opponent if they happen to have something blue on them. Good thing we didn't lose control back there, choosing to fight her near the mural would have been suicidal even if our suit is the right color to fend her off. If her power works how I think it does she may have potentially collapsed the entire thing under us. Grond fucked around with this message at 00:54 on Apr 12, 2021 |
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Apr 11, 2021 22:56
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The Blue Book posted:
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Apr 12, 2021 23:18
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Huh, am I reading that right and Bleeder... avenges the other lords? And all we have to do to get Dancer to show up is to just keep wishing over and over again? I'm assuming that's referring to an actual "wish" ability and not just typing in "wish" over and over at a text prompt. And we need to find some mining equipment for Moulder. I'm thinking a backhoe, or maybe if we can find one, one of those large jackhammers that's mounted on an arm similar to the backhoes. ...maybe I just want to play with the trucks. Though I'm curious about the "luring Burner to Moulder for a double kill", is that because we can get them to fight, or is it because Burner just causes that much collateral damage?
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Apr 12, 2021 23:53
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Burner also "knows something the others don't." Maybe if we consult with her we can learn something important about the nature of the Lords and the Island (or even get some warning about the difficulty spike?) Maybe we could even enlist her help against Moulder. Her territory does sound particularly inhospitable though.
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Apr 13, 2021 00:00
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...is Moulder a literal mountain?
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Apr 13, 2021 00:00
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That's definitely what it sounds like.
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Apr 13, 2021 00:01
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so from what I’m reading here we could conceivably get the better of Bleeder by 
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Apr 13, 2021 00:05
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pumpinglemma posted:...is Moulder a literal mountain? that does seem to be the implication, yes
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Apr 13, 2021 00:05
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SatansOnion posted:so from what I’m reading here we could conceivably get the better of Bleeder by by the time we got it to him, it would be true 
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Apr 13, 2021 00:06
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Going down the list... Hunter is just bad news in general. Heading to a Lord's section of the Dreamlands seems to be what pissed her off last time we met her. Moulder is a longterm fight that lasts an entire playthrough due to its massive HP pool. It's very interesting that it's mentioned using "reflections" that aren't "accusations" - I'm assuming there's some stuff going on with it that's similar to that cave on Dagobah where Luke killed himself as Darth Vader. I guess that means Anxiety may be the biggest threat Moulder poses to us? That might be why Beastlord Chicken is so good against it. Also, boasting about your Lord-slayings to it - presumably the reflection - isn't good long-term? Hoo boy, I guess that's evidence that killing the Lords is a bad idea if boasting about it to our reflection will gently caress us over later. So Doubler is what's in the water near the Mountain. That is a very, very good reason to stay out of it. Hider sounds like she'd be interesting to talk to. The Dancer's crew are around Jandoubi, aren't they? Huh, so THAT'S what happened with Camp. We got the "distant campfire at night" spawn of Burner right on top of Camp, and it nabbed her, us and Dancer before any of us could really do anything. Burner seems to know something interesting, so going to say hi to her should be a priority once we can actually reach her without dying horribly. I wonder if the warning about the Pilgrimage route is about Dancer, or about something that happens during the Pilgrimage? That "recurring chance once dead" comment worries me. But the bit that really gets my attention - he goes out of his way to hunt down Lord-slayers? That, combined with Hunter protecting the dreams of the Lords, as well as Burner and Dancer hanging out probably means that the Lords share a bond, likely due to whatever traumatizing fuckery happened on the Island. That's good news - that likely means that our in with Dancer and Burner is a really big deal. We haven't just made peace with two Lords - we've made peace with two members of a close-knit group of survivors. Burner seeming not to care about killing Moulder in the collateral might mean that it's not a part of that circle, and it's likely Doubler isn't either, so even if we manage to convince the other five to help us we'll still need to fight them. Camp may just have made the peace route a viable option...though the more I hear about the Island, the more worried I am about its connection to the Corruption that's about to swallow the land and it's influence over the Lords. GilliamYaeger fucked around with this message at 00:36 on Apr 13, 2021 |
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Apr 13, 2021 00:24
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