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from a bit ago and this is kind of a hot take, but... if some kind of armed, organized opposition to police occupation formed, wouldn't that be a counter insurgency, not an insurgency?
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Apr 20, 2021 13:24
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Cabbages and Kings posted:from a bit ago and this is kind of a hot take, but... if some kind of armed, organized opposition to police occupation formed, wouldn't that be a counter insurgency, not an insurgency? Police are agents of the state and the state cannot insurge upon itself. An armed reaction to police occupation by regular citizens would absolutely be an insurgency and if it were happening anywhere else nobody would object to it being labeled as such
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Apr 20, 2021 13:27
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Cabbages and Kings posted:from a bit ago and this is kind of a hot take, but... if some kind of armed, organized opposition to police occupation formed, wouldn't that be a counter insurgency, not an insurgency? Cops aren't really in revolt so no.
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Apr 20, 2021 13:28
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VitalSigns posted:Also kind of weird that the op was saying NATO was a defensive response to Warsaw Pact aggression when NATO predated the Warsaw Pact Just as a note, NATO wasn't a response to the Warsaw Pact. It was a response to the Berlin Blockade and the coup in Czechoslovakia.
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Apr 20, 2021 13:58
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Sedisp posted:Cops aren't really in revolt so no. Yeah, policing is working as it has (and is expected to) for a long time now. It’s other systems that are changing.
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Apr 20, 2021 14:08
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I'd assume he's going to run for governor. https://twitter.com/HotlineJosh/status/1384494109105262594?s=20 but lmao quote:Robinson accused people "who support this mass delusion called transgenderism" of seeking "to glorify Satan";[16] claimed that the movie Black Panther was "created by an agnostic Jew and put to film by satanic Marxist" that was "only created to pull the shekels out of your Schvartze pockets" (using a Yiddish slur for Black);[16][13] called former President Obama a "a worthless, anti-American atheist"[16] and posted "birther" memes;[13] accused American Muslims of being "INVADERS"; called Michelle Obama a man; and disparaged Joy Behar and Maxine Waters in crude terms.[16] After the 2016 Pulse nightclub shooting, Robinson wrote that "Homosexuality is STILL an abominable sin and I WILL NOT join in 'celebrating gay pride.'"[13] In 2020, Robinson asserted that the coronavirus was a "globalist" conspiracy to defeat Donald Trump, and in response to the threat of the COVID-19 pandemic, writing, "The looming pandemic I’m most worried about is SOCIALISM."[13]
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Apr 20, 2021 14:14
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Sedisp posted:Cops aren't really in revolt so no. But they are revolting! 
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Apr 20, 2021 14:19
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https://twitter.com/allahpundit/status/1384502307514056714 I try to check foxnews.com (and CNN.com) once a day to see what insanity half the country is consuming daily. On any day that some Trump malfeasance was the top story, the Fox header would be that glowering photo of Durham with "PROBE MOVING ALONG" or some other bullshit. I still don't know what he's supposed to be investigating, Obama wiretaps or something?
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Apr 20, 2021 15:13
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GlyphGryph posted:I love how superior you act while you lecture us on the importance of always letting empires exert dominion over their neighbours completely unchecked because the potential cost of that effort being resisted, or even threatening to resist it, is too high. It really lines up so well with the other stuff you advocate. Raenir Salazar posted:So if China took Alaska, or Hawaii, should the US ignore it to avoid the end of industrial civilization? That's pretty insane, I hope you agree. You've somehow strawmanned my objection to this into "oh so you think empires should get to do whatever they want", but I never said that. Self-determination is a good thing, sure use diplomacy and soft power to pressure China into respecting Taiwan's self-determination. Also to get them to leave Tibet if you want, I don't think we should be invading and bombing them over it though. Just like I think international pressure should be brought against the US to get us to stop occupying Afghanistan, stop overthrowing governments in Latin America, stop unleashing police brutality on our own people, stop imprisoning refugees, give justice to the native peoples we forced onto reservations etc, but I don't think China should bomb New York over it. GlyphGryph posted:This is still a good thing to consider though. Even if its right for Taiwan to be saved from being conquered by an outside power, it could still be true that from a geopolitical perspective its a bad move and the US government should not take any action to prevent. Even then its still probably worth threatening to take action up until the point where you back down, so long as you're sure you can back down. Which you can't always so... This is pretty much what I am saying though. You can't stop every injustice everywhere, you can try, but sometimes you have to know when taking another step would make things worse. Saddam was a bad guy who did bad things, that didn't mean the US invasion made Iraq a better place or left the world better off. Also consider that a lot of injustice is ignored or even perpetrated by the US. So why is your attention being drawn to this one place. Is it because the US State Department and foreign policy establishment just especially cares about Asian people and can't stand to see them hurt, lol no, this is the same country who sells cluster bombs to the Saudis and who still refuses to pay reparations for 75 million tons of Agent Orange we dropped on Vietnam. If the US actually wanted to reduce injustice, it could stop perpetrating injustice and stop giving weapons to the perpetrators of injustice. That's the low-hanging fruit, that would not only cost zero lives and zero dollars to do, it would save us a whole bunch of money. But of course we won't do that, because perpetrating injustices is sometimes in our geopolitical interests. So why is the State Dept monging all this war over Taiwan, is it because of a principled commitment to fighting injustice, obviously not. It's because monging wars with China is in the geopolitical interests of a crumbling empire that's trying to fend off a rising economic competitor. And the state department and the corporate media apparatus are incredibly good at targeting propaganda to coopt our morality and sense of justice and twisting them to support evil ends, they did it with Afghanistan, they did it with Iraq, and they're doing it now.
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Apr 20, 2021 15:17
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FizFashizzle posted:I'd assume he's going to run for governor. North Carolina elected this guy and reelected Governor Cooper?  I want to read the interview with the Cooper/Robinson voters
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Apr 20, 2021 15:22
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the_steve posted:I'll be curious as to what the sentence is if they do render the guilty verdict, if they'll try to reduce it down to a slap on the wrist somehow. If it's the lowest charge it's jail time OR like a 20k fine. Guess what the judge will give. And after a day on Gofundme it's done and done.
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Apr 20, 2021 15:29
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https://twitter.com/bubbaprog/status/1384512274174447617 Wow cancel culture is out of control.
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Apr 20, 2021 15:29
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Amazing how it eliminated every job in 9 of the Georgias and half the jobs in the 10th
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Apr 20, 2021 15:31
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Maybe if they want people to have jobs they shouldn’t make a law where the high-school coach has to look at all the players’ dicks before every game. I don’t know—I am not a politician.
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Apr 20, 2021 15:32
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haveblue posted:Amazing how it eliminated every job in 9 of the Georgias and half the jobs in the 10th It's equivalent to 15 kiloshermans
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Apr 20, 2021 15:33
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zoux posted:https://twitter.com/bubbaprog/status/1384512274174447617
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Apr 20, 2021 15:33
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VitalSigns posted:China is in the geopolitical interests of a crumbling empire that's trying to fend off a rising economic competitor. I agree with a lot of what you’re saying, but this pretty clearly isn’t true. US domination has not abated and is more clear now than it was in the 90’s post-USSR. There are economic indicators it would’ve been impossible for the US to remain on top of for long given the populations of countries like China or India unless they were destined to have standards of living several magnitudes shy of the US. If you look at the landscape today I would challenge you to name a single marker of cultural dominance that isn’t centered on the US. Especially if we’re going to define this time and age by technology, it isn’t even sort of close.
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Apr 20, 2021 15:34
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FlamingLiberal posted:I’m pretty sure Georgia doesn’t have 100 million jobs not anymore anyway
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Apr 20, 2021 15:34
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Some really bizarre takes on china stuff IMO. Helping Taiwan defend against PRC is absolutely nothing like Iraq, Afghanistan, or even Vietnam or Korea  . I doubt anyone short of the biggest nutjobs actually wants a hot war, but a firm commitment could go a long way to discourage any fuckery. Full pacifism is of course a cool strategy until some rear end in a top hat comes along and ruins everything.
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Apr 20, 2021 15:37
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Well, this explains a lot https://twitter.com/ddayen/status/1384513544842928146 Congressional Dems want to dump DeJoy bad, but the postal carrier's union backs him and the BoG https://twitter.com/igorbobic/status/1384513121994248195 Lol what the gently caress
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Apr 20, 2021 15:37
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zoux posted:
Chuck Choomer
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Apr 20, 2021 15:42
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FlamingLiberal posted:I’m pretty sure Georgia doesn’t have 100 million jobs Maybe it does if you count all the pidgins?
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Apr 20, 2021 15:43
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mobby_6kl posted:Some really bizarre takes on china stuff IMO. Helping Taiwan defend against PRC is absolutely nothing like Iraq, Afghanistan, or even Vietnam or Korea This really sleeps on one of the arguments citing hit anime fate/zero for a thought experiment that depends on the idea that the invasion and slaughter of Americans by China is inevitable.
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Apr 20, 2021 15:44
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i am a moron posted:I agree with a lot of what you’re saying, but this pretty clearly isn’t true. US domination has not abated and is more clear now than it was in the 90’s post-USSR. There are economic indicators it would’ve been impossible for the US to remain on top of for long given the populations of countries like China or India unless they were destined to have standards of living several magnitudes shy of the US. If you look at the landscape today I would challenge you to name a single marker of cultural dominance that isn’t centered on the US. Especially if we’re going to define this time and age by technology, it isn’t even sort of close. Yeah true I didn't mean crumbling in the immediate, gonna-fall-next-year-sense. More that living in the US you can see the imperial rot setting in, in a long-term sense. Ruled by a short-sighted plutocracy that can't abide any government spending which isn't graft funnelled right into their pockets, basic services like healthcare and public education and roads and even electricity failing, the inability to deal with natural disasters like blizzards or pandemics because no one at the top even gives a poo poo anymore, an insanely expensive colonial occupation force constantly falling into military boondoggles, etc. Someone earlier posted "we should be doing our own Belt and Road to expand our influence abroad", and that would actually be a very smart long-range move, but that's not something we can even do anymore. That's what "nation-building" in Iraq and Afghanistan was supposed to be, a way to win the hearts and minds and turn those countries into US allies, but all the money went to politically-connected contractors who embezzled it all and slapped down the shittiest possible construction projects or just 'lost' pallets of physical cash. And that's when there was at least the political will to spend money in those places because we were bogged down in endless wars, there's no way you could politically sell a Belt and Road plan or Marshall Plan or anything like that to the American people today, because half the country swallows down a steady diet of jingoism and chauvinism telling them that America is The Best and spending money on ""shithole countries"" is practically treason, and all the other countries should be paying us tribute just for being America, and that NATO should be a protection racket to rip off our allies, etc.
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Apr 20, 2021 15:44
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zoux posted:https://twitter.com/bubbaprog/status/1384512274174447617 How is this not just laughable.
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Apr 20, 2021 15:49
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VitalSigns posted:Yeah true I didn't mean crumbling in the immediate, gonna-fall-next-year-sense. Gotcha. I wonder though - when has this not been true of the US? I feel like looking back this is all very cyclical and we’re at the ‘oops’ part where people realize hyper capitalism is awful, and that people have been calling the end for a while now. Not to say the US will last forever (frankly I hope all nation states are absorbed into a global government of some kind one day) but has all the slapdickery ever really hurt in the long term? Edit: I wish the foreign wars would just stop, but I guess another thought is do they even remotely matter to the country continuing to exist as it does? Seems like the only ‘war’ that really determined the outcome of this country was genociding the natives and securing a huge advantage with where our land mass is situated, how huge it is, and the natural resources that came with it i am a moron fucked around with this message at 15:53 on Apr 20, 2021 |
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Apr 20, 2021 15:50
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VitalSigns posted:Yeah true I didn't mean crumbling in the immediate, gonna-fall-next-year-sense. Well on that I agree with you. But we shouldn't just throw our hands up and pretend its impossible. We should build on things like the ARP act and the upcoming infrastructure act and focus on rebuilding those rotting institutions. Some of this smacks of the centrist line of "better things aren't possible". You act like America and the west are in some irreversible plutocratic decline. I would argue the one good thing about the US is that it can course correct. It has done so at many times in its history and it has had periods of decline, reinvention and progress. I think this is as bad as it gets and as long as congress continues to push for progressive policies of the nation building sort we can start to see a reversal of the trend you described. Kraftwerk fucked around with this message at 15:55 on Apr 20, 2021 |
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Apr 20, 2021 15:51
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zoux posted:Well, this explains a lot And who's in charge of the postal carrier's union? At this point it wouldn't surprise me if it's some dude installed by the private shipping companies.
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Apr 20, 2021 15:51
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zoux posted:https://twitter.com/igorbobic/status/1384513121994248195
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Apr 20, 2021 15:51
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mobby_6kl posted:Some really bizarre takes on china stuff IMO. Helping Taiwan defend against PRC is absolutely nothing like Iraq, Afghanistan, or even Vietnam or Korea How firm is your commitment if you don't actually want to do the hot war though? What happens if the other side calls your bluff? Do you back down and let everyone know that your "firm commitments" aren't actually that firm? Or does your belief in Domino Theory and face-saving railroad you into the hot war that your firm comment was supposed to prevent? Is it really a good idea to commit to doing something that would be disastrous for you in the hopes that the other side always chickens out first? I mean let's look at how everyone got into WWI despite it not being in anybody's interest at all. Austria thinks she can smack down Serbia because German backing will force the Russians to back down rather than start a general war. The Russians think they can mobilize against Germany and Austria because it will force Austria to back down rather than start a general war. The Germans think they can threaten war on Russia because it will force Russia to back down on mobilization rather than start a general war. The Russians mobilize anyway because they think Germany will back down before declaring war. Now everyone has made firm commitments and they all can't afford to back down out of fear that showing weakness will embolden their adversaries and all the bluster and alliances and pledges that were supposed to prevent war and get the other guy to chicken out make a war that no one wants inevitable.
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Apr 20, 2021 15:58
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i am a moron posted:Gotcha. I wonder though - when has this not been true of the US? I feel like looking back this is all very cyclical and we’re at the ‘oops’ part where people realize hyper capitalism is awful, and that people have been calling the end for a while now. Not to say the US will last forever (frankly I hope all nation states are absorbed into a global government of some kind one day) but has all the slapdickery ever really hurt in the long term? The cycle is long. This is really only the second time we've been through an upheaval like we're approaching, we didn't exactly sail through it the first time, we weren't the dominant empire then, and all of Europe destroyed itself.
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Apr 20, 2021 15:59
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https://twitter.com/daveweigel/status/1384519797757542406
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Apr 20, 2021 16:02
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https://twitter.com/mkraju/status/1384522357742710784 https://twitter.com/mtgreenee/status/1384476739221479426 Lmao they are sprinting this back Forms a white nationalist caucus *girls get mad at me* sorry, sorry I'm trying to delete it https://twitter.com/oliverdarcy/status/1384514188844879874  
zoux fucked around with this message at 16:09 on Apr 20, 2021 |
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Apr 20, 2021 16:04
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Kraftwerk posted:Well on that I agree with you. But we shouldn't just throw our hands up and pretend its impossible. We should build on things like the ARP act and the upcoming infrastructure act and focus on rebuilding those rotting institutions. Some of this smacks of the centrist line of "better things aren't possible". You act like America and the west are in some irreversible plutocratic decline. I would argue the one good thing about the US is that it can course correct. It has done so at many times in its history and it has had periods of decline, reinvention and progress. I think this is as bad as it gets and as long as congress continues to push for progressive policies of the nation building sort we can start to see a reversal of the trend you described. No I agree, I not saying it's impossible, it's just not possible with our current leadership and internal power structure. The American people have broken the stranglehold of plutocrats over our government before. The way to deal with the possibility of a rising China is to rebuild our own country instead of letting corporations continue to rip the copper out of the walls for quick cash, then we'd have options besides escalating military brinkmanship. i am a moron posted:Gotcha. I wonder though - when has this not been true of the US? I feel like looking back this is all very cyclical and we’re at the ‘oops’ part where people realize hyper capitalism is awful, and that people have been calling the end for a while now. Not to say the US will last forever (frankly I hope all nation states are absorbed into a global government of some kind one day) but has all the slapdickery ever really hurt in the long term? Sure all states go through cycles, currently there's rot and decline setting in, but that happened to Rome plenty of times and they bounced back (until they didn't). We might too. I'm just saying right now all the hysterical war propaganda is about building up public will to keep a rising rival in check, it has nothing to do with caring about the fate of the Taiwanese or self-determination or anything like that. All that stuff about lofty principles coming from the military-industrial complex and its stenographers in the corporate media is nonsense, just a way to sell another ruinous forever-war to us by portraying the enemy as fantasy scifi anime bad guys and playing on our sense of morality and justice.
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Apr 20, 2021 16:11
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A little late, but if you either want to cite Fate/Zero in its critique of Utilitarianism or you want to dunk on someone for doing so, just substitute The Brothers Karamazov, its pretty much the exact same critique of the philosophy, ie that you can't build a happy future by trying to use math to justify suffering, the majority who get the happiness at the expense of the suffering minority will either reject it or inevitably have their happiness ruined by the crime over time. Save yourselves some petty sniping about the chosen source. Or if you really want to be spicy substitute Avengers: Endgame, since that's ALSO the same critique. Truly the names Dostoyevsky, Urobuchi and Feige must be spoken in the same breath.
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Apr 20, 2021 16:23
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zoux posted:Congressional Dems want to dump DeJoy bad, but the postal carrier's union backs him and the BoG So when the Postal Worker's Union no longer exists because DeJoy has completely privatized and destroyed the Postal Service, will they just shrug and say what an oopsie they've done? gently caress them, ignore them, dump the board, dump Dejoy, they can cry their worker-betraying tears into their beer over it later.
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Apr 20, 2021 16:42
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Sanguinia posted:So when the Postal Worker's Union no longer exists because DeJoy has completely privatized and destroyed the Postal Service, will they just shrug and say what an oopsie they've done? gently caress them, ignore them, dump the board, dump Dejoy, they can cry their worker-betraying tears into their beer over it later. The story quotes a couple of NALC rank-and-files who say that the union head, Frederic Rolando, and some of the other leadership are doing this on their own. Sounds to me like it's some backscratching going on among deeply entrenched establishment Democratic interests quote:A week later, the NALC privately issued its response to Connolly, Pascrell, and Blumenauer. The four-page letter states firmly that the NALC disagrees with firing any current board members, particularly the two Democrats: Ron Bloom, currently serving as the board chair, and Donald Lee Moak. NALC president Rolando staunchly defends Bloom and Moak as having “deep ties and experience with the American labor movement” and having had “a very positive impact on the board … their contributions should not be dismissed or attacked.” Hard to tell how much of this is NALC leadership agreeing with DeJoy's "reforms" and how much of it is trying to protect these two board members.
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Apr 20, 2021 16:46
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Sanguinia posted:A little late, but if you either want to cite Fate/Zero in its critique of Utilitarianism or you want to dunk on someone for doing so, just substitute The Brothers Karamazov, its pretty much the exact same critique of the philosophy, ie that you can't build a happy future by trying to use math to justify suffering, the majority who get the happiness at the expense of the suffering minority will either reject it or inevitably have their happiness ruined by the crime over time. Save yourselves some petty sniping about the chosen source. This kinda makes it sound like the problem isn't using artistic media to form an analogy, but that the problem was not picking an example from a media old and obscure enough that most people wouldn't have read it much less heard of it.
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Apr 20, 2021 16:48
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Republicans posted:And who's in charge of the postal carrier's union? At this point it wouldn't surprise me if it's some dude installed by the private shipping companies. There's two of them--the National Association of Letter Carriers and National Rural Letter Carriers' Association. I know my union's leadership--American Postal Workers Union--wants to piss in DeJoy's mouth.
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Apr 20, 2021 17:00
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Why are there three postal workers unions? Haven't they considered organizing together into a group to enhance their influence through collective bargaining
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Apr 20, 2021 17:02
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