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Dapper_Swindler posted:they also tend to convict soldiers when said soldiers decide shooting civilians and prisoners and etc is fun and cool. unlike cops. which is also sad. And then the Chud God issues a presidential pardon.
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Apr 21, 2021 04:34
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Sarcastro posted:And then the Chud God issues a presidential pardon. True, but if you look up who was upset with that poo poo: military personnel were a big part of it.
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Apr 21, 2021 04:46
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PT6A posted:That too, yes. Also the jury is composed entirely of people who knew what rules you were told to follow and are pissed off that you didn't. and sexual assult. the military and its courts have plenty of its own horror and awful poo poo as everyone knows.
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Apr 21, 2021 05:06
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Dapper_Swindler posted:and sexual assult. the military and its courts have plenty of its own horror and awful poo poo as everyone knows. Oh god yes. It's an absolute shitshow, as I'm sure everyone here well knows, and they still manage to be more controlled about shooting people for no reason and/or holding those responsible to account. Which should serve to illustrate how bad police forces are, if the US military can be superior to them in any way.
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Apr 21, 2021 05:09
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How do you guys feel about the guilty verdict announced today with regards to Derek Chauvin's murder charges?
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Apr 21, 2021 05:14
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Wizard Master posted:How do you guys feel about the guilty verdict announced today with regards to Derek Chauvin's murder charges? Who?
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Apr 21, 2021 05:28
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cr0y posted:How in the cinnamon toast gently caress do police see one of their own basically get the book thrown at them and then immediately think "Pulling a gun and shooting at this child will go my way" seems a little hasty, BW looks like she was in the process of stabbing someone. What are police supposed to do when they see someone about to get stabbed? https://www.dispatch.com/story/news/crime/2021/04/20/one-person-killed-officer-involved-shooting-east-side/7309088002/
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Apr 21, 2021 06:28
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chinigz posted:seems a little hasty, BW looks like she was in the process of stabbing someone. What are police supposed to do when they see someone about to get stabbed? De-escalate rather than immediately murder someone?
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Apr 21, 2021 06:30
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PT6A posted:Oh god yes. It's an absolute shitshow, as I'm sure everyone here well knows, and they still manage to be more controlled about shooting people for no reason and/or holding those responsible to account. Which should serve to illustrate how bad police forces are, if the US military can be superior to them in any way. Same in the UK. The military do a thing early on in training where they match recruits by size pop them in the ring with gloves and gum shields and let them have at it for a minute. They are not looking for skill or ability (you can teach those) it's a simple courage check to make sure they are all willing to put themselves at risk to stand and fight. The ones who run away go home. The pigs don't do that so abject cowards who need the badge to feel powerful get through training and go on to hurt people because they genuinely enjoy it and it's what they joined to do.
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Apr 21, 2021 06:35
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Sanguinia posted:De-escalate rather than immediately murder someone? quote:Bryant then appears to swing a knife at a girl who is on the hood of a car, and the officer fires his weapon what sounds like four times, striking Bryant, who died a short time later. I agree but what does de-escalation look like in this scenario when someone is actually swinging a knife at a victim? if there is space and time to verbally de-escalate or back off etc then they ought to do that but here?
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Apr 21, 2021 06:39
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chinigz posted:I agree but what does de-escalation look like in this scenario when someone is actually swinging a knife at a victim? if there is space and time to verbally de-escalate or back off etc then they ought to do that but here? You know what there's not space to do AFTER you shoot the gun? Undo murdering someone if you hosed something up in your fraction-second decision where you defaulted to "Murder That Scary Looking Minority" as the obvious right answer. You want to get real here? How lethal is a knife, really? How sure are you that this guy would have killed this woman even if he had successfully stabbed her? Because unless you are 100% sure that's what would have happened if the cop did not open fire, you are condoning the taking of a life extrajudicially for a non-capital crime
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Apr 21, 2021 06:48
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Wizard Master posted:How do you guys feel about the guilty verdict announced today with regards to Derek Chauvin's murder charges? I thought this episode was garbage personally.
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Apr 21, 2021 07:05
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Sanguinia posted:You know what there's not space to do AFTER you shoot the gun? Undo murdering someone if you hosed something up in your fraction-second decision where you defaulted to "Murder That Scary Looking Minority" as the obvious right answer. Knives like guns are as lethal as the person holding them. If you wait to see how professional they are at stabbing people and they know what they are doing or are lucky you just let someone die in front of you, if they are rubbish at it you let someone get injured in front of you. Either of which are a bad look on camera. Then there's the question of if someone's willing to stab somebody right in front of a cop are they likely to listen to reason at all.
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Apr 21, 2021 07:07
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I doubt that IQ brag is real if this is his opinion on what being a police officer is Starsfan posted:I mean I know that this dude is already getting torn up for his ridiculous twitter handle but yeah.. if my job entailed me doing things that would get me sent to jail for 40 years for doing them outside of my work, I would probably quit my job right away. Yeah, the problem is this cop wasn't doing his job, he was violating the rules. To people like that shitstain the cops are there to murder anyone that doesn't mesh with their view of society happyhippy posted:Was it with Floyd's death that the police themselves turned up and clapped for the cop the day after? I think they were too busy tear gassing people outside the day after. That's what kicked off the violence in the first protest SocketWrench fucked around with this message at 07:22 on Apr 21, 2021 |
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Apr 21, 2021 07:08
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Sanguinia posted:You know what there's not space to do AFTER you shoot the gun? Undo murdering someone if you hosed something up in your fraction-second decision where you defaulted to "Murder That Scary Looking Minority" as the obvious right answer. We can agree to disagree here. If someone is about to imminently receive a fatal or life threatening injury that is clearly a case where cops are justified in shooting.
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Apr 21, 2021 07:16
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chinigz posted:We can agree to disagree here. If someone is about to imminently receive a fatal or life threatening injury that is clearly a case where cops are justified in shooting. I am actually aghast at this post. After everything we've seen from American police officers, and their utter disregard for human life, you still manage to find a way to justify them executing a child. Seriously, what the gently caress is wrong with you?
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Apr 21, 2021 07:24
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In theory 'actively attempting to stab someone right at this exact moment' is pretty much the platonic ideal of a time when lethal force is justified. In practice, I don't even remotely trust the cops not to be actively and currently lying about... everything. There is nothing they can say about the situation that would make me think they were right, because they have zero credibility.
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Apr 21, 2021 07:25
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Dapper_Swindler posted:honestly, i wouldn't be shocked with either. i could see trump being legit degusted on some level when watching a man get murdered and saying as much. but also "law and order"/etc. I can guarantee you this will not happen. For that to happen Trump would need some form of empathy for people other than him. He can't even give that to his own direct family outside of his daughter kinda sorta because he wants to bang her
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Apr 21, 2021 07:31
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forbidden dialectics posted:I am actually aghast at this post. After everything we've seen from American police officers, and their utter disregard for human life, you still manage to find a way to justify them executing a child. Seriously, what the gently caress is wrong with you? From the GBS thread Weka posted:That's all largely true but this really looks like somebody about to do a stabbing. It's a still from just before she's shot if that's not something anyone wants to see. I'm not 'justifying executing a child' - I'm taking the fairly vanilla position that lethal force is justified if there is an imminent threat to someone's life. This is a pretty milquetoast take
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Apr 21, 2021 07:32
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The Lone Badger posted:In theory 'actively attempting to stab someone right at this exact moment' is pretty much the platonic ideal of a time when lethal force is justified. From the bodyworn this is exactly what this looks like!
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Apr 21, 2021 07:33
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chinigz posted:From the bodyworn this is exactly what this looks like! Yeah but... yhe bodycam footage was provided by the police, and their credibility is negative.
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Apr 21, 2021 07:36
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cr0y posted:How in the cinnamon toast gently caress do police see one of their own basically get the book thrown at them and then immediately think "Pulling a gun and shooting at this child will go my way" Because for a lot of them they're conditioned to believe they are above the law and will walk. The world is changing faster than their brains can adapt. It's like watching the slaughter of the US Civil War because while the technology advanced to make better guns, the tactics remained the same from an era of lovely guns. chinigz posted:I agree but what does de-escalation look like in this scenario when someone is actually swinging a knife at a victim? if there is space and time to verbally de-escalate or back off etc then they ought to do that but here? If within range? Taser. Outside of this, it doesn't look like a situation where "dump till they drop" seemed like it was needed. Yeah, Bryant was a threat to the safety of others, but again, this doesn't warrant execution by cop SocketWrench fucked around with this message at 07:46 on Apr 21, 2021 |
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Apr 21, 2021 07:37
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chinigz posted:I agree but what does de-escalation look like in this scenario when someone is actually swinging a knife at a victim? if there is space and time to verbally de-escalate or back off etc then they ought to do that but here? tasers exist for a reason and hey for all we know, maybe that's what he meant to shoot her with
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Apr 21, 2021 08:06
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DEEP STATE PLOT posted:tasers exist for a reason Tasers are torture bullshit and can still kill. chinigz posted:I agree but what does de-escalation look like in this scenario when someone is actually swinging a knife at a victim? if there is space and time to verbally de-escalate or back off etc then they ought to do that but here? You take take the time and talk that person down and de-escalate, just like every other loving police department in the world does. Or you take them out non-lethally. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mzPj_IaMzY It's absolutely amazing to me that you can walk into this thread and admit to your absolute failure of imagination while the police murder a loving child.
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Apr 21, 2021 08:15
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Not sure how to read this shooting after those pictures other than it shouldn't have happened somehow. But aside from tasers being torturous, they have short range and the leads often fail to pierce layers of fabric and stay in. They're considered unreliable. It looks like they'd have to taser the attacker in the neck while/before they were mid-swing.Jaxyon posted:You take take the time and talk that person down and de-escalate, just like every other loving police department in the world does. Or you take them out non-lethally. Yeah this should unequivocally be the goal. Your video didn't include other bystanders/imminent stabbing victims, which should be the way cops try to steer the aggressor...make them mad at the cops to draw them out to isolate threats. Doesn't seem like police should be involved in the choice of who lives and dies in that situation to me at all. I thought the police dispatch recording call had cops on the scene calling shots like they saw/heard a gun. Anyone else hear that? Need to relisten...now I'm thinking they may have called that inappropriately or illegally when there was just a knife. ILL Machina fucked around with this message at 08:35 on Apr 21, 2021 |
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Apr 21, 2021 08:21
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Glory to Italia!
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Jaxyon posted:Tasers are torture bullshit and can still kill. i mean, yeah, it was mostly a setup for a joke by the way there is exactly zero doubt in my mind that had it been a white guy who called the police, and he was being attacked by two black guys and was going after them with a knife when cops arrived, he'd absolutely still be alive and the other two would be in custody, or dead
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Apr 21, 2021 08:32
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How do you de-escalate when the person is in the process of murdering someone else? I've only seen a still so far but it's of the girl with the knife extremely close to another girl, and she has her backed against the car, the knife close to the girl trapped.
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Apr 21, 2021 08:33
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Jaxyon posted:
I posted earlier that I agree that should be the goal - but when there isn't time, as in this instance, as the person was literally raising a knife and advancing towards someone trapped against a car?
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Apr 21, 2021 08:41
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BetterToRuleInHell posted:How do you de-escalate when the person is in the process of murdering someone else? Yeah this is basically my read. It sucks, I'd rather everyone in this situation made different choices but ultimately when you're attacking someone with a deadly weapon you are absolutely opening yourself up to escalation of force. This isn't a clear cut "The cop is obviously in the wrong" situation.
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Apr 21, 2021 09:07
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https://twitter.com/TheOnion/status/1384629303372095493 Goddamn. The Onion posted:“Moments like this can be tough, but it helps to take a step back and remember that this is the exception that proves the rule,” said Margolin, confirming that despite the conviction he still believed in the justice system’s fundamental purpose of exonerating police officers. “In these trying times, I remember everything I have to be grateful for—qualified immunity, powerful police associations, massive budgets, and all the officers I know who have done similar stuff to Chauvin and gotten away scot-free, and it starts to make me calm down. It’s important not to let a little hiccup like this make you lose sight of the big picture.” At press time, a cheerful Margolin had fully regained his faith in the system after taking out a baton and breaking a demonstrator’s arm.
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Apr 21, 2021 10:39
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Sanguinia posted:You want to get real here? How lethal is a knife, really? How sure are you that this guy would have killed this woman even if he had successfully stabbed her? Because unless you are 100% sure that's what would have happened if the cop did not open fire, you are condoning the taking of a life extrajudicially for a non-capital crime Uh.... incredibly? Especially when the attacker is already close to the victim and has them pinned against a car? There is a reason any self defense class worth a drat tells you the proper reaction to a knife is to run like hell because fighting your assailant is a literal last ditch option that will get you maimed/killed even if you do successfully fend them off. That said, I know nothing of the incident beyond the still, so unless they rolled up to that scene there is still a huge problem here because the cops job is to stop things from getting to the point where someone needs shot
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Apr 21, 2021 11:07
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Sanguinia posted:De-escalate rather than immediately murder someone? In the bodycam footage the girl is literally charging at a girl she has pinned against a car and is swinging the knife to stab her in the head and neck. The police we’re already there, she was aware the police were there. Are you saying you roll up on that situation and whilst this girl is stabbing another girl you would verbally de-escalate the situation whilst she is murdering her?
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Apr 21, 2021 11:23
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chinigz posted:seems a little hasty, BW looks like she was in the process of stabbing someone. What are police supposed to do when they see someone about to get stabbed?
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Apr 21, 2021 11:31
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It's so fast that you can't really tell what's going on in the full speed video but in the slow mo by all appearances the altercation doesn't even start until the cop is already walking up, visually there's nothing to deescalate in the first place until all of a sudden she's shoving one girl over and about the stab a second. This is not "threatening" she is in the act of stabbing someone.
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Apr 21, 2021 11:33
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This is literally the only time lethal force is justified because a woman had a knife en route to her neck when the cop shot her. This isn't justification of executing a child, the other lady was literally about to be stabbed.
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Apr 21, 2021 11:39
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Alhazred posted:Not shoot her four times? There was a similar situation in Norway where a woman was threatening a child with a knife. The police shot one time and it was non lethal. A cop just unloading his clip on someone seems bad. the impression i get from american-dominated discussions on these matters is that every shot is necessarily shooting to kill, so once you've justifiably opened fire you might as well go the extra mile
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Apr 21, 2021 11:43
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also norwegian police have been quite trigger-happy themselves lately. unarmed-as-a-rule has been fully hollowed out for reasons that seem to me to be obscure
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Apr 21, 2021 11:46
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Alhazred posted:Not shoot her four times? There was a similar situation in Norway where a woman was threatening a child with a knife. The police shot one time and it was non lethal. A cop just unloading his clip on someone seems bad. Was she mid swing with the knife? Did the police have time to take the shot, see what they hit, re-evaluate? Because in this case they sure didn’t. It’s absolutely horrifying to watch this girl swing a knife at someone she is pinning against a car, aiming for her head/neck. The woman who was being stabbed is incredibly lucky she didn’t get got even with 4 bullets going into her attacker as the attacker was very much swinging, her weight could of still propelled her attacker. Shooting people isn’t like in movies, where you can magically shoot a knife out of someone’s hand, or hit a specific body part guaranteeing immediate compliance or debilitating injury to prevent someone doing something. It’s brutal and chaotic.
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Apr 21, 2021 11:56
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Why the gently caress are you people theorycrafting about a justified killing? The cops didn't kill her because she might have been a threat to someone, but to make a point that they can: https://twitter.com/_WhatRiot/status/1384672602921209861
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Apr 21, 2021 12:44
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drat, lucky for that lady who was a half second away from being stabbed that they wanted to make a point, 'cause I guess if they didn't want to make a point she would've gotten stabbed.
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Apr 21, 2021 12:51
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