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Rainbow Knight posted:"Biden is gambling with the lives of our troops!" they'd say. "Biden won't let our boys join in the fun of killing Palestinians"
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May 20, 2021 19:35
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https://apnews.com/article/gaza-israel-middle-east-israel-palestinian-conflict-caac81bc36fe9be67ac2f7c27000c74bquote:GAZA CITY, Gaza Strip (AP) — Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s Security Cabinet has approved a unilateral cease-fire to halt an 11-day military operation in the Gaza Strip, Israeli media said late Thursday. Lets hope
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May 20, 2021 20:49
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Idk how this is helpful. Netanyahu got what he wanted. And the IDF leveled 55 loving high rises. Ceasefire good but for the wrong reasons.
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May 20, 2021 20:56
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Did Hamas get its two conditions out of the ceasefire?
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May 20, 2021 20:58
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WAR CRIME GIGOLO posted:Idk how this is helpful. Netanyahu got what he wanted. And the IDF leveled 55 loving high rises. It would be helpful because it would mean less people dying. Not really in any other way, but since the world largely isn't going to do anything about the ethnic cleansing this is what we get.
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May 20, 2021 21:01
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WAR CRIME GIGOLO posted:Idk how this is helpful. It's pretty helpful if you happen to live in the Gaza Strip
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May 20, 2021 21:04
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WAR CRIME GIGOLO posted:Idk how this is helpful. Netanyahu got what he wanted. And the IDF leveled 55 loving high rises. Israel should face way more consequences for their genocide, but anything that prevents more kids from being bombed is a win. We're in war crime triage here.
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May 20, 2021 21:15
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How much did the Palestinian worker's general strike cost/shut down commerce? Is it a strong factor in the possible ceasefire?
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May 20, 2021 21:16
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World Famous W posted:How much did the Palestinian worker's general strike cost/shut down commerce? Is it a strong factor in the possible ceasefire? Nah, this is 100% because bibi already got what he wanted
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May 20, 2021 21:23
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https://twitter.com/Anthony/status/1395474400611348480?s=20 Besides the obvious "Israel only gets a few more hours to destroy gaza buildings" advantage, this seems like a loss for Hamas. They didnt get any assurances on their two ceasefire conditions, Israel got to gently caress poo poo up for free. Makes me wonder if Israel did hit Hamas harder than we thought; if they were successfully evading bombings you'd think they would have held on as global action continued to mount. The strike dealt tens of millions of dollars in damages to Israel's economy, you'd think they would prefer to stoke that.
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May 20, 2021 21:26
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Neurolimal posted:https://twitter.com/Anthony/status/1395474400611348480?s=20 Tens of millions of dollars is a drop in the bucket to the Israeli economy which is getting literally thousands of millions of dollars from Uncle Sam every year.
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May 20, 2021 21:31
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Israel does one of these mass escalations roughly every 5 years, during which time they receive about 15 billion dollars of military aid from the US. Hamas is absolutely no threat.
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May 20, 2021 21:37
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Neurolimal posted:https://twitter.com/Anthony/status/1395474400611348480?s=20 There's no real evading bombs in gaza, which has a population density just under singapore or hong kong. On that note, Israel spends years collecting the targets that will have the most severe human and economic impact, they absolutely did orders of magnitude more damage to gaza than gaza is capable of doing in response. Like Gaza just had a bunch of their limited medical clinics and their most prominent physicians blown up during a pandemic. The toll of that goes far beyond the diffuse economic damage of a strike. OctaMurk posted:Tens of millions of dollars is a drop in the bucket to the Israeli economy which is getting literally thousands of millions of dollars from Uncle Sam every year. it's also a drop in the bucket even without that support, but yeah the US aide is ~4 billion/year Herstory Begins Now fucked around with this message at 22:17 on May 20, 2021 |
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May 20, 2021 22:12
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Oh yeah obviously, in terms of damage to Gaza vs damage to Israel the former was devastated. I was thinking more Hamas' military personnel and operations. Maybe they don't really need it since everyone seems to hate Abbas, but "we stopped Israel from stealing Jerusalem homes, what has the PA done?" Seems like it would have been a nice feather in their cap. At least those 'evictions' have been delayed for a month. Hopefully they meet just as much local resistance then as well. Neurolimal fucked around with this message at 22:22 on May 20, 2021 |
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May 20, 2021 22:20
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Neurolimal posted:https://twitter.com/Anthony/status/1395474400611348480?s=20 There was never any real chance of Hamas getting concessions from Israel. When the other side has Gaza under a total blockade and can bomb critical infrastructure at will, a protracted all-out shooting war is suicide not just for Hamas but for the entire population of Gaza. While the international media was focusing on the bombing of media offices and apartment buildings, Israeli airstrikes have also been blowing up clinics, hospitals, sewage plants, and desalination systems. Continuing the conflict would have caused a serious crisis among Gaza's already-overburdened healthcare system and basic infrastructure. Compared to that, dragging on a strike among low-paid laborers a few more days is small potatoes. In any case, like Israel, Hamas has already gotten what they actually expected to get from this exchange: shoring up their domestic political cred. While Hamas was decrying Israel's attack on the Al-Aqsa protesters, Palestinian collaborationists spent their time calling for calm and asking the protesters to go home. When Hamas was launching rockets and enduring Israeli airstrikes, the most Mahmoud Abbas did about Israeli attacks was call up Joe Biden and ask him to please politely have Israel stop. As a result, Hamas comes out looking strong compared to Fatah, which has been very much drifting in the winds of public opinion in this whole thing. After a while, Fatah sensed where the winds were blowing and ramped up the anti-Israel rhetoric and endorsed the general strike, but they're clearly being forced to follow Hamas' lead by public opinion...and all their condemnations ring pretty hollow when the PA security forces are still actively cooperating with Israel to help them find and arrest Hamas members. With Palestinian elections canceled again and Mahmoud Abbas being in his 80s, Hamas benefits a lot from acting as a strong advocate for Palestinian rights. Even if their actual accomplishments are nil, just showing their willingness to clash with Israel should help their position a lot in overall Palestinian politics. This has also been a big blow to Ra'am, the Islamist party that broke away from the opposition to try to cozy up to Netanyahu and play kingmaker. While protesters are everywhere and inter-ethnic street attacks are ramping up even within Israel, Mansour Abbas is spouting both-sides platitudes about how everyone needs to stop the violence and work to better Arab-Jewish relations. Unsurprisingly, his already-small party seems to he splintering under the strain of trying to accept that.
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May 20, 2021 22:51
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How can Isreali justify bombing desalination plants, sewage and other infrastructure? 
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May 21, 2021 00:40
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Crosby B. Alfred posted:How can Isreali justify bombing desalination plants, sewage and other infrastructure? There's little pressure at this point to justify anything but they can just say the same thing they say about blowing up apartments, hospitals, individual doctors, etc. "Hamas!!! Rockets!!!!!!"
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May 21, 2021 00:44
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The AP is a disgusting organization. https://twitter.com/suhaunah/status/1395479074450022401?s=20
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May 21, 2021 00:45
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Nonsense posted:The AP is a disgusting organization. It's pretty good at reporting stuff.
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May 21, 2021 00:52
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Count Roland posted:It's pretty good at reporting stuff. They canned a person for supporting Palestine the day after Israel reduced their office to rubble.
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May 21, 2021 01:13
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Nonsense posted:The AP is a disgusting organization. And yet they’re somehow considered a legitimate news source.
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May 21, 2021 01:20
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Jaxyon posted:They canned a person for supporting Palestine the day after Israel reduced their office to rubble. I don't think supporting Palestine is their job
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May 21, 2021 01:43
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Count Roland posted:I don't think supporting Palestine is their job Yeah the AP sucks poo poo for firing her and can’t be trusted
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May 21, 2021 01:46
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Count Roland posted:I don't think supporting Palestine is their job Okay. They're still a disgusting organization.
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May 21, 2021 01:46
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Count Roland posted:I don't think supporting Palestine is their job I don't think policing their employee's political beliefs is either.
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May 21, 2021 01:48
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Crosby B. Alfred posted:How can Isreali justify bombing desalination plants, sewage and other infrastructure? They either blame Hamas, or spout the usual tripe about how they try as hard as they can to avoid damaging critical infrastructure. Sometimes they mumble some platitudes about how tunnels are everywhere, or make vague references to "Hamas facilities". No one really challenges them, so they don't have to defend it against anyone calling bullshit. https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/18/world/middleeast/gaza-israel.html quote:GAZA CITY — The nine-day battle between Hamas militants and the Israeli military has damaged 17 hospitals and clinics in Gaza, wrecked its only coronavirus test laboratory, sent fetid wastewater into its streets and broke water pipes serving at least 800,000 people, setting off a humanitarian crisis that is touching nearly every civilian in the crowded enclave of about two million people.
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May 21, 2021 02:03
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Main Paineframe posted:They either blame Hamas, or spout the usual tripe about how they try as hard as they can to avoid damaging critical infrastructure. Sometimes they mumble some platitudes about how tunnels are everywhere, or make vague references to "Hamas facilities". No one really challenges them, so they don't have to defend it against anyone calling bullshit. From article: quote:On Tuesday, as a convoy of 24 trucks carrying much-needed international aid from Israel tried to enter Gaza they came under mortar fire from Palestinian militants, according to Israeli and United Nations officials. Only five of the trucks got through the crossing before the rest were turned back. The UN and UNRWA seem to characterise this rather differently than the Israelis: https://news.un.org/en/story/2021/05/1092212 The UN definitely seems to think that the Israelis were using the general unrest nearby as an excuse to limit the convoy rather than the Israeli account that made it sound as if the convoy was mortared... This is the Israeli take: https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/israel-blasts-unrwa-for-claiming-its-blocking-aid-to-gaza-simply-a-lie/ lol @ the NY Times there...
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May 21, 2021 02:36
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Main Paineframe posted:And all but one member of the European Union, Hungary, called for an immediate cease-fire in an emergency meeting on Tuesday. Big Vik Orban always looking out for his friends
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May 21, 2021 02:42
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Main Paineframe posted:They either blame Hamas, or spout the usual tripe about how they try as hard as they can to avoid damaging critical infrastructure. Sometimes they mumble some platitudes about how tunnels are everywhere, or make vague references to "Hamas facilities". No one really challenges them, so they don't have to defend it against anyone calling bullshit. "Hamas, which has fired more than 3,000 rockets at Israeli cities and towns, is clearly committing war crimes, legal experts say, though its weapons are far less effective and their toll far lower." Hmm yes hypothetical war crimes. The most insidious type of war crime.
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May 21, 2021 04:27
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There was a Israeli/Palestinian discussion on Clubhouse today. It was good.
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May 21, 2021 05:19
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A thread https://twitter.com/FrankWaln/status/1395456324012494850
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May 21, 2021 05:25
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Rainbow Knight posted:"Hamas, which has fired more than 3,000 rockets at Israeli cities and towns, is clearly committing war crimes, legal experts say, though its weapons are far less effective and their toll far lower." That's not really hypothetical, to rockets have gone through and killed people
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May 21, 2021 10:02
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Crosby B. Alfred posted:How can Isreali justify bombing desalination plants, sewage and other infrastructure? They claim that Hamas is operating out of them and forcing Israel to do war crimes, when they acknowledge it at all. Same way all the children and doctors that get gunned down were being used as human shields. The fact that there's no evidence on this has never been an issue. One time, armaments were found in the basement of an abandoned UN building (I think a schoolhouse), which Israel made sure to milk when they bombed everything else that month.
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May 21, 2021 10:23
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Rainbow Knight posted:"Hamas, which has fired more than 3,000 rockets at Israeli cities and towns, is clearly committing war crimes, legal experts say, though its weapons are far less effective and their toll far lower." I do think if Israeli actions are criminal, one could also consider Hamas' actions criminal, but they're the same sort of thing- Hamas doesn't have a well-funded PR team talking about how they were targeting the IDF HQ in Tel Aviv and simply missed because they don't have the budget for precision munitions, or that the buildings they hit had an IDF reservist in them once. If Israel's attacking and targeting methods are legal, then so are Hamas'.
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May 21, 2021 11:04
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Hmm yes violence in the service of enacting apartheid, settler colonialism and genocide is the same as violence in the service of defending yourself from those things.
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May 21, 2021 12:16
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From an Al Jazeera reporter https://twitter.com/arwaib/status/1395696980823875585?s=20
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May 21, 2021 12:19
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forkboy84 posted:From an Al Jazeera reporter Israel. Israel never changes.
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May 21, 2021 12:43
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Orange Devil posted:Hmm yes violence in the service of enacting apartheid, settler colonialism and genocide is the same as violence in the service of defending yourself from those things. Nothing wrong with loving up colonialist occupiers, imo, just pointing out the legalistic absurdity of calling Hamas rocket attacks 'indiscriminate' and IDF attacks 'targeted'.
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May 21, 2021 12:53
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Main Paineframe posted:There was never any real chance of Hamas getting concessions from Israel. When the other side has Gaza under a total blockade and can bomb critical infrastructure at will, a protracted all-out shooting war is suicide not just for Hamas but for the entire population of Gaza. While the international media was focusing on the bombing of media offices and apartment buildings, Israeli airstrikes have also been blowing up clinics, hospitals, sewage plants, and desalination systems. Thanks for the write up, this is the sort of political incentive detail that provides more clarity to the situation.
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May 21, 2021 13:59
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Crosby B. Alfred posted:How can Isreali justify bombing desalination plants, sewage and other infrastructure? 95% of water in gaza is unfit for human consumption. So by bombing the water supplies the Palestinians must buy the water from Israel. Now the thing is, when you have the hyperpower on your side. You don't need to justify your crimes with anything other than media funding to loyal talking heads.
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May 21, 2021 15:27
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