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Sky Shadowing posted:It does always amuse me that people argue Jon would be a good king in the show when every time he's in a leadership position, it goes poorly for him. Snipping this a bit, Olly did nothing wrong. "Hey kid, the folks that killed and ate your parents are my buddies now, and I'm not going to explain my reasoning. Deal with it- ow that hurt!" As Nero Danced fucked around with this message at 17:52 on May 18, 2021 |
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May 18, 2021 17:50
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As Nero Danced posted:Snipping this a bit, Olly did nothing wrong. "Hey kid, the folks that killed and ate your parents are my buddies now, and I'm not going to explain my reasoning. Deal with it- ow that hurt!" Nah, think about this another way. What if they weren't "wildlings" ? "Hey, your parents were killed by Lannister bannermen but we just signed a peace treaty with them, so don't kill any Lannisters" See that sounds perfectly reasonable. What? You want to know WHY the king signed a peace treaty with the Lannisters? You're a peasant, shut up! Maybe for US that sounds hard to accept, but for people of Game of Thrones that would be absolutely par for the course.
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May 18, 2021 17:58
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I might be in the minority but I loving HATED Lyanna Mormont's character. She felt so forced and out of place like right out of an anime where you have the kawaii~ little kid but actually she is the strongest and most badass being in the universe and made so little sense in the historical era GoT was trying to represent that grown rear end man would let a kid sass them around. If at least she was the kid with the biggest army amongst the people there, then maaaaybe, but by her accounts she had like 62 soldiers, some of which probably already died in the Bastardbowl, so stfu kid.
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May 18, 2021 18:05
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lezard_valeth posted:I might be in the minority but I loving HATED Lyanna Mormont's character. She felt so forced and out of place like right out of an anime where you have the kawaii~ little kid but actually she is the strongest and most badass being in the universe and made so little sense in the historical era GoT was trying to represent that grown rear end man would let a kid sass them around. Having a younger character who is a noble so has power over much older (and more experienced) soldiers is a pretty common thing both in history and fantasy and can have some interesting effects. (Joffrey) Lyanna being somewhat competent was fun for awhile, I lied her sass in short doses. But the end where she kills the giant was just plain stupid fanservice in the worst way.
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May 18, 2021 18:07
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lezard_valeth posted:I might be in the minority but I loving HATED Lyanna Mormont's character. She felt so forced and out of place like right out of an anime where you have the kawaii~ little kid but actually she is the strongest and most badass being in the universe and made so little sense in the historical era GoT was trying to represent that grown rear end man would let a kid sass them around. YOUREFUSEDDAHCUH I hated her as well. I'd have loved it if they toned down her character a bit and had her played by someone a little bit older.
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May 18, 2021 18:07
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Zaphod42 posted:Nah, think about this another way. What if they weren't "wildlings" ? This. They specifically use the shitbag cannibal Wildlings to make the kid's treason seem more reasonable. The whole point of the traitors is that they're led by a guy who's always hated Jon pretty much exclusively for irrational reasons, and they are killing him specifically because he's making peace with the wildlings and they consider it treason because the wildlings are basically animals and unworthy of peace. They include the kid and they show that the kid is the victim of the worst of the Wildling clans to make it seem like they have a point and aren't just bigoted assholes.
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May 18, 2021 18:14
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Sanguinia posted:This. They specifically use the shitbag cannibal Wildlings to make the kid's treason seem more reasonable. The whole point of the traitors is that they're led by a guy who's always hated Jon pretty much exclusively for irrational reasons, and they are killing him specifically because he's making peace with the wildlings and they consider it treason because the wildlings are basically animals and unworthy of peace. They include the kid and they show that the kid is the victim of the worst of the Wildling clans to make it seem like they have a point and aren't just bigoted assholes.  Also God drat did I hate the way the Thenns were portrayed in the show. Vichan fucked around with this message at 18:19 on May 18, 2021 |
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May 18, 2021 18:17
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Zaphod42 posted:Having a younger character who is a noble so has power over much older (and more experienced) soldiers is a pretty common thing both in history and fantasy and can have some interesting effects. (Joffrey) Yes but again, whereas Joffrey was the king, had both the Lannister and King's Landing army at his disposal AND was eldest and thus the 1st in line, Lyanna had a non existant army (like seriously how have they not been overtaken by any stray Iron Island pirate already, this is another instance of the show not knowing how to handle army numbers and just toss "10 thousand!" "50 thousand!" "62!" "20 good men!" according to what made the plot sound cooler at the point) and was not even the 2nd in line, she wasn't the heir to the Bear Islands, and thus she most likely was not groomed to be the heir and leader to his people but till recently when her older sister died.
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May 18, 2021 18:20
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lezard_valeth posted:Yes but again, whereas Joffrey was the king, had both the Lannister and King's Landing army at his disposal AND was eldest and thus the 1st in line, Lyanna had a non existant army (like seriously how have they not been overtaken by any stray Iron Island pirate already, this is another instance of the show not knowing how to handle army numbers and just toss "10 thousand!" "50 thousand!" "62!" "20 good men!" according to what made the plot sound cooler at the point) and was not even the 2nd in line, she wasn't the heir to the Bear Islands, and thus she most likely was not groomed to be the heir and leader to his people but till recently when her older sister died. House Mormont has a reputation in the north despite its small size though. I don't find it hard to believe the whole family adopts a certain amount of attitude to back up that rep, especially the young ones who are probably going to act in a more pronounced way just because they haven't matured. That's how kids are.
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May 18, 2021 18:38
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I thought that was from getting a bunch of the filming locations locals to be extras to save money and no-one realized how it looked until afterwards.
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May 18, 2021 19:18
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Also they were combined with the youngest Manderly daughter I think, who loudly opposes being in an arranged marriage with a Frey and keeps saying she’s loyal to the Starks. Manderly is secretly proud of her but can’t really show it because of his plan.
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May 18, 2021 19:25
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TheKirbs posted:I thought that was from getting a bunch of the filming locations locals to be extras to save money and no-one realized how it looked until afterwards. Yeah GRRM was questioned about this and he outright came out and said "no gods no that's not at all what it was supposed to be like." I think he made the point it was people of all ethnicities reaching out for Dany (also in the books they did not lift her, she rode through them on her horse). In the books there are a LOT of slaves who look like Dany; the island of Lys breeds Valyrians like animals to create the most beautiful sex slaves to staff their brothels. And GRRM is not subtle with the fact that Dany empathizes so much with the slaves because she pretty much was one of them; in her very first chapter she gets told Drogo is so rich even his slaves wear golden collars, and when she's dressed to be presented to him, she realizes she's wearing a golden necklace. She then begs Viserys to not marry her off but he basically says "get hosed- literally."
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May 18, 2021 22:09
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I still smile a bit when I think about that scene where a dude on a boat snipes a dragon hundreds of yards away with a ballista. I had stopped watching the show by that point but was told to look it up. One in a million, kid
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May 19, 2021 08:56
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Lyanna Mormont was great as a one-off but then they had to drive it into the ground because they're bad showrunners.
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May 19, 2021 13:33
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Sanguinia posted:This. They specifically use the shitbag cannibal Wildlings to make the kid's treason seem more reasonable. The whole point of the traitors is that they're led by a guy who's always hated Jon pretty much exclusively for irrational reasons, and they are killing him specifically because he's making peace with the wildlings and they consider it treason because the wildlings are basically animals and unworthy of peace. They include the kid and they show that the kid is the victim of the worst of the Wildling clans to make it seem like they have a point and aren't just bigoted assholes. No they include the kid because the intern thought that would be a cool idea.
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May 19, 2021 13:50
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kater posted:No they include the kid because the intern thought that would be a cool idea. They include the kid because in the book the character is a gay sex worker and their audience is made up of football players and housewives.
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May 19, 2021 14:11
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ilmucche posted:I still smile a bit when I think about that scene where a dude on a boat snipes a dragon hundreds of yards away with a ballista. The funny thing is that I would have 100% accepted that with a smile if this was a series set in the Discworld. But then we would have had a scene or two where Euron would have made drat sure his chance to hit was exactly one in a million.(like hopping around on one leg while balista-ing backwards with the sun in his eye)
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May 19, 2021 16:58
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Open Source Idiom posted:They include the kid because in the book the character is a gay sex worker and their audience is made up of football players and housewives. I don't think Olly and Satin are supposed to be the same character.
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May 19, 2021 17:07
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Sky Shadowing posted:She then begs Viserys to not marry her off but he basically says "get hosed- literally." And then she falls in love with him because he gave her a pretty horse.
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May 19, 2021 17:32
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Sky Shadowing posted:He disregards the politics and feelings of the Night's Watch and lets the wildlings through. It's absolutely the right call, but he doesn't even attempt to politic around it, he just says, "I'm Lord Commander, I'm doing it." And as a result the Night's Watch- who have reasonable reasons to hate wildlings- loving murder him. (In the books it's much more obvious that Jon had it coming; he basically announces he's going to take the Wildlings and march on Winterfell to help Stannis and a group of Night's Watchmen basically realize this is him breaking his oaths and assassinate him for it). its been a while but i thought jon gets killed when hes about to go to hardhome to try and save the wildlings there in what is clearly a really stupid suicide mission. either way yeah he totally had it coming
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May 19, 2021 18:46
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babypolis posted:its been a while but i thought jon gets killed when hes about to go to hardhome to try and save the wildlings there in what is clearly a really stupid suicide mission. either way yeah he totally had it coming He was originally supposed to go to Hardhome but decides to go to Winterfell instead after getting Ramsay's letter. Tormund was supposed to go to Hardhome instead.
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May 19, 2021 18:52
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Vichan posted:I don't think Olly and Satin are supposed to be the same character. Satin owns, I want to see more of him (and not just because Jon is in love w him)
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May 19, 2021 19:08
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Groovelord Neato posted:Lyanna Mormont was great as a one-off but then they had to drive it into the ground because they're bad showrunners. Lyanna killing the undead giant was a shark jump, but her telling off Jorah for patronizing her and telling off John for going south a King and coming back a couple weeks later a servant were both great and worth bringing her back.
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May 19, 2021 21:13
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Sanguinia posted:Lyanna killing the undead giant was a shark jump, but her telling off Jorah for patronizing her and telling off John for going south a King and coming back a couple weeks later a servant were both great and worth bringing her back. Yeah her conversation with Jorah, and then Jorah's connection with Sam both owned. Brought his arc as a Mormont and a man redeemed full circle, in addition to his last stand defense of Dany.
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May 19, 2021 21:41
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Mat Cauthon posted:Yeah her conversation with Jorah, and then Jorah's connection with Sam both owned. Brought his arc as a Mormont and a man redeemed full circle, in addition to his last stand defense of Dany. Jorah really got incredibly lucky as far as GoT characters went in terms of closure and a good ending for his story.
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May 19, 2021 21:58
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Sanguinia posted:Jorah really got incredibly lucky as far as GoT characters went in terms of closure and a good ending for his story. His death is also the absolute final point of no return for the show's quality.
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May 20, 2021 03:43
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nine-gear crow posted:His death is also the absolute final point of no return for the show's quality. Yeah, its almost impressive how total the failures were after that. The broad strokes sucking are obvious, but even the detail work in the gaps just constantly falls on its face. You'd think you could appreciate Brienne and Jaime getting together only for it to be completely shat on multiple times. You'd think you could appreciate Missandei's defiance in her final moments but you have to remember the incredibly stupid poo poo like Forgot About The Iron Fleet it took to put her there. You'd think you could appreciate Arya and the Hound's final moment together and how he finally gets her to see that being a revenge golem isn't worth it, except its incredibly ham-handed, forced due to time constraints and is hard to swallow given all both have done this season. You'd think you could appreciate Jon's conflict during the Siege on King's Landing, having to kill one of his own men to prevent a rape and just generally trying to survive the horror of what's going on around him with some shred of his honor intact, except the only reason it's happening is Dany's character being ruined. You'd think you could appreciate Bronn's grand ending to his rise through the world and his long journey with the Lannister Brothers he befriended, except it really doesn't make any sense from a dozen levels and directions (and it kills me because on one level it kind of does, because the entire reason the Lannisters are what they are is because their ancestor Lann the Clever literally stole Casterly Rock and the wealth and titles that went with it, and Bronn basically doing the same thing to them is really juicy dramatic irony. This plot point could have been saved with just a smidge more effort but instead it is just more slop!) I think literally the only thing that isn't a complete trashfire after Jorah's death is Brienne writing Jaime's Deeds in the White Book. And maybe Edmure getting dunked on trying to pitch himself as king. I really can't think of any others.
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May 20, 2021 08:07
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Sanguinia posted:I think literally the only thing that isn't a complete trashfire after Jorah's death is Brienne writing Jaime's Deeds in the White Book. And maybe Edmure getting dunked on trying to pitch himself as king. I really can't think of any others. Wait, don't forget she didn't wait for the ink to dry so his deeds got all hosed up.
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May 20, 2021 13:22
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As Nero Danced posted:Wait, don't forget she didn't wait for the ink to dry so his deeds got all hosed up. Now both Lannister brothers will be forgotten.
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May 20, 2021 15:32
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ilmucche posted:I still smile a bit when I think about that scene where a dude on a boat snipes a dragon hundreds of yards away with a ballista. Never forget this was also the infamous 'Dany kinda forgot about the Iron Fleet' scene, where a person on a dragon high up in the air with an aerial view was somehow surprised by a big fuckoff fleet of ships below her.
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May 23, 2021 13:57
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Drunk in Space posted:Never forget this was also the infamous 'Dany kinda forgot about the Iron Fleet' scene, where a person on a dragon high up in the air with an aerial view was somehow surprised by a big fuckoff fleet of ships below her. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b9lRgk_HR-g Always liked this fix, it's still stupid but leagues better than the scene we got.
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May 23, 2021 14:12
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That is definitely much better, especially the change to showing a barrage of shots at the start rather than the first three hitting with unerring accuracy one after the other in the original. When I first saw that scene, I remember turning to my friend and saying, "I guarantee you in the final battle they're going to have a ton of those things set up like flak guns all over the place, and they will not land a single loving shot on Dany's dragon." Show didn't disappoint!
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May 23, 2021 16:21
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Definitely far from perfect, but they're not writing the show they're working with what footage they have. Pretty good editing considering, I think they even inserted some more ballista bolts in the air and overdubbed more firing sounds to make it work better and make more sense. Apparently some information about cut scenes and changes to the S8 scripts have come out? Not sure how true it is, but supposedly Mormont was originally going to survive the battle of Winterfell and be around to counsel Dany as she started going mad. Not sure how much that would help things, and if he survived that'd mean almost nobody actually died in the battle which would be hilarious.
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May 23, 2021 21:20
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https://twitter.com/people/status/1396937050105028608?s=19
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May 25, 2021 00:25
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Sanguinia posted:House Mormont has a reputation in the north despite its small size though. I don't find it hard to believe the whole family adopts a certain amount of attitude to back up that rep, especially the young ones who are probably going to act in a more pronounced way just because they haven't matured. That's how kids are. Yes but even if house Mormont kids are little shits that doesn't mean the adults around them will sit around and take it. Back in s1 when Greatjon Umber was offended by Robb he was taking none of that poo poo and was even ready to square up till Greywind bit his fingers off. Northman being stubborn and not taking poo poo from anyone is one of the few consistent things throughout the seasons, except when confronted by anime children. Zaphod42 posted:Not sure how true it is, but supposedly Mormont was originally going to survive the battle of Winterfell and be around to counsel Dany as she started going mad. Not sure how much that would help things, and if he survived that'd mean almost nobody actually died in the battle which would be hilarious. They probably realized how little sense it would make for Dany to go into Hitler mode if Jorah survived. So they offed him and instead had Grey Worm take the spot of trusted counselor. This is really hosed up, made even worse by both actors taking it in stride implying it's common poo poo they have to put up with in the industry, and for what? Both of those scenes ended up taking a combined screentime of 2 minutes in the same episode. lezard_valeth fucked around with this message at 04:48 on May 25, 2021 |
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May 25, 2021 04:42
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They never use the abusive take, either. They should be in a union to prevent this kind of thing!
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May 25, 2021 06:19
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You would expect the most successful show in the history of television to have a little more quality control.
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May 25, 2021 06:40
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I just feel like if there were any justice and it wasn't such a broken industry she'd take HBO/D&D to court and drain their wallets for coercing her to be tortured for entertainment, leaving real psychological scars.
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May 25, 2021 08:37
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It's pretty hosed up that probably there'd have been more outcry against simulating her being raped rather than her actually be loving tortured for 10 hours.
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May 25, 2021 09:14
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Just quit if you don't like it 
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May 25, 2021 09:34
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