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Volmarias posted:There's also the ability to just drag a bridge all the way up there, and given that they curve now it seems like you may well be able to get a switchback that way. That bridge segment costs 935 tons of concrete, if anyone is tempted to 'shortcut' this way.
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Apr 26, 2021 23:56
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Anime Store Adventure posted:That bridge segment costs 935 tons of concrete, if anyone is tempted to 'shortcut' this way. You'll have that back in a month with all that sweet gravel you can now access 
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Apr 26, 2021 23:57
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For real it'd be great if that scaled by how high the bridge is or if there was an option more tailored to switchbacks because if the cost effective and visually awesome solution was a switchback with the road bed semi supported by piers that would be 
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Apr 27, 2021 00:02
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Retaining walls and semi-constructed terraforming options would be very nice in general. Oh also I appear to have gotten my helicopters to deliver concrete by putting a helipad attached to the concrete plant, so while they do not list it as a valid cargo they can still apparently carry it. Helicopters are, however, monstrously inefficient ways to carry things, not least because they are incredibly slow to load. I know, I'm amazed too. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 00:11 on Apr 27, 2021 |
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Apr 27, 2021 00:09
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OwlFancier posted:Retaining walls and semi-constructed terraforming options would be very nice in general. Hmm! I'll have to do exactly that. They are far less inefficient than a dedicated concrete truck trundling down a dirt road at an anemic 30kph, when they can fly 300kph and can fly straight there instead of winding or waiting for traffic. Did you try asphalt as well? That's all I would need to actually make those remote construction sites a reality!
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Apr 27, 2021 00:42
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One annoying thing I see is when a dumper goes to the asphalt plant and there are no workers, it'll just grab the 0.5t in the storage and waste time carrying that to the site. Obviously I should try to always have workers present, but is there a way to make those trucks wait until they're full, as you might for a train route? Ed: Also chiming in that those pics are gorgeous, ASA. I've never made anything even a tenth that nice. Are you using any mod content in those shots?
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Apr 27, 2021 00:52
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Volmarias posted:Hmm! I'll have to do exactly that. They are far less inefficient than a dedicated concrete truck trundling down a dirt road at an anemic 30kph, when they can fly 300kph and can fly straight there instead of winding or waiting for traffic. I built a road in the way of the asphalt plant so I can't stick a helipad on it, but I can't imagine it would work differently. If you're transporting it a very long way then yes I grant you it might be better but I still think a decent fleet of trucks will use far less fuel and get much better throughput. Certainly once you get to 70's trucks with 85km/h speed.
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Apr 27, 2021 00:56
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Is there a way to assign walls to a construction office without a direct connection to the road/gate building? It'd be nice if they could begin construction if they were in close proximity to a road.
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Apr 27, 2021 00:56
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Fray posted:One annoying thing I see is when a dumper goes to the asphalt plant and there are no workers, it'll just grab the 0.5t in the storage and waste time carrying that to the site. Obviously I should try to always have workers present, but is there a way to make those trucks wait until they're full, as you might for a train route? I have absolutely tons of mods. I just updated my collection, but it doesn't contain some of my early start stuff or many (any?) vehicles. I don't know if it has any maps either, I've generally stuck to buildings. Crucially, don't miss the linked Robs074 collections. His stuff is absolutely must have, for me. https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2329453474
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Apr 27, 2021 01:06
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OwlFancier posted:I built a road in the way of the asphalt plant so I can't stick a helipad on it, but I can't imagine it would work differently. Again, dirt roads. Trucks make sense when you're near the concrete producer, but being able to start building a whole city remotely (or even remote construction yards!) is extremely my poo poo right now.
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Apr 27, 2021 01:44
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I'm going to end up spamming this thread with pictures, but I used the new snapping tool for pipes and got my heating plant moved to a much safer distance from the city. Absolutely thrilled with that mechanic. 
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Apr 27, 2021 01:57
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Anime Store Adventure posted:I'm going to end up spamming this thread with pictures, but I used the new snapping tool for pipes and got my heating plant moved to a much safer distance from the city. My god...
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Apr 27, 2021 02:01
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Is there a particular logic to how pumping stations work? Do they just work as repeaters for pipes or do they actually limit the heat conductance?
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Apr 27, 2021 02:11
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OwlFancier posted:Is there a particular logic to how pumping stations work? Do they just work as repeaters for pipes or do they actually limit the heat conductance? Yes.
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Apr 27, 2021 02:12
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OwlFancier posted:Is there a particular logic to how pumping stations work? Do they just work as repeaters for pipes or do they actually limit the heat conductance? They do reduce the temp by themselves slightly. You should build the longest pipe you can before using them. I don't think there's any rhyme or reason to where it sits in a line - those are probably 75% closer to the plant, but if they were 75% closer to the exchangers, it would reduce it by the same amount (but have less temp coming in, because of the distance.) I can't figure out if you could potentially pump 600 into an pumping station and get 600 out - a tutorial on steam says yes, but I don't trust it. Easier to just do 300in/out since that's its capacity. I wonder if they act as a sort of battery for the system - albeit briefly - should your heating plant run out of coal or go unstaffed. I don't think so, though.
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Apr 27, 2021 02:20
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Turns out that with curved bridges we can do all kinds of fancy interchanges for our one way highways. I just made a trumpet! 
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Apr 27, 2021 06:31
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Anime Store Adventure posted:They do reduce the temp by themselves slightly. You should build the longest pipe you can before using them. I don't think there's any rhyme or reason to where it sits in a line - those are probably 75% closer to the plant, but if they were 75% closer to the exchangers, it would reduce it by the same amount (but have less temp coming in, because of the distance.) I can't figure out if you could potentially pump 600 into an pumping station and get 600 out - a tutorial on steam says yes, but I don't trust it. Easier to just do 300in/out since that's its capacity. I wonder if they act as a sort of battery for the system - albeit briefly - should your heating plant run out of coal or go unstaffed. I don't think so, though. I feel like with the new pipe changes it would be nice if there was a station you could just stick all the plant's pipes into and get them all out the other side.
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Apr 27, 2021 14:03
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With the new wind turbines functioning autonomously it should be possible to build a set, connect them to an export and get free money. Has anybody done the math already on when they pay off?
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Apr 27, 2021 16:39
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I'm getting annoyed at how many comrades claim to not have access to culture when there's a cinema right there and it's usually sitting there with dozens and dozens of empty customer slots. e; Will logging facilities replant trees, and if not, can I restore or create a forest with the planting tool that will be usable for chopping down the road? Ms Adequate fucked around with this message at 22:07 on Apr 27, 2021 |
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Apr 27, 2021 22:01
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Ms Adequate posted:I'm getting annoyed at how many comrades claim to not have access to culture when there's a cinema right there and it's usually sitting there with dozens and dozens of empty customer slots.w I think that "no access to x" complaints hang around for quite a long time. I just ignore them after a while. I basically parse them as "one day in 1972 the bins were not collected on time and this informs my entire subsequent existence"
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Apr 27, 2021 22:03
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OwlFancier posted:I think that "no access to x" complaints hang around for quite a long time. I just ignore them after a while. Could be, though there were a couple of other things I was slow to get up and running that declined much quicker once I did. Ah well, it's not critical, and now that you mention it it is pretty weird there's no garbage mechanic.
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Apr 27, 2021 22:08
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I really wish there were underground power lines, the underground heating is so much nicer being able to just run them under roads. I have no idea how to do power without the place just looking like an absolute pigsty. Or even if there was just the ability to combine the function of a switch and a substation.
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Apr 27, 2021 22:35
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Now that you mention it it is kind of weird you need at least one wire segment connecting a switch to a substation. Otherwise, for being really into industrial porn I've never seen a power line enhance the look of anything except for those really emblematic forest cuts for HV lines. If you're doing pretty realistic step down of your MV network and running it along roads I don't know that you can make it look any better.
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Apr 27, 2021 22:59
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I've never managed to make my power grid not look like complete poo poo. I also have a bad habit of always wanting to use the biggest lines because I'm worried I'll under shoot
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Apr 27, 2021 23:09
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I would be running it along roads but the fact that any given substation can only feed a very small number of buildings before browning out means that I end up running a very large number of MV lines around towns trying to find places to squeeze them in between other infrastructure. And the largest MV line can only carry two substations worth of power. That's part of the complaint, really, it is very hard to make them look neat and the number of weird loops and poo poo and extra switches you have to add to break out of a trunk HV line just turns any electicity installation into a horrible mess of wires. It doesn't at all lend itself to looking appealing. Whereas especially with the new parallelism tools, pipes and roads often do. If power lines could snap above roads and if you could just link up substations in sequence that would help. Or also if you had like, a big substation that could serve a wider area with more MW, that would be nice. As it stands I think you need to many of the stupid things and too many wires connecting them and it's all just a chore, like it doesn't add anything to the game and the drat things are slow and tedious to build and to wait to have them built and I just buy them all anyway because they don't cost anything worth a drat they're just there and they don't need to be and why are there like a million different types of line you only need maybe four of them. gently caress. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 23:21 on Apr 27, 2021 |
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Apr 27, 2021 23:10
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OwlFancier posted:I think that "no access to x" complaints hang around for quite a long time. I just ignore them after a while. It's cool to see Dwarf Fortress influence on other games.
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Apr 27, 2021 23:21
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Popete posted:It's cool to see Dwarf Fortress influence on other games. Tantrum spiral except it's a revolution
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Apr 27, 2021 23:37
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Ms Adequate posted:I'm getting annoyed at how many comrades claim to not have access to culture when there's a cinema right there and it's usually sitting there with dozens and dozens of empty customer slots. I definitely don't pay attention to the "Can't access culture/etc" messages unless a high percentage of the flats say they can't get it. Then it suggests there's an issue as opposed to a "I couldn't walk there one time because I ran out of free time." Logging facilities don't replant but you can make a wood lot with the planting tool. Be careful! You can't replant on steep slopes, but can cut them down. If you have pretty forests on hills you won't be able to get them back. quote:Power Grid stuff     The only place it gets really busy and nasty is around the transformer, so I built that sort of near to the edge of town where there was going to be dead space because of the rail access anyway.  There's not any great solution for high voltage other than try to follow roads and land contours.  I used to be a "build the biggest line always" guy, but you can get a little trickier with it once you get a feel for how much power things will draw. I don't have any hard and fast rule, but that city worked as a good reference for me. I have 6 sub stations - one for each "corner" - one on each of the three blocks of apartments, another out where there wasn't quite room for a full block (but also had a radio station) and then two along the middle of the city. They almost all overlap.   This lets me rely on the fact that buildings can draw from any number of substations, and only a very few buildings are tied exclusively to one. In those two blocks, I ran the 2.35MW line only just to a switch near the edge of town, then stepped down to 1.20MW lines for each block - One substation sometimes gets close to nudging up to 1.00MW, but even still, it doesn't come close to capacity. Unfortunately, the best way to check this is just watch it using the electric overlay for wattage. Doing this has let me use smaller wires which are so much easier to tuck into the city than the big 2.35MW ones, but it does require using more substations and generally having more smaller wires than one bigger line. Just depends on your set up. Unless you're playing extremely strict Kosmonaut or extremely tight on cash, lines aren't usually expensive to replace. Start with smaller lines and then change them later if you're having trouble and try to have a lot of sub stations for busy areas. The way they calculate max wattage and estimated max consumption doesn't help. Max wattage is helpful more for factory complexes, but even still, has issues. Even in my more efficient factories, not every factory, conveyor, bus stop, storage, etc, is going to pull maximum power all at once. Generally, though, they're the areas that might be more true to the total factor if they're highly productive because there's a limited number of buildings. Cities aren't like that and very rarely come within 10-15% of the maximum - I'm not sure I've seen a building use its full maximum power even instantaneously and almost every apartment is 100% capacity. It's difficult to estimate, but I think the total wattage of that city would be on the order of 29MW by their calculation. I tried to under estimate, so let's call it 20MW just for errors sake and assume I was way off... That city averages about 2MW, maybe 2.5. I'm not sure I've ever seen 3. It's fed by a 6MW high voltage line and has never blacked out partially. Worse is the "Estimated Maximum Consumption" statistic. It's phrased like its telling you the math and observation I just did, but it isn't. Each of my substations says that it's about 3-4MW for that, but again, the entire city is only about 3MW ever. If you assume an even spread of consumption at each substation, that should be about 0.5 MW. TLDR: Start small, the numbers are lying to you. Brief aside, I finally got helicopter construction offices and they can get cement and asphalt if you attach a regular helipad to the building - I don't recall if someone posted that solution here. As if this post wasn't long enough I wanted to share some glamour shots, too. My next city I don't think I'll go so heavy into "garden city" mode and see how it turns out.          
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Apr 28, 2021 01:01
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How the gently caress do you get things to align with each other cleanly
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Apr 28, 2021 01:20
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Danaru posted:How the gently caress do you get things to align with each other cleanly Fine adjust and use the wireframe mapmode. There's a lot of looking if the green dots are perfectly on a grid line to make sure they're at right angles. If I'm aligning at anything other than 90 or 45 I either count off fine adjust turns or, if its a free standing building with some spaces, it won't matter too much if its 1 or 2 clicks off. Getting roads aligned sucks rear end, you usually have to drag it much further than you want along a gridline to make sure its aligned with it. That entire city happens to be 45 to the map grid, but that's not bad either. I am probably going to refuse to make a layout that isn't 90 or 45 to the grid. If the land doesn't agree I'll make due.
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Apr 28, 2021 01:24
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Like poo poo I cant even get my roads to align that smoothly what dark communist magic are you using
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Apr 28, 2021 01:24
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For buildings, fine adjust: These are regular scroll wheel clicks without holding ctrl (default):  You can see neither aligns to the grid. Look specifically at the green dots, they should align to the same gridline all the way along. Even if I want to move this building around a bit, I'll use the grid to align it first and then move it into position without rotating after its correct. Then, give it a ctrl+scroll and:  Same principle for 45, align the green dots to either the 45 line or in this case, the middle crossings of the grid like so. You'll also notice that the short side is aligned to the 45 line.  Roads suck, on the other hand, and require a lit more finesse. Straight, right?  Nope, you'll notice the purple dots aren't on the gridline. Just to prove it, let me extend it further so you can see easier.  See, it's a full half-grid off already. So instead, make sure to, again, use gridlines. Sometimes you'll have to estimate a little - if the road I want doesn't sit perfectly at an easy grid junction, I'll put it on a line and just eyeball how far left/right it is within the grid. Sometimes when dragging you can eyeball the edge of the road with a gridline, too. Here's a road I aligned with a gridline:  Now there's a whole lot of tricks with roads I could get into, but there's a few critical ones where I want to get my city roads straight. First, right angled roads. Obviously, you can just drag off of a road and use the same grid-eyeball method, but this trick is new! Using the 'near snap' feature, you can easily make right angles. Draw two parallel, snapped roads, and:  Then you can use the delete road tool (not bulldozer!) and clean up the other road:  Then you just have to extend out using the same wireframe trick to keep it straight as you would any other road. Related to that, here's another one that I run into absolutely constantly.  Close, but not quite! Pay attention to the space on either side of the road. Its almost centered on the gridline at the top, but drifts right at the bottom. Unfortunately, the next notch left is left of center, too, so I can't connect these two roads at a perfect 90 degrees with one snap. So!  Draw almost to the intersection at a right angle (I eyeballed this one on the gridline) and then do another small segment thats inevitably going to be 1 or 2 squares off. You can't really tell once its paved. Getting the second small segment to be the right size is difficult, I just have that from experience now. Too close, you can't build the segment because its too short. Too far, you'll see more angle. If you see..  Here, a little further back and the curve/angle becomes more pronounced. There's other little tricks I have for things like getting good 45/30 angled intersections and making good curves, but those are harder to describe. (I can if you like!) Making good curves, especially, is tough, and requires a lot of fiddling with the scroll wheel curvature feature and also holding shift for the other curvature method.
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Apr 28, 2021 02:03
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Planning out a new city, then realizing it's going to be a death trap due to it's proximity to coal and iron resources and their respective industries and just using the clone tool to put the whole thing 300m out of harms way just gave me the most glorious soviet feeling.
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Apr 28, 2021 02:06
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Kinksky posted:Planning out a new city, then realizing it's going to be a death trap due to it's proximity to coal and iron resources and their respective industries and just using the clone tool to put the whole thing 300m out of harms way just gave me the most glorious soviet feeling. I have thought about building 'Potemkin villages' that are basically just blueprints for blocks that I can later snap and add/subtract from as needed just so I can use the clone tool.
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Apr 28, 2021 02:09
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Thanks for this! Thisll make my residential town a whole lot less wonky 
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Apr 28, 2021 02:12
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Anime Store Adventure posted:I have thought about building 'Potemkin villages' that are basically just blueprints for blocks that I can later snap and add/subtract from as needed just so I can use the clone tool. I feel like you should be mailing the devs half of the stuff you're showing us here. It's all just incredible.
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Apr 28, 2021 03:21
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I have very important breaking news for the thread's citizens. You can make stack interchanges now that we have curved bridges.  I'm never doing it again and I don't think it saved any real space over a cloverleaf in this game.
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Apr 28, 2021 05:40
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New patch for the test branch! I wonder if the slow construction was the reason I couldn't get my heating plant up before winter in my current cosmonaut game. quote:0.8.4.8 - PUBLIC TEST Generation Internet fucked around with this message at 18:41 on Apr 28, 2021 |
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Apr 28, 2021 18:38
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quote:-Fixed issue with slow asphalt helicopter unloading when small amount of workers present on the construction site Oh thank goodness, the road building is funky and was causing road blocks from trucks and busses piling up, the helicopters were just the icing on the cake. E: now all we need is distribution office style behavior for trains and planes, I want the train to load only if the source has more than 50% stored etc
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Apr 28, 2021 19:02
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Angry IRL at how great Anime Store Adventure's city is. Lenin above
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Apr 28, 2021 19:08
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